Time Share Ownership Advice

[Carta]

Many folks mention Resale...How about the poor shmuck that paid top dollar and had to pay to get rid of it?...

Everyone claims: I'm paying $200,$400, $600 for the week...And on and on .......Ask yourself this question: How much did I pay upfront originally? And lets not forget MAINTENANCE FEES that constantly rise

Now if u buy timeshares to make money...That's a different animal

 

[paxsarah]

Everyone claims: I'm paying $200,$400, $600 for the week...And on and on .......Ask yourself this question: How much did I pay upfront originally?

Self, how much did I pay upfront originally? Looking back, it was $359, $239, $315, $343, and a whopping $815. I guess I'm a bit embarrassed that it totals out a hair over $2,000. There are a lot of owners around here who've paid much less. Averaged out over my nine years of ownership, though, I can live with it.

And lets not forget MAINTENANCE FEES that constantly rise

As does basically the cost of everything. The maintenance costs on my home constantly rise, and it would be pretty unrealistic of me to expect the maintenance costs of a timeshare development to stay static over the years.

 

[Rolltydr]

Many folks mention Resale...How about the poor shmuck that paid top dollar and had to pay to get rid of it?...

Everyone claims: I'm paying $200,$400, $600 for the week...And on and on .......Ask yourself this question: How much did I pay upfront originally? And lets not forget MAINTENANCE FEES that constantly rise

Now if u buy timeshares to make money...That's a different animal

It is very puzzling to me why someone who hates timeshares so much would spend so much time on a forum about timeshares. Also, you keep saying everyone this and everyone that. The one thing I have learned more than anything else on this forum is that everyone doesn’t agree about timeshares.

 

[uaremymuse]

So then was the meaning behind your original question, "Can anyone explain to me how it makes financial sense for me to own a time share?" Because the answer to that is definitely not, not if you've already decided it doesn't work for you. And that's fine. Since we each speak from our own experience, we've explained how it makes financial sense to own a timeshare ourselves, or in some cases how we know it may not make financial sense but we're okay with it. The reasons we say it makes financial sense for us are right for us, and the reasons you say it doesn't make financial sense for you are right for you. Neither are going to be applicable across the board.

I agree with you but I’m always ready to be taught something new.


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[uaremymuse]

You are correct. I posted my financial justifications of timeshare ownership as a counterpoint to yours (and others’) timeshare ownership vacuums of reality.

For the benefit of those actually using this thread for research; I paid $500 or less resale for each of my units (thank you TUG), travel predominantly to Hawaii, and I am indeed bound to the school calendar peak travel times.

And your other fees? Maintenance, RCI? II? Exchange fees if applicable? Time of year to travel? Which TS? Did I miss anything?


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[uaremymuse]

It is very puzzling to me why someone who hates timeshares so much would spend so much time on a forum about timeshares. Also, you keep saying everyone this and everyone that. The one thing I have learned more than anything else on this forum is that everyone doesn’t agree about timeshares.

Where did I say I hate TS?
I like to educate myself, don’t you? Perhaps something new has changed in the industry that I know nothing about and my opinion could be swayed, right?
People generalize “all the time.” I’m sorry if that hit a nerve. Thanks for your comment.


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[uaremymuse]

Self, how much did I pay upfront originally? Looking back, it was $359, $239, $315, $343, and a whopping $815. I guess I'm a bit embarrassed that it totals out a hair over $2,000. There are a lot of owners around here who've paid much less. Averaged out over my nine years of ownership, though, I can live with it.



As does basically the cost of everything. The maintenance costs on my home constantly rise, and it would be pretty unrealistic of me to expect the maintenance costs of a timeshare development to stay static over the years.

Yes, but a house is an investment whereas a TS generally speaking isn’t. Big difference.


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[Rolltydr]

Where did I say I hate TS?
I like to educate myself, don’t you? Perhaps something new has changed in the industry that I know nothing about and my opinion could be swayed, right?
People generalize “all the time.” I’m sorry if that hit a nerve. Thanks for your comment.


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That post was a response to @Carta, not you.

 

[paxsarah]

Yes, but a house is an investment whereas a TS generally speaking isn’t. Big difference.

But both have to be maintained. I would expect the maintenance costs of both to rise, regardless of the underlying resale value. The timeshare has to be repaired, heated, cooled, landscaped. You need to keep the water and the cable running. And the costs of all of those things generally rise over time.

 

[SteelerGal]

Actually many ppl purchased direct. I just happen to not be one of them. I was lucky because a friend suggested I could rent TS instead of buying. That’s what we did until I learned enough to buy resale.
I will say that all of my resales were at least enjoyed by previous owners for at least 15yrs.

 

[uaremymuse]

That post was a response to @Carta, not you.

My response was to your response to Carta.


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[uaremymuse]

But both have to be maintained. I would expect the maintenance costs of both to rise, regardless of the underlying resale value. The timeshare has to be repaired, heated, cooled, landscaped. You need to keep the water and the cable running. And the costs of all of those things generally rise over time.

True but I’d rather pay maintenance costs on an investment.


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[bluehende]

Many folks mention Resale...How about the poor shmuck that paid top dollar and had to pay to get rid of it?...

Everyone claims: I'm paying $200,$400, $600 for the week...And on and on .......Ask yourself this question: How much did I pay upfront originally? And lets not forget MAINTENANCE FEES that constantly rise

Now if u buy timeshares to make money...That's a different animal

Many poor schmucks have made mistakes. That has no bearing on my decision in timeshares as well as many other things. If I could have helped them I would have but at this point that is a done deal.

 

[bluehende]

True but I’d rather pay maintenance costs on an investment.


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I would rather have my investments have no maintenance costs. I have owned my home, an investment property, and a vacation home. Not one of those came close to the investment quality that the S&P was over the same time frame. Was owning these a mistake? Not in my mind because I got value other than the investment value.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

@uaremymuse 60% of the time it is a bad use of money if you buy resale and 99% of the time when you buy from developer. Like anything you have to pick what's works and if it doesn't work for you then it's not a fit. Simple. Renting is risky and there are a lot of low quality AirBnBs out there. But we also use renting when it works. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. you are a financial guy, so think portfolio e.g. very selective timeshare, some rent. It's like stock picking...

Here is how it works for us. We travel during peak season in Maui and Oahu and want oceanfront at top resorts. We purchased an EOY Westin OF for $12k resale. These units rent for $5000+ per week during the summer. Three rentals and we have spent $15k+resort fees with nothing to show for it. With owning, we have ROI vs. renting after 3 visits. Even better, we can lockoff the unit and rent half for the cost of MF = Free stay (or small profit) for one week in OF at the Westin, or we can lockoff and get two weeks out of the MF = $1400/week in OF in HI during peak. You can't rent similar unit for anywhere near that price. If the lockoff rents for $3,800 then we are ahead $2,400 per WEEK or saving $4,800 vs. renting those two weeks.

Last summer we had a 3 bedroom penthouse at the Lagoon Tower at Hilton Hawaiian Village over the July 4 holiday. Our cost was about $1000/week. The room rents for $2500/DAY. We recouped the cost of a TS we purchased with that single trade by 4x vs renting (if we could even find one to rent). Our timeshare that we traded still has resale value but could give it away easily tomorrow and still be way ahead financially.

 

[Rolltydr]

My response was to your response to Carta.


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Bye bye.


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[uaremymuse]

I would rather have my investments have no maintenance costs. I have owned my home, an investment property, and a vacation home. Not one of those came close to the investment quality that the S&P was over the same time frame. Was owning these a mistake? Not in my mind because I got value other than the investment value.

Everyone would love not to have maintenance costs with any investment but I’ve not found too many investments that don’t have it.

But to your point, there’s maintenance costs even with stock ownership and you can’t put a dollar value on one’s enjoyment, whether with owning a TS or a bike. Enjoy your TSs. Many do. Just not my cup of tea for an investment or for enjoyment purposes as an owner, which I’m no longer thank God.


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[uaremymuse]

@uaremymuse 60% of the time it is a bad use of money if you buy resale and 99% of the time when you buy from developer. Like anything you have to pick what's works and if it doesn't work for you then it's not a fit. Simple. Renting is risky and there are a lot of low quality AirBnBs out there. But we also use renting when it works. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. you are a financial guy, so think portfolio e.g. very selective timeshare, some rent. It's like stock picking...

Here is how it works for us. We travel during peak season in Maui and Oahu and want oceanfront at top resorts. We purchased an EOY Westin OF for $12k resale. These units rent for $5000+ per week during the summer. Three rentals and we have spent $15k+resort fees with nothing to show for it. With owning, we have ROI vs. renting after 3 visits. Even better, we can lockoff the unit and rent half for the cost of MF = Free stay (or small profit) for one week in OF at the Westin, or we can lockoff and get two weeks out of the MF = $1400/week in OF in HI during peak. You can't rent similar unit for anywhere near that price. If the lockoff rents for $3,800 then we are ahead $2,400 per WEEK or saving $4,800 vs. renting those two weeks.

Last summer we had a 3 bedroom penthouse at the Lagoon Tower at Hilton Hawaiian Village over the July 4 holiday. Our cost was about $1000/week. The room rents for $2500/DAY. We recouped the cost of a TS we purchased with that single trade by 4x vs renting (if we could even find one to rent). Our timeshare that we traded still has resale value but could give it away easily tomorrow and still be way ahead financially.

If I understand correctly, you own a Westin unit for $12k. How much are the annual maintenance fees? What week do you own and what size is the unit?


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[uaremymuse]

Bye bye.


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Bye bye


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[Chrispee]

And your other fees? Maintenance, RCI? II? Exchange fees if applicable? Time of year to travel? Which TS? Did I miss anything?

- Maintenance fees: Sheraton Desert Oasis Annual ($1180), Marriott's Shadow Ridge Enclaves EOY ($790), Marriott's Canyon Villas EOY ($750), Marriott's Willow Ridge EOY ($650).
- Each unit gets locked off as I rarely feel the need to deposit a 2br in II to get my desired trade
- Exchange costs $154 and I usually add eplus for $60. Factor in $50 for II membership and another $40 for the lockoff and hey maybe I've upgraded my unit size for another $60.

Even with my most expensive unit I'm at $1154 for a week, but I've averaged my costs out per night over the past couple of years and it came out to under $140 per night (as I stated in an earlier post). So, this is how I make timesharing financially viable for my family's personal situation, but I definitely agree with you that it doesn't make financial sense for people in other situations (particularly not buying resale).

I'm interested to hear what you own?

 

[uaremymuse]

- Maintenance fees: Sheraton Desert Oasis Annual ($1180), Marriott's Shadow Ridge Enclaves EOY ($790), Marriott's Canyon Villas EOY ($750), Marriott's Willow Ridge EOY ($650).
- Each unit gets locked off as I rarely feel the need to deposit a 2br in II to get my desired trade
- Exchange costs $154 and I usually add eplus for $60. Factor in $50 for II membership and another $40 for the lockoff and hey maybe I've upgraded my unit size for another $60.

Even with my most expensive unit I'm at $1154 for a week, but I've averaged my costs out per night over the past couple of years and it came out to under $140 per night (as I stated in an earlier post). So, this is how I make timesharing financially viable for my family's personal situation, but I definitely agree with you that it doesn't make financial sense for people in other situations (particularly not buying resale).

I'm interested to hear what you own?

Sounds like it’s working for you. I spoke to my prior ownership in an earlier post if you care to look for it. I’ve always been able to rent a time share from an owner that’s less expensive than owning at the location of the rental, local hotels and other open market rentals. Thank you for your reply.


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[heathpack]

And your other fees? Maintenance, RCI? II? Exchange fees if applicable? Time of year to travel? Which TS? Did I miss anything?


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Lol you are amusing. You think you're smarter than everyone else in the room? Do you honestly believe that everyone else is delusional and can't run numbers?

Here's my example:
SBP 1BR gold plus week free on TUG
MF $615
II membership $100/yr
Exchange fee including eplus and unit size upgrade ~$400
Total costs ~$1100
When I'm done with this timeshare, Sheraton will take it back as a deedback.

Exchanged for a week in Sedona in a 2BR unit over Thanksgiving 2020. The EXACT check in date and location relative to trailheads that I want.

The cheapest VRBO for a 2BR or larger place with a kitchen and washer/dryer in a similar (but not as good location), same check in date, including taxes and fees ~$2400.


Timeshares are my favorite travel hack. They are definitely a cost effective means of travel.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Westin Maui 2 Bedroom Oceanfront Lockoff (1 side studio OF and 1 side 1 Bdrm OF) Platinum 1- 50 weeks (we use during peak summer but similarly expensive rent during whale season). MF + dues approx $2750 EOY so approx $1400/year. A sample of Redweek rental listings below:

 

[uaremymuse]

Lol you are amusing. You think you're smarter than everyone else in the room? Do you honestly believe that everyone else is delusional and can't run numbers?

Here's my example:
SBP 1BR gold plus week free on TUG
MF $615
II membership $100/yr
Exchange fee including eplus and unit size upgrade ~$400
Total costs ~$1100
When I'm done with this timeshare, Sheraton will take it back as a deedback.

Exchanged for a week in Sedona in a 2BR unit over Thanksgiving 2020. The EXACT check in date and location relative to trailheads that I want.

The cheapest VRBO for a 2BR or larger place with a kitchen and washer/dryer in a similar (but not as good location), same check in date, including taxes and fees ~$2400.


Timeshares are my favorite travel hack. They are definitely a cost effective means of travel.

No, to your question. Of course not. My original question was sincere. Why would I think I’m smarter than others who actually own TSs when I obviously don’t? That’s a silly statement.

It’s wonderful that owning works for you and others. It never worked for me in any sense. Maybe I’m the one who is lacking in TS ownership smarts which is why I’ll stick with my real estate vacation investment membership where in the end I don’t paying anything for my vacations to places all over the world and in multi million dollar lovely single family homes in premier resorts that come with personal concierge service, daily maid service, on call car service, etc. Of course it’s not for everyone because of the initial investment but if you can afford the investment, well, it’s a great way to travel and enjoy life with zero costs.


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[CalGalTraveler]

I just checked the Marriott site. Cannot find a 2 bedroom but the 1 bedroom lockoff of the Ocean View (not OF) is $683 - $687/night plus resort fees (none for owners) plus parking (free for owners) so that's $4571 - $4810 just for a 1 bedroom without oceanfront! Compare that to $2750 for MF for a 2 bdrm OF that can be locked off with half rented = free stay; or stay for 2 weeks at $1400/week. This unit will also be easy to dispose of someday as these are highly desirable units. So if we lose half of our initial capital, we have only lost $6k over 20 - 30 years. Worst case $12k, so what? This won't bankrupt us and we can keep staying for free or rent out until it is time to give away.

Unlike developer purchases, the beauty of resale is you cannot lose money you haven't spent.