[2008] SDKath's guide to 5* platinum [merged]

[Ken555]

ask the rep to split the unit into EOYs and retro something with each side! It works and will get you more SOs and get you to the new 5* level for a slightly higher MF only. No need to give up -- till one day they change that rule too.

I would think you could also purchase a third EOY at the same 50% off (at the same time as the others) at the same or different resort. So, if I understand correctly, what you're saying is to do something like:

Buy 3 EY WMH Platinum 2-bed weeks resale - estimate $10,000 each
Buy 3 EOY WLR Platinum 2-bed developer weeks - $64,350

= $94,350 and 666,450 SOs (no phantom SOs needed with this scenario)

MFs estimate:

$1400 per WMH EY = $4200
$733 per WLR EOY = $2199

= $6399 (and budget 10% increases each year...)

This assumes a minimum $20,000 developer purchase per requal needed.

I haven't analyzed all the purchase options. Is there a cheaper way to get to 5* now, perhaps using 30,000 phantom SOs? Of course, you could get lucky and grab a SDO "true" Platinum week (or SMV week) for less than 10k.

 

[SDKath]

Exactly.

I also just found out that you can get "phantom" SOs for each PURCHASE you make. But it is credit for other, non-Starwood timeshares so you would need to own something else.

So let's say you buy an EOY and retro a WMH. You can get 30,000 phantom SOs for owning a Disney contract (for example).

Then a week later you buy the other EOY unit and retro another WMH. You get ANOTHER 30,000 phantom SOs for your Marriott EOY week (for example).

You can keep doing this. ANd since people would be making EOY purchases (over 20,000), you can theoretically get up to 90,000 SOs just for this. Of course you need to own something else (even 25 DVC points is enough) and be able to prove it to them. These SOs will help you get to 3* or 5* but you CANNOT "use them" to reserve a week or anything. That's why they are phantom.

So to me the EOY purchases and retros at this point make waaaay more sense than any other scenario (as originally suggested by Duke).

It WILL cost more to be 5* though because you basically need to own more properties in the end to make the new SO requirement. So don't kid yourself. This is in Starwood's favor. And I am SURE they will close the EOY purchase retro loop soon too.

Katherine

 

[Ken555]

I also just found out that you can get "phantom" SOs for each PURCHASE you make. But it is credit for other, non-Starwood timeshares so you would need to own something else.

So... what if you own several other t/s's at the time of the purchase / 5* qualification, and then sell them. And, is there a minimum qualification on the other t/s units (Marriott, Disney, etc) or can it be even the cheap week from xyz?

 

[SDKath]

So... what if you own several other t/s's at the time of the purchase / 5* qualification, and then sell them. And, is there a minimum qualification on the other t/s units (Marriott, Disney, etc) or can it be even the cheap week from xyz?

I think once you prove your ownership of an outside TS, you don't have to do it again. I did this phantom SO thing for one of my purchases and got credit for one of my DVC contracts. There I very seriously doubt that they will ask me to prove ownership again. But for the first time, I did have to fax them my deed.

They asked me for an annual ownership at another TS. I don't think it matters where and they were a little stumped with DVC's point system but once I sent them the recorded deed that said annual points of X, they were fine. I don't think they "judge" your week on how cheap it is. But it does have to be an annual TS.

K

 

[stevens397]

Again - for me, you now need even more weeks to get to 5*. Just how many vacation weeks do you have in order to be able to take advantage of Starwood Platinum? Only works, I think, for most people it you trade weeks for points. Then, of course, you are at their mercy in terms of further devaluations!

BTW, I AM Starwood Platinum and I have had some incredible upgrades, especially in Europe over the last four years. No one knows what the future brings, but I get a double stay promotion each year for the last two years and have worked out a deal with a local Starwood. Usually costs me less than $1,000 per year to reach Platinum (most of my REAL stays are on points!) AND I get Starpoints for my efforts that bring my net cost down to about $600 (I figure and usually get 5 cents per point). With a week in Kierland, a week in Mission Hills, a Marriott week I never use and always trade, it makes much more sense to me than spending another $50,000 and hoping the rules don't change.

Don't misunderstand - I am certainly not saying anyone taking another path is wrong. But I still believe that PFL is the only significant value for 5* and for me, the numbers don't work. If they work for others, I'm happy for them.

 

[DJmonkey]

Marriot?

Okay now you have confsed me again.
I own a seperate Marriot week in Vail.
Are you saying I can get some sort of phantom Staroptions for owning this?
Also when I retroed I did not ask for phantom options. Should I have?
Is it too late to ask for some?

If 5* just went up 90000SO some phantom points would helpt the sting assuming I ever actually make it to 5*.
However I think I can make it to 4* fairly easily. Especially if I can use phantom SO towards that.

BTW
How can SVO be increasing prices in this market when resales are dropping dramatically??

 

[SDKath]

Okay now you have confsed me again.
I own a seperate Marriot week in Vail.
Are you saying I can get some sort of phantom Staroptions for owning this?
Also when I retroed I did not ask for phantom options. Should I have?
Is it too late to ask for some?

If 5* just went up 90000SO some phantom points would helpt the sting assuming I ever actually make it to 5*.
However I think I can make it to 4* fairly easily. Especially if I can use phantom SO towards that.

BTW
How can SVO be increasing prices in this market when resales are dropping dramatically??

YES. Exactly. But phantom credits are ONLY good if you are going for 5*. otherwise they are worthless. You can't actually use them. But today I learned that you can get them 3 different times (30,000x3=90,000SOs for free) as long as you request them at each purchase. So it seems to me that if anyone is interested in 5* EVER in the future and you own elsewhere, ask for the phantom credits at every single purchase you make with Starwood. WHY NOT?? Kath

 

[DJmonkey]

So do you think I can ask for them for my last purchase?
Also cant I use them to get to 4* more quickly?

 

[Grandmama]

YES. Exactly. But phantom credits are ONLY good if you are going for 5*. otherwise they are worthless. You can't actually use them. But today I learned that you can get them 3 different times (30,000x3=90,000SOs for free) as long as you request them at each purchase. So it seems to me that if anyone is interested in 5* EVER in the future and you own elsewhere, ask for the phantom credits at every single purchase you make with Starwood. WHY NOT?? Kath

We were told that they give phantom credits only when they get you to a new elite level. So, you can use them in getting to elite level 3, 4 and 5. They won't give you any if you do not reach the next elite level with that transaction.

 

[DJmonkey]

YES. Exactly. But phantom credits are ONLY good if you are going for 5*. otherwise they are worthless. You can't actually use them. But today I learned that you can get them 3 different times (30,000x3=90,000SOs for free) as long as you request them at each purchase. So it seems to me that if anyone is interested in 5* EVER in the future and you own elsewhere, ask for the phantom credits at every single purchase you make with Starwood. WHY NOT?? Kath

Still confused. How are the other timeshares owned related to the pahntom options given? I thought they were just something SVO would give you to get ot the next elite level.
Also if I didnt need 30K phantoms now but need 60K phantom to get to 4* do you think I can get them at that time??

 

[SDKath]

Still confused. How are the other timeshares owned related to the pahntom options given? I thought they were just something SVO would give you to get ot the next elite level.
Also if I didnt need 30K phantoms now but need 60K phantom to get to 4* do you think I can get them at that time??

They are not related. I think they just try to "help" people who are sooo close but can't quite reach their elite level. I got one with my last purchase and they had me fill out the form for it saying it would be to get me to 3* or 5*. I didn't see 4* on there even.

You can't do it retroactively. And they can only do it ONCE per transaction. I am guessing if you purchase 2 EOYs with separate contracts, you can fill out the form for each one and get 60,000. But remember you really can't use these for reservations or SP conversions or anything. So they are worth nothing if they don't help you reach another elite level.

Like I said, I would ask for it with every purchase. Why not? You never know when the 5* bug is going to hit you. Trust me. :ignore:

Katherine

 

[Grandmama]

Still confused. How are the other timeshares owned related to the pahntom options given? I thought they were just something SVO would give you to get ot the next elite level.
Also if I didnt need 30K phantoms now but need 60K phantom to get to 4* do you think I can get them at that time??

They will give you a maximum of 30,000 phantom options to get the the next elite level. Those are given with a purchase. So, if you are purchasing a annual week to get to the next elite level, and you are short up to 30,000 star options in reaching that elite level, SVO will give you those phantom options if you own an annual week in a non-SVO timeshare. You must submit a copy of your contract or deed for the non-SVO to prove ownership. We were told that they will only give the phantom options to get to the next elite level, and they will only give them when purchasing an annual week.

 

[SDKath]

Should Add This To Guide Too...

I am not sure I mentioned this in the original guide but be sure to also look at the TOTAL SOs you end up with when you retro/upgrade and buy units.

For example, I am looking at someone's scenario where they would have 670,000 SOs. Another scenario would give them 677,300. Not much difference, right?? WRONG! Those 7,000 SOs make a HUGE difference.

Look at the SOs and make sure that for each year, you will end up with multiples of 148,100 and 81,000 SOs. Unless you like staying in a studio, you want to have enough SOs to get you to a larger 1BR plus some 2BR LO's.

148,100x4=592,400 SOs. That means you have 4 weeks in 2BR LOs each year. You want at least 81,000 more SOs after that so that you don't end up with some wierd 77,000 SO number that is not too useful each and every year. Unless of course you don't mind traveling off season or staying in studios.

My thought is to grab at least 673,400 SOs with your 5* deal to get the PFL benefits AND get the most usable SOs each year. Of course you may not use all of them for TS reservations each year or you may travel off season so SOs go farther then, or add on extra days to a trip, but this is a safe bet year after year.

Katherine

 

[tomandrobin]

But your assuming that all the weeks you are booking are peak season, like Hawaii. We like to reserve weeks at HRA in gold and silver season that throws those staroption requirements off. Two bedroom lock-off gold season is 95,700, one bedroom premium is 51,700 ........and gold season is the summer.

 

[SDKath]

But your assuming that all the weeks you are booking are peak season, like Hawaii. We like to reserve weeks at HRA in gold and silver season that throws those staroption requirements off. Two bedroom lock-off gold season is 95,700, one bedroom premium is 51,700 ........and gold season is the summer.

Exactly. And that is also assuming that all your weeks will turn into reservations. Many people convert their weeks (at least some) to SPs and so on. K

 

[oneohana]

But your assuming that all the weeks you are booking are peak season, like Hawaii. We like to reserve weeks at HRA in gold and silver season that throws those staroption requirements off. Two bedroom lock-off gold season is 95,700, one bedroom premium is 51,700 ........and gold season is the summer.

Yes it will. But, look at this way. You will have extra *options to donate to the make a wish fund.

 

[easterntraveler]

I really wish some updates were posted to these threads, they are so good. But they are over a year old. I was just offered 60,000 phantom points to reach *3. Now I am exploring my cheapest method of getting *5. I did not buy, I did the 15 mo wait and see option. Anyone have any up to date advise that is not covered here?

 

[jarta]

easterntraveler, ... Currently, the easiest and cheapest way to get to 5 Star Elite is to buy the most annual Staroptions for the lowest price (including MF) at a voluntary resort in the re-sale market and then buy an every other year 2-br Platinum at Lagunamar for $21,500. That would allow you to retro the non-developer purchase as part of the Lagunamar purchase. Lagunamar has low MF (but they will undoubtedly rise over time). But, Lagunamar is a voluntary resort and resale prices will drop quickly. (I think Desert Willow and Riverbend have the same price for an every other year 2-br lockoff in Platinum season, $21,500.)

If you are concerned about selling your timeshares, buy the most staroptions at the lowest price (including MF) at a mandatory resort. Currently, the price on eBay for a 2-br annual at WKV in Platinum season (148,100 Staroptions) is $17K. But, all you really gain by buying a mandatory resort resale and retroing it is the ability to convert the Staroptions to Starpoints. Some might feel that the extra expense of buying mandatory does not lend itself to retroing.

Whatever you do, be advised your must end up owning 6-7 weeks and that owning 6-7 weeks of 2-br Starwood resorts can put a very large dent in your wallet in terms of purchase amount (resale or developer) and the MF will probably run in excess of $7K per year.

Only try to get to 5 Star Elite if you can afford to make the purchases and can afford the yearly total MF and you will actually use the Staroptions. Dropping them in Starpoints is OK - depending how you use the points - but to use the points well you must use them in Europe or Asia. Using points at airport hotels in the US is a waste! But, using points in Asia is good - but you have to get there!

Consider this decision carefully. I am 5 Star Elite and love it. But, it's definitely not for everyone. Please, do not waste your money by overbuying just to get to (and be able to say you are now) 5 Star Elite. ... eom

 

[LisaRex]

I really wish some updates were posted to these threads, they are so good. But they are over a year old. I was just offered 60,000 phantom points to reach *3. Now I am exploring my cheapest method of getting *5. I did not buy, I did the 15 mo wait and see option. Anyone have any up to date advise that is not covered here?

To review, here are the minimum requirements for status:

3* status: Two-weeks or more of interval ownership with a combined value of 159,000 StarOptions
4* status: combined value of 359,000 StarOptions
5* status: combined value of 649,000 StarOptions

Your cheapest path to get to 5* hasn't changed in a year. The bottom line is that you should buy a cheap voluntary resale and then spend sufficient $$ on a developer purchase to retro the resale. I'd target the resorts with the lowest historical MFs, such as SDO or WKV or SVV.

If they are offering you 60,000 phantom options to reach 3*, then you only have 99,000 SOs? You've got your work cut out for you to reach 659,000 SOs. BTW, they'll only give you enough phantom options to reach the next plateau. They're not going to give you multiple batches -- 60,000 phantom SOs to reach 3* and then another batch of phantom SOs to reach 4*.

 

[DeniseM]

With the on-going double digit increases in MF, I would think long and hard about buying more timeshares to reach 5 Star Elite. What is your motivation for reaching 5 Star Elite? What do you hope to achieve?

Here is a link to the Elite Perks for review - note that only a few of the "perks" have any real value-

https://www.mystarcentral.com/elite/chart.html

 

[CanadianLawyer]

Resale upgrades

Has there been any recent changes to the ability to upgrade resale units? I saw a mention of a change in May that you could not do an upgrade and a retro in the same transaction, but I didn't know whether that applied to straight upgrades where you pay the difference between the original price and the price of the upgraded unit without buying a new unit as well.

We upgraded a resale week this way last March - is this no longer possible? I've looked through all the stickies and I couldn't see a clear answer.

Thanks in advance for any definitive (or somewhat definitive) clarification.

 

[Ken555]

And keep in mind that the "perks" may change at any time, by unilateral action by Starwood. (As has been done in the past...).

 

[DeniseM]

Good point Ken - when they took away the automatic upgrade for 5 Star Elite owners that was a real blow.

 

[DeniseM]

I see in another thread that you want to buy more timeshare weeks for the sole purpose of converting to points every year. I don't know of any TS system where this is a good value. Why? Because the conversion rate from timeshare to hotel points always benefits the developer - not the owner. Take the money you would spend to become 5 Star Elite, put it in an interest bearing acct. and use the funds to rent hotel rooms, and you will come out ahead.

If you want Starpoints - simply get a Starwood AMEX card, use it for all your spending, and pay it off every month. You will get one Starpoint for every dollar spent. AMEX has frequent offers where they offer an incentive of 20K Starpoints to open a new AMEX Acct. You and you spouse can open separate Acct's and double the incentive. If you put $30K a year on the card, you automatically get Starwood Gold member status. If you transfer Starpoints to airline FF miles, you get 25K miles for every 20K SP's.

 

[jarta]

Denise, ... I agree with the idea of getting a Starwood Amex card.

However, the value of Starpoints depends on how you decide to use them. Example: it took me about $140K to get to 5 Star Elite. (Much less and much more flexible than buying a vacation home somewhere and TUG helped me knock off about $40K - or more - of the usual cost to get there by teaching me about retroing.) I started out in March of 2008 and I ended up with just about 500K Starpoints from the purchases.

Last Summer I converted 180K Starpoints to US Air miles. With the 20% Starwood bonus for transferring out and the 50% US Air bonus for transferring in, I ended up with 327.5K US Air air miles.

I did this because my wife and I are going on a cruise to Istanbul, Greek Isles, Athens and the Black Sea this summer. A friend frrom NY is also going on the same cruise and he is taking care of us for the ground reservations in Istanbul before and after the cruise. So, I wanted to pay for his ticket to reciprocate.

With the 327.5K air miles, I bought 2 business class round trip tickets to Istanbul from Chicago (and the one from NY for my friend) on Turkish Airlines and still had 87.5K US Air air miles left over. Plus, I had 320K Starpoints still left over. The value of the 3 business class, almost 12-hour flight, tickets - about $15K.

So, how would I have done better by putting the $140K in a bank account or CD the last 2 years? I could maybe have bought the tickets. But, I wouldn't have had the enjoyment of ownership of the weeks, the extra 320K Starpoints or the left over US Air miles.

Or, how about a Category 6 Starwood accommodation at the Danieli in Venice or the Prince de Galles in Paris for 4 days (with the 5th day free) and a SPG Plat. upgrade. Is that not worth the Starpoints used?

Denise, it depends on how you would otherwise travel and how you use the Starpoints. But, because a TUG member travels another way, he/she cannot make the blanket statement that converting to Starpoints is never a "good deal." Sometimes, and for some travelers, it is a very good deal.

As I have pointed out to the OP, it's expensive to get to 5 Star Elite. 5 Star Elite is not for everyone. If you would already travel to the places where you can use 5 Star Elite to save money, do it. If you wouldn't, don't. ... eom