Forget Max, new new thing is Trust Points

[pedro47]

Diamond Resorts Mf, were always higher than Hilton. Where is the money?

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

We read it was 10-15% for management fee in the annual report. It didn’t specify the type of property. Where did you see about the annual trust mgmt fee. I hope to get the documents shortly.

When fee statements are sent out in the fall each year, the trust fee shows as a line item in the expense statement for the particular collection. It's called "management fees" - it gets charged in the Base Standard Assessment. The Base Standard Assessment is a flat rate charge to all trust members regardless of the number of points owned. If you own more points, the trust fee becomes a smaller fraction of what you pay.

 

[mountainboy]

When fee statements are sent out in the fall each year, the trust fee shows as a line item in the expense statement for the particular collection. It's called "management fees" - it gets charged in the Base Standard Assessment. The Base Standard Assessment is a flat rate charge to all trust members regardless of the number of points owned. If you own more points, the trust fee becomes a smaller fraction of what you pay.

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> 3500 Annual MF :-(

 

[WaikikiFirst]

"flat rate charge to all trust members regardless of the number of points owned. If you own more points, the trust fee becomes a smaller fraction of what you pay"
Explains what I wrote in another thread that the MFs/PT for these seemed to be Y = mX + B across contracts when I saw a bunch of them on eBay almost 2 yrs ago. The smaller ones were about $0.22/Pt & the biggest ones were $0.20/Pt. Something like that, iirc.
in any case, having higher MFs/PT for lower quality properties than HGVC has made me

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

> 3500 Annual MF :-(

That all depends on the number of points you have in the account.

Three weeks in a fully furnished 2-bedroom condominium at Point at Poipu in Kauai for $3500 is quite reasonable. There are quite a few people, including TUGgers, who love the resort.

 

[mountainboy]

That all depends on the number of points you have in the account.

Three weeks in a fully furnished 2-bedroom condominium at Point at Poipu in Kauai for $3500 is quite reasonable. There are quite a few people, including TUGgers, who love the resort.

Agree!
Have seen folks post annual MFs of almost 3k for 1 week for a 2 BR at P@P on some posts & hence thought it would be much more expensive...

https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/maintinance-fees-for-point-poipu-2025.368905/reply?quote=3112324

https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/maintinance-fees-for-point-poipu-2025.368905/reply?quote=3141893

https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/maintinance-fees-for-point-poipu-2025.368905/reply?quote=3112976

 

[FunnyFarm]

3 weeks for $3500 would be very nice, must be garden view points or something.
1 week deeded is about $2650 MF

 

[cd5]

3 weeks for $3500 would be very nice, must be garden view points or something.
1 week deeded is about $2650 MF

With points you chose how/where/when you want to spend them. It could be oceanview but not holiday season...

 

[youppi]

When fee statements are sent out in the fall each year, the trust fee shows as a line item in the expense statement for the particular collection. It's called "management fees" - it gets charged in the Base Standard Assessment. The Base Standard Assessment is a flat rate charge to all trust members regardless of the number of points owned. If you own more points, the trust fee becomes a smaller fraction of what you pay.

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So, now they hide the GET in the assessment amount ?
The last time I paid the Hawaii Collection MF was in 2022 and when I saw the increase in 2023, I just walked away.
I'm happy that I did it because from what I see with your 2025 MF, the Hawaii Collection MF is out of control.
In 2022, we had a surplus of $276,291. In 2023, a deficit of $120,435. And now in 2025, the deficit is $2,131,318.
The more they increase the MF, the more people walk away (it generates bad debt) and more the MF must be increased the next year. They are doomed.

When Apollo bought DRI in 2016, they decrease a lot the MF in 2018 and the MF stay almost the same until HGV bought them in 2021.
I expected a decrease of the MF in 2023 under HGV like Apollo did 2 years after they acquired DRI but it's the inverse that happened.
HGV continues to increase the MF year after year like DRI did after they bought Sunterra in 2007 (I bought from Sunterra).

 

[gravityrules]

We read it was 10-15% for management fee in the annual report. It didn’t specify the type of property. Where did you see about the annual trust mgmt fee. I hope to get the documents shortly.

Just a question, why isn't G&A and Billing, Assessment & Accounting considered as 'Management'? If those are added in, the management cost is 19.5%. Or expressing it another way, just over 80% of the MF actually goes to the component properties maintenance. And making it worse, don't those component associations MFs also have 'management fees' baked in?

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

3 weeks for $3500 would be very nice, must be garden view points or something.
1 week deeded is about $2650 MF

You are correct. The collection is only a part of our ownership. We also have a deed at Point at Poipu, which allows us to book ocean front, any week of the year, for 10,000 points.

 

[Maria Mccarthy]

Just a question, why isn't G&A and Billing, Assessment & Accounting considered as 'Management'? If those are added in, the management cost is 19.5%. Or expressing it another way, just over 80% of the MF actually goes to the component properties maintenance. And making it worse, don't those component associations MFs also have 'management fees' baked in?

I think these are real costs ie accounting staff, etc. The management is the company’s expertise. Ive seen this in commercial property can’t say if that’s a reasonable % though.

 

[youppi]

Just a question, why isn't G&A and Billing, Assessment & Accounting considered as 'Management'? If those are added in, the management cost is 19.5%. Or expressing it another way, just over 80% of the MF actually goes to the component properties maintenance. And making it worse, don't those component associations MFs also have 'management fees' baked in?

This is from the financial document of Hawaii Collection 2022: