Hurricane Kiko, ? impact on HI?

[ScoopKona]

How are the really big farms able to have enough workers to pick the coffee beans?

I'm not answering that. My wife and I are US citizens. We have no employees and we have never had employees.

https://www.hsta.org/news/recent-stories/kona-teachers-meet-with-tokuda-to-share-immigration-enforcement-concerns/

Immigration Raids Throw Shadow Over Big Island Coffee Harvest

As their workers are arrested and deported, flee the country or stay away, coffee farmers are struggling to bring in a bumper crop.

www.civilbeat.org

https://www.hsta.org/news/recent-stories/10-maui-teachers-detained-questioned-in-erroneous-federal-immigration-raid/

 

[chellej]

Maybe they should have tours where tourists can pick their own beans and then are charged to process and roast the beans. We have lots of farms near us that open up to the public to pick their own fruit, vegetables etc and it does pretty well for them.

 

[Tamaradarann]

Maybe they should have tours where tourists can pick their own beans and then are charged to process and roast the beans. We have lots of farms near us that open up to the public to pick their own fruit, vegetables etc and it does pretty well for them.

That's funny. When I started this change in the discussion from hurricane Kiko to harvesting coffee beans on this timeshare discussion group I was thinking about how timeshare resorts could have tours to help pick coffee beans. However, I believe that there is a roasting process that takes place on farms before the beans can be used to make coffee so you may not get back the beans you pick but something could be worked out for everyone. I am sure ScoopKona can edify us on this much better than I can on the coffee bean process.

 

[Tamaradarann]

I'm not answering that. My wife and I are US citizens. We have no employees and we have never had employees.

https://www.hsta.org/news/recent-stories/kona-teachers-meet-with-tokuda-to-share-immigration-enforcement-concerns/

Immigration Raids Throw Shadow Over Big Island Coffee Harvest

As their workers are arrested and deported, flee the country or stay away, coffee farmers are struggling to bring in a bumper crop.

www.civilbeat.org

https://www.hsta.org/news/recent-stories/10-maui-teachers-detained-questioned-in-erroneous-federal-immigration-raid/

As I said it is great that you and your wife can do all the work that needs to be done. We all know how big money can make things happen for their benefit.

 

[lynne]

That's funny. When I started this change in the discussion from hurricane Kiko to harvesting coffee beans on this timeshare discussion group I was thinking about how timeshare resorts could have tours to help pick coffee beans. However, I believe that there is a roasting process that takes place on farms before the beans can be used to make coffee so you may not get back the beans you pick but something could be worked out for everyone. I am sure ScoopKona can edify us on this much better than I can on the coffee bean process.

Not ScoopKona but I can provide a little explanation. It is a very labor intensive process. Once the cherry is picked, the beans need need be dried before the bean can be separated from the husk. This process takes quite some time and the 'green beans' are then ready for roasting. When we lived in Honokaa, we had a few coffee trees alongside our mac nut orchard. It was not an easy process and we stopped harvesting coffee early on and just concentrated on the mac-nut processing.

Our neighbors had small batch coffee that they sold and although delicious, it was a labor of love and not for profit.

 

[Tamaradarann]

Not ScoopKona but I can provide a little explanation. It is a very labor intensive process. Once the cherry is picked, the beans need need be dried before the bean can be separated from the husk. This process takes quite some time and the 'green beans' are then ready for roasting. When we lived in Honokaa, we had a few coffee trees alongside our mac nut orchard. It was not an easy process and we stopped harvesting coffee early on and just concentrated on the mac-nut processing.

Our neighbors had small batch coffee that they sold and although delicious, it was a labor of love and not for profit.

As I said you won't be able to get the beans back that you picked. What if you picked 10 pounds of coffee beans for the farmer and he gave you say a pound of coffee made from his farm's beans that were previously picked? You might say that the farmer was not getting a good deal since the finished Kona coffee is very valuable but it is better than, as ScoopKona said many small farmers just letting the cherry go to black and be useless.

 

[JohnnyO]

AA flight number..


Looks like Oahu or Maui may have a greater probability of issues with the cyclone rather than BI..

They haven't shown any for HI yet but will keep a close eye...


Hope & pray that remains true...
Unfortunately out of town for a meeting; returning home tmrw afternoon to fly to KOA on Monday morning, so can't go sooner...
AY is a bit of a pain to book/change (for AA), so waiting for now (& hoping & praying everything goes well)...
Mahalo for everyone's excellent recommendations!

Have a great trip @mountainboy. Hopefully the weather will hold and you and yours will be able to experience a lava event at the caldera. Stay on top of the volcano alerts as the events are every couple of weeks and don't last long. You may need to move on it immediately.

 

[ScoopKona]

That's funny. When I started this change in the discussion from hurricane Kiko to harvesting coffee beans on this timeshare discussion group I was thinking about how timeshare resorts could have tours to help pick coffee beans. However, I believe that there is a roasting process that takes place on farms before the beans can be used to make coffee so you may not get back the beans you pick but something could be worked out for everyone. I am sure ScoopKona can edify us on this much better than I can on the coffee bean process.

The ripe cherry is picked daily. Then the cherry is pulped in a machine that is like a giant cheese grater. The skin (which makes an interesting tea) and what little "fruit" is in the cherry is separated. The beans are then fermented to get rid of any residual sugar.

After fermentation and washing, the beans must dry down to 10% moisture content. Then they can be milled into green coffee. And finally roasted.

Takes months from start to finish.

The problem with "pick your own," is that the best coffee grows on land that like walking on a field of bowling balls made out of razor blades.

 

[ScoopKona]

What if you picked 10 pounds of coffee beans for the farmer and he gave you say a pound of coffee made from his farm's beans that were previously picked?

1) The farm would go bankrupt.

2) 10 pounds of cherry is less than 1 pound of roasted coffee. (It's a 15:1 ratio.)

Pickers are typically paid $1-2 per pound of cherry.

 

[lynne]

The ripe cherry is picked daily. Then the cherry is pulped in a machine that is like a giant cheese grater. The skin (which makes an interesting tea) and what little "fruit" is in the cherry is separated. The beans are then fermented to get rid of any residual sugar.

After fermentation and washing, the beans must dry down to 10% moisture content. Then they can be milled into green coffee. And finally roasted.

Takes months from start to finish.

The problem with "pick your own," is that the best coffee grows on land that like walking on a field of bowling balls made out of razor blades.

and walking through crab spider webs

 

[ScoopKona]

and walking through crab spider webs

Yup. I'm always covered in bites.

 

[davidvel]

That is great that you and your family can handle all the work yourselves. How are the really big farms able to have enough workers to pick the coffee beans?

Hawaiians do a lot more of the manual labor, housekeeping, gardening, etc. with local people than the rest of the country. Everywhere you go in Hawaii, you see Hawaiians doing the type of work that you see immigrants doing on the mainland, many into their 70s and 80s. But obviously they cannot do it all.

 

[Tamaradarann]

The ripe cherry is picked daily. Then the cherry is pulped in a machine that is like a giant cheese grater. The skin (which makes an interesting tea) and what little "fruit" is in the cherry is separated. The beans are then fermented to get rid of any residual sugar.

After fermentation and washing, the beans must dry down to 10% moisture content. Then they can be milled into green coffee. And finally roasted.

Takes months from start to finish.

The problem with "pick your own," is that the best coffee grows on land that like walking on a field of bowling balls made out of razor blades.

Cetainly if it that dangerous you couldn't have tourist doing it.

 

[Tamaradarann]

1) The farm would go bankrupt.

2) 10 pounds of cherry is less than 1 pound of roasted coffee. (It's a 15:1 ratio.)

Pickers are typically paid $1-2 per pound of cherry.

I just threw out 10 pounds of picked for a pound of coffee. It could certainly could be 100 pound of picked for a pound of coffee or 10 pounds of picked for one of those little bags of coffee that you see sold for tourists. The amount of coffee for what is picked is not the real issue. You mention that the farm would go bankrupt; what is the financial condition of the farms that are letting ALL of the beans stay unpicked?

 

[Tamaradarann]

Hawaiians do a lot more of the manual labor, housekeeping, gardening, etc. with local people than the rest of the country. Everywhere you go in Hawaii, you see Hawaiians doing the type of work that you see immigrants doing on the mainland, many into their 70s and 80s. But obviously they cannot do it all.

While we were not farmers my husband and I always did all of the manual labor on our house and 1/2 acre of property in NY that included a vegtable garden and pool while we saw others getting cleaning and landscaping people to do the work. However, as we got into our 70's we did start to think about the future so we wanted a Condo all on 1 level with elevators rather than a house with steps and lots of work outside.

Your comment "But obviously they cannot do it all" leads to but does not address the large coffee farmers immigrant labor situation since obviously they cannot do all the work!

 

[ScoopKona]

I just threw out 10 pounds of picked for a pound of coffee. It could certainly could be 100 pound of picked for a pound of coffee or 10 pounds of picked for one of those little bags of coffee that you see sold for tourists. The amount of coffee for what is picked is not the real issue. You mention that the farm would go bankrupt; what is the financial condition of the farms that are letting ALL of the beans stay unpicked?

100 pounds would take the average visitor all week to pick. That's the problem, and the reason for the prices. Each tree (bush is closer to the mark) only has a handful of ripe cherry on it any given day. Pick those 20-30 cherries, and then move on to the next bush. It's boring, repetitive work. It's like standing on bowling balls while being bitten by spiders and poked by cactus. (Guinea grass has thorns like cactus.)

Nobody would do this except to take a selfie, "We picked coffee!" and then off to the beach.

When you get down to it, "I'm a coffee farmer" is only a flex outside Hawaii. People who live here want nothing to do with the business. They're selling their farms because they can't find any younger relatives who want to work the farm. Chew on that for a minute -- people would rather rent and work at a bank than inherit acreage in Hawaii. That's precisely how I bought my place. Nobody else wanted it.

 

[mountainboy]

Aloha Folks!
*Closing the loop: We reached HI safely! Yay!
Beautiful sunny day in KOA & Waikoloa yesterday!
AA flight crew was excellent. They had routed us a little longer route (just extra 200 miles, 20 minutes extra, to avoid Kiko's outer bands).
Some rain tonight into tmrw AM in Waikoloa but otherwise no major impact here with Kiko! Hoping everyone else in HI also doing ok with Kiko!
Mahalo!

 

[WaikikiFirst]

sounds like HI govt needs to fund iRobot to design coffee-cherry-pickin drones, with laser-beams on their heads bellies to get rid of the spiders
what is max force required to pick a cherry? or maybe have a 2nd laser to slice the stem and have it drop into a net being held by the drone

 

[ScoopKona]

sounds like HI govt needs to fund iRobot to design coffee-cherry-pickin drones, with laser-beams on their heads bellies to get rid of the spiders
what is max force required to pick a cherry? or maybe have a 2nd laser to slice the stem and have it drop into a net being held by the drone

Tom Greenwell thinks we're about five years away from robotic pickers. That'll work great on their farm -- since it's like a putting green. Not so much for me.

Most coffee is strip-picked by machines that would look more in place in Kansas than Columbia. The plantation manager decides what day is best -- the least amount of under-ripe and over-ripe cherry. And then everything is picked at once. It has to be roasted dark because under-ripe coffee is undrinkable any other way. It'll get people caffeinated in the morning and it's cheap. But that's about it.

 

[Tamaradarann]

Aloha Folks!
*Closing the loop: We reached HI safely! Yay!
Beautiful sunny day in KOA & Waikoloa yesterday!
AA flight crew was excellent. They had routed us a little longer route (just extra 200 miles, 20 minutes extra, to avoid Kiko's outer bands).
Some rain tonight into tmrw AM in Waikoloa but otherwise no major impact here with Kiko! Hoping everyone else in HI also doing ok with Kiko!
Mahalo!

That's great that you had a good flight. Here in Honolulu we have been desparate for some wind since we live without A/C. Over the last 4 days while we keep hearing about Kiko's strength on the news it seems like thousands of miles away not hundreds since there is no wind.

 

[mountainboy]

Here in Honolulu we have been desparate for some wind since we live without A/C.

Praying for more wind for you soon...

 

[Tamaradarann]

100 pounds would take the average visitor all week to pick. That's the problem, and the reason for the prices. Each tree (bush is closer to the mark) only has a handful of ripe cherry on it any given day. Pick those 20-30 cherries, and then move on to the next bush. It's boring, repetitive work. It's like standing on bowling balls while being bitten by spiders and poked by cactus. (Guinea grass has thorns like cactus.)

Nobody would do this except to take a selfie, "We picked coffee!" and then off to the beach.

When you get down to it, "I'm a coffee farmer" is only a flex outside Hawaii. People who live here want nothing to do with the business. They're selling their farms because they can't find any younger relatives who want to work the farm. Chew on that for a minute -- people would rather rent and work at a bank than inherit acreage in Hawaii. That's precisely how I bought my place. Nobody else wanted it.

OK so tourists can't pick a hundred pounds of coffee in a day and it is too unpleasant to pick any coffee at all. So what is the solution for getting the cherry picked for those farmers that want to keep their farms do to the lack of labor? By the way while I am a big advocate for increased farming in Hawaii for food to make Hawaii more food sustainable it is not necessarily for coffee. However, food farmers have the same problem with lack of labor to plant and pick food that they do for coffee. So what is the solution? I am going to a Eat, Think, Drink Session on Tuesday Night Septmeber 16th at the Prince Hotel here in Honolulu hosted by the Hawaii Agricultural Foundation entitled "Building the Future Ag Workforce". Hopefully I will learn more about this subject.

 

[ScoopKona]

You know Hawaii isn't serious about something when they hold a conference.

 

[Tamaradarann]

You know Hawaii isn't serious about something when they hold a conference.

This isn't a conference it is a quarterly dinner/meeting that they call Eat, Think, and Drink. There is an hour presentation at 6:00 PM with a panel with people from all over Hawaii that are involved with Hawaiian Agriculture and the food system. Then there is a pu pu dinner that is prepared and served buffet style by 4 different local chef's along with a couple of drink tickets for the bar. We started going to these before COVID but stopped until about a year ago.

 

[davidvel]

This isn't a conference it is a quarterly dinner/meeting that they call Eat, Think, and Drink. There is an hour presentation at 6:00 PM with a panel with people from all over Hawaii that are involved with Hawaiian Agriculture and the food system. Then there is a pu pu dinner that is prepared and served buffet style by 4 different local chef's along with a couple of drink tickets for the bar. We started going to these before COVID but stopped until about a year ago.

It doesn't matter. It is what coffeguy says or the high road.