What should I buy (in HGVC)?

[crashtime]

Hello and thanks in advance for the opinions and sharing your knowledge! I've lurked around the forums for a while, but would like to formally ask for some help getting started.

General info:I prefer to stay in the HGVC family because I trust and often choose the Hilton brand for business and family travel. The resale price and MF amount are not necessarily important to me, I just want to believe that I'm making a smart decision mathematically! I'm very math-oriented, so as I look around, I see some resales that seem to be great deals - those with prices sometimes less than $1/pt. And if I reduce that list further by ones that have low MF/pt, I can start to develop a list that seems to work.

a) Is there anything wrong with choosing a Eurpean HGVC home resort - even if I don't ever plan to go there?
b) If we're never planning to go to the same place twice (or at least not regularly), should I just do the math as suggested above to find the most amount of points for my money, with the lowest MF's annually?

1) Is there a vacation destination you wish to visit most of the time or on a regular basis? if so where? No, will actually prefer to visit different places.
2) Do you want to visit your home resort at least half the time, or do you want to trade more than half the time? Trade more often than not - home resort is not part of the decision (as far as WHERE we'll travel).
3) What are your 5 top trade destinations? No real preferences, but to at least provide some answer: Hawaii, Breckenridge (or other ski destinations), Mexico, Europe (really any other countries), NYC.
4) How many people do you usually travel with? 3.
5) Can you travel any time, or are you locked into the school schedule? Any time.
6) Can you make firm plans 12 or more mos. in advance? Yes.
7) Can you vacation for a full week at a time? Yes.
8) What level of accommodations do you prefer on a scale of 1 to 5 stars? 4+.
9) How much can you afford to spend upfront, without financing? 20k.
10) How much can you afford to spend every year for a maintenance fee that will come due right after Christmas, and increase each year? 3k.
11) Are you a detail oriented planner? Yes.
12) Do you understand that once you buy a timeshare, it may be very difficult to sell or give away, and you are responsible for all fees, until you do? Yes.

Thanks much for the guidance!

 

[crashtime]

Sorry, is my situation too specific, or did I provide too much info?

 

[SmithOp]

Sorry, is my situation too specific, or did I provide too much info?

Your answers are perfect! You seem like a good fit for a resale HGVC with a good mf/points ratio. If you check the HGVC forum there are several Sticky FAQs (at the top of the forum message list). We report annual maint fees and compile a list of best point ratios.

$20k upfront should get you a nice point package, and $3k maint fees is way more than you will need. Look for at least a platinum season 9600 point 2 bedroom, for that you could split and get two weeks in a one bedroom suitable for 3 people.

You don’t need to be concerned about where you own, points can be used anywhere. The Scotland properties are popular right now with low fees and good exchange rate, I don’t have a crystal ball to predict world currency fluctuations.



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[crashtime]

You don’t need to be concerned about where you own, points can be used anywhere. The Scotland properties are popular right now with low fees and good exchange rate, I don’t have a crystal ball to predict world currency fluctuations.

Thank you, I appreciate the response. Glad to know in my situation that it is ok to ignore the home resort completely. I hadn't considered foreign currency fluctuations as part of the decision, but that's a great point!

 

[dayooper]

Yeah, it would take a pretty good swing in currency to make a dent in the low MF’s of Scotland. It has an added benefit of being sold by HGVC and has no ROFR. Las Vegas is another low MF destination (it’s where I’m currently buying now). You will spend more upfront, but the MF’s in the back end would be well worth it.

 

[Marathoner]

Personally, I would recommend Marriott over HGVC since the II exchange company generally has higher quality resorts than RCI. Possible good Marriott choices include a platinum week in Aruba, Hawaii, Park City Mountainside (ski-in/out) , and Lake Tahoe Timber Lodge (walk to lifts). Always better to own at a resort that you can use rather than only getting a week to exchange. Would recommend staying away from Marriott DC points.

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[GT75]

I moved your thread to the Hilton forum since you specifically stated HGVC. I think that you will get more responses here by HGVC members.

Sorry that it took me so long to move but I actually have been out traveling for the past two months.

 

[GT75]

I agree with the advice from @SmithOp.

You did state in your answer to Q#3 about HGVC ski locations (which HGVC has both Valdoro Mountain Lodge {Breckenridge} and Sunrise Lodge {Park City}). Now, if you plan/want to go there regularly during ski season {especially if you have a specific week requirement}, then I would suggest buying a ski season week there on resale market. If you are very flexible and can pickup random times/partial weeks, then that is possible without owning there. If you own there ski season, then you will be able to book your exact rental size (2-bd/3-bd ect) for the week (Sat-Sat) during at 9-months to 12-month from the start date. Otherwise, you will be able to book during club booking at less than 276-days before check-out. I just don't want you to think that you will have great open availability unless you own there.

 

[dayooper]

I agree with @GT75. A ski and summer package at Valdoro would work well for you. It would give a dedicated ski week in Breckenridge and summer points as well. You can get that package resale within your $20k upfront and $3k MF’s. The Park City Utah resort (Sunrise Lodge) might be a bit harder to find within your specifications.

 

[GT75]

A ski and summer package at Valdoro would work well for you.

The only issue that I would have with Valdoro (and I actually own a ski week there) is the MFs. I think that Valdoro has some of the higher platinum MFs (MFs/point ratio) in HGVC system. So I would only recommend purchasing there if you are planning on using the ski weeks there. Since I have priced Breckenridge (VRBO & AirBnB) during ski season, I think that Valdoro is a very good deal for that use. I have been able to reserve summer season book using club booking window.

 

[GT75]

Also, I think that HGVC is rated at 4 level accommodation. I think that Hyatt (now part of Marrott, Vistana & Hyatt merger) would be 4+. But I am not the expert in that because I have only stayed in HGVC.

 

[crashtime]

Also, I think that HGVC is rated at 4 level accommodation. I think that Hyatt (now part of Marrott, Vistana & Hyatt merger) would be 4+. But I am not the expert in that because I have only stayed in HGVC.

Thanks for moving me to the right place GT75, and for all the info from all of you who responded!

I'm a total nerd, so won't go too deep into my way-over-engineered spreadsheet formulas, but generally I'm using something like this to determine the value of a resale:

[(pts*$0.30)-MF-clubfees] = [my surplus annual value] NOTE: In my research, I've valued a point at at least $0.30 for the places I might go. It's not exact, but it's a number I feel comfortable with.

Then I divide the [sales price] by the [annual value] to get a break even point in terms of years. There's other wacky stuff I do too, but this kind of let's you know how I'm running the numbers, and I'm sure it's similar to what tons of other people have discussed on these forums!

Another factor is, I want there to be a significant surplus annual value. For me, that means something near the $1000+ range.

As an example, I've seen a couple listings on TUG Marketplace and others that is pretty much this:

LV Flamingo Platinum 2bd: 7000pts, $1100MF, $3000 price.

If I do that math, I basically get $2100 in value from the points, then subtract the MF's and dues and I'm left with a bit more than $700 in surplus. So at $3000, I break even a bit after 4 years.

Are there other fees or costs that you guys are using that change that up a bunch? Do you see a flaw in that way of analyzing (outside of the subjectivity of any home resort preference and such)?

When you see that LV Flamingo deal - because it seems like there are bunch that are similar - do you look at that like a good deal or why not? I realize the MF's end up being 0.17 - which is on the higher end of the spectrum, but if the price is low enough then it works itself out (say vs. it being 0.11, but a price of $7k) for at least 10 years.

One other non-math question! When I'm ready to purchase one of these, is there someone recommended that I should have represent me, who knows what is needed to complete a safe transaction?

Thanks so much for indulging my questions and calculations!

 

[dayooper]

A 2 br platinum at the Flamingo for $3000 would be a fantastic deal! The cheapest I have seen listed is the $3900 one in the TUG marketplace now. There was one for $4000 in the TUG marketplace and the one I bought for $4500 on Redweek. Otherwise, they are generally above $6000. There are gold season 2 br Flamingo units for around $3000, but generally the platinum units are more.

 

[GT75]

I'm a total nerd, so won't go too deep into my way-over-engineered spreadsheet formulas, but generally I'm using something like this to determine the value of a resale:

I am not sure that I really followed your formula. I really am a little more basic than that on purchasing a TS. If you purchase resale for a good low price at a place where people want to go that has value then you should be able to sell it at that same price when you are finished with it. I know that some don't consider the resale value, just to be more conservative. Anyway, another user had a formula which they used to purchase (https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/best-value-hgvc.269937/#post-2105754)

Are there other fees or costs that you guys are using that change that up a bunch? Do you see a flaw in that way of analyzing (outside of the subjectivity of any home resort preference and such)?

HGVC has fees for:

Activation Fees
Enrollment/Activation fee: Purchased through Third Party or Private Sale - $599
Ownership Change Fee: $399

Transaction Fees (there are many transaction fees - {https://d1m2ucn09z2f8d.cloudfront.n...-8bba-531ddbbbeea6/2018-HGV-Club-Fees-v5a.pdf)

One other non-math question! When I'm ready to purchase one of these, is there someone recommended that I should have represent me, who knows what is needed to complete a safe transaction?

Discussion of TUG recommended resale brokers (https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/tug-recommended-brokers-for-hgvc.275240/)
Another one (https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/top-hgvc-brokers-realtors-most-listings.276212/)

If you aren't using a broker then many suggest LT Transfers to handle the closing (https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/lt-transfers-questions.267815/)

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

Remember, crashtime, you must add in the reservation fee with your maintenance fee, since you do not plan to stay at your home week. It will reduce your "profit".

 

[crashtime]

That's a good point - thanks.