Had anyone sold MVC to RCI?

[Gunshy]

We have been owners and have quite a few points with Marriott Vacation Club and we were approached by RCI to sell our points/deeds and buy their into their (RCI) points. Have to admit the maintenance fees at Marriott are killing us and the fees for RCI are much lower. After the sales person showed us the compounded over 10 and 20 years the difference was staggering. But our Marriott points are paid off and if we switch we are not getting full value and will OWE RCI essentially to have them get us 'out' of the marriott deeds. Looking for advice and to see if anyone has experienced the RCI sales pitch and any suggestions on what may be a better option.

 

[theo]

We have been owners and have quite a few points with Marriott Vacation Club and we were approached by RCI to sell our points/deeds and buy their into their (RCI) points. Have to admit the maintenance fees at Marriott are killing us and the fees for RCI are much lower. After the sales person showed us the compounded over 10 and 20 years the difference was staggering. But our Marriott points are paid off and if we switch we are not getting full value and will OWE RCI essentially to have them get us 'out' of the marriott deeds. Looking for advice and to see if anyone has experienced the RCI sales pitch and any suggestions on what may be a better option.

RCI does not buy deeds and RCI does not own any resorts or any timeshare weeks. RCI is an exchange company --- no more, no less. Period.
Exchange, in the context of RCI operations, is specifically limited to owners "depositing" owned RCI-affiliated resort weeks on a one time basis for the possibility of obtaining (by "exchange") a different week (not owned by RCI, but owned and "deposited" by another owner) on a one time basis.

There are RCI affiliated resorts which are in RCI Points, of course, but that's distinctly different from what you have described above.
Exactly where and how did you come to encounter this "sales person", anyhow? You haven't made that important detail at all clear.

Why would you believe that RCI (or anyone else) can somehow magically "get you out" of your current Marriott deeds --- and for money, to boot?

Perhaps it's a RCI affiliated resort sales rep looking to peddle RCI Points? (not very likely; they couldn't / wouldn't touch your Marriott ownerships).
Maybe it's a "vacation club" sales operation of some sort? (they routinely come and go). More details on where / how you encountered them would help.
Worst case / most likely scenario is that it's just a scam operation inappropriately invoking RCI's name in an effort to create an appearance of credibility.
The fact that you would be paying big bucks out of pocket to "get out of your Marriotts" is a red flag strongly indicating the likelihood of a scam operation.

In any case, proceed with extreme caution (...better still, don't proceed at all). Something here has a really foul aroma to it.

 

[fluke]

Agree with above. If this is not an outright scam they are being very deceptive. I wouldn't deal with them.

 

[Gunshy]

Thanks Theo and fluke. Looks like the 'parent company' is Leisure Getaways Inc. Any insight on them?

 

[Gunshy]

RCI does not buy deeds and RCI does not own any resorts or any timeshare weeks. RCI is an exchange company --- no more, no less. Period.
Exchange, in the context of RCI operations, is specifically limited to owners "depositing" owned RCI-affiliated resort weeks on a one time basis for the possibility of obtaining (by "exchange") a different week (not owned by RCI, but owned and "deposited" by another owner) on a one time basis.

There are RCI affiliated resorts which are in RCI Points, of course, but that's distinctly different from what you have described above.
Exactly where and how did you come to encounter this "sales person", anyhow? You haven't made that important detail at all clear.

Why would you believe that RCI (or anyone else) can somehow magically "get you out" of your current Marriott deeds --- and for money, to boot?

Perhaps it's a RCI affiliated resort sales rep looking to peddle RCI Points? (not very likely; they couldn't / wouldn't touch your Marriott ownerships).
Maybe it's a "vacation club" sales operation of some sort? (they routinely come and go). More details on where / how you encountered them would help.
Worst case / most likely scenario is that it's just a scam operation inappropriately invoking RCI's name in an effort to create an appearance of credibility.
The fact that you would be paying out of pocket to "get out of your Marriott deeds" is a big red flag strongly indicating the likelihood of a scam operation.

In any case, proceed with extreme caution (...better still, don't proceed at all). Something here has a really foul aroma to it.

Thanks Theo,
They invited us to a dinner under the guise of informing us of more benefits from MVC and when we got there the sales pitch began. Thought something smelled fishy. The 'parent company' is Leisure Getaways Inc. Any insight on them?

 

[theo]

Thanks Theo,
They invited us to a dinner under the guise of informing us of more benefits from MVC and when we got there the sales pitch began. Thought something smelled fishy. The 'parent company' is Leisure Getaways Inc. Any insight on them?

I've heard the name before (and certainly not in a good way) but I don't recall details. If you do some searching on their name on TUG, you'll likely find lots of material and details to reinforce that it is an operation with which you probably don't want to become involved in any way. Forewarned is forearmed.

 

[Gunshy]

I've heard the name before (and certainly not in a good way) but I don't recall details. If you do some searching on their name on TUG, you'll likely find lots of material and details to reinforce that it is an operation with which you probably don't want to become involved in any way. Forewarned is forearmed.

Thanks for the insight. Will not proceed.

 

[theo]

Thanks for the insight. Will not proceed.

Wise decision. This operation sounds like one in which the real "payoff" (...for them, not for you) is the serious upfront money they would collect from you to (allegedly) "get you out" of your MVC ownership (something which they frankly cannot lawfully accomplish at all).

It also sounds like, in the process, they would also sell you a low value RCI Points ownership (which they might actually have on hand to transfer to you, via Power of Attorney from some unhappy RCI Points deed owner). In the worst case scenario, you would still remain the owner of record for MVC, be out several thousand dollars of upfront money and now have a new legal obligation in the form of a new deed with RCI Points attached. In short, you'd be much worse off than you were before ever even hearing from or about these parasites.

How exactly did you come to be "invited" to be graced with their alleged benevolence in the first place anyhow? Did they just "cold call" you out of the blue?
Did you respond to some sort of ad or promotion of some sort? They clearly lured you in somehow; I'm just curious about their actual tactics.

 

[Gunshy]

Wise decision. This operation sounds like one in which the real "payoff" (...for them, not for you) is the serious upfront money they would collect from you to (allegedly) "get you out" of your MVC ownership (something which they frankly cannot lawfully accomplish at all).

It also sounds like, in the process, they would also sell you a low value RCI Points ownership (which they might actually have on hand to transfer to you, via Power of Attorney from some unhappy RCI Points deed owner). In the worst case scenario, you would still remain the owner of record for MVC, be out several thousand dollars of upfront money and now have a new legal obligation in the form of a new RCI Points deed. In short, you'd be much worse off than you were before ever even hearing from or about these parasites.

How exactly did you come to be "invited" to be graced with their alleged benevolence in the first place, pray tell? Did they contact you out of the blue?
Did you respond to some sort of ad or promotion of some sort? They clearly lured you in somehow; I'm just curious about their actual tactics.

Theo
It was pretty slick - they called and invited us - as Marriott Owners - to dinner to hear about the new opportunities and services MVC had to offer. I was intrigued because Marriott had changed some of their levels and different options. When we got there they 'couldn't believe we were Marriott owners and weren't sure how our name got in the list' - had one pretending to be a newby salesman who had to bring the manager over because he didn't know how to handle the situation. So...in swoops the slim ball manager who began the pitch. He knew exactly what we had with Marriott that it was paid off and then played up the 'compounded fees' from Marriott to compare to what RCIs were. Should have walked out then but they essentially had us cornered!! Once we did get the hell outta there I started to do some research and I came across this site! I wanted to see if anyone else had an experience like that. It was so uncomfortable. Very helpful information in this site by some really savvy timeshareers - so thanks Theo! I feel like such a Newby!

 

[theo]

Theo
It was pretty slick - they called and invited us - as Marriott Owners - to dinner to hear about the new opportunities and services MVC had to offer. I was intrigued because Marriott had changed some of their levels and different options. When we got there they 'couldn't believe we were Marriott owners and weren't sure how our name got in the list' - had one pretending to be a newby salesman who had to bring the manager over because he didn't know how to handle the situation. So...in swoops the slim ball manager who began the pitch. He knew exactly what we had with Marriott that it was paid off and then played up the 'compounded fees' from Marriott to compare to what RCIs were. Should have walked out then but they essentially had us cornered!! Once we did get the hell outta there I started to do some research and I came across this site! I wanted to see if anyone else had an experience like that. It was so uncomfortable. Very helpful information in this site by some really savvy timeshareers - so thanks Theo! I feel like such a Newby!

Pat yourself on the back for having the wisdom to be skeptical and walking away and then seeking out more information. Well done and good on 'ya!

What is always discouraging in these forums is a very different scenario in which someone takes the bait, gets hooked, pays the big bucks --- and then comes here asking questions. By that time, it's essentially too late to even help them (except in instances of developer-direct purchases which, by state law, have a cancellation period ranging from 3-10 days, depending on the individual state, but this would not have benefited you since it was resale, not developer direct).

It's interesting that you were apparently "targeted" in advance as a Marriott owner, right from the git go. Makes you wonder how / where / from whom they were somehow able to learn of your MVC ownership status before contacting you.

 

[taffy19]

Congratulations TUG and the person involved who wasn't SCAMMED!

 

[Gunshy]

Pat yourself on the back for having the wisdom to be skeptical and walking away and then seeking out more information. Well done and good on 'ya!

What is always discouraging in these forums is a very different scenario in which someone takes the bait, gets hooked, pays the big bucks --- and then comes here asking questions. By that time, it's essentially too late to even help them (except in instances of developer-direct purchases which, by state law, have a cancellation period ranging from 3-10 days, depending on the individual state, but this would not have benefited you since it was resale, not developer direct).

It's interesting that you were apparently "targeted" in advance as a Marriott owner, right from the git go. Makes you wonder how / where / from whom they were somehow able to learn of your MVC ownership status before contacting you.

 

[Gunshy]

Thanks. So to educate myself further and for potential future encounters what is the difference between developer direct and a resale? What are the catches?

 

[WackyLucy]

Thanks. So to educate myself further and for potential future encounters what is the difference between developer direct and a resale? What are the catches?

State rescission laws generally do not apply to resale timeshare purchases, but only to purchases made directly from a developer. Florida law is a noteworthy exception; my understanding is that in Florida the rescission rights apply to resale purchases and developer purchases alike.

A "resale" is simply any transaction of a timeshare after the original purchase from a developer. As far as the "catches", you have a whole lot of research ahead of you to understand all of the many different systems and different assorted rules and assorted nuances.

 

[silentg]

There used to be a commercial on TV, it said if something seems wrong a bell should go off in your head,Listen to that bell. Don't deal with these scammers!
Anyone else remember?
Silentg

 

[pedro47]

This is a great thread, with some excellent, excellent advice and with a happy ending.
Outstanding posts Theo and some excellent advice Theo.

 

[icydog]

I, too, wonder how these scammers knew the OP was a Marriott owner. They also knew his resorts and points were paid off; how could they know that?

 

[LannyPC]

...what is the difference between developer direct and a resale?

About $15,000. And maybe a few small perks (that are worth nowhere near $15,000).

 

[ResaleExpert]

State rescission laws generally do not apply to resale timeshare purchases, but only to purchases made directly from a developer. Florida law is a noteworthy exception; my understanding is that in Florida the rescission rights apply to resale purchases and developer purchases alike.

A "resale" is simply any transaction of a timeshare after the original purchase from a developer. As far as the "catches", you have a whole lot of research ahead of you to understand all of the many different systems and different assorted rules and assorted nuances.

I'm a licensed broker selling resales throughout the United States for over 12 years and every state I know of has the same right of rescission for resales as from the Developer. For example, CA & HI & NV all have specific forms needing to be signed by buyer and seller addressing this exact right on resales. In resales the SELLER has this same right too, so if they got a higher offer or have seller's remorse they can also cancel outright in 5-10 days (depending on state) for no reason with no recourse.
If you have different information on resales please post so our readers will know.

 

[WackyLucy]

I'm a licensed broker selling resales throughout the United States for over 12 years and every state I know of has the same right of rescission for resales as from the Developer. For example, CA & HI & NV all have specific forms needing to be signed by buyer and seller addressing this exact right on resales. In resales the SELLER has this same right too, so if they got a higher offer or have seller's remorse they can also cancel outright in 5-10 days (depending on state) for no reason with no recourse.
If you have different information on resales please post so our readers will know.

Simply stated, I believe that you are (licensed broker notwithstanding) entirely mistaken, except perhaps as pertains to the three western U.S. states which you have cited (states about whose applicable laws I claim no knowledge or experience).

You may or may not be aware that Florida statutes were overtly and specifically amended just a few years ago to include Florida timeshare resale transactions for rescission rights (10 days in Florida). Before that statutory amendment, no such rescission rights applied to private resale (secondary market, non-developer) timeshare transactions, which is precisely why a specific statutory amendment was required and adopted there. Few (if any) other states have followed suit, afaik. Rescission rights do not apply to private resale transactions in Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, Massachusetts, Rhode Island or Connecticut --- all of which states have a significant number of timeshare properties --- unless added and mutually agreed in writing within a purchase and sales contract.

We can agree to respectfully disagree, but it is my belief that private timeshare resale transactions (unfortunately) do not enjoy the same rescission rights provided by state law as apply to developer-direct sales, at least in the vast majority of U.S. states, except and unless otherwise specifically stated within the applicable state statutes (as was recently adopted by specific statutory amendment in Florida). I would be glad to be proven wrong if you can identify any contradictory statutory cites, but in the meantime my firm belief and clear understanding is that you are quite simply incorrect.

 

[ResaleExpert]

I'm a licensed broker selling resales throughout the United States for over 12 years and every state I know of has the same right of rescission for resales as from the Developer. For example, CA & HI & NV all have specific forms needing to be signed by buyer and seller addressing this exact right on resales. In resales the SELLER has this same right too, so if they got a higher offer or have seller's remorse they can also cancel outright in 5-10 days (depending on state) for no reason with no recourse.
If you have different information on resales please post so our readers will know.

Theo
It was pretty slick - they called and invited us - as Marriott Owners - to dinner to hear about the new opportunities and services MVC had to offer. I was intrigued because Marriott had changed some of their levels and different options. When we got there they 'couldn't believe we were Marriott owners and weren't sure how our name got in the list' - had one pretending to be a newby salesman who had to bring the manager over because he didn't know how to handle the situation. So...in swoops the slim ball manager who began the pitch. He knew exactly what we had with Marriott that it was paid off and then played up the 'compounded fees' from Marriott to compare to what RCIs were. Should have walked out then but they essentially had us cornered!! Once we did get the hell outta there I started to do some research and I came across this site! I wanted to see if anyone else had an experience like that. It was so uncomfortable. Very helpful information in this site by some really savvy timeshareers - so thanks Theo! I feel like such a Newby!

I've actually had a buyer that I represented from one of these 'trade ins' where they bought from a resort in Mexico. While it eventually went through and the buyer I represented obtained a very good deal, the issue was the company representing the Mexican Company is either buying the right to market or is adding brokerage on the sales price. This was still in the original seller's name and had not been transferred.

 

[ResaleExpert]

Simply stated, I believe that you are mistaken, except perhaps as pertains to the three western U.S. states which you have cited (states about whose applicable laws I claim no knowledge or experience) --- and Florida.

You may or may not be aware that Florida statutes were overtly and specifically amended just a few years ago to include Florida timeshare resale transactions for rescission rights (10 days in Florida). Before that statutory amendment, no such rescission rights applied to private resale (secondary market, non-developer) timeshare transactions.

We can agree to respectfully disagree, but it is my own belief that private timeshare resale transactions (unfortunately) do not enjoy the same rescission rights provided by state law as apply to developer-direct sales --- at least in the vast majority of U.S. states. I would be glad to mistaken and proven wrong, but in the meantime that is indeed my belief and understanding.

 

[ResaleExpert]

Thank you.
Yes as a broker with over 1,400 clients I am aware of Florida's law changes.
So we have At least Florida, Hawaii, Nevada and California with right to cancel for either buyer or seller. These are the top 4 states for timeshares, by far. We can agree on that

 

[WackyLucy]

I've actually had a buyer that I represented from one of these 'trade ins' where they bought from a resort in Mexico. While it eventually went through and the buyer I represented obtained a very good deal, the issue was the company representing the Mexican Company is either buying the right to market or is adding brokerage on the sales price. This was still in the original seller's name and had not been transferred.

This observation is neither germane nor relevant to the topic of whether state rescission laws in the U.S. apply equally to developer-direct and private resale timeshare transactions.

 

[HudsHut]

Which Marriott resort/week do you own? Do you use it or trade it?