• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 30 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other Owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered 24 hours a day!
  • TUG started 30 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Read about our 30th anniversary: Happy 30th Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    Free memberships for every 50 subscribers!

    Visit TUG on Youtube!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $21,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $21 Million dollars
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free!

    60,000+ subscribing owners! A weekly recap of the best Timeshare resort reviews and the most popular topics discussed by owners!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    All T-shirt options here!
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

How are the maintenance fees going to be impacted?

rickandcindy23

TUG Review Crew: Elite
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
31,901
Reaction score
9,003
Points
1,049
Location
The Centennial State
Resorts Owned
Wyndham Founder; Disney OKW & SSR; Marriott's Willow Ridge,Shadow Ridge,Grand Chateau;Val Chatelle; Hono Koa OF (3); SBR(LOTS), SDO a few; Grand Palms; WKORV-OF (2),Westin Desert Willow.
Vistana=Marriott. Same thing, and Marriott increases fees every single year, no skipped years at Willow Ridge. I am selling my Willow Ridge Platinum units. There is no reason to keep them with my SBP and SDO units pulling all of the Marriott exchanges via II and at reduced fees.
 

controller1

TUG Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2017
Messages
3,042
Reaction score
1,940
Points
298
Location
Tulsa
Resorts Owned
Westin KORVN OF
Westin Nanea OF
Westin FLEX
I would like to see the fees go down a bit based on reduced costs. Also let the landscaping get a little rough instead of daily manicuring.

I disagree on the landscaping. My timeshare stays are my escapes from the rest of the world. I want the landscaping to look like it's Masters week at Augusta National. That is one of the things I enjoy about Vistana's Westin timeshares.
 

Sea Six

TUG Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2005
Messages
4,045
Reaction score
872
Points
349
Location
Marco Island, FL
Resorts Owned
Club Regency - Marco Island
Lagunamar - Cancun
Vistana Villages Key West (2) - Orlando
I disagree on the landscaping. My timeshare stays are my escapes from the rest of the world. I want the landscaping to look like it's Masters week at Augusta National. That is one of the things I enjoy about Vistana's Westin timeshares.
Why does it matter when nobody's there?
 

pedro47

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
22,072
Reaction score
8,536
Points
948
Location
East Coast
This should be an excellent time for resorts to preform their preventive maintain and to refurbish their units. IMO.

I do not feel mf will decrease next year. They will find some reasons to tell TS owners why.. IMO.
 

DannyTS

TUG Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2018
Messages
5,753
Reaction score
3,076
Points
348
I have looked at the budget of the resorts I own. Unfortunately too many items are bundled together so it is very hard to make any decent estimate for any resort.
 

komosatp

TUG Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2007
Messages
306
Reaction score
20
Points
378
Location
Washington, DC
Harborside may be due some sort of rebate from Atlantis for Atlantis' closure. HRA owners pay an annual access fee to Atlantis for the use of Atlantis' amenities, collected as part of their annual dues. Sections 4.2 and 9.2 of the Use and Access agreement says that if Atlantis amenities become unavailable, Atlantis' owners and HRA timeshare association 'shall agree to a proportionate reduction of the Atlantis Facilities Assessment'.

Now there could be another force majure clause (section 9.2 is titled force majure) elsewhere in the governing documents, but I would hope that the lawyers that drafted this agreement considered the easily foreseeable possibility that Atlantis could be closed for an extended period due to hurricanes, and that HRA shouldn't have to pay for Atlantis access during that closure period.
 

Sea Six

TUG Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2005
Messages
4,045
Reaction score
872
Points
349
Location
Marco Island, FL
Resorts Owned
Club Regency - Marco Island
Lagunamar - Cancun
Vistana Villages Key West (2) - Orlando
Have you every heard of first impression.? LOL :wave:

Again, what does it matter when nobody's there? Just get it looking perfect again before guests start coming back. No need for daily manicuring when there's nobody there to see it.
 

Sea Six

TUG Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2005
Messages
4,045
Reaction score
872
Points
349
Location
Marco Island, FL
Resorts Owned
Club Regency - Marco Island
Lagunamar - Cancun
Vistana Villages Key West (2) - Orlando
If @pedro47 was only talking about when the resorts are closed I agree but it's unclear that was his intent.
Did you happen to notice the original post in this thread was about maintenance fees being impacted by employee furloughs and resort closures? That was the whole point. His thought was that fees should be reduced because operating expenses are DOWN.
 

controller1

TUG Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2017
Messages
3,042
Reaction score
1,940
Points
298
Location
Tulsa
Resorts Owned
Westin KORVN OF
Westin Nanea OF
Westin FLEX
Again, what does it matter when nobody's there? Just get it looking perfect again before guests start coming back. No need for daily manicuring when there's nobody there to see it.

Apparently you missed the LOL and the laughing/waving emoji! Take a very deep breath, count to ten and exhale slowly. ;)
 

LisaRex

TUG Review Crew
TUG Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
6,792
Reaction score
317
Points
518
Location
'burbs of Cincinnati, OH
Resorts Owned
Used to own: WKORV-N; SVV - Bella
It's hard to predict how hard this pandemic is going to impact the average timeshare owner, but we have to keep in mind that during the last financial crisis (the housing crisis of 2008), timeshare developers soon realized that they were walking a tightrope. With so many distressed owners walking away from their timeshares, and the HOAs' remedy to simply pass along those missing fees to loyal owners, they exposed an economic reality of their system: MFs can never exceed the current rental rate of the lowest season (and the lowest view ), or the whole system risks collapsing.

Why? Because consumer protection laws mandate that MFs are based on square footage, and not season or view. HOAs cannot charge a high season owner more than a low season owner of the same unit. You cannot charge a 1200 sf ocean front owner more than a 1200 sf island view owner. And if they try to raise MFs above the current rental rates of the lowest season/lowest view, those low season owners will walk away. And that risks setting off a vicious cycle of delinquencies = higher MFs = more delinquencies. They even acknowledged this risk in one of their filings.

Since then, they've tried to mitigate this risk by switching to points systems, which allows them to essentially charge higher season and higher view owners more than their fair share. However, a majority of owners are still deeded owners, so IMO, deeded owners are still protected by that economic reality.

Long way to say that my guess is it will not go above low season rental rates. :) Hawaii owners may see a jump in MFs because rental rates have gone up on the islands, but if your MFs are already at low season rental rates, you'll be fine. Points owners? I imagine they'll be seeing a slight jump as they test the waters to see what they can get away with.
 

CarlosRobayo23

TUG Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2020
Messages
50
Reaction score
15
Points
68
Location
Calgary, Canada
Vistana=Marriott. Same thing, and Marriott increases fees every single year, no skipped years at Willow Ridge. I am selling my Willow Ridge Platinum units. There is no reason to keep them with my SBP and SDO units pulling all of the Marriott exchanges via II and at reduced fees.

Hey Cindy. I'm on the market for Willow Ridge Platinum units. If you want send me a PM
 

ocdb8r

TUG Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2008
Messages
1,543
Reaction score
754
Points
473
MFs can never exceed the current rental rate of the lowest season (and the lowest view ), or the whole system risks collapsing.

There were many examples of this during the last financial crisis, and plenty of examples of this today (pre-COVID crisis). Several low-season Harborside weeks don't rent for their current maintenance fees and most of the Vistana mountain resort mud weeks also don't rent for enough to cover maintenance fees. I took a quick look at Redweek and there are also a few Westin Mission Hills weeks renting for less that 2020 MFs.

Long way to say that my guess is it will not go above low season rental rates.

I don't think we can count on this.
 

LisaRex

TUG Review Crew
TUG Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
6,792
Reaction score
317
Points
518
Location
'burbs of Cincinnati, OH
Resorts Owned
Used to own: WKORV-N; SVV - Bella
There were many examples of this during the last financial crisis, and plenty of examples of this today (pre-COVID crisis). Several low-season Harborside weeks don't rent for their current maintenance fees and most of the Vistana mountain resort mud weeks also don't rent for enough to cover maintenance fees. I took a quick look at Redweek and there are also a few Westin Mission Hills weeks renting for less that 2020 MFs.

For rental rates, I mean what the average Joe could go onto Vistana.com or Expedia and rent the unit for, not what an owner could get on Redweek. Most people don't know about timeshare resale sites.
 

needvaca

TUG Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2017
Messages
731
Reaction score
815
Points
203
Resorts Owned
MGO, WKV, SVV Bella
They will never lower maintenance fees. If they have lower costs this year, they will just use the extra cash to beef up “reserves”
 

bobpark56

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
1,694
Reaction score
375
Points
444
Location
Gibsonia, PA (just north of Pittsburgh)
Resorts Owned
Westin Lagunamar, Westin Aventuras, Marriott Grande Vista, Sandos Caracol, Festiva, Diamond Resorts (Hawaii Collection)
Our maintenance fees at Westin St John went down significantly after the resort was closed due to hurricane damage.
 

krj9999

TUG Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2007
Messages
1,090
Reaction score
172
Points
423
Location
Maryland
Yeah, not thrilled by the Willow Ridge increases either. But it still pulls good Marriott trades for me. Stayed at Ko Olina 2BR unit in January using a studio, and have an upcoming late June check-in at OceanWatch Villas (fingers crossed situation better by then) using a 1BR.

Usually easier for me to use the Willow Ridge deposits than my SDO deposits (in terms of getting value from). But I wouldn't be buying more of either resort at this point.

Vistana=Marriott. Same thing, and Marriott increases fees every single year, no skipped years at Willow Ridge. I am selling my Willow Ridge Platinum units. There is no reason to keep them with my SBP and SDO units pulling all of the Marriott exchanges via II and at reduced fees.
 

JudyS

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
4,166
Reaction score
211
Points
448
Location
Ann Arbor, MI
Our maintenance fees at Westin St John went down significantly after the resort was closed due to hurricane damage.
Thanks for posting; that is good to know. How long was the resort closed, and how much did fees go down?

I should note, though, that the Westin St John was no doubt carrying hurricane insurance. As far as I know, no hotel insurance pays on pandemics.
 
Top