Elderly Father in law bought timeshare he cannot afford

[dottie127]

Hi all,

Two days ago, my husband found out that his 80-something father purchased a timeshare that he is not able to afford. The transaction occurred in the fall so we are well past the rescission period. The debt appears to be around 11k, though we're still trying to figure out the full financial impacts. I've read about the responsible exit program, but that appears to be geared toward those who do not have any debt. Has anyone else been in this kind of situation? We have learned to stay away from timeshare exit companies. Any other tips?

 

[sue1947]

What did he buy; company and where, which week or type and/or how many points?
With any timeshare past rescission, you have 3 choices.
1. Get somebody else to take it over either by selling or giving it away. For the vast majority of timeshares, this isn't an option if you owe money. The resale value just isn't there and nobody will pay $11K for something they can get for a couple hundred or free. However, there are a very few situations that might make this an option.
2. Default and let it foreclose. This will likely ding the credit report, but he may be credit proof if he doesn't intend to buy a house/car etc.
3. Pay it off and use it. This might be the kids/relatives paying it off and using it. Again, it depends on what is owned as to whether it's a good deal or not. Timeshares can be an inexpensive way to travel with a family; kitchens, laundry, extra bedrooms all for less than a motel room.

 

[andre10056]

It makes me so angry to read things like this. I'm not a lawyer, but I'm pretty sure that both parties to a contract have to have the "capacity" to enter into a contract in order for it to be enforceable.

Therefore, no minor can have a contract that they sign enforced against them. I would think an 80 year old who enters into a timeshare contract would similarly be deemed to not have had the capacity to contract. As would, in my opinion, virtually all judges and, in particular, all juries. If it were me, I might even seek punitive damages and I bet a jury might award them to me.

If you're not as angry as I am and don't want to sue, at least call the resort and let them know how you feel. Let's see what they say.

 

[Tia]

Did your 80yo father in law take a vacation and attend a presentation ?

 

[dottie127]

Did your 80yo father in law take a vacation and attend a presentation ?

That is correct. He said that he asked to speak about decisions with his kids first but they told him he'd lose out on a great deal if he did, and he fell for the hard sell.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Previous posting advice is good.

Try to get the resort to take it back and tell them that he will not pay the debt because he needs to pay for his care as an 80 YO. Who sells to 80 YOs? Does he have dementia? Tell them he will need to walk so they can take it back now for free or pay money to lawyers to foreclose.

What state is this resort in?

Do not pay anyone upfront to sell this for you. They are a scam

Do not put this in your name or you will be stuck with it. Worst case is that when he dies it goes away with the estate. No one can force debt on heirs. Refuse the inheritance - unless you want it.

 

[rickandcindy23]

It amazes me to see people older than me (I am 70) sitting in the waiting area for a timeshare presentation. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know what these sleazeballs have in mind to con seniors. It's elder abuse, frankly, to push an older person into signing for a timeshare. There should be a law that no one over a certain age should be invited to a timeshare presentation. It has to be over 70 because I am 70.

 

[dayooper]

It amazes me to see people older than me (I am 70) sitting in the waiting area for a timeshare presentation. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know what these sleazeballs have in mind to con seniors. It's elder abuse, frankly, to push an older person into signing for a timeshare. There should be a law that no one over a certain age should be invited to a timeshare presentation. It has to be over 70 because I am 70.

Free stuff is a hell of a drug. Addictive.

 

[pedro47]

To the OP, can you name the resort or what state where he purchased the timeshare ?

 

[pedro47]

It amazes me to see people older than me (I am 70) sitting in the waiting area for a timeshare presentation. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know what these sleazeballs have in mind to con seniors. It's elder abuse, frankly, to push an older person into signing for a timeshare. There should be a law that no one over a certain age should be invited to a timeshare presentation. It has to be over 70 because I am 70.

I agree with you 100 %. No more sales timeshare presentation after age 70.

 

[dottie127]

To the OP, can you name the resort or what state where he purchased the timeshare ?

Bluegreen vacations. We think this was Louisiana or Florida. We don't have the paperwork in front of us and it's been a bit of a game of telephone trying to sort out what actually happened

 

[jp10558]

It amazes me to see people older than me (I am 70) sitting in the waiting area for a timeshare presentation. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know what these sleazeballs have in mind to con seniors. It's elder abuse, frankly, to push an older person into signing for a timeshare. There should be a law that no one over a certain age should be invited to a timeshare presentation. It has to be over 70 because I am 70.

I mean, this is the exact problem - what age do you become legally incompetent? Should Warren Buffett be disempowered? Do you want to be forced to a conservator when you become some "old age"?

Even just for timeshares - you still need to determine the "bright line" and I don't see getting political agreement. And TBH I've seen worse done in car sales to much younger people who are mentally impaired. Say around 68 or so. Heck, I have a relative who's 78 but who I would say can make a totally informed decision around vacationing, and is currently perfectly able to travel and as mobile as I am at 43. Now, maybe the argument would be she wouldn't get long enough use to be a reasonable purchase, but again, who would we be to decide that?

I would think that you could try and get a contract voided if you could prove impairment at time of signing, but that's pretty expensive and potentially hard to do.

Now, I've made the argument before that I think there's a market and business plan for TSs that isn't predatory and doesn't need these high pressure sales, but clearly the Industry disagrees.

 

[rickandcindy23]

I agree with you 100 %. No more sales timeshare presentation after age 70.

Let's make it 75. I want to get those points from Marriott a while longer.

 

[rickandcindy23]

Bluegreen vacations. We think this was Louisiana or Florida. We don't have the paperwork in front of us and it's been a bit of a game of telephone trying to sort out what actually happened

How old is your parent?

 

[VacationForever]

I agree with you 100 %. No more sales timeshare presentation after age 70.

It was interesting that several years ago we went to Grand Solmar at Lands End and we then asked about our ages for attending their sales presentation. We were told that they had a policy that they would not sell to anyone over the age of 70. My husband was just past 70 was "rejected"! That was refreshing.

 

[Snazzylass]

^^^ Well, good for that company. However, I presume the buyer was well enough to travel. This person was already on vacation. Let's hope he doesn't need his credit score for anything.

I don't condone the purchase but age is not automatic "elder abuse." This person's decision isn't any different than many folks who get sucked into a T/S purchase.
There are rules about competency but how do you prove someone is incompetent if he's well enough to travel? On the other hand, there are laws against age discrimination for a mortgage, etc. A 95-yo qualifies for a 30-yr mortgage just like everyone else.

 

[LannyPC]

Worst case is that when he dies it goes away with the estate. No one can force debt on heirs. Refuse the inheritance - unless you want it.

I'd be careful about making a bold statement like that. This has been debated a lot here on TUG. Yes, it's true that "No one can force debt on heirs", but the TS does not necessarily "[go] away with the estate." The estate is still responsible for getting rid of the TS.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

True. Perhaps I was too simplistic in tactics. But it doesn't take away from the main point (and one where some developers lie) that heirs will be stuck with the inheritance.

 

[jp10558]

I'd be careful about making a bold statement like that. This has been debated a lot here on TUG. Yes, it's true that "No one can force debt on heirs", but the TS does not necessarily "[go] away with the estate." The estate is still responsible for getting rid of the TS.

Well, presuming the estate has no assets, the TS can go after a dead person all they like. Even if you have a lot of assets still in your estate for some reason rather than in a trust or TOD, I'm pretty sure it's been decided that a TS can't keep an estate open forever for future MF payments. They could go after back payments and the current year, but that's about it. At some point the estate closes.

 

[Passepartout]

My advice is simply, DO NOT PAY! Not a dime. His retirement income is safe. It would take YEARS to get a judgement- that would be unsuccessful in any court- and more years if BG attempted to fight it- which they won't. He'll get calls and letters, but he can limit them by mailing a written requirement that any and all communication MUST BE BY USPS- NO EXCEPTIONS! Then drop ALL their notices in the trash.

Shame on BG.

Jim

 

[rickandcindy23]

^^^ Well, good for that company. However, I presume the buyer was well enough to travel. This person was already on vacation. Let's hope he doesn't need his credit score for anything.

I don't condone the purchase but age is not automatic "elder abuse." This person's decision isn't any different than many folks who get sucked into a T/S purchase.
There are rules about competency but how do you prove someone is incompetent if he's well enough to travel? On the other hand, there are laws against age discrimination for a mortgage, etc. A 95-yo qualifies for a 30-yr mortgage just like everyone else.

My stepdad was talking about a trip to Europe yesterday, told me that he is going to go to France, then Italy, then to Poland and Germany. He is 90 and has dementia. We asked him for his log-ins to his bank and credit card. This is SCARY that he is planning a trip. I think people with mild dementia do plan trips. I just hope my stepdad forgets that he planned a trip, and we can get a refund for him.

He also talked about going on a cruise a few days ago. He is tired of being home alone. I told him that he could maybe go on a cruise with us, but he is wobbly, so getting off the ship, not really a good idea. Maybe he could go up to meals and enjoy the views from the balcony. I have no idea what to say to him about these crazy plans he is making in his head.

His doctor reiterated to him in front of Rick that he should not be driving, unless it's the 1 mile to the grocery store, but he keeps driving down "his street," Lowell Blvd (his name is Lowell) and we keep telling him that his doctor said he shouldn't be driving.

The doctor told him to remember 3 words, talked to him for a few minutes about his meds, then asked the three words he was supposed to remember. He could not remember any of the words.

I could see an elderly couple getting into a car, driving a distance, like from Denver to the Colorado Rocky Mountains, going to a timeshare presentation, and walking away and forgetting that they bought something, until the bill comes. You might think that is an unlikely scenario, but I know my stepdad, and he is impulsive.

He has me so worried right now because he is bored at home and won't go the few blocks to the senior center.

 

[easyrider]

I drive by an Indian Casino every once in a while and I see busses of old people spending their SS checks likely on slots. I think most of them are losing.

Then this guy being discussed on this thread bought a timeshare.

At what age is too old ? From what I see it's different for everyone but generally by 80+ many people aren't functioning physically or mentally as well as they did in their 70's.

Bill

 

[GrayFal]

Hi all,

Two days ago, my husband found out that his 80-something father purchased a timeshare that he is not able to afford. The transaction occurred in the fall so we are well past the rescission period. The debt appears to be around 11k, though we're still trying to figure out the full financial impacts. I've read about the responsible exit program, but that appears to be geared toward those who do not have any debt. Has anyone else been in this kind of situation? We have learned to stay away from timeshare exit companies. Any other tips?

He can not sell or give away a TS that is not paid in full.
An $11,000 purchase from Bluegreen is likely 4,000 points which will not get him more than a Studio/1BR off season for 3-5 weekdays.

They sell these ridiculous amount of points to have you come back in 4-8 weeks for an “educational meeting” and tell you how this isn’t enough points, who wpuld sell you such a small amount? and you need to buy more.


At 80+ years old, is he planning on buying a new car or a house?
If not, tell him to stop paying.
BG will come after him for the loan payments and ding his credit but so what?
Do not give them any more money. Even if you have him ( or you help him) pay it off he will still be stuck with yearly fees forever.

 

[Snazzylass]

My stepdad was talking about a trip to Europe yesterday, told me that he is going to go to France, then Italy, then to Poland and Germany. He is 90 and has dementia. We asked him for his log-ins to his bank and credit card. This is SCARY that he is planning a trip. I think people with mild dementia do plan trips. I just hope my stepdad forgets that he planned a trip, and we can get a refund for him.

He also talked about going on a cruise a few days ago. He is tired of being home alone. I told him that he could maybe go on a cruise with us, but he is wobbly, so getting off the ship, not really a good idea. Maybe he could go up to meals and enjoy the views from the balcony. I have no idea what to say to him about these crazy plans he is making in his head.

His doctor reiterated to him in front of Rick that he should not be driving, unless it's the 1 mile to the grocery store, but he keeps driving down "his street," Lowell Blvd (his name is Lowell) and we keep telling him that his doctor said he shouldn't be driving.

The doctor told him to remember 3 words, talked to him for a few minutes about his meds, then asked the three words he was supposed to remember. He could not remember any of the words.

I could see an elderly couple getting into a car, driving a distance, like from Denver to the Colorado Rocky Mountains, going to a timeshare presentation, and walking away and forgetting that they bought something, until the bill comes. You might think that is an unlikely scenario, but I know my stepdad, and he is impulsive.

He has me so worried right now because he is bored at home and won't go the few blocks to the senior center.

I'm of the opinion that if an older person wants to avoid interstates and still drive, okay. But limiting driving to 1 mile? I'm not so sure. We don't know the circumstances of the OP. Loved ones have to decide what responsibilities they want to assume for their elderly and impaired. I had friends intervene years ago for their sister with early onset dementia and they did a great job!

My dad turned 89 this winter and insists on still going to the office everyday and running a business. Who can stop him? My mom will be 88 in a few weeks. They will celebrate their 70th wedding anniversary this summer. My brother and SIL took them to Alaska to Salmon fish last summer. Yes, we've all stepped up to pitch in and they drive me nuts I'm going a cruise this fall with my mom. They are going on a river cruise this summer - just the two of them. My dad regularly flies solo.

Just sayin' we can all make poor financial decisions at any age. Unless loved ones are able to step in with POAs and such once someone is diagnosed with limitations, then yes, people will carry on. I wish you the best with your loved one!

 

[pedro47]

Timeshare sales presentation could be fine, if only the sales staff would not insist you must sign a contract right now, this hour, this very second, today to receive the best offer.

I cause this Pressure . IMHO.