Senior MVCI sources have told me that ALL VC points are equal!

[SueDonJ]

I think the original post is all about somantics. The reference to Destinations Club quoted by th OP could easily be replaced with "internal exchange company" or any other term and it would agree with the prevailing opinion on this board.

I made a post back in Nov/Dec describing my experience of Ko Olina trust inventory present that I was unable to access after Jan 2nd 2013 despite securing the more coveted previous holidays. A month or 2 later I was able to get that inventory with my legacy points. This was not with just 1 VOA, I spoke to at least 3 different people.

What I bolded is a good point that you've made a few times in this thread - there's a strong possibility that some of what the OP related is simply the wrong use of words. It really would be so much easier if the reps all had a good basic understanding of things, and used the same language when talking about it.

 

[FractionalTraveler]

FractionalTraveler, just a note here to say thanks for spending so much time in your account for purposes of this thread. It's so helpful to be able to look at what's happening despite the fact that some of us don't have points to play with right now.

But please, be careful that you don't click on something that you didn't want to click! The last thing we want is for you to end up with a reservation in East Timbuktu during Monsoon Season.

Sue,

Your very much welcome. No worries, a 3-bedroom penthouse in Marco for the day wouldn't hurt a bit!

Best Regards.

 

[windje2000]

good morning...

After 3 days at the Beach at Oceana Palms ( a stunning resort). I realized that I have been contemplating the wrong question. I(like the rest of us) have been contemplating Trust v. legacy points. However, the true question is much simpler!!!!

At this time i own 4 deeded weeks that come with 13,866 enrolled points. My vacation 401K is full. IOW.. I am not in the market for more weeks, Legacy points Or Trust points. A few years ago, I drank the Kool Aid and purchased tomorrows vacations at today's prices. I have done extremely well.

My 13,866 cannot be morphed into Trust points and I am not purchasing more, so the comparison is moot, except for an a academic exercise!!

The only question for me is "Has the DC rollout enhanced or hurt my timeshare portfolio???

To me the answer is an unequivocal enhancement!!!!! I spent $695 to enroll...Used the 800 pts to more than recoup the $695...
I have made great DC point ressies, cancelled a gazillion times for no charge,, I have used the "Puck trick" twice to save 20%. I have still used II to get some great snags on Flexchange with GV studios... I still have great home weeks and my cash drains are guaranteed Hawaii honeymoons and in 15 years I plan to have the grand kids down for Pres weeks at GV in my 3 bedroom!!!

My rep asked me If I had a choice between 13,866 Trust points vs. My 4 deeds and 13,866 Enrolled which would i choose. The answer was keeping what I have!!!!

Not to contradict windje in the "got the call" thread, but I believe that I am the big cheese in the new world (a direct purchaser with enuf legacy points to be Premier Plus)....I get so many benefits including the %45 discount which gets me Trust inventory (Oceana Palms) for cheaper than the MF's on Trust points...

I love MVCD!!!!!!

p.s today I get to meet Greg for Berns steak house and Lightning hockey!!!!

You are indeed a master of the universe when it comes to maximizing your options, and have lots of ways to accomplish your goals. It is working well for you and I hope it continues to do so long into the future.

Berns --- one of the best in the USA Enjoy.

 

[windje2000]

FractionalTraveler, just a note here to say thanks for spending so much time in your account for purposes of this thread. It's so helpful to be able to look at what's happening despite the fact that some of us don't have points to play with right now.

But please, be careful that you don't click on something that you didn't want to click! The last thing we want is for you to end up with a reservation in East Timbuktu during Monsoon Season.

+1

BTW Sue - Timbuktu is on the edge of the Sahara desert in central Africa - no monsoons there

 

[puckmanfl]

good afternoon...

Please also remember last june's sales data, 17 K customers , purchasing 35,000,000 points. Just over 2k points per new purchase of Trust points. How many Trust owners will have 5K Trust points to snag those primo weeks that will be added to the Trust. I don't think MVCD will be adding Timbuktu in monsoon season!!!! They will adding NYC etc....I think Legacy points wil work just fine for a long long time!!!

I was playing today..plenty of Oceana Palms and Marco stuff open....

Sue, can't slip anything by the geography police here on TUG :hysterical: :hysterical: :hysterical:

 

[kjd]

There's a lot of wasted time and motion trying to split hairs between the meaning of a legacy point and a trust point. It appears to me that the early description of two buckets has thrown everyone into a tither needlessly. After thinking about it the only group to benefit from the two bucket approach is the sales staff who argue that you must buy some trust points to stay in the game.

It would seem to me that Marriott Corporate would look at it differently. More like, what puts "heads in beds" rather than establishing two classes of ownership. Perhaps some of the early statements announcing the new program have started a feeding frenzy by the sales staff. If you remember that early in the game Marriott was a little unsure of how the program would work. It lacked details. As we move on it is my belief that things are smoothing out and we will get to the concept of "a point is a point". We may be there already and there's no sense beating this "what if" situation to death on TUG.

 

[GregT]

Fractional Traveler,

Thank you - I'll look at your examples when I am back online. I do know the reservation system well, and will be happy to see this development.

If you (or any Trust Point owner) have any extra trust points (25 pts?) for 2013, I'd love to repeat your success and can transfer you 25 legacy points in trade?

Best,

Greg

All,

I'd like to thank Fractional Traveler for transferring me 25 Trust Points -- I in turn have transferred back to him 25 Legacy Points but it was his contribution that made this experiment possible.

I took the Legacy Points that I have and I parked the majority of them in a reservation, leaving 875 Legacy Points and his 25 Trust Points. I then found a property that had individual days for 300 points apiece (Cypress Harbour, March 3 4 and 5th were available). Although I knew the three days were available (based on requesting booking the individual days), the system would not allow me to book a 3 day reservation for 900 points. Individual days were not a problem.

I believe this was due to an inability to combine Trust and Legacy Points for a single day, which was the hypothesis that we formed during this thread. It is clear from other TUGgers experience that points can be combined on a day-by-day basis (example: Trust Points for Mon/Tues/Wed and Legacy Points for other days) but we still do not see the ability to combine the points to book a single day.

No other experiments were run, but again my thanks to FT for making the Trust Points available.

All the best,

Greg

 

[dioxide45]

No, I think it would not have let me put the reservation on hold and take the inventory unless it was a valid request. On HOLD status is just 1-click away from an actual confirmation number. So I think the scenario is still VALID.

But you only have 1000 trust points available. You were trying to make a reservation for 1200 points. Where would the the system have pulled the additional 200 points from? Would it have asked you to confirm borrowing or banking 200 trust points to pull off the reservation?

 

[dioxide45]

All,

I'd like to thank Fractional Traveler for transferring me 25 Trust Points -- I in turn have transferred back to him 25 Legacy Points but it was his contribution that made this experiment possible.

I took the Legacy Points that I have and I parked the majority of them in a reservation, leaving 875 Legacy Points and his 25 Trust Points. I then found a property that had individual days for 300 points apiece (Cypress Harbour, March 3 4 and 5th were available). Although I knew the three days were available (based on requesting booking the individual days), the system would not allow me to book a 3 day reservation for 900 points. Individual days were not a problem.

I believe this was due to an inability to combine Trust and Legacy Points for a single day, which was the hypothesis that we formed during this thread. It is clear from other TUGgers experience that points can be combined on a day-by-day basis (example: Trust Points for Mon/Tues/Wed and Legacy Points for other days) but we still do not see the ability to combine the points to book a single day.

No other experiments were run, but again my thanks to FT for making the Trust Points available.

All the best,

Greg

I think this limitation is just plain poor system design more than a true legal limitation of how trust and legacy points can be used to make a reservation. If the inventory is in the Exchange Company, the source of the points shouldn't matter. All points should be equal when pulling inventory from the Exchange Company.

Perhaps it has more to do with physical movement of inventory. There are no days where you can make a reservation for only 25 points. So in order to make the reservation with 25 trust points, the trust would have to move some physical inventory to the Exchange Company. With no days worth 25 points, there would be nothing that the trust could give the Exchange Company to make it whole? However, if windje's post about IOU, then this wouldn't make any difference because those IOUs would pile up to make enough for a single night for the trust to move to the Exchange Company.

 

[FractionalTraveler]

But you only have 1000 trust points available. You were trying to make a reservation for 1200 points. Where would the the system have pulled the additional 200 points from? Would it have asked you to confirm borrowing or banking 200 trust points to pull off the reservation?

Yes, I think this is also a possibility. Good point that needs to be tested!

 

[ral]

All,

I'd like to thank Fractional Traveler for transferring me 25 Trust Points -- I in turn have transferred back to him 25 Legacy Points but it was his contribution that made this experiment possible.

I took the Legacy Points that I have and I parked the majority of them in a reservation, leaving 875 Legacy Points and his 25 Trust Points. I then found a property that had individual days for 300 points apiece (Cypress Harbour, March 3 4 and 5th were available). Although I knew the three days were available (based on requesting booking the individual days), the system would not allow me to book a 3 day reservation for 900 points. Individual days were not a problem.

I believe this was due to an inability to combine Trust and Legacy Points for a single day, which was the hypothesis that we formed during this thread. It is clear from other TUGgers experience that points can be combined on a day-by-day basis (example: Trust Points for Mon/Tues/Wed and Legacy Points for other days) but we still do not see the ability to combine the points to book a single day.

No other experiments were run, but again my thanks to FT for making the Trust Points available.

All the best,

Greg

Thank you for performing this experiment. Eventually, I think Tuggers will determine how this program functions! Using the example you proposed, can we deduce the following: The Mon/Tues/Wed nights reserved by trust points could have been obtained from either the trust OR the exchange inventory and the rest of the nights (obtained by use of legacy points) could ONLY come from the exchange inventory?

 

[Quilter]

Availability will be determined on inventory as well as "Trust" and "Legacy" points.

I have only Legacy points. On 2/6 I turned in a couple weeks to get 12 nights at Frenchman's Cove next Jan.-Feb. At that time all the days I questioned were available. So the DC worked for me this time and I'm currently 100% satisfied. Tweaking the reservation I called several more times to rearrange dates. As time went on, inventory for each day I looked at got increasingly scarce as others began securing their '13 travel reservations. I still remained with all the days I wanted so, for me, it was all good.

The system is still new. What will matter to me over the years to come is whether I get the vacations I want at the time I want them using either home resort, II or DC. That remains to be seen. If it works, that's good. If not, then I'll have to put my head in other beds. Marriott doesn't control the whole vacation/travel industry. There are plenty other opportunities for great travel memories.

 

[smithde]

All,

I'd like to thank Fractional Traveler for transferring me 25 Trust Points -- I in turn have transferred back to him 25 Legacy Points but it was his contribution that made this experiment possible.

I took the Legacy Points that I have and I parked the majority of them in a reservation, leaving 875 Legacy Points and his 25 Trust Points. I then found a property that had individual days for 300 points apiece (Cypress Harbour, March 3 4 and 5th were available). Although I knew the three days were available (based on requesting booking the individual days), the system would not allow me to book a 3 day reservation for 900 points. Individual days were not a problem.

I believe this was due to an inability to combine Trust and Legacy Points for a single day, which was the hypothesis that we formed during this thread. It is clear from other TUGgers experience that points can be combined on a day-by-day basis (example: Trust Points for Mon/Tues/Wed and Legacy Points for other days) but we still do not see the ability to combine the points to book a single day.

No other experiments were run, but again my thanks to FT for making the Trust Points available.

All the best,

Greg

I'm not sure this totally proves that you can't combine for a single day. I believe all of the examples showed combinations in increments of 50 points. I wonder what would have happened if you had 850 Legacy and 50 Trust points. I'm guessing it still would not have worked, but it seems possible based on the other examples.

 

[pacheco18]

My wife and I attended a presentation in Orlando in November 2011. We were told that if we purchased 1000 of the new DC points that all of our points from converting our weeks would be equal and be able to be used whenever and wherever we wanted, before signing the contract we asked one more time if ALL of the points would be equal, the answer was yes.
When we returned home I contacted Mr. Steve Weisz's office and asked the same question to the gentleman who took my call, and was told that the two types of points are NOT equal and NEVER would be equal.
With that information we cancelled our contract, if fact, the gentleman who I spoke to offered to cancel the contract for us.
Once the email was sent to cancel we received calls from the salesman and his manager telling me that I misunderstood the presentation, I repeated some of his quotes and the conversation was over.
Unless Marriott has once again changed their course, the DC and legacy points will never be equal.

I had the same untruthful presentation at Shadow Ridge. Was told the same lie. Rescinded after I investigated. I lodged an official complaint against the sales rep. They never learn and they never will stop lying.

 

[FractionalTraveler]

I had the same untruthful presentation at Shadow Ridge. Was told the same lie. Rescinded after I investigated. I lodged an official complaint against the sales rep. They never learn and they never will stop lying.

I'm not sure what's being said at these presentations, but my experience from the last 2 years of making reservations as an enrolled and trust owner has been outstanding.

I routinely mix the points up between legacy and trust to get my reservation.

Don't really care where the points are coming from. It just works!

 

[seema]

So, to see if my quote of the senior source is true, or not- we should see if legacy points, trust points, or a combination to the two types of points, gets one access to any type of reservation (or not), if it can be confirmed that resort units are available at that given time,

 

[dioxide45]

So, to see if my quote of the senior source is true, or not- we should see if legacy points, trust points, or a combination to the two types of points, gets one access to any type of reservation (or not), if it can be confirmed that resort units are available at that given time,

I think that we have determined that there is a difference. Between what Puck was able to see at NCV for this summer with legacy points and what FractionalTraveler could see with trust points. There did seem to be an apparent difference. Fractional's trust points could see much more available inventory.

 

[Wolfpacker]

FWIW, Went to the owner's meeting with the GO General Manager this week. Among other things, he said that the use of 2 terms "Legacy points" and Trust points" was "our (Marriott's) bad" - it was too confusing and points are points so the distinction doesn't mean anything to us point-holders. He said the terminology was "going away".

He said that GO occupancy was about 10% through points (90% weeks). He also said that only 1% of the Marriott GO weeks are owned by the Trust and that inventory was acquired by foreclosures. He said they tended to keep the Bronze and Silver foreclosure weeks in the trust and resell the gold and platinum foreclosures. He also said that "Marriott doesn't cherry-pick the inventory they assign from the trust-owned weeks" - that they distribute them across the _____ ( I wasn't clear if he meant "season" or "year" - I hope he meant "season").