ROFR metric / Ongoing ROFR Activity

[TravelTime]

But it is. No one can prove it, sure, But once you understand the backstory, you know it does make a difference. There is no question about it.

I am making an offer on a timeshare (i.e real estate) now. I asked the agent to bundle the 2019 maintenance fees into the purchase price to make it more expensive if the developer decides to exercise ROFR. So I am using this strategy, which I learned from you, my mentor! I only say it does not always work because many Tuggers have said they have used this strategy and Marriott has still exercised. So while it makes sense intellectually, it does not always pass ROFR. If it consistently passed, I would agree with you. I encourage everyone to use this strategy because we need all the help we can get to pass ROFR.

 

[dioxide45]

Then we are all real estate tycoons! Little did I know I had amassed an international real estate empire so cheaply. I just wish they would appreciate like my other real estate and that there was a more liquid resale market. Or maybe I should wish my house came with destination points or staroptions instead? How much extra to enroll my house?

You may mock it, but it doesn't change the reality in the eyes of the law. If Marriott so desired, they could take title to the deed on your house, convey it to the MVC DC Land Trust and divy it up in points and sell them.

 

[TravelTime]

You take it as mocking. I was just kidding and playing around. There is a difference.

I give up here. My humor is too bizarre. I was going to make another sarcastic joke but my DH and I decided no one would understand.

 

[Steve Fatula]

You take it as mocking. I was just kidding and playing around. There is a difference.

I give up here. My humor is too bizarre. I was going to make another sarcastic joke but my DH and I decided no one would understand.

I'll vouch for that. Traveltime can have interesting posts, but is actually a good person and smart. I am still learning what is mocking and what isn't. That is interesting to me as it sounds a lot like me in my life. People seem to mis-interpret me a lot and maybe I can learn something from this! Heck, I can even offer to help someone with something and they think there is some devious ulterior motive. It confuses me! I once offered to help mow a property and they took it as an insult.

 

[Steve Fatula]

I am making an offer on a timeshare (i.e real estate) now. I asked the agent to bundle the 2019 maintenance fees into the purchase price to make it more expensive if the developer decides to exercise ROFR. So I am using this strategy, which I learned from you, my mentor! I only say it does not always work because many Tuggers have said they have used this strategy and Marriott has still exercised. So while it makes sense intellectually, it does not always pass ROFR. If it consistently passed, I would agree with you. I encourage everyone to use this strategy because we need all the help we can get to pass ROFR.

Well, there are different ways of doing that and some are incorrectly structured. However, of course it will never always work. But that's because ROFR seems to have no formula. They can exercise on person A at $10,000 but not person B the very next day at $5000.

 

[frank808]

I just wish they would appreciate like my other real estate and that there was a more liquid resale market.

Own DVC points. And those are only a RTU. They have appreciated nicely in 8 years, can rent them put quickly and sell pretty easily.

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[taterhed]

Own DVC points. And those are only a RTU. They have appreciated nicely in 8 years, can rent them put quickly and sell pretty easily.

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Funny, I was just about to start ranting about the automatic 50% loss on points resale....and then I re-read your post: You mean Disney points? or MVC destination club points?

If Marriott, the automatic loss of 50% value on resale ($3 per point) makes that a very expensive 'easy sell.'
Liquid, yes. High MF's as well.....it's all relative of course.

 

[TravelTime]

Own DVC points. And those are only a RTU. They have appreciated nicely in 8 years, can rent them put quickly and sell pretty easily.

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I own DVC points. Those are the only ones that appreciate but are the least like real estate since they are RTU and expire in less than 50 years. Imagine if your house expired in 2060 or even sooner!

 

[TravelTime]

Funny, I was just about to start ranting about the automatic 50% loss on points resale....and then I re-read your post: You mean Disney points? or MVC destination club points?

If Marriott, the automatic loss of 50% value on resale ($3 per point) makes that a very expensive 'easy sell.'
Liquid, yes. High MF's as well.....it's all relative of course.

I suspect that MVC points and most timeshares are not very liquid since you need to give them away or sell them cheaply and even then you might not get takers due to people not wanting the maintenance fees. Also broker fees are very high to sell timeshares compared to traditional real estate. Many timeshares rent at the cost of maintenance fees, unfortunately. Marriott DPs rent for only a few pennies above MFs. There are very few timeshares that are good renters from an owner perspective.

 

[capjak]

I suspect that MVC points and most timeshares are not very liquid since you need to give them away or sell them cheaply and even then you might not get takers due to people not wanting the maintenance fees. Also broker fees are very high to sell timeshares compared to traditional real estate. Many timeshares rent at the cost of maintenance fees, unfortunately. Marriott DPs rent for only a few pennies above MFs. There are very few timeshares that are good renters from an owner perspective.

Disney Vacation Club is the exception for sure, it is worth more now than when I bought it resale and I can rent out the points for 2x MFs in about a week (very liquid). WKORV-North rents well also but not as well as DVC.

 

[TravelTime]

Disney Vacation Club is the exception for sure, it is worth more now than when I bought it resale and I can rent out the points for 2x MFs in about a week (very liquid). WKORV-North rents well also but not as well as DVC.

I own both in my real estate empire.

 

[hajjah]

I just got an email back from the closing company regarding the purchase of:
MARRIOTT SHADOW RIDGE ENCLAVES CALIFORNIA TIMESHARE 2 BEDROOM LOCKOFF GOLD. Marriott is not enforcing their ROFR. This is an EOY that I found on Ebay for $1. I won't post this on the ROFR website until the Deed has been sent out for updating/recording. I never thought this would go through.

 

[FamilyEsq]

How long did it take for Marriott to notify you that they were not exercising ROFR?

 

[hajjah]

The request for ROFR was sent to Marriott on 11/23 and the waiver was received on 11/29. I don't see much activity for this resort on the ROFR website.

 

[GregT]

I just got an email back from the closing company regarding the purchase of:
MARRIOTT SHADOW RIDGE ENCLAVES CALIFORNIA TIMESHARE 2 BEDROOM LOCKOFF GOLD. Marriott is not enforcing their ROFR. This is an EOY that I found on Ebay for $1. I won't post this on the ROFR website until the Deed has been sent out for updating/recording. I never thought this would go through.

Wow, that’s a great purchase. I’m surprised that went through as well.

Was the Seller in bankruptcy?

I know there are plans to build out Shadow Ridge (someday) and maybe they don’t want that much Shadow Ridge in the Trust but I still don’t get it.

Congrats on your purchase!

Best,

Greg

 

[taterhed]

The request for ROFR was sent to Marriott on 11/23 and the waiver was received on 11/29. I don't see much activity for this resort on the ROFR website.

Cost of a Marriott timeshare: $1
Using it to trade into a prime Maui Ocean View/Front? Priceless. (actually about $149).

Good catch!

 

[vol_90]

What is the going rate for ROFR for Asia Pacific Points. They carry an approximately lower maintenance fee to the tune of 30% less. I assume they can only be used in certain MVCI locations. I hear they are normally sold for about 30% more than DPs.

Not sure of ROFR on AP Points. I can confirm they can be used on all MVCI properties subject to availability. Maintenance fees per point from 2014 - 2018 are as follows:

2014 - .3279
2015 - .3375
2016 - .3515
2017 - .36889
2018 - .38365

 

[bazzap]

Yes, there are currently 8 Asia Pacific Club resorts with more planned, but all MVC resorts are now available to AP points owners.
Further details are available here (full details require AP Club sign in)
https://www.marriottasiaholidays.com/

 

[dioxide45]

Yes, there are currently 8 Asia Pacific Club resorts with more planned

Will they really add more properties to AP where owners can use their AP points to book in to directly? Or would they not just put them all in to DC and have all owners book through DC?

 

[bazzap]

Will they really add more properties to AP where owners can use their AP points to book in to directly? Or would they not just put them all in to DC and have all owners book through DC?

Yes although the DC and AP points have been aligned 1:1 for a while now and cross booking opened up to all MVC resorts, there are many complexities about the Asia set up and the AP programme that would probably make it far too difficult to open new resorts and put them in to DC.
There are even different nuances here, with for example the introduction of Surfers Paradise and Australia Points!

 

[hajjah]

Wow, that’s a great purchase. I’m surprised that went through as well.

Was the Seller in bankruptcy?

I know there are plans to build out Shadow Ridge (someday) and maybe they don’t want that much Shadow Ridge in the Trust but I still don’t get it.

Congrats on your purchase!

Best,

Greg

The total I paid was $1. The closing and transfer costs were paid by the seller. They must have really wanted out of this timeshare. I'm planning to use this timeshare to exchange into others. I'm not interested in going there since we are in the south east. We did go to the Desert Springs Villas I last year and loved it.

 

[hajjah]

Update: The documents have been sent to be recorded today.

 

[FamilyEsq]

Marriott Grand Chateau - 2 bedroom - Platinum: Passed ROFR at $1,500. Could not complete purchase because Seller deposited 2019 into II. Seller wasn't willing to pay 2019 MFs and start usage in 2020 so I walked away.

Entered into another contract for $1,300. I confirmed 2019 is available. I hope this one works out.

I really wanted to find a Platinum Plus week for sale.

 

[TXTortoise]

Maui Lahaina 3BR Week 46, before Thanksgiving.

I had inquired and broker said it just got taken by Marriott. They haven’t disclosed unit number or price, but were recommending an offer of $40k for 3BR. Guessing it went for $35k.

Wonder if new 2019 ROFR money influenced that.

 

[StevenTing]

Maui Lahaina 3BR Week 46, before Thanksgiving.

I had inquired and broker said it just got taken by Marriott. They haven’t disclosed unit number or price, but we’re recommending an offer of $40k for 3BR. Guessing it went for $35k.

Wonder if new 2019 ROFR money influenced that.

Wow. Based on this news, I was very lucky in my purchase. Mine were about $34k a piece when I bought mine 1.5 years ago.