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Snowbirding -- how to?

ScoopKona

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I'm confused about intention of this post within a post.

Squatters are a problem.

Squatters are a HUGE problem in both areas where I owned property. I've had squatters on both ends and had to run them out. Leaving a property vacant for weeks at a time is a risk -- a potentially huge risk depending on where the snowbird lives.

I was actually a reverse snowbird -- escaping summer heat (and working on the farm while escaping the heat).

Theft is a problem. Plumbing issues are a problem. And there's really no good way for a snowbird to ensure they avoid all problems. It's not a question of "if."
 

silentg

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There was a Tug Member, Ray Harper who used to be a snowbird. He wrote a section called Travels with Ray. His advice my be archived on TUG? We met him in Massachusetts once with his wife Darlene when we were on vacation.
Sadly he passed away, but his journeys were an interesting read.
silentg
 

WinniWoman

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Our neighbors rent an apartment for like 6 weeks every winter in Aruba. Maybe you could do that somewhere out West?
 

DeniseM

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We have owned a 2nd home for 12 years. Originally, we built the 2nd home to be our retirement home, but eventually we decided to keep both homes. Our original home is paid off and we have a small mortgage on the 2nd home with a 3% mortgage rate. We got lucky, because we built the 2nd home when the housing market was really depressed, so we got a great deal, it has more than doubled in value since we bought it, and it would be easy to sell.

We love having a 2nd home and it's a "vacation home," for us now. But it's not everyone's cup of tea - kind of like timesharing:
- You need to have the income to support 2 homes with no strain.
- You need to have low maintenance so that you can leave both homes and they will run on their own for awhile.
- You need to be handy around the house and landscaping and not mind doing things yourself.

We live in a new neighborhood and have none of the crime issues that were previously mentioned. We are friendly with our neighbors at both homes, and they look after our places for us when we aren't there.

We have had a couple of drip system problems when we weren't there, but we have used a local landscaping company a number of times (they installed the system originally) and we can call them and have them go fix things, even if we can't be there. We do have a web cam and an alarm system.

Since our 2nd home was originally going to be a retirement home, we definitely have 2 of everything, but this isn't a problem for us. In fact it's ideal, because we don't have to take anything back and forth. We can hop in the car and be there in 4-5 hours, and everything we need will be waiting for us.

YMMV
 
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easyrider

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Not for some people here. God has bless them with luck and nothing bad happens in their world and they make sure you know it.

Sounds kind of like my world, lol. You have probably heard the line "God helps those that help themselves". In a way, it's about trying to be prepared so when the bad happens you have ways to work it out. God bless you renter.

Bill
 

b2bailey

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Squatters are a problem.

Squatters are a HUGE problem in both areas where I owned property. I've had squatters on both ends and had to run them out. Leaving a property vacant for weeks at a time is a risk -- a potentially huge risk depending on where the snowbird lives.

I was actually a reverse snowbird -- escaping summer heat (and working on the farm while escaping the heat).

Theft is a problem. Plumbing issues are a problem. And there's really no good way for a snowbird to ensure they avoid all problems. It's not a question of "if."
So, the OP should just stay home?
There have been snowbirds flying (or taking train, or driving for many years).
 

b2bailey

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Our neighbors rent an apartment for like 6 weeks every winter in Aruba. Maybe you could do that somewhere out West?
A friend of friend -- lives in NY. Came to visit my friend near San Diego many years ago. They fell in love with Oceanside, rented a condo for 6 weeks and have returned every winter.
 

ScoopKona

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So, the OP should just stay home?
There have been snowbirds flying (or taking train, or driving for many years).

Why are you putting words in my mouth?

I'm not saying "stay put." But I AM saying the old Yiddish idiom, "Man plans, God laughs." Maintaining two domiciles (even if one is just a temporary rental) is more than twice as hard as maintaining one. Anyone who says otherwise has been lucky. Good for them. But luck runs out.

Mann Tracht, Un Gott Lacht
 

VacationForever

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We are both avid golfers and spend 2 weeks after Thanksgiving every year rotating between Scottsdale, Palm Desert and Hawaii. Golfing in Hawaii is the most expensive. We then spend another 4 to 5 weeks in Palm Desert in January every year in Marriott's Desert Springs Villas 1. We tried WM Indio in Jan earlier this year. While the resort was alright (it's not a Marriott :)), the WIFI was horrendous, dropping a dozen times every hour. I wrote to WM/Wyndham CEO, COO etc... and got a response promising that they would work on fixing it. We don't see ourselves going back to Indio as long as we can get our dates in Desert Springs Villas 1.

We also spend a month or two of summer in coastal California, typically using Worldmark points, at Oceanside. This year we went to Monterey and it was too cold for my husband. Next year we are splitting our summer between WM Oceanside and Park City (Marriott).

We own at Marriott and Worldmark and find that we have our winter and summer getaway needs met between both systems.

We golf 4 to 5 days a week while home and 3 to 4 days a week when we travel. The costs add up very quickly. :(
 
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Elan

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We are both avid golfers and spend 2 weeks after Thanksgiving every year rotating between Scottsdale, Palm Desert or Hawaii. Golfing in Hawaii is the most expensive. We then spend another 4 to 5 weeks in Palm Desert in January every year in Marriott's Desert Springs Villas 1. We tried WM Indio in Jan earlier this year. While the resort was alright (it's not a Marriott :)), the WIFI was horrendous, dropping a dozen times every hour. I wrote to WM/Wyndham CEO, COO etc... and got a response promising that they would work on fixing it. We don't see ourselves going back to Indio as long as we can get our dates in Desert Springs Villas 1.

We also spend a month or two of summer in coastal California, typically using Worldmark points, at Oceanside. This year we went to Monterey and it was too cold for my husband. Next year we are splitting our summer between WM Oceanside and Park City (Marriott).

We own at Marriott and Worldmark and find that we have our winter and summer getaway needs met between both systems.

We golf 4 to 5 days a week while home and 3 to 4 days a week when we travel. The costs add up very quickly. :(
If you don't mind sharing, can you give rough estimate of greens fees in Palm Desert area. If you don't care to, that's fine. I have looked a little online, but there's always discount options like GolfNow, etc. that are sometimes hard to determine.
 

VacationForever

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If you don't mind sharing, can you give rough estimate of greens fees in Palm Desert area. If you don't care to, that's fine. I have looked a little online, but there's always discount options like GolfNow, etc. that are sometimes hard to determine.
It "depends". With discount sites like golfmoose and underpar, you can get a round under $100 at Mountain Vista (Sun City) course. They have 2 courses, Santa Rosa is the better one but both are decent, although this January they had to close off some holes due to flood/mud. It had never happened in all the years that we played there. A few of the less expensive courses to play would be Mission Hills North (Gary Player) and the newly refurbished Westin Mission Hills (Rancho Mirage - Pete Dye) course. They are about $110 to $120 a round.

We had been getting Troon cards although they changed the program in 2025 and it's no longer a good deal. When we had/have the Troon cards, we played regularly at Indian Wells Golf Resort courses and they used to cost us about $120 a round. They had the 2-for-1 deal in the old program so we played for half the price once at each of the courses on the program. That is all gone in the new program. Normal rate is about $170 a round. I think we won't be playing there in January. Classic Club is a tough course and regular rate is also about $170 or so. There are some good and not so good courses everywhere that you can play for about $110 to $120 a round. JW Marriott has 2 courses and used to cost about $120 a round for owners and resort guests. I checked recently and it looks like the rate has gone up to about $150 We really like the Palm course there.

There are 2 courses at WM Indio and they are cheap, about $80 a round. They are quite playable. Cimarron (Boulder - 18 holes) golf course is also in good condition and costs about $110 or so, based on my memory. Cimarron Pebble course is an executive course and costs maybe like $70. We really like this course too.

We also play at private courses there because we have friends who own second homes there, and Toscana (private) has 2 very nice courses.

If you want even more details on where we have played etc, I will need to look at my calendar, and you will need to PM me before I put this forum to sleep. :)
 
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moonstone

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Since our 2nd home was originally going to be a retirement home, we definitely have 2 of everything, but this isn't a problem for us. In fact it's ideal, because we don't have to take anything back and forth.

We are in a similar situation with our Florida condo. My Dad moved into a retirement home a few months before we were going to furnish our condo. We had already emptied out the cottage of everything we wanted and then Dad said to take what we wanted from the house before it was sold. We didnt take furniture as it is too costly to take to Florida but I did get lots of kitchen stuff and linens. That saved us a lot of money with not needing to buy 2nds of everything. DH and I brought down a bunch of our clothes, summer and cooler weather, to leave here and we purchased extra bathing suits, sandals, jackets and other items so we could travel back and forth with just a backpack when we go home at Christmas and in early March for a few days. We drive down in October so we have 2-3 days of clothes from home with us but they are worn again for the drive back home in April.
It is really nice to get on a plane for a few weeks away with just a personal item!

~Diane
 

b2bailey

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We are both avid golfers and spend 2 weeks after Thanksgiving every year rotating between Scottsdale, Palm Desert or Hawaii. Golfing in Hawaii is the most expensive. We then spend another 4 to 5 weeks in Palm Desert in January every year in Marriott's Desert Springs Villas 1. We tried WM Indio in Jan earlier this year. While the resort was alright (it's not a Marriott :)), the WIFI was horrendous, dropping a dozen times every hour. I wrote to WM/Wyndham CEO, COO etc... and got a response promising that they would work on fixing it. We don't see ourselves going back to Indio as long as we can get our dates in Desert Springs Villas 1.

We also spend a month or two of summer in coastal California, typically using Worldmark points, at Oceanside. This year we went to Monterey and it was too cold for my husband. Next year we are splitting our summer between WM Oceanside and Park City (Marriott).

We own at Marriott and Worldmark and find that we have our winter and summer getaway needs met between both systems.

We golf 4 to 5 days a week while home and 3 to 4 days a week when we travel. The costs add up very quickly. :(
I've been to Indio twice. No comparison to staying in Palm Springs or Palm Desert.
 

Elan

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It "depends". With discount sites like golfmoose and underpar, you can get a round under $100 at Mountain Vista (Sun City) course. They have 2 courses, Santa Rosa is the better one but both are decent, although this January they had to close off some holes due to flood/mud. It had never happened in all the years that we played there. A few of the less expensive courses to play would be Mission Hills North (Gary Player) and the newly refurbished Westin Mission Hills (Rancho Mirage - Pete Dye) course. They are about $110 to $120 a round.

We had been getting Troon cards although they changed the program in 2025 and it's no longer a good deal. When we had/have the Troon cards, we played regularly at Indian Wells Golf Resort courses and they used to cost us about $120 a round. They had the 2-for-1 deal in the old program so we played for half the price once at each of the courses on the program. That is all gone in the new program. Normal rate is about $170 a round. I think we won't be playing there in January. Classic Club is a tough course and regular rate is also about $170 or so. There are some good and not so good courses everywhere that you can play for about $110 to $120 a round. JW Marriott has 2 courses and used to cost about $120 a round for owners and resort guests. I checked recently and it looks like the rate has gone up to about $150 We really like the Palm course there.

There are 2 courses at WM Indio and they are cheap, about $80 a round. They are quite playable. Cimarron (Boulder - 18 holes) golf course is also in good condition and costs about $110 or so, based on my memory. Cimarron Pebble course is an executive course and costs maybe like $70. We really like this course too.

We also play at private courses there because we have friends who own second homes there, and Toscana (private) has 2 very nice courses.

If you want even more details on where we have played etc, I will need to look at my calendar, and you will need to PM me before I put this forum to sleep. :)
Thanks for the info. About what I was expecting based on my online searches.
 

RENTER

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Sounds kind of like my world, lol. You have probably heard the line "God helps those that help themselves". In a way, it's about trying to be prepared so when the bad happens you have ways to work it out. God bless you renter.

Bill
There are some people who live in a different world then most of us and they should remain silent. When others post their concerns, they are glad to rub it our faces that they do and they have no concerns like the rest of us.

These are the same people who mock others about their concerns about electric cars. They love to rub it our faces that they never have any problems and have no concerns about the heat and cold reducing their battery power. No concerns about finding chargers and if they do that a criminal has not destroyed it to steal the copper.

These are the same people who mock others who post about their concerns about their 401K plans because they have a crappy plan with high fees. They love to rub it our faces our they have no concern because they have the perfect plan.

These are the same people who mock others who post their concerns about stock market crashes and being defensive because they are not financially strong to survive a crash. They love to rub it in our faces that they are financially strong and will stay aggressive because they can survive a crash.

These are the same people who mock others who post their concerns about leaving their homes for a period of time and risking squatters and burglars moving in. They love to rub it in our faces how that is not a concern of theirs because they have superior security systems and the best neighbors in the world.

Other people look up to them and listen to every word they say. Not me. I think they are elite snobs who are jerks. I have dealt with people like this my entire life. One good thing about 2000 and 2008 was many of them were not as smart as they thought and I good laugh watching their perfect little world bubble pop.

I remember reading articles about how they went from the top of the world to cleaning houses in order to survive. I knew several of them personally and argued with them for years. They went from Vice-President of some company to working as a Wal-Mart greeter when their perfect world bubble popped.

The sad part that I could not have a good laugh at was they bought down with them others who listened to them.
 

Elan

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With respect to a second home, I've definitely considered it, and currently get emailed RE listings for specific areas. In fact, I've even considered a "3 condo" solution. But, it's not a good fit for me, at least for now, because there's still too many places to visit to consider "locking myself" into going to the same location for prolonged periods repeatedly. Maybe that will change after I've visited a few new spots. I can always buy something later if my mind changes.
 

easyrider

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With respect to a second home, I've definitely considered it, and currently get emailed RE listings for specific areas. In fact, I've even considered a "3 condo" solution. But, it's not a good fit for me, at least for now, because there's still too many places to visit to consider "locking myself" into going to the same location for prolonged periods repeatedly. Maybe that will change after I've visited a few new spots. I can always buy something later if my mind changes.

We thought about the second home but really like different destinations and don't want to work on a second home when we leave home. We ended up with a cabin about 45 minutes away and almost any time I go up I'm working on something, which I do enjoy for the most part.

Bill
 

Passepartout

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With respect to a second home, I've definitely considered it, and currently get emailed RE listings for specific areas. In fact, I've even considered a "3 condo" solution. But, it's not a good fit for me, at least for now, because there's still too many places to visit to consider "locking myself" into going to the same location for prolonged periods repeatedly. Maybe that will change after I've visited a few new spots. I can always buy something later if my mind changes.
As I may have mentioned over a completely enjoyable shared beverage with you, we have been active travelers over our lifetimes- instilled- or infected on us by our well-traveled parents. camping, 'better camping', hotels, foreign service, a 30-year career of watching bugs commit suicide on windshields, assorted timeshares and multiple annual cruises behind us. Now, we still like to get away for a change of scenery, so the second digs downtown in your home city serves us well. We're down to one RCI Points TS for when we want to wander further afield.

Let's get together for another of those bevvies before too much water passes under the bridges.

Jim
 

easyrider

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Sugarcubesea

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I'm hoping to retire in 2027 and our original plan was to buy a 2nd condo in florida. We did step one of our plan and downsized to a condo in the state we live in and our family lives in. Our goal was to keep this condo as our summer location and winter in FL. The cost of home insurance quadrupling in the last two years, has us pausing on that plan and we are researching other options. I need warm weather January thru April and I really need 72 or higher for me to be warm.
 

JoeWilly

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Now that I'm retired, we're looking into heading south for the winter. Probably 4-8 weeks after the first of the year, so early to mid January to mid to late February. Not going to start until next winter, at the earliest.
For those of you that do this, what have you found works in terms of accommodations? We would likely go back to certain locations annually, but want the freedom to go to different locations either within the same trip, or from year to year. So buying a condo or second home doesn't make sense. Thinking a combo of VRBO, hotels and possibly point based TS system. Obviously, keeping costs down is an objective, so accommodations would need to have kitchen and be comfortable for multi week stay (i.e. not standard hotel room). Occasional standard hotel rooms (for short stays) are acceptable. Should add that we'd almost certainly stay west of the Rockies (Palm Springs, Vegas, AZ, San Diego, etc) and would drive our own vehicle from ID.
Anyone care to share your experience? Where you stay and what your budget looks like?
For us, it comes down to what risks you are willing to take when leaving your home vacant for an extended length of time. We are on our third year of wintering in Mexico for three months. So far, so good. Our neighbors check the house weekly for water leaks, vandalism, etc. And, the neighbors blew off our back deck and driveway after a storm which was very nice. It was something we didn't think about. Last year there was a beep in the house. Neighbors couldn't figure out where it was coming from. We usually change batteries in all smoke and carbon monoxide detectors on Halloween. Oops, we forgot to change the batteries before we left for Mexico. We enjoy doing something different for three months and escaping the rain. That said, we don't want to own a second home/condo anywhere. We like contacting the landlord when something goes wrong.
 

Elan

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As I may have mentioned over a completely enjoyable shared beverage with you, we have been active travelers over our lifetimes- instilled- or infected on us by our well-traveled parents. camping, 'better camping', hotels, foreign service, a 30-year career of watching bugs commit suicide on windshields, assorted timeshares and multiple annual cruises behind us. Now, we still like to get away for a change of scenery, so the second digs downtown in your home city serves us well. We're down to one RCI Points TS for when we want to wander further afield.

Let's get together for another of those bevvies before too much water passes under the bridges.

Jim
Hi Jim.

Any time. I'll catch the first round!

Jim
 

Elan

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I'm hoping to retire in 2027 and our original plan was to buy a 2nd condo in florida. We did step one of our plan and downsized to a condo in the state we live in and our family lives in. Our goal was to keep this condo as our summer location and winter in FL. The cost of home insurance quadrupling in the last two years, has us pausing on that plan and we are researching other options. I need warm weather January thru April and I really need 72 or higher for me to be warm.
That was always my plan. Downsize to a more manageable townhome or condo here, and then buy a tiny condo somewhere warm. But I more recently decided I didn't need or really even want to own somewhere else. But, I just need to "escape" in winter for 4-6 weeks to maintain my sanity, so my needs are a little different.
My brother lives in Tampa. I get to hear all about rising homeowners insurance rates. Ugh!
 
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