New policy - confirming Guest Reservations [MORE CHANGES]

[Helios]

It's really not that complicated. You are only permitted to rent a unit reserved >8 months prior to arrival, OR a unit you could have reserved >8 months prior to arrival.

The intent is that you are entitled to use or rent your deeded/owned property, but you are NOT entitled to use the Vistana Signature Network exchange program to rent weeks you don't own.

I am not a CCR expert but I like your definition about what you can rent. I think renting a unit that was reserved before 8 months from arrival or something that could have been reserved before 8 months from arrival is a good interpretation. Sometimes plans change and you need to reserve (and/or rent) what you own within the 8 months period.

Enforcing the legitimacy of the SO rental would be too complicated in this case because it would make it not as simple as you can only rent a Home Resort Coded resie

 

[DavidnRobin]

I hear you and won't start the bashing. I agree on the strict interpretation of CCRs, how about okwiater point above? I like it because he says you can rent something you could have reserved before 8 months from arrival.

I would suggest looking at VSE/VSN CCRs - SVEC Rules and Regulations (when it was called SVN which is now VSN):

8.2 SVN Member Rentals. An SVN Member may reserve a Vacation Period at the SVN Member's Home Resort and rent it on the SVN Member's own account. All renters must comply with the rules and regulations of the Resort Documents affecting occupancy, and the renting SVN Member will be responsible for the acts or omissions of the SVN Member's renters or any other person or persons permitted by the SVN Member to use the Unit. Rental by an SVN Member of Units reserved through SVN (other than a Vacation Period reserved at the SVN Member's Home Resort) is prohibited.

Anyone have the new VSE/VSN rules and regulations from recent purchase?

 

[okwiater]

I am not a CCR expert but I like your definition about what you can rent. I think renting a unit that was reserved before 8 months from arrival or something that could have been reserved before 8 months from arrival is a good interpretation. Sometimes plans change and you need to reserve (and/or rent) what you own within the 8 months period.

Enforcing the legitimacy of the SO rental would be too complicated in this case because it would make it not as simple as you can only rent a Home Resort Coded resie

That's correct. Being a member of VSN was never intended to abridge your usage rights, only to expand them. So just as a non-VSN member could reserve and rent a unit at their home resort within 8 months, so can a VSN member. And yes, this makes it very difficult to enforce because the enforcer would have to be familiar with your ownerships as well as which bucket of StarOptions you used to make the reservation.

 

[Helios]

That's correct. Being a member of VSN was never intended to abridge your usage rights, only to expand them. So just as a non-VSN member could reserve and rent a unit at their home resort within 8 months, so can a VSN member. And yes, this makes it very difficult to enforce because the enforcer would have to be familiar with your ownerships as well as which bucket of StarOptions you used to make the reservation.

Why don't they just code all resies as Home Resort if they are made to reserve the unit you own during the season you own even if the resie is made within the 8 month period. The system knows what options are being used for the resie and what you own...if it is an exact match I think it should be a home resort resie.

 

[Helios]

Why don't they just code all resies as Home Resort if they are made to reserve the unit you own during the season you own even if the resie is made within the 8 month period. The system knows what options are being used for the resie and what you own...if it is an exact match I think it should be a home resort resie.

or they could say network reservation using home resort SOs

 

[okwiater]

Why don't they just code all resies as Home Resort if they are made to reserve the unit you own during the season you own even if the resie is made within the 8 month period. The system knows what options are being used for the resie and what you own...if it is an exact match I think it should be a home resort resie.

Once the VSN 8-month threshold has been reached, you aren't necessarily booking your owned unit any longer. You might get your owned unit but you might get something comparable instead. So it's important to distinguish that the reservation is not a Home Resort Reservation.

or they could say network reservation using home resort SOs

Yes, that would be more accurate. The system could theoretically be programmed to flag a VSN reservation as having used the correct SOs to be eligible for rental. But that's a pretty complex calculation given the various rules which apply, and I'm not sure the benefits outweigh the costs. For instance, programming the systems would cost time and money. Training the staff to enforce the rule would cost time and money. And even then, it wouldn't be truly enforceable since owners are still permitted to "give away" their reservation and allow it to be used by someone else.

 

[duke]

And even then, it wouldn't be truly enforceable since owners are still permitted to "give away" their reservation and allow it to be used by someone else.

How could they possibly tell that you "rented" an VSN reservation as opposed to just letting your guests stay there?
This rule is stupid and only for the benefit of VSN so they can rent their units without competition.

 

[okwiater]

How could they possibly tell that you "rented" an VSN reservation as opposed to just letting your guests stay there?

If everybody keeps the rental arrangement on the DL, the likelihood is that they won't be able to tell.

This rule is stupid and only for the benefit of VSN so they can rent their units without competition.

I don't think the rule is stupid. Allowing owners to rent VSN reservations will just create a feeding frenzy at the opening of the booking window for the most popular weeks at the most popular resorts, which would in turn dilute the value of the network for personal use.

A timeshare isn't a financial investment and shouldn't be treated like one. Anything that makes it more difficult for owners to utilize their timeshares for their own personal enjoyment is counter to their purpose.

 

[DavidnRobin]

The rule is set up to prevent people from using their SOs (e.g. SVV, WKV) at 8 months to reserve at another resort (WKORV/N) - which is/was happening. As mentioned - we met a couple at WKORV hot tub bragging how they bought a bunch of SVV resale and using to pickup WKORV/N and rent. There was also a time here on TUG where this was being actively advised (incorrectly) and used as a business model - there is a thread about this in stickies where this conversation started.

Allowing people to use SOs to rent out other resorts reduces the ability for people to use their SOs legitimately to stay at other resorts (the 2nd pillar of VSE/VSN usage).

 

[tschwa2]

It also protects owners at the higher priced resorts who are renting their own units that can be severely undercut by those with cheaper SO's. A summer 1 BR premium at Harborside only takes 51,700 SO's. My MF not including SVN fee is about $1700 for that unit. There are many owners who pay less and much less for 51,700.

 

[DavidnRobin]

It also protects owners at the higher priced resorts who are renting their own units that can be severely undercut by those with cheaper SO's. A summer 1 BR premium at Harborside only takes 51,700 SO's. My MF not including SVN fee is about $1700 for that unit. There are many owners who pay less and much less for 51,700.

^^^^ this as well ^^^^
I gave SVO/SVN a suggestion - just state it clearly on reservation confirmation.
Guess that was too simple.