Starwood Has Won [Unilateral II Changes] [merged]

[ArtsieAng]

It would only show up as platinum if it were one of the floating 1-21,50-52 weeks that were sold by Starwood. The original floating 1-52 weeks are all considered gold plus because they are pre-Starwood, even though the underlying deeded week might be a week that falls during platinum season.

If someone owns a non-SVN deeded wk that falls between weeks 1-21, 50-52, and has the right to reserve that week, what gives Starwood the right to determine that those weeks are not to be considered Platinum?

I'm very confused by this, because some of us non-SVN owners have a right to reserve our deeded week. Just because those weeks were purchased prior to Starwood taking over, they have a right to say that a deeded Platinum week is no longer Platinum?

Just doesn't seem right to me.

 

[djyamyam]

You always have to pay the exchange fee at the time of entering an ongoing search. You may be confusing an ongoing search with an instant search online.

Sorry about not being clear. I rarely use an ongoing search. I have had more luck when I do the search myself as I'm online quite often. That's what I meant. When you have 5+ Starwood weeks, I find I get better results searching rather than using II. Now, I only have the request first option if I want to "look" / "search" *whatever term you want to use past the 12 month mark. Therefore I have to pay the fee. So it amounts to more out-of-pocket money sooner

 

[bogeygolf]

The other consideration is that I have to put out the cost of the exchange fee to do the ongoing search. I didn't have to do that previously when I did all the searching. I'd only pay the fee if I found something I wanted to confirm. When you more than 1 week (like 5 or 6), that's a lot of exchange fees to put out at one time just to search!

I believe that's always been the case with most if not all II ongoing request. You always have to pay the exch. fee first. If your just doing an instance search to see what is available at that moment and not putting in a request for on-going then you don't have to pay. If your ongoing search is not met, II will refund your fee.

 

[djyamyam]

If someone owns a non-SVN deeded wk that falls between weeks 1-21, 50-52, and has the right to reserve that week, what gives Starwood the right to determine that those weeks are not to be considered Platinum?

I'm very confused by this, because some of us non-SVN owners have a right to reserve our deeded week. Just because those weeks were purchased prior to Starwood taking over, they have a right to say that a deeded Platinum week is no longer Platinum?

Just doesn't seem right to me.

I totally agree with you. That's how Starwood applies the rules for SVN, which I don't have a problem with because you agree to those rules by opting into SVN but outside the system, it shouldn't apply, which was Pat's comment about her SBP week 27 ownership. The same applies my SDO "platinum" weeks.

 

[ArtsieAng]

I totally agree with you. That's how Starwood applies the rules for SVN, which I don't have a problem with because you agree to those rules by opting into SVN but outside the system, it shouldn't apply, which was Pat's comment about her SBP week 27 ownership. The same applies my SDO "platinum" weeks.

Exactly!

What they do within SVN, and what one agrees to is one thing. This is just wrong, IMO.

 

[ArtsieAng]

Another thing that has always bothered me is that SVO's have never gotten an AC from II.......If Starwood has just renegotiated a new system/deal with II, you would think they would have gotten us AC's for our deposits....That would have been a nice little perk. Sheesh!

 

[bccash63]

I own a lockout odd yr 1-21, 51-52 at SDO, can anyone confirm if these are showing up as platinum? At this point I only belong to RCI but was considering joining II. Not sure if I want to now Dawn

 

[Politico]

I own a lockout odd yr 1-21, 51-52 at SDO, can anyone confirm if these are showing up as platinum? At this point I only belong to RCI but was considering joining II. Not sure if I want to now Dawn

same question. I am not seeing in my non-SVN II account how these weeks are now being designated.

 

[barndweller]

1-21, 51-52 at SDO is designated as Plat Plus (all prime time). I think SDO 1-52 is Gold Plus (averaged between non-prime and prime is my guess).

 

[Joshadelic]

1-21, 51-52 at SDO is designated as Plat Plus (all prime time). I think SDO 1-52 is Gold Plus (averaged between non-prime and prime is my guess).

It's actually 1-21, 50-52 - which sucks because I have a deeded week 50. If you look at the travel demand index, week 50 is not good at all. Hopefully they are saying that my crappy week 50 that happens to be plat-plus will now be as valuable as an average of all the other weeks in that season. We'll see.

 

[bizaro86]

As barndweller has pointed out, if you don't like the new II rules for depositing Starwood timeshares, don't use II. And, if II can't change its rules for depositing, I'd really like to know what law, what right of timeshare ownership or what declaration II is violating by changing its rules for depositing timeshares. ... eom

This is exactly why this change isn't illegal. Starwood can't tell you what to do with a week you have a right to, since you have a deed.

But II doesn't have to take it in trade from you unless they want to. Nobody here has a deed from II. II has decided that they'll only take starwood resorts under circumstances that aren't beneficial for some (many, most?) starwood owners. That will probably reduce the number of starwood exchanges they get, which is a benefit they'll have to weigh against keeping Starwood, the timeshare development company, happy.

II could make a policy change, and say, "From now on we're only giving 3 nights in a Comfort Inn and a bonus Sham-wow for depositing a Starwood TS." Everyone would complain, and nobody would deposit into II, which would hurt them. They've decided to make a change that helps Starwood corporate and hurts non-svn owners.

Potential recourse to non-svn owners:

1) Complain, and hope II/Starwood changes their mind

2) Deposit your TS with an alternative company, thus depriving II of revenue, and helping build the independents as viable competitors to II.

The more people that do 2), the more likely 1) is to succeed.

Best regards,

Michael

 

[barndweller]

In looking again, I stand corrected on the Plat Plus designation. It is Float weeks 1-21,50,52. This on a deed means your unit will have that level of trade power if you chose to use II for an exchange. Units with a deed listing Float 1-52 only recieve Gold Plus because the average of all weeks of the year is lower trade power than the average of the higher demand weeks. I guess there are deeds with only non-prime weeks, perhaps summer (?) that would be a lower designation. Fixed weeks owners should be assigned the level of their individual week by Starwood. It appears they are being averaged and should not be, in my opinion. They will have to fight Starwood on that.

Looking at what my units can pull doing searches right now, I don't see a lot of difference between Gold Plus and Plat Plus. I think your actual deeded week on a float week deed doesn't affect your trading power.

Keep in mind that the hassle of getting a prime reservation for the purpose of exchanging and then jumping through hoops to make sure that week got deposited was the initial complaint of non-SVN owners. That issue has been eliminated. Starwood has granted our wish. But now we have to accept their terms. As people try out the system we may find that it works just fine and the majority will find it much easier to make nice exchanges. As long as you are sure you won't use your unit yourself, you have nothing to loose by depositing under the new system no matter what exchange company you choose to use.

 

[Captron]

I am checking my understanding of this situation as we know it and our response.

By instituting this new process Starwood has negated the advantage of having an out of network unit. All weeks SVN and non-SVN are going to be treated exactly the same for exchange purposes. They will be assigned a trading value based on the season in which they fall (possibly that each (and every) week in a particular season would be assigned trading power equal to the average of that season's trading power).

Is this statement accurate?

We are attempting to get changes to this to be able to search first, search more than a year in advance from the current date and, specifically for non-SVN weeks, reserve a specific week to deposit with an exchange company.

Is this also accurate?

Thanks for helping me get my head around this!

 

[rickandcindy23]

I would say the exchange power will be averaged in any given season, so my 9-43, 47 SBP's will have the exchange power based on the average of all. Not really good, I don't think.

 

[Captron]

R/C

That is what I meant I will edit to try to make it more clear. Do you otherwise agree with the statements?

 

[Twinkstarr]

Captron,

I think you've covered the important issues in your post.

 

[WINSLOW]

Okay, I now know that my trading power is less then it was before.

When the Sheraton Broadway Plantation June 2010 weeks came up on the sightings board, I tested my Vistana 2 bedroom week, which is now classified as a VI2 Gold Plus. I couldn't see any weeks with it. I tried my Marriott Aruba Surf 1 bedroom and could see all the weeks, so there was no SVN priority.
I know Vistana is only a lowly Florida week, but before the II rule change I could see everything that my Aruba could see, putting in a week 7 (which is what is on my deed). They were always pretty equal as long as I put in a high demand week for the Vistana to trade with. If Marriott could see it then being in the SVN priority my Vistana could definitely see it. Now I can't.

I was wondering if all weeks at resorts like Vistana only have one level (Gold Plus) or should there be 2 levels because on the StarOption chart there is 2 levels - Platinum and Gold Plus?
How is everyone else's new code, does it follow the same week/color catagory as the StarOptions chart for the most part? Or are all units at a resort averaged out to just 1 level?


I called II and they said that SVN is in charge of putting me in the Gold plus catagory and to speak to them.
I called SVN and spoke to an owner advisor who said its II who does it.
she then conferenced II who still said it was SVN.
The advisor put me thru to customer relations who is supposed to call me back. We'll see?

Oh, I asked about info being sent out about the rules and customer relations said II is in charge of sending out new books but it won't be until the 2010 books come out anyway. No info flyer or quick email about the new rules, we just have to wait until II does it's regular 2010 book mailing.

Any help? Thank You Crystal

 

[Twinkstarr]

Winslow,

You know between all of us Tuggers, will have the whole thing figured out before the II books come out.

If the new rules are going to be in the II book, and I don't think they print up a "special Starwood" addition, do you think that it's II starting the 12 months for an ongoing search? That it could be for all II members(hyatt, marriott etc etc?). The season avg trading range, pulling your week out, and no request first I think are from Starwood.

I just come up with this, as I talked to the *wood desk at II and the lady said something about "most people don't start ongoing searchs until a year out or less." Mine for July 2010 has been in since March 2009. I think they called me wanting to know why I haven't been bugging them about getting a match.

 

[lily28]

I called II starwood desk today regard clarification on SI2 code which is given to my large SDO unit float 1-52. I was told that SI2 corresponds to gold plus, not platinum. Per II, gold plus refers to weeks 22-27 and 36-49. I protests that the week floats wk 1-52 and how come it correlates to different weeks under the II system. I was then told to call starwood.

Talked to a starwood resolution specialist regard above problem. I mention since the week I was inquiring is deeded week 10, then how can it become gold plus with different week association under the II. This resolution specialist said since the new deposit system is new and SDO has multiple seasons, she has to check with someone. since it is the labor day holiday weekend, many people have left early and she won't get back to me till tuesday. I keep you posted.

I am sure that the power of my deposit will go down with this new system.

 

[WINSLOW]

I called II starwood desk today regard clarification on SI2 code which is given to my large SDO unit float 1-52. I was told that SI2 corresponds to gold plus, not platinum. Per II, gold plus refers to weeks 22-27 and 36-49. I protests that the week floats wk 1-52 and how come it correlates to different weeks under the II system. I was then told to call starwood.

Your situation sounds the same a mine. Which is why I am just trying to clarify if all of Vistana Fountains weeks are concidered Gold Plus or if anyone has a Platinum code for their unit?

Do you know if anyone has a Platinum code for your SDO? On the StarOption chart SDO has 3 levels, did they just average out all the weeks to a Gold Plus? If so, people that bought gold weeks get better and people that bought platinum get worse trading power?

Per II, gold plus refers to weeks 22-27 and 36-49.

Per II - where did you get or see that info? Is it in their book/online or did someone from II give you the breakdown for Gold Plus? Did they breakdown the Platinum and other too?

Thanks, Crystal

 

[tschwa2]

Per II, gold plus refers to weeks 22-27 and 36-49.[/QUOTE]

Per II - where did you get or see that info? Is it in their book/online or did someone from II give you the breakdown for Gold Plus? Did they breakdown the Platinum and other too?


My understanding from previous discussions about requalifying starwood weeks is that the previous developer sold weeks that floated 1-52 regardless of the deeded week. When Starwood took over they sold weeks in seasons. Resales from originally deeded weeks still retain their ability to float over the year but starwood valued them lower and averaged out the seasons. People looking to requalify weeks have always looked for what they call "true platinum weeks" which float only during the corresponding seasons. There are stickeys and threads about which buildings at which resorts trade as "true platinum". Starwood is trying to make everyone who trades in II play by their rules where it doesn't matter what you reserve or what your deeded week is, it only matters what season they give for your deeded ownership.

 

[lily28]

Crystal, starwood told me my unit's code is SI2. representative at II told me this code is gold plus season and correlate to the specific weeks I mention.

 

[WINSLOW]

Crystal, starwood told me my unit's code is SI2. representative at II told me this code is gold plus season and correlate to the specific weeks I mention.

Thank you. I have a feeling all of Fountains is probably all one season (Gold Plus), but I'm going to call II back to see if they have a breakdown of multiple seasons anyway.

 

[ricki999]

Although Starwood has historically played with the right of a non-SVN unit owner to deposit a non-SVN week, they needed help to pull off this new caper -- and I think the real culprit is I.I. Why is that?

First, Starwood has had a very cozy relationship with I.I.; think about the retroactive reassignment of units bulk banked by Starwood over the years.

Next, there is absolutely nothing preventing I.I. from accepting non-SVN reservations; other exchange companies do.

Finally, as rickandcindy point out above, this is new arrangement may not be in I.I.'s interest; they will end up with only "average" deposits rather than the mix of the previous hand-selected deposits by knowledgeable owners and the previous bulk deposits by Starwood.

My theory: I.I. is running scared. Disney just moved to RCI. Marriott is (maybe) moving to an internal trading system. Starwood already has a relationship with RCI on its older resorts which could presumably be expanded. If Starwood also switched its primary external trading company, I.I. would lose much of its remaining high-end exchange resorts, and losing Disney, Marriott, and Starwood within a year or two would be devasting.

So -- and this is total speculation -- Starwood has enough bargaining power with I.I. at this particular point in time that it can force I.I. not to accept "unauthorized" deposits, even if the owner has the legal right to use, rent, or deposit a reserved use week. What Starwood previously tried to accomplish by misinformation to the owners of the units ("we will deposit a week for you"), it will accomplish by forcing a change in its relationship with I.I. instead.

I'm a Marriott owner and don't often venture into the Starwood board and just learned about the big change going on for Starwood owners and Interval. With the suspected upcoming changes in the Marriott system, I would agree with your speculation.

 

[Ken555]

My fixed weeks are still showing as able to deposit at II, as of this morning.

Update: I just checked my SVN corporate II account. That account now shows my SVR (fixed) weeks as floating weeks, and has 2009, 2010, and 2011 available for both of my weeks (so I see six (6) weeks I could use, even though some of those have already been exchanged...). It also has this sentence at the bottom of each listing:

Note: Contact resort/club to obtain reservation or assignment. 1-888-9869637

Even so, my personal II account also continues to list the SAME UNITS for 2010 and 2011.

I'm not sure whether to be pleased or not. I've only exchanged them a few times, but my May SVR week seems to be quite good while Dec is not as good. This change may make my Dec week better while neutralizing the benefit of the May week... At the moment, I'm of the opinion that it was working before, and don't agree with the change.

And yes, I own fixed weeks, which II specifically told me when I first registered them that they & Starwood couldn't change for me since my deed stated what I owned and that's what had to be deposited. I love it when companies like Starwood say whatever they like one day and then reverse themselves the next for no good reason.

If I have time this week (I'm at WKORV so I'm not going out of my way for this...) I will call Starwood. Since my SVR weeks are listed in the corporate account, and since I paid the renovation special assessment for these weeks... I'm going to let them tell me which week I can deposit... as long as they put these weeks in SVN and give me SOs. That's what I want now. If they do that, then I don't care how they let me trade them. Anything less and I'm going to start writing letters.