mayan palace resorts are the gold of the mexican t-s world and the reasons why!

[T_R_Oglodyte]

...

In a floating weeks system, there is not a one to one correspondence of number of members to (number of Villas times the number of weeks)....

That is an incorrect basic premise. There are many floating week systems that have exactly that one-to-one correspondence.

The rest of your discussion, which I have nxt quoted, also proceeds incorrectly. It is certainly true that in a floating week system not veryone will get the week that they want. A property operated floating week system accomodtes that through exchanges. When the resort knows they are not going to be fully occupied, they bank the week with an exhange company. Then when a member tries to get a reservation and nothing is available that they can make, they can accept a banked week.

I am in the minority in TUG, because I believe that resorts that have floating week systems should bulk bank and not allow owners to select weeks for deposit, My rationale follows some of your thinking - the most demanded weeks should be reserved for owners. A bulk banking system effectively relieves some of the pressure on owner reservations for peak times.

It is certainly true that some floating resorts have oversold their inventory. But contrary to what you seem to be asserting, overselling is not intrinsic to floating week systems.

 

[sally]

sallys TOUGH LUCK

Hey marty do you think I am rational? I believe my (tough luck day) will come only after all of you TRADERS AND E-BAYERS trying to secure dates in the Grand mayan have thiers!....nothing mean here..just rational thought.. imho

YES... sally DOES have a written contract for 97 years that states A GRAND MAYAN 1 bedrm is reserved for sally 1 week per year if 6 months advance notice is recieved!

This resort system will become more crowded going forward of course,but..with new resorts always coming on line they can continue to bring in new purchasers.

sally

 

[5infam]

......Oh and 5 infam...the charter will say every thing in writing BUT,what you are looking for, they would be choking business flow if they did divulge that developer purchased owners get special treatment over others.

Thanks Sally for clearing that up...I now know that there is nothing in the "charter" that says anything about a downgrade in service for developer buyers versus resale buyers. So essentially, all your other comments regarding resale buyers (those on EBAY, etc.) are just for opinion purposes and do not state any facts. I know you feel that it is inevitable that anyone who may have paid less than you is doomed for utter torture at the Mayan resorts, but I am trying to stick to evidence that can actually be proved, or by real life experience - such as the poor treatment of RCI traders (which is clearly an issue).

Is there anyone in TUG land that can tell us if there is a stated difference when buying a Mayan resort resale vs. developer? As best I have been able to figure here, there is just the 10% charge of the direct purchasers price when it is resold. Besides this, can anyone give any other FACTS that would be a reason for not buying resale (penalties, lower priorities, no points program, unable to reserve at other resorts,etc.)? Thanks!!

 

[quiltergal]

Am I the only one who thinks it odd that GM treats their exchangers so badly? Talk about killing the cash cow. I mean here you have all this fresh meat to exploit and rather than wine them and dine them and treat them like kings to make the sale the exchangers get shunted off to the Mayan Palace or worse yet the Sea Gardens and treated like they have a communicable disease. I'm having a hard time wrapping my mind around the logic behind that behavior given the amount of effort they put into dragging people off the street for a presentation.

I think the answer to exchangers being bumped is over on the other thread. MR owners whose weeks were affected by Wilma are being allowed to use their 2005 week in 2006 at one of the other resorts. No wonder those weeks are getting pulled back. Should make for some interesting bookkeeping.

 

[california-bighorn]

I'm starting to think "Sally" may not really exist and is just someone playing a game on TUG. I just can't image anyone writing the things "Sally" writes. Every so often, while defending the Mayans, "Sally" goes off on Walmart for selling items made by people in less developed countries. Last February we stayed at the Mayan Riviera where we observed first hand the very thing "Sally" accuses Walmart of. That is paying low wages (as compared to the US) to employees without any benefits. On my morning walks I saw the laborers who showed up to work on building the resort put on a number to identify themself then work 12 hours. Those workers make around $8 USD for the day. We also watched as a worker fell from a ladder. After about 20 minutes, he had to get up without assisance and try to walk with an obviously broken ankle or leg. No problemo for GM/MP just put a number on another worker. I don't mean this to be political or anything like that. For people in less developed countries they may consider making a small amount is better than making nothing. Just pointing out that the very concept that "Sally" vilifies Walmart for is the normal operating procedure for her beloved resort. But these underpaid workers sure build a great resort for "Sally" to enjoy her vacation.
Marty

 

[LisaH]

Marty, I agree with you. It's just hard to believe "Sally" is real. The kind of statement she made is so outlandish that, like NONI said, this thread has been a "hoot".

 

[Pat H]

I think "Sally" works for MP. Her statements are ludicrous. There is nothing that says resale buyers will be treated any differently than developer buyers. I love the MP and wish they would tone down their sales presentations. I hope that we find out the real reason exchangers are being bumped from the GM.

 

[Ellis2ca]

Incorrect premise... thanks for correcting me...

That is an incorrect basic premise. There are many floating week systems that have exactly that one-to-one correspondence.

The rest of your discussion, which I have not quoted, also proceeds incorrectly. It is certainly true that in a floating week system not everyone will get the week that they want. A property operated floating week system accomodtes that through exchanges. When the resort knows they are not going to be fully occupied, they bank the week with an exhange company. Then when a member tries to get a reservation and nothing is available that they can make, they can accept a banked week.

I admit that if there are floating weeks, or point system resorts, that have a one to one correspondence between the number of members and the number of Villa Weeks, then my statement is mistaken, and most of what I fear about the floating weeks and points system would not happen. Some of it would happen, but not the worst of it.

I also admit that I have only had good experience with the way things are done at the Royal Resorts, which is that we each own a specific Villa on a specific week, so no reservations are necessary, and nobody has ever had any problem renting out or renting into the Royal Resorts.

So based on my own good experience and the bad experience I have read and discussed on TUG about the "Royal" Sunset (which nobody should confuse with a Royal Resort...) and the Mayan Palaces, I came to my own conclusion about why and how this happens, and perhaps I jumped to conclusions about the entire floating weeks and point systems. I hadn't thought of a floating weeks or points system that is actually honest, but now you are telling me that there are some, and that makes me happy.

Good. Thanks for correcting me. It is good to know that there are some good resorts with floating weeks and/or points... Please tell me which they are, so that I will feel more comfortable if I ever want to trade or rent into one of them in the future.

In any case, I advise anybody that buys into a floating weeks or points system that this should be very clearly specified in the contract, that they will not oversell the resort.

Sally, if your contract says this, then I really (really) do think you made a good buy. If not, someday you will wake up to reality. You keep on telling us about the tough world and reality, but you don't seem to see that it's your own head that's on the block.

But then, assuming that there are resorts that have a floating week system, or a points system, and that it is written into the contract that there is not going to be overselling... WHAT IS THE ADVANTAGE of having a floating weeks or points system? Why not sell one-to-one, your specific time, your specific Villa, and then have an internal exchange for those who sometimes need to exchange or upgrade or downgrade? This is all of the good, and none of the bad, and there are no seeds of discord, as I think exist inherently in the floating weeks and points system.

EVEN IF there is a one to one correspondence in a floating weeks system, somebody is going to be left unhappy because they couldn't get exactly what they wanted, when they wanted it, or the view they wanted, or they couldn't go the week their friends were going to go, etc. None of this happens if everybody owns their specific week and specific Villa.

Maybe this thread should be discussed in a separate New Post...

I am in the minority in TUG, because I believe that resorts that have floating week systems should bulk bank and not allow owners to select weeks for deposit. My rationale follows some of your thinking - the most demanded weeks should be reserved for owners. A bulk banking system effectively relieves some of the pressure on owner reservations for peak times.

It is certainly true that some floating resorts have oversold their inventory. But contrary to what you seem to be asserting, overselling is not intrinsic to floating week systems.

I don't see why the owners should not be allowed to select high season weeks for deposit. If you bought RED weeks, you have to be allowed to pick a RED week and do whatever you want to with it. If you want to trade with me, you have to give me the weeks I want, or else you can't trade with me. I own VERY RED so I might want RED or BLUE but you should be allowed to pick one of those weeks and deposit it into R.C.I. or else I can't find those RED weeks I need to make a trade, either with you or through R.C.I. and if it is not there, I can't trade through R.C.I. either.

Sally should be able to reserve a week 7 in February, or a week 25 in July, rent it to me, and I should have 100% confidence that I will arrive and Sally's reservation will be honored, no questions asked.

According to Sally, if I buy a cheap week to stay at the Grand Mayan from her on e-Bay, I should not count on getting it because those are the facts of life, I haven't paid my dues, even though she has paid them for me, etc.

"Owners" should be no different than "Exchange Visitors" in any way. I was severely mistreated at Disney Vacation Village (DVC) many years ago, as an exchange visitor. I don't know if this has to do with the fact that it is a point system but in any case, I was asked to leave the swimming pool with my family at Wilderness Lodge. I would not have been asked to leave if I had been the owner who rented to me at Old Key West, where I was "only" an exchange guest....

For your information, the owner who rented to me had recommended that I should go visit Wilderness Lodge, and I could have a good time in their pools... The owner and many other DVC members were shocked at my mistreatment... In any case, that is the last time I ever visited Disney Vacation Village, which I think is a great place to visit... but go as an owner, or don't go. Now that I know the rules, that I am a second class citizen at Disney Vacation Village, I choose to go elsewhere where I am welcome. - Ellis

 

[sally]

trust ..do not trust anyone?

THE BIG PPPLEASE...SALLY works for the mayan palace, sally is not real,sally does not like wallmart,sally does not like anyone on tug.

sally IS a real person,and many of you know this by reading my many post about my childeren and vacations! I live in Chicago and have A fixed week at a wisconsin resort we enjoy very much! (PAT).

I am sorry so many of my thoughts regarding these issues are different then so many tuggers.I look at life, glass half full,and how I can best provide my family with great vacation memorys.We have been on some cruddy trips an I swore that would not happen again.
As far as wallmart goes ITS A (metaphor) silly!I admit I shop at wallmart for the value,I am a hipocrit! Moral backing is not one of my strong suits with this, as I am trying to raise a family the best way I can.Our polititions have made choices that give us little choice on who to buy from,as most stores now carry a majority of chinese goods.
Lest us forget how Cathylee Gifford was publicly hammered for having her namesake on child slave labor produced sneakers? NOW its OK for any one to produce any thing with child slave labor, and nothing is said.THAT IS OUTRAGEOUS! Do you really think that the communist government of china has cleaned up its act? not hardly...its worse more then ever now.At least there are not factories in mexico on every corner using exclusively childeren under 10 as thier main workers. tens of thousands of factories.but I digress...the main point here is do not be all moral and upity stating you dislike the mayan palace for poor moral sales practices and then open your cabinets in your homes to find secret atrocities that you are unknowingly supporting indirectly anyhow! THIS is what I am calling attention to in regards to the way the world works now. Nobody can stop wallmart can they? the iron curtain is closed to cameras , but many chinese tell of these factories.The wallmarts will go on, the mayan palace...the enrons, the haliburtons, the worldcoms,ect ect, ect

FInd a thing or two in life that you can enjoy
while you still have the capacity to do this. That is my only message.

The real HOOT here for me is the amount of people who see the world as they want it to be rather then how it is.




sally

sally

 

[Larry]

Am I the only one who thinks it odd that GM treats their exchangers so badly? Talk about killing the cash cow. I mean here you have all this fresh meat to exploit and rather than wine them and dine them and treat them like kings to make the sale the exchangers get shunted off to the Mayan Palace or worse yet the Sea Gardens and treated like they have a communicable disease. I'm having a hard time wrapping my mind around the logic behind that behavior given the amount of effort they put into dragging people off the street for a presentation.

I think the answer to exchangers being bumped is over on the other thread. MR owners whose weeks were affected by Wilma are being allowed to use their 2005 week in 2006 at one of the other resorts. No wonder those weeks are getting pulled back. Should make for some interesting bookkeeping.

I recently stayed at the Mayan Palace in Acapulco ( January 15-22 ) and spoke to several other guests throughout the week and everyone who exchanged into the Grand stayed at the Grand. The only difference between what owners got and exchangers received was the view. Most of the owners received ocean view units however I did speak to a couple of owners who ( yes and they did buy from the developer) get what they felt were " bad views). All of the exchangers were given rooms facing the golf course and many were on low floors so most of their views was of the parking lot. Not one exchanger was placed into the Mayan Palace that I met during the entire week.

The only couple I met that were shafted in my opinion was this really nice older couple we met. who bought from the developer and paid 35K while they were vacationing in Puerto Vallarta. When they were ready to sign their papers they noticed they were sold 2 weeks in Puerto Panasco and not Puerto Vallarta. They tried to get out without signing but were told " When you buy one you own them all". After 8 hours of high presure sales they took the deal.

By the way this very nice couple who bought from the developer called to make a reservation and the only thing left was the Mayan Sea Garden which is were they stayed after paying $35,000 to the nice developer that Sally says will always take care of their owners.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

I don't see why the owners should not be allowed to select high season weeks for deposit. If you bought RED weeks, you have to be allowed to pick a RED week and do whatever you want to with it. If you want to trade with me, you have to give me the weeks I want, or else you can't trade with me. I own VERY RED so I might want RED or BLUE but you should be allowed to pick one of those weeks and deposit it into R.C.I. or else I can't find those RED weeks I need to make a trade, either with you or through R.C.I. and if it is not there, I can't trade through R.C.I. either.

This has been discussed in threads several times in the past, including a month or two ago. Try doing a search on bulk banking. In sum, it's a matter of priorities. As you point out, in a floating system there will inevitably be some weeks that are more in demand than others. So determining who gets those weeks is a matter of priorities.

Some resorts believe that their first priority should be to accomodate owners who want to make usage reservations to return to their resort. In that case, it makes perfect sense to reserve the highest demanded weeks for owners and make the less-demanded weeks within that usage class more available to exchangers. That is consistent with the concept that timesharing is mostly about owning a resort to use, with exchanging being a second priority.

In a bulk banking system as I desccribe, owners still receive weeks that are consistent with their usage right - e.g., if their ownership entitles them to usage during weeks 22-35, they get a week 22-35 as their exchange week. They just can't select which particualar week in their usage class they can use.

As for floating weeks systems that don't oversell, there are quite a few - in fact there are probably far more that don't oversell than those that do oversell. Some that I am familiar with inclde the Embassy resorts. Pahio, Club Regina/raintree Vacation Club, Worldmark, and Club Sunterra.

 

[sally]

larry...

the devil is in the details, I suspect. Did the older couple complain? Did they ask to be compensated? All resorts have unfortunate probems from time to time. The question is.. Do they shaft developer purchasing owners on a regular basis? NO !!!and do they know WHO these owners are? yes!! remember the kiss of death! Also..I would venture that they are not interested in exploiting all(FRESH MEAT ) sources. as Quiltergirl calls people,...they are a business,they have thier system,and it is far from perfect....but, It is an excellent product and good enough for my family.

sally ..end rant

 

[quiltergal]

the devil is in the details, I suspect. Did the older couple complain? Did they ask to be compensated? All resorts have unfortunate probems from time to time. The question is.. Do they shaft developer purchasing owners on a regular basis? NO !!!and do they know WHO these owners are? yes!! remember the kiss of death! Also..I would venture that they are not interested in exploiting all(FRESH MEAT ) sources. as Quiltergirl calls people,...they are a business,they have thier system,and it is far from perfect....but, It is an excellent product and good enough for my family.

sally ..end rant

Seems to me if I am remembering your assertions correctly that the MR KNOWS WHO BOUGHT FROM THE DEVELOPER that the older couple should not have had to complain. Anybody who pays top dollar should be treated like royalty according to your theory. If your theory holds true then someone who exchanged in should have been bumped to the Sea Gardens not the top dollar couple. I'd be a little uneasy if I were you. One day you could be that couple.

As for fresh meat, I was trying to be nice and not call them poor suckers. If GM ran their resorts like a business they would look at their exchangers as a potential pool of possible buyers that they have spent virtually zero money recruiting. They didn't have to be bribed to come to a presentation, they go to the resort willingly. Doesn't it seem easier and more cost effective to pester people who are already captive at your resort than accosting strangers on every street corner, grocery store, and storefront?

Lets face it. We've all been there in the sales room and took the bait hook line and sinker. I'm no exception. Would I do it again? Not after knowing what I have learned here on TUG. Do I regret my purchases? Not really. Eagle Crest has turned out to be a great trader for me, and Club Regina has allowed me to travel all over Mexico, the Rockies and Hawaii without the hassle of exchanging or paying any fees. Sally I'm glad you enjoy the Grand Mayan, I just don't think you'll have any luck convincing folks here that it's better to spend thousands more than you need to for the same service.

 

[sally]

convincing tuggers?

hard core tuggers are too set in thier ways to open thier minds to a different point of view,I believe.I first came here because I saw an unfair slant, lumping in a (RABID) sales force, with a top quality resort.In my expierience,like arms of a corporation one is not always as well as the other.I thought it unfair that you tuggers were influencing people who really never heard of the mayan palace before.I wanted to right a wrong and put in my views on this.There are many people who never get to enjoy timesharing because they were scared into thinking it was for fools.I never was so delighted to find out how much $$$$ we saved from our fist t-s.We saved by having a kitchen and not having to eat out always.I calculated the savings into the tens of thousands over the years.This is very important to so many young families.You savy garage salers scare me! (with some of your rigid thoughts) well any way, I see this has been a lesson in futility, for me. I hope my view has pulled some heads out of some holes and people relize the baby is in the bath water.

I for one do not like to be called a deciever,when I put so much of myself out here for you guys to carve up!

Hey PAT! want to buy a Mayan palace time-share???
(just kidding)

so long,sally

 

[Larry]

Seems to me if I am remembering your assertions correctly that the MR KNOWS WHO BOUGHT FROM THE DEVELOPER that the older couple should not have had to complain. Anybody who pays top dollar should be treated like royalty according to your theory. If your theory holds true then someone who exchanged in should have been bumped to the Sea Gardens not the top dollar couple. I'd be a little uneasy if I were you. One day you could be that couple.

.

Sally :That was my point exactly as Quiltergal stated why should they have to complain since they paid top dollar and as you assert the developer should know that they bought a developer week so someone who exchanged in should have been bumped to the Sea Garden to make room for their customer so they can be "treated like royalty".

Also I do agree with your statement that MP is a top notch product so if you get a chance read my recent review on my stay at the MP Acapulco entitled
" This is the best resort I have ever stayed at".

 

[Kevin]

I feel like A broken record...

sally

Sally... NO... you don't sound like a "broken record"!

Though it may seem like we TUGgers don't respect your opinion... I'm sure most do.

You're just not going to change many minds on this subject... you can continue to wave the flag of the MP if you so choose.

Respectfully,

Kevin

 

[davilin88]

Last time I was at M.P. N.V., which I love, I asked the woman who tried to talk me into yet another presentation if anyone there ever read the comments on this and rci community bbs about their sales staff. She said she knew nothing about all the negative opinions. Maybe more people can point this out to them. Meanwhile, I look forward to many great vacations to come at M.P.

 

[JudyS]

I have never stayed at a resort in Mexico, and am debating what one to start with. Are the Mayan palace resorts really better than the Royals?

When you buy a re-sale the resort rarely, if ever, has any idea what the re-sale price was.

Just a quick comment -- in some US states (and perhaps other locations), property taxes are based on sales price, and resorts may handle the billing of these taxes. So, some resorts (or rather, the resort management) can tell what you paid resale.

 

[quiltergal]

That's only true with deeded property. All Mexican resorts are Right to Use. You don't own anything but the time.

 

[california-bighorn]

Judy S I wish your premise were true about the property tax being based on the sales price. I would have minimal tax liability (and lower maintenance fees) on the Mexican timeshare I purchased for $2 on ebay.
Marty
PS now you've really got me thinking how they determine the tax. Probably take the value of the whole resort then divide with some formula of the # of units and the size of the units.

 

[tonyg]

I think the taxes in Mexico (referred to as "asset tax") are based on a valuation of the property. The resort pays it and then bills (or overbills) the members proportionally. I doubt if many people even have seen what the actual tax is.

 

[royalholidayclubbed]

Taxes?

I think the taxes in Mexico (referred to as "asset tax") are based on a valuation of the property. The resort pays it and then bills (or overbills) the members proportionally. I doubt if many people even have seen what the actual tax is.

Excuse my ignorance on this subject .. . but are you saying that property taxes are levied on timeshare owners (weeks) on properties in Mexico? Even though they only have right-of-use and are not the "real" owners?

So these taxes are paid in addition to normal maintenance fees?
Or did I pick up the post in the wrong way?

 

[JudyS]

Excuse my ignorance on this subject .. . but are you saying that property taxes are levied on timeshare owners (weeks) on properties in Mexico? Even though they only have right-of-use and are not the "real" owners?

So these taxes are paid in addition to normal maintenance fees?
Or did I pick up the post in the wrong way?

I don't know about Mexico, but DVC ownerships are right-to-use, and still get socked with property tax. A lot of property tax, in fact -- about 12 times what I pay for my North Carolina timeshare.

 

[debkay_w]

Wowie!

You are all scaring me! We just purchased a resale MP 2BR lockout. I WAS happy about it, but now I'm not so sure. We spent little and got a lockout with available extra week for price of maintenance fee. Sounded good to me. Where did we go wrong with a resale??????

Thanks
Deb