Resale use restrictions - Marriott various point systems

[reyack1]

What are the major restrictions on sing the various Marriott point systems if the points are bough resale?

 

[dioxide45]

Marriott only has one points program. Abound. You can buy resale Abound Trust points or you can buy them direct. They work the same either way.

 

[ljmiii]

What are the major restrictions on using the various Marriott point systems if the points are bough resale?

Unlike many/most other timeshare systems there are no restrictions on resale points. You do have to pay MVC their 'activation' fees of a little over $3/pt (minimum $3000) but once you do so they behave exactly like points purchased directly from MVC...including counting toward your MVC status.

There is a red herring that MVC salesweasels sometimes tell potential customers that resale points can only be used to book reservations within 60 days of check-in. This comes from language in the docs that says if you don't pay the 'activation' fees your points are restricted...but the reality is that MVC won't add the points to your account until you pay up.

 

[Cellularguy]

Just to be clear, if I buy 1000 Abound points from a 3rd party owner (not directly from MVC), I have to pay MVC a $3000 fee? If I purchase 2,500 points I pay $7500? Any other fees from MVC I should be aware of?

 

[dioxide45]

Just to be clear, if I buy 1000 Abound points from a 3rd party owner (not directly from MVC), I have to pay MVC a $3000 fee? If I purchase 2,500 points I pay $7500? Any other fees from MVC I should be aware of?

There is a $25 transfer fee. I think a $95 ROFR waiver fee and also if you don't already own Trust Points there is a $300 owner education fee.

 

[Fasttr]

Just to be clear, if I buy 1000 Abound points from a 3rd party owner (not directly from MVC), I have to pay MVC a $3000 fee? If I purchase 2,500 points I pay $7500? Any other fees from MVC I should be aware of?

This tool from @StevenTing breaks things down pretty well.

Points Resale Purchase Calculator

 

[Cellularguy]

Thank you! Very handy and easy to use.

 

[Dean]

What are the major restrictions on sing the various Marriott point systems if the points are bough resale?

Just to be clear, if I buy 1000 Abound points from a 3rd party owner (not directly from MVC), I have to pay MVC a $3000 fee? If I purchase 2,500 points I pay $7500? Any other fees from MVC I should be aware of?

Spend a few months becoming knowledgeable about the system before jumping into the deep end of the pool. One of the biggest mistakes I see is people moving too quickly and making a poor decision for their situation. Usually it takes a number of months of active investigation for someone new to the system to reach a point where moving forward is reasonable. Trying to move quickly to get that next vacation and consider that a discount on the purchase is almost always a very bad idea. For most not buying MVC or buying resale weeks that are restricted are the best options by far. When points are needed either buying a limited number (like 1500) and renting for additional points OR buying resale then enrolling with a strategic retail weeks purchase (like Spain) are the best options when points are needed.

 

[davidvel]

Thank you! Very handy and easy to use.

The most important things you MUST do before buying points is look at the Points Charts for various resorts. Be honest with yourself about when, where, room size, and view type you will actually want to use them. Then calculate how much that week would cost you each year including your purchase price (amortized over 15-20 years) plus your annual MF.

Then go to Redweek.com and compare what you found to how much you could rent it for from an owner.

 

[Bill4728]

I believe that for a non Abound trust owner, you must buy a minimum of 1500 points. Current owners can buy as little as 1000 pts

 

[TheTimeTraveler]

Just to be clear, if I buy 1000 Abound points from a 3rd party owner (not directly from MVC), I have to pay MVC a $3000 fee? If I purchase 2,500 points I pay $7500? Any other fees from MVC I should be aware of?

If the Resorts you are interested in have "resale" weeks then do give consideration of going that route instead of resale points. Once you buy those points there's a high probability that you'll be hung with them forever as the resale market is flooded with listings of points that folks can't get rid of.

Resale weeks have a much higher demand than resale points.

Granted, points have more flexibility, but weeks are cheaper to own and maintain annually. Interval International is your trading partner.












.

 

[MALC9990]

Marriott only has one points program. Abound. You can buy resale Abound Trust points or you can buy them direct. They work the same either way.

Actually MVC has multiple points systems. The first was the Asia Pacific Points System created back in 2008. That system acquired all the unsold weeks at Phuket Beach Club plus all the weeks at Mai Khao Beach Club and also acquired weeks in Hawaii and Las Vegas. Subsequently ia Asia Pacific MVC created Australia Points based on ownership at The MVC Resort in Surfers Paradise in Queensland and more recently Indonesia Points for the two new resorts in Bali. All these points have equivalent and interchangeable usage value with Abound points. They however do have differing maintenance fees per point.

A significant difference is that Asia Pacific Points have a lower maintenance fee per point. Also there is no $3 per point registration fee on resale AP points.

 

[jabberwocky]

Actually MVC has multiple points systems. The first was the Asia Pacific Points System created back in 2008. That system acquired all the unsold weeks at Phuket Beach Club plus all the weeks at Mai Khao Beach Club and also acquired weeks in Hawaii and Las Vegas. Subsequently ia Asia Pacific MVC created Australia Points based on ownership at The MVC Resort in Surfers Paradise in Queensland and more recently Indonesia Points for the two new resorts in Bali. All these points have equivalent and interchangeable usage value with Abound points. They however do have differing maintenance fees per point.

A significant difference is that Asia Pacific Points have a lower maintenance fee per point. Also there is no $3 per point registration fee on resale AP points.

Do the AP points count towards your OBL if purchased resale? Also, I thought I saw somewhere (can’t find it now) that there were some restrictions on purchasing AP points if you are resident in North America (or perhaps US only).

 

[dioxide45]

Do the AP points count towards your OBL if purchased resale? Also, I thought I saw somewhere (can’t find it now) that there were some restrictions on purchasing AP points if you are resident in North America (or perhaps US only).

I recall that same restriction. AP points couldn't be purchased by US residents. Not sure if that applies to Canada too.

 

[bazzap]

I recall that same restriction. AP points couldn't be purchased by US residents. Not sure if that applies to Canada too.

I have not seen any “official” MVC statement on this, but the common understanding is that membership contracts for Marriott Asia Pacific points generally cannot be transferred to residents in the US. This means that even if you can acquire the points, your ability to utilise or transfer them may be restricted.
It would be helpful to know for sure though.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[kgsanchez4]

This tool from @StevenTing breaks things down pretty well.

Points Resale Purchase Calculator

Thanks great tool for trying to figure out whether I should move forward with a transaction I am considering.

 

[rthib]

One other thing to keep in mind when looking at points and point cost is that many resort have a minimum number of nights required before they will let you book with points.

 

[davidvel]

Thanks great tool for trying to figure out whether I should move forward with a transaction I am considering.

The tool only tells you the cost, not any alternatives or whether the transaction is a good deal in general. You should follow my suggestion in Post #8 to evaluate the best path forward.

 

[lorenmd]

Spend a few months becoming knowledgeable about the system before jumping into the deep end of the pool. One of the biggest mistakes I see is people moving too quickly and making a poor decision for their situation. Usually it takes a number of months of active investigation for someone new to the system to reach a point where moving forward is reasonable. Trying to move quickly to get that next vacation and consider that a discount on the purchase is almost always a very bad idea. For most not buying MVC or buying resale weeks that are restricted are the best options by far. When points are needed either buying a limited number (like 1500) and renting for additional points OR buying resale then enrolling with a strategic retail weeks purchase (like Spain) are the best options when points are needed.

so are you saying if i buy resale points of 2000 i should try to buy a week in spain retail from marriott? will that automatically get my 2k points into the system without having to pay the re education fee? if i don't buy a retail week in spain and i just pay the 6k re education fee are my 2k points then just like as if i bought them from marriott and i can use then for hotels, marriotts and westin and sheratons ? trying to decide if we should move foreward accepting 2k points from our friens at a very minimal cost, pay the reeducation fees of about 7k total and then we have what we need along with our 400k star options. we would like to stay at more marriott resorts and we can't unless we go through II or convert SO to club points and hope we find something. thanks

 

[Hindsite]

and we can't unless we go through II or convert SO to club points and hope we find something.

Yes you can, If you have enrolled ownership, the ability to elect for Club points, you can rent club points for a specific usage year and book via Abound for those. Often you can get those club points for less than the maint fees on the resale club points that you will buy, but without any capital outlay.

You also don't need to elect (convert) and then see availability, you can search for availability and then elect to get the reservation you want.

Also remember that some MVCs have better availability via II than via Abound, so ensure that you check that before you rule out II or think that Abound will work for you.

 

[Dean]

so are you saying if i buy resale points of 2000 i should try to buy a week in spain retail from marriott? will that automatically get my 2k points into the system without having to pay the re education fee? if i don't buy a retail week in spain and i just pay the 6k re education fee are my 2k points then just like as if i bought them from marriott and i can use then for hotels, marriotts and westin and sheratons ? trying to decide if we should move foreward accepting 2k points from our friens at a very minimal cost, pay the reeducation fees of about 7k total and then we have what we need along with our 400k star options. we would like to stay at more marriott resorts and we can't unless we go through II or convert SO to club points and hope we find something. thanks

No, not at all in line with what I'd suggest. First, you should spend enough time investigating so you could answer this question reasonable for someone else. The benefit to buying Spain is if you buy a GOOD WEEK then buy a Spain week that will enroll the week, you'll have the best of both worlds points and weeks including II option and renting points transferred to you. But until you're sure of the options then what's best in your situation, you shouldn't buy anything. In reality for most people TODAY, buying weeks and not enrolling is often the best option.

 

[regatta333]

My husband and I attended a sales presentation today where the salesman told us that the inventory available to trust points was not the same as the inventory available through Abound points. He said the Abound points inventory included only the weeks that members had "elected" to convert to points, where the Trust inventory included the inventory that Marriott sells as points. I always thought that Abound and trust points were one and the same, which is what appears to be said in this thread. Which is correct?

 

[Hindsite]

My husband and I attended a sales presentation today where the salesman told us that the inventory available to trust points was not the same as the inventory available through Abound points. He said the Abound points inventory included only the weeks that members had "elected" to convert to points, where the Trust inventory included the inventory that Marriott sells as points. I always thought that Abound and trust points were one and the same, which is what appears to be said in this thread. Which is correct?

Abound is the name of the exchange, Club points is the name of the currency used in the exchange, with there being the 2 different varieties, Trust Club points and elected club points. Abound points is a made up name. I assume the pitch was for you to buy Trust points to get access to more inventory, that is the usual line with this.

The issue that this salesperson is getting jumbled up is where the letter of the Abound exchange procedures differs from reality and it has been subject to a considerable amount of attention by the TUG glitterati.

The Abound exchange procedures allow for the separation of inventory between Trust Club points and Elected Club points, but in practice that has never been seen, other than a few reported occasions many, many years ago. I've personally done side by side tests with trust points owners and can see exactly the same inventory with just enrolled club points. The best way to respond to a salesperson saying this is "prove it!". Log in to your account (assuming you are enrolled ownership only) and let them log in to a Trust points account and do a search to compare. To date no salesperson has taken up the challenge, so that says everything about their knowledge of the system.

Other things to bear in mind when looking at the logic of why MVC would do such a thing:
- The initial population of inventory in the Destinations Club, now Abound, was unsold inventory some of which was low season, and population since has included a lot of returned US inventory, some of which will be decent, but a lot of it isn't. The effect of this is that the maint fee per club point is higher than many equivalent weeks, so its an expensive product.
- If they limited the inventory that enrolled owners could see, they would see a relatively large drop in variety and quality of inventory in Abound as those owners sought to use different ways to use their ownership, other than Abound. That would then cause Trust, and elected club points owners to have a far worse experience getting inventory via Abound and damage the product.

While MVC "could" restrict what enrolled owners see, its unlikely to be in the business interest to do so. Sales, however, aren't interested in anything more than getting a commission, so are quite happy to spread misinformation on this subject.

 

[Dean]

My husband and I attended a sales presentation today where the salesman told us that the inventory available to trust points was not the same as the inventory available through Abound points. He said the Abound points inventory included only the weeks that members had "elected" to convert to points, where the Trust inventory included the inventory that Marriott sells as points. I always thought that Abound and trust points were one and the same, which is what appears to be said in this thread. Which is correct?

Technically there is an element of truth here but in reality this is not how it currently works. Early on there were some very limited examples where this was the case but I have seen no reports where this was applicable in many years. It is not a reason to buy points.

 

[regatta333]

Are these points kept separate for purposes of booking? In other words, if someone did not have enough trust points to complete a reservation, could elected points be combined with the trust points to make the reservation?