UPDATE: RCI CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT - must read for all RCI members [Includes Results]

[ecwinch]

When Anon first started posting, the owner of the site verified his bonafides by asking a series of specific questions about his own RCI account that only someone with access to RCI's computers could possibly answer correctly. Anon came back with all of the right answers. He is who is says he is.

Then there is longtime TUG poster Bootleg, who also disappeared not too long after the class action was filed, and likely during an RCI witchhunt. Bootleg undoubtedly worked for RCI and helped quite a few Tuggers with issues. He also confirmed that he could see prime weeks on RCI computers that were deposited for exchange but put immediately into the rental pool instead.

I would bet on both Bootleg and Anon being the genuine article. There are some other posters who indicate they work for RCI who have posted similar things, but their bonafides are not as well established.

Sorry, I was conceived in Missouri. Is there another thread where the site owner vouched for Anon's bonafides, and what questions he used to establish the bonafides? Do you recall if it by voice or e-mail?

 

[Jennie]

RCI rents to the general public... I suggest that people that don’t like that just don’t deposit anything of value with RCI. We are RCI members and would never even consider giving a valuable week to RCI.

Um, if you don't deposit anything of value with RCI and you are suggesting that other members not deposit valuable weeks either, then why do you remain an RCI member? Am I missing something here?

 

[Jennie]

Sorry, I was conceived in Missouri. Is there another thread where the site owner vouched for Anon's bonafides, and what questions he used to establish the bonafides? Do you recall if it by voice or e-mail?

"Bootleg" and Craig Urbane posted here on TUG for a couple of years and became known personally to some of us. Craig attended a timeshare owners luncheon at the Lighthouse Cove Resort in Pompano Beach, Florida one February and many of us met him there.

Craig held an upper level position in Interval International and let us know that I.I. was beginning to get into the "rental game" after seeing how financially successful it was for RCI. His honesty on TUG seems to have cost him his job. (He checked back in at TUG a couple of years later and said he very happy owning his own business, which had nothing to do with timeshaing.

 

[Carolinian]

Sorry, I was conceived in Missouri. Is there another thread where the site owner vouched for Anon's bonafides, and what questions he used to establish the bonafides? Do you recall if it by voice or e-mail?

I am a moderator on that site, and the site owner advised moderators of his checking out Anon soon after Anon first started posting. The questions were about the site owner's own RCI account, but he did not mention the details of the questions.

 

[Happytravels]

RCI do whatever they want..

I got lumped in just for citing the user agreement language which says, in essence, that RCI can do anything it wants with deposited timeshare weeks.

So it goes.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

YA EVEN GIVE THEM BACK TO THE RESORT!! (which happened to me)

I thought once they get them they keep them, but what I found out is exactly like you said. THEY CAN DO WHATEVER THEY WANT WITH THE WEEKS. EVEN GIVE THEM BACK.

 

[doubleos]

Just for fun

I just banked a week (Thanksgiving week) about 2 weeks ago in RCI. Just for fun I wanted to see if it showed up in the available rentals and voila I found the following
Harbortown Point Marina Resort & Club (#4042) 1 available unit
Ventura
CA, 93001 USA


map resort

Available Unit Size
1 BR (6 max)
Check-In Date
21-Nov-2009
Price
$800.99

there is probably a 1% chance this is not my unit sleeps 6, check-in 11/21/09
Unfortunately it is not letting me access this listing but I was wondering if anyone might be interested in seeing if it available for exchange or if its a Voyager unit which means there is an even greater chance that it is mine.
As in the link to Anon's postings in the Insider thread here is a vacation week that went right to rentals.

 

[ecwinch]

"Bootleg" and Craig Urbane posted here on TUG for a couple of years and became known personally to some of us. Craig attended a timeshare owners luncheon at the Lighthouse Cove Resort in Pompano Beach, Florida one February and many of us met him there.

Craig held an upper level position in Interval International and let us know that I.I. was beginning to get into the "rental game" after seeing how financially successful it was for RCI. His honesty on TUG seems to have cost him his job. (He checked back in at TUG a couple of years later and said he very happy owning his own business, which had nothing to do with timeshaing.

My post was about Anon. But I do appreciate that info about Craig. I thought it is a shame that both exchanges stopped participating on TUG.

But then if we want to use developer reps as on-line punching bags, it is natural.

 

[ecwinch]

I am a moderator on that site, and the site owner advised moderators of his checking out Anon soon after Anon first started posting. The questions were about the site owner's own RCI account, but he did not mention the details of the questions.

I always have a problem with second and third hand information.

I believe you were told his bonafides were checked. It stretches me a little further, but I can even accept that site owner did some verification. With a little more stretching I can see how he might have been an employee at RCI with access to account information.

But without knowing that the bonafides support his claims, I cannot take that last step.

Now if the bonafide was "There is a Hawaii in the rental pool now. Can you tell me where it came from" and then you verify that information, then I could believe his statements.

I do not see the reason to believe everything he says, just because it can be proven that he worked at RCI. He makes some pretty boastful claims...

Could just as easily be RCI trying to draw out any proof that might exist

 

[Carolinian]

There was also a screen shot from RCI's computer posted at TST, and I do not remember if it was by Anon or by one or others who indicated they were RCI employees. While the screen shot was compressed, Bootleg verifeid on this site that it contained precisely what would be on RCI's computers. That is additional evidence that posters on TST are what they say they are.

 

[Carolinian]

You also now completely ignore Bootleg. At least one Tugger has actually talked to him on the phone at RCI. And he has helped Tuggers with problesms at RCI. Bootleg confirmed many of the same things as Anon.

I always have a problem with second and third hand information.

I believe you were told his bonafides were checked. It stretches me a little further, but I can even accept that site owner did some verification. With a little more stretching I can see how he might have been an employee at RCI with access to account information.

But without knowing that the bonafides support his claims, I cannot take that last step.

Now if the bonafide was "There is a Hawaii in the rental pool now. Can you tell me where it came from" and then you verify that information, then I could believe his statements.

I do not see the reason to believe everything he says, just because it can be proven that he worked at RCI. He makes some pretty boastful claims...

Could just as easily be RCI trying to draw out any proof that might exist

 

[Jennie]

Can someone please provide a link to the archived "Ask RCI" forum--the one where "Madge" answered questions.

Thanks!

 

[ecwinch]

Can someone please provide a link to the archived "Ask RCI" forum--the one where "Madge" answered questions.

Thanks!

I thought the Ask RCI forum on this board when back to 2005.

EDIT: If you click on the last response icon, you only get the sub-forum with Brian's post. You need to click on the forum link. That gets you to the archives.

 

[Carolinian]

I wish we had an archive of all of Bootleg's posts. He gave straight info, as opposed to Madge's bobbing and weaving.

 

[MuranoJo]

Bootleg gave me some very good advice--not necessarily about RCI rentals, but about logistics for my own trade power, places I wanted to go, etc. He really did seem to have an 'insiders' view. And I remember well his piping in on this board. I'll have to see if I kept any of his messages, but that also wouldn't 'prove' anything.

Edited to add: Aha! I did find some old '04 messages from Bootleg. I'm just not comfortable posting them here right now, and, no, we didn't get into RCI renting deposited weeks, but I did clip a cute comment he made per below:

"If you ever call us and someone says "Might be rainy,
hope you're wearing your boots!" you'll know who's on
the other end! I've surprised a few familiar Tuggers!"

Great guy--very giving and helpful.

 

[ecwinch]

You also now completely ignore Bootleg. At least one Tugger has actually talked to him on the phone at RCI. And he has helped Tuggers with problesms at RCI. Bootleg confirmed many of the same things as Anon.

No, I was not ignoring Bootleg. I just did not see any information about Bootleg that I had a comment on.

If you re-read my post, you see that I could even agree that he might work at RCI. But his boasts and reports of his sleuth work is what put me off

Did Bootleg verify Anon's claims about weeks automatically going to the rental inventory even if a open request was on the books for that resort?

 

[MuranoJo]

Can someone please provide a link to the archived "Ask RCI" forum--the one where "Madge" answered questions.

Thanks!

Jennie, if you go way to the bottom of this page, you'll find 'Archives.' Once in there, you have to scroll down past Exchanging to find archives with Madge. Here's the link:

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/archive/index.php/f-31.html

 

[Carolinian]

No, I was not ignoring Bootleg. I just did not see any information about Bootleg that I had a comment on.

If you re-read my post, you see that I could even agree that he might work at RCI. But his boasts and reports of his sleuth work is what put me off

Did Bootleg verify Anon's claims about weeks automatically going to the rental inventory even if a open request was on the books for that resort?

Yes. He initially privately emailed a Tugger that he doubted Anon's findings, then did some checking on his own RCI computer and quickly reversed his opinion. He allowed that Tugger to post his communication that confirmed what Anon was saying. Bootleg subsequently posted under his own handle about his findings as to prime weeks deposited for exchange that had nothing to do with cruises, points, or anything else, that were immediately placed into the rental pool.

Here is a thread where Bootleg, a few posts down, discusses the rental pool and where it comes from:

www.timesharetalk.co.uk/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1021

 

[Jennie]

Keep in mind that during the recent Federal Court "fairness hearing," RCI made no secret of the fact that they rent weeks that have been deposited into the space-bank. They gave what I consider to be a concocted reason for doing so--their "business model" requires flexibility due to situations such as the downturn in the economy, terrorism, gas price increases, etc... In response, the Judge made what seemed to be a sarcastic remark--something to the effect of "What does the price of gas have to do with it?"

The RCI attorneys maintain that RCI has the absolute right to rent deposited weeks because of a clause buried in fine print in the back of the annual RCI book under "Terms and Conditions" of membership. If this lawsuit does nothing more than make sure that RCI Weeks members become fully aware of this, it will have served a very useful purpose. Of course, the hope is that it will accomplish much more.

One of the changes that is supposed to be made, if the proposed settlement is approved, is that RCI will not remove more deposited weeks than the number they replace from other sources. Apparently they have been removing more weeks than they have replaced, otherwise why the need to spell this out in the agreement. Our stand is: Do whatever you want with the weeks you obtain from other sources but leave our deposited weeks in the spacebank, for exchange only with other members.

Since this company has been operating with impunity, with no impartial oversight, I don't see how anyone can doubt that RCI is renting weeks that members believed were being deposited for exchange to other members, and that RCI would generally choose the "cream of the crop" to increase their profit.

Even someone born in Missouri should not need verification from an RCI insider to accept this as a fact.

 

[Carolinian]

And as Bootleg points out, it is the PRIME weeks that RCI is removing for rental. One wonders what they are replacing them with, if anything. RCI also says that they replace weeks removed from Weeks to give to Points members but refuses to say what they are giving back. Anon says that, in fact, they give nothing back.

And if, at appears to be the case, the self-interested plaintiffs attorneys did not even do any discovery on the merits of the case, do they have any proof other than RCI's own claims or admissions, as to what is REALLY going on? Settling a case without doing substantial discovery on the merits of the case, would IMHO be malpractice. How could they possibly know how strong a case they had without discovery on the merits?

Keep in mind that during the recent Federal Court "fairness hearing," RCI made no secret of the fact that they rent weeks that have been deposited into the space-bank. They gave what I consider to be a concocted reason for doing so--their "business model" requires flexibility due to situations such as the downturn in the economy, terrorism, gas price increases, etc... In response, the Judge made what seemed to be a sarcastic remark--something to the effect of "What does the price of gas have to do with it?"

The RCI attorneys maintain that RCI has the absolute right to rent deposited weeks because of a clause buried in fine print in the back of the annual RCI book under "Terms and Conditions" of membership. If this lawsuit does nothing more than make sure that RCI Weeks members become fully aware of this, it will have served a very useful purpose. Of course, the hope is that it will accomplish much more.

One of the changes that is supposed to be made, if the proposed settlement is approved, is that RCI will not remove more deposited weeks than the number they replace from other sources. Apparently they have been removing more weeks than they have replaced, otherwise why the need to spell this out in the agreement. Our stand is: Do whatever you want with the weeks you obtain from other sources but leave our deposited weeks in the spacebank, for exchange only with other members.

Since this company has been operating with impunity, with no impartial oversight, I don't see how anyone can doubt that RCI is renting weeks that members believed were being deposited for exchange to other members, and that RCI would generally choose the "cream of the crop" to increase their profit.

Even someone born in Missouri should not need verification from an RCI insider to accept this as a fact.

 

[ecwinch]

One of the changes that is supposed to be made, if the proposed settlement is approved, is that RCI will not remove more deposited weeks than the number they replace from other sources. Apparently they have been removing more weeks than they have replaced, otherwise why the need to spell this out in the agreement. Our stand is: Do whatever you want with the weeks you obtain from other sources but leave our deposited weeks in the spacebank, for exchange only with other members.

Even someone born in Missouri should not need verification from an RCI insider to accept this as a fact.

Just for clarification, I was born in Montana. But I am so insistent on seeing the actual evidence and not relying on heresay, that I say I was conceived when my parents spent the night in Missouri.

I was not doubting that RCI rents out weeks. You interpreted my comment out of context. I was questioning the bonafides of Anon.

On a side note, I always do like to hear your first hand observations of the RCI hearing.

And I think the 1 out, 1 in rule will hurt members, especially with regard to last minute rentals. Given the low price of those weeks, it would almost benefit RCI to not make them available for rental and to let the week go to waste. Particularly if they have to replace them. I think they should be excluded. But maybe there is some aspects of that provision that I am missing.
Thanks

 

[PerryM]

Move on folks...

This thread started June 18, 2009 and what has been accomplished - nothing that I can see.

All of we RCI and RCI Points members have had an alternative to RCI for years now - the RedWeek Point exchange system. Granted that system is running on fumes but if all the folks here so bent out of shape just started using an alternative to RCI and quit RCI then RCI would listen - or at least the stockholders who eventually get revenue from RCI would start bellyaching.

Move on folks; this battle benefits just the lawyers and courts - they win no matter who wins or loses.

So just quit RCI and use RedWeek or band together and form your own exchange company. That would be something you control 100% instead of 1% as with the current litigation.

If you haven't approached your HOA and asked them to drop RCI and move to another exchange company you are spending energy in the wrong place.

 

[Carolinian]

Eric, did you get a chance to read the thread with Bootleg's comments? As he points out, it is not that hard to look up for an RCI employee with access to their computers.

Just for clarification, I was born in Montana. But I am so insistent on seeing the actual evidence and not relying on heresay, that I say I was conceived when my parents spent the night in Missouri.

I was not doubting that RCI rents out weeks. You interpreted my comment out of context. I was questioning the bonafides of Anon.

On a side note, I always do like to hear your first hand observations of the RCI hearing.

And I think the 1 out, 1 in rule will hurt members, especially with regard to last minute rentals. Given the low price of those weeks, it would almost benefit RCI to not make them available for rental and to let the week go to waste. Particularly if they have to replace them. I think they should be excluded. But maybe there is some aspects of that provision that I am missing.
Thanks

 

[Carolinian]

Perry, while I agree with you on the need for Tuggers to become proactive and encourage their resorts to dual affiliate with II and spread the word on the independents, I think you are too pessimistic about the chances of the lawsuit. The judge seems to be listening and there are now voices for timesharers who cannot be bought off like the original ''plaintiff's attorneys'' were.

Big companies can be backed down from their anti-consumer policies by customer activism. One successful one that I was involved in myself was the Save Sky Miles campaign ( www.saveskymiles.com ) at Delta.

This thread started June 18, 2009 and what has been accomplished - nothing that I can see.

All of we RCI and RCI Points members have had an alternative to RCI for years now - the RedWeek Point exchange system. Granted that system is running on fumes but if all the folks here so bent out of shape just started using an alternative to RCI and quit RCI then RCI would listen - or at least the stockholders who eventually get revenue from RCI would start bellyaching.

Move on folks; this battle benefits just the lawyers and courts - they win no matter who wins or loses.

So just quit RCI and use RedWeek or band together and form your own exchange company. That would be something you control 100% instead of 1% as with the current litigation.

If you haven't approached your HOA and asked them to drop RCI and move to another exchange company you are spending energy in the wrong place.

 

[PerryM]

Perry, while I agree with you on the need for Tuggers to become proactive and encourage their resorts to dual affiliate with II and spread the word on the independents, I think you are too pessimistic about the chances of the lawsuit. The judge seems to be listening and there are now voices for timesharers who cannot be bought off like the original ''plaintiff's attorneys'' were.

Big companies can be backed down from their anti-consumer policies by customer activism. One successful one that I was involved in myself was the Save Sky Miles campaign ( www.saveskymiles.com ) at Delta.

The outcome of this and any other legal dispute is out of our control - that judge decides.

There are alternatives to RCI and those who fight RCI have decided to bypass the alternatives and instead put their faith in one person's decision, or a bunch of folks who were Shanghaied into servitude in a court system that threatened them if they didn't conform.

Win or lose this long battle and you could have been exchanging in RedWeek and a host of other places.

That's all I'm saying.

 

[e.bram]

If Redweek let you search first like II I would join.