Converting to Marriott points

[jim4529]

I just left an Owner Update at Sheraton Vistana Resort in Orlando. We have owned week 6 in Spas unit 412 for almost 20 years, paid $3500 on resale. The offers seems fishy:

1. If I convert to points I will receive double the points each year, which means I can rent one of my weeks to pay my MF’s. They use Koala, which the sales rep said owns Expedia, but that isn’t true. They have a software sharing agreement. If Koala rents for more than my MF’s, I get to keep the difference.

2. I have a guaranteed “buy-back” program that is quite complicated. Supposedly, they value my points at the retail (NOT resale) level which is currently 61 cents a point, then subtract the amount I paid, which would be about 42 cents a point or $13k, and they pay me the difference if there is one. There is an 81,000 point minimum. We currently own a 2BR 2BA, which gives us 81,000 Star Options each year.

3. By joining the “Trust” as opposed to owning a specific week/unit deed, I am no longer liable for any assessments to a property, such as hurricane damage, etc. Also, if I rent the unit I have a $1 million hold harmless for any damage the renter might cause.

All this seems a bit hard to believe. I see a few caveats to it:

1. Even if true, while they said I was “guaranteed” Koala would rent it, I doubt that to be true. No one is going to guarantee to rent your timeshare. Also, Marriott needs to generate revenue to take care of the properties, so where are they getting that money if everyone “rents out” of paying MF’s? They said Koala only keeps 10%, so even if they split that with Marriott they will be grossly underfunding their reserves.

2. It seems like a pretty big promise to pay top dollar for buy-backs, and I’m thinking that will change over time. I didn’t see any paperwork, but all the Trust has to do is vote for a change and it’s done. I wouldn’t hang my hat on that.

3. It seems easy enough to spread any assessments on to all members of the Trust, which is certainly bound to be less than a fixed week/unit/resort. But again, if everyone is “renting out of” their MF’s it seems like Marriott could decide to make assessments non-avoidable.

My biggest problem with going into a points based system is that it is no longer a guarantee you will get to go where you want, when you want to go there. We have always bought fixed week/unit TS’s in the places we want to go, when we want to go there. Just wondering if anyone has any insight into this deal? Considering we only paid $3500 initially, it might make some sense if all these claims are true.

A sneaky idea I had is, buy the deal with the credit card they offer with no interest for 15 months and get 6x points (about 6x13,000=78,000 points on the credit card), then immediately ask for a buy-back. Then go buy points resale on TUG!

 

[jp10558]

It's all a lie by the salesperson. They will not buy it back. Also Abound is about the most expensive way to get into MVC - search TUG and you'll see posts where if you owned a week and elected for points you'd get 1000 less points than the points required to reserve that week with the points system. I think Abound is probably the hardest system to make the numbers work on. I would not change from a deeded week + II if you need to go somewhere else. If you need additional weeks, buy resale, or explore other systems. The junk fees / costs to get a resale back into Abound is prohibitive IMO.

 

[dioxide45]

If you already have StarOptions with your SVR week that you bought 20 years ago, you are already a member of Abound and can use the points program. Buying more points does nothing but get you more points. Don't fall for the rent your timeshare trick. Sure it can be done but it isn't always as easy as it sounds. If you've never rented out before, don't buy to start now. You won't ever recoup your purchase price.

There is no guaranteed buyback program. Vistana and Marriott will take back what you have and charge you $400 per VOI to do it. This is 100% a lie

Koala is a legitimate rental platform that perhaps has an agreement with Expedia to list their rentals there too. That doesn't mean much except more exposure for rentals.

 

[Eric B]

I've been using Koala to rent for a few years now because it's free to list. It is not a guaranteed rental. I have had a few get rented through them, probably about 15-20% of what I've listed with them.

 

[kozykritter]

IMO you are being manipulated with a series of half-truths and lies. Based upon that alone, I would recommend that you not do any deal with those individuals. I can tell you from my past work selling timeshares that their job is to find a problem with your ownership that can be solved by buying more ownership. When an obvious "problem" doesn't exist, some salespeople make one up and use lies and half truths to sell it. If I were in your shoes I would run far, far away from these particular individuals but in the end it's your choice.

 

[jim4529]

IMO you are being manipulated with a series of half-truths and lies. Based upon that alone, I would recommend that you not do any deal with those individuals. I can tell you from my past work selling timeshares that their job is to find a problem with your ownership that can be solved by buying more ownership. When an obvious "problem" doesn't exist, some salespeople make one up and use lies and half truths to sell it. If I were in your shoes I would run far, far away from these particular individuals but in the end it's your choice.

Thanks. We stayed with what we have. I have no intention of ever doing anything based on a sales presentation. I must say, the experience was very pleasant and low pressure. I think FL has some pretty strict rules. When we went to one in HI it was brutal. Never again there, no matter what they offer.

 

[Jimster480]

All star options should be able to be elected into club points as of 2025? I know it could be done in 2024, but I don't think it was available to everyone?
So if you convert the deeded week into points, then you should be able to elect that as club points also? Unless there is some restriction on purchased (resale) points or deeded weeks turned into points.

 

[Eric B]

All star options should be able to be elected into club points as of 2025? I know it could be done in 2024, but I don't think it was available to everyone?
So if you convert the deeded week into points, then you should be able to elect that as club points also? Unless there is some restriction on purchased (resale) points or deeded weeks turned into points.

Bottom line up front: No, you cannot elect any StarOptions into Abound Club Points. The only things that can be elected into Abound Club Points are deeded weeks or HomeOptions in one of the FLEX products.

Further details: the answer really depends on what you own and when you acquired it. If it is a deeded week ownership that you purchased directly from the developer, you kept it enrolled in VSN if a voluntary resort, and you did not opt out of enrollment in Abound, you should be able to elect the usage of the week for a particular year if done before the deadline for election, which depends on your ownership benefit level. If it is a bundle of HomeOptions that you purchased directly from the developer, the same would hold true. Things get trickier if it is a mandatory VSN resort you acquire resale - for those, if you contracted the purchase prior to the August 2022 deadline and did not opt out of enrollment in Abound, you would be able to elect similar to a developer-purchased week. If you did not acquire the mandatory VSN resort week prior to August 2022, you would not be able to elect because you would not be enrolled in Abound. For the non-eligible ownerships, the option to requalify them by purchasing additional VOIs from the developer still exists.

 

[Jimster480]

Bottom line up front: No, you cannot elect any StarOptions into Abound Club Points. The only things that can be elected into Abound Club Points are deeded weeks or HomeOptions in one of the FLEX products.

Further details: the answer really depends on what you own and when you acquired it. If it is a deeded week ownership that you purchased directly from the developer, you kept it enrolled in VSN if a voluntary resort, and you did not opt out of enrollment in Abound, you should be able to elect the usage of the week for a particular year if done before the deadline for election, which depends on your ownership benefit level. If it is a bundle of HomeOptions that you purchased directly from the developer, the same would hold true. Things get trickier if it is a mandatory VSN resort you acquire resale - for those, if you contracted the purchase prior to the August 2022 deadline and did not opt out of enrollment in Abound, you would be able to elect similar to a developer-purchased week. If you did not acquire the mandatory VSN resort week prior to August 2022, you would not be able to elect because you would not be enrolled in Abound. For the non-eligible ownerships, the option to requalify them by purchasing additional VOIs from the developer still exists.

Very interesting, so I would have to ask any seller these details if I wanted to be able to elect them.
My points are called "Star Options" and I can elect for club points since 2024. I reached the base ownership level for Marriott with my additional 22k purchase. My ~81k points (I previously incorrectly stated 88k) becomes a bit more than 2k club points.
I elected for club points this year, but I didn't last year.

 

[dioxide45]

Very interesting, so I would have to ask any seller these details if I wanted to be able to elect them.
My points are called "Star Options" and I can elect for club points since 2024. I reached the base ownership level for Marriott with my additional 22k purchase. My ~81k points (I previously incorrectly stated 88k) becomes a bit more than 2k club points.
I elected for club points this year, but I didn't last year.

No need to ask the seller. Any Vistana resale after August 2022 is not eligible to elect for Club Points. You can enroll an ineligible VOI with Vistana by requalifying it with a direct purchase of at least $10,000 in new money to Vistana.

 

[Jimster480]

No need to ask the seller. Any Vistana resale after August 2022 is not eligible to elect for Club Points. You can enroll an ineligible VOI with Vistana by requalifying it with a direct purchase of at least $10,000 in new money to Vistana.

Then no need to purchase any of them. However since I confirmed with a seller that it did have interval access, it could be worth it for a friend of mine so that he could have access to Interval.

 

[Venter]

You will have access to Interval but will have to pay the membership fees yourself. You will not be able to convert to Abound points.

 

[Eric B]

Very interesting, so I would have to ask any seller these details if I wanted to be able to elect them.
My points are called "Star Options" and I can elect for club points since 2024. I reached the base ownership level for Marriott with my additional 22k purchase. My ~81k points (I previously incorrectly stated 88k) becomes a bit more than 2k club points.
I elected for club points this year, but I didn't last year.

The only thing you need to ask every seller for regarding a resale TS is a copy of the estoppel, which would confirm whether it is a mandatory resort or not.

In reality, what you elected was the usage of the week as a whole, not the StarOptions that you could have gotten in VSN for the usage of the week. It's a subtle difference but important to understand why you can't just convert a fraction of your 81,000 StarOptions; with some ownerships that are bundles of HomeOptions rather than deeded weeks you can convert less than a full bundle with certain restrictions.

You will have access to Interval but will have to pay the membership fees yourself. You will not be able to convert to Abound points.

That would depend on whether the resort is a mandatory VSN resort or not. If a mandatory resort, the Interval fees are included in the VSN fees.

 

[Jimster480]

The only thing you need to ask every seller for regarding a resale TS is a copy of the estoppel, which would confirm whether it is a mandatory resort or not.

In reality, what you elected was the usage of the week as a whole, not the StarOptions that you could have gotten in VSN for the usage of the week. It's a subtle difference but important to understand why you can't just convert a fraction of your 81,000 StarOptions; with some ownerships that are bundles of HomeOptions rather than deeded weeks you can convert less than a full bundle with certain restrictions.


That would depend on whether the resort is a mandatory VSN resort or not. If a mandatory resort, the Interval fees are included in the VSN fees.

I can elect exactly how many StarOptions I want to turn into MVC Club Points (in increments of 1000 Star Options). I don't have HomeOptions as that doesn't appear anywhere on my Vistana website. I bought Sheraton Flex Star Options in Jan 2020 and added to it in 2023 to reach 81k to be a Marriot "Owner" level that allows me access to MVC clubs.
In 2024 I put roughly half my StarOptions into Club points. This year I elected all of them into Club Points.

 

[Jimster480]

You will have access to Interval but will have to pay the membership fees yourself. You will not be able to convert to Abound points.

Right, the main thing was having access to getaways and being able to exchange the week.
I was mainly looking for my friends; who have wanted to get access to interval for the past years. I book for them sometimes with my getaways but now with the restricted guest weeks and some shorter stays; I have at-least 1 friend who is interested in having his own access.
For me; If I can scoop up some more ownership stake with a manageable yearly MF then I will make good use of it.

The only thing you need to ask every seller for regarding a resale TS is a copy of the estoppel, which would confirm whether it is a mandatory resort or not.

In reality, what you elected was the usage of the week as a whole, not the StarOptions that you could have gotten in VSN for the usage of the week. It's a subtle difference but important to understand why you can't just convert a fraction of your 81,000 StarOptions; with some ownerships that are bundles of HomeOptions rather than deeded weeks you can convert less than a full bundle with certain restrictions.


That would depend on whether the resort is a mandatory VSN resort or not. If a mandatory resort, the Interval fees are included in the VSN fees.

I can convert exactly (I think its per 1k StarOptions when I elect) how many StarOptions I want into MVC Club Points. I did this in 2024; I converted roughly half to club points and kept the other half as Star Options. I don't have any specific week, I originally bought Sheraton Flex Star Options in Jan 2020.
I'm not sure what "homeOptions" are as I don't have that word anywhere on my Vistana Dashboard.
Since all the Sheraton resorts are available in the Marriott Vacation Club portal; I decided to convert all my points this year. I might split it again next year, especially with the "new" VSN Escapes.

 

[Eric B]

I can elect exactly how many StarOptions I want to turn into MVC Club Points (in increments of 1000 Star Options). I don't have HomeOptions as that doesn't appear anywhere on my Vistana website. I bought Sheraton Flex Star Options in Jan 2020 and added to it in 2023 to reach 81k to be a Marriot "Owner" level that allows me access to MVC clubs.
In 2024 I put roughly half my StarOptions into Club points. This year I elected all of them into Club Points.

The Sheraton Flex ownership is one of the trust ownerships sold as bundles of "HomeOptions" that can be used to book stays at the Sheraton resorts included in the trust during the period between 8 and 12 months prior to check in. If you were to look to make a reservation for one of those resorts during that period, you would be able to see that it is costed in HomeOptions rather than StarOptions. Once you get within 8 months of check in, the HomeOptions can automatically shift to being StarOptions useable at any VSN resort through the VSN provided there is availability there; during that period you would be competing with all VSN members rather than only the Sheraton Flex owners for the availability allocated to Sheraton Flex.

The representation within the Vistana website where it shows you how many options you have for the current year and the next several years does include the designation of your ownership as being "HOME OPTIONS INTERESTS," "WEEKLY OWNERSHIP INTERESTS" and "STAROPTIONS." The final designation only applies to Banked or Restricted StarOptions. The election portion of the website admittedly lists what you are electing as being StarOptions but that's technically not correct because what you are giving up in exchange for the Abound Club Points is the right to make a home resort reservation during the usage year, not just the right to make a VSN reservation. That is similar to what you give up if you elect a weekly ownership interest - the right to use the weekly ownership to its fullest purpose (12 months out at the resort you own in the unit type you own or 18 months out for a fixed week ownership).

I can convert exactly (I think its per 1k StarOptions when I elect) how many StarOptions I want into MVC Club Points. I did this in 2024; I converted roughly half to club points and kept the other half as Star Options. I don't have any specific week, I originally bought Sheraton Flex Star Options in Jan 2020.
I'm not sure what "homeOptions" are as I don't have that word anywhere on my Vistana Dashboard.
Since all the Sheraton resorts are available in the Marriott Vacation Club portal; I decided to convert all my points this year. I might split it again next year, especially with the "new" VSN Escapes.

There is a minimum election of 20,000 HomeOptions for the various flex products in the VSN, I believe. I have used my Aventuras HomeOptions to generate Abound Club Points fairly consistently and am familiar with how it works. The one thing I would suggest is comparing how many HomeOptions or StarOptions would be needed to make a reservation at a Sheraton resort you may want to book with the number of Abound Club Points that would be needed to book the same resort for the same time period. It may well be less expensive overall to book through Abound rather than through the VSN; there are some time periods I've noticed where that is the case particularly towards the ends of the higher seasons. Looking at it in terms of the overall cost in real money on a per HomeOption or per Abound Club Point basis would give you an equal footing to figure out whether you're better off going through VSN or electing and going through Abound. While all the Sheraton resorts that were part of Vistana are available in Abound, there can also be differences in the availability of those resorts that could have an impact on which way works best to book them depending on how set you are on wanting particular dates.

 

[Henry M.]

There is a thread on this forum that discusses a tool for evaluating using Staroptions vs. Club Points for a given reservation:

New Tool to Calculate/Compare SO vs CP needed for booking. (Need Feedback)

Hi Everyone, I built a tool last night to help me figure out if booking with SO or CP are a better option depending on the resort and dates. I can never decide if I should convert my VOI to CP and needed to visualize it. Looking for feedback from you all to decide if I should keep building it...

tugbbs.com

 

[Jimster480]

Edited because of double post

There is a thread on this forum that discusses a tool for evaluating using Staroptions vs. Club Points for a given reservation:

New Tool to Calculate/Compare SO vs CP needed for booking. (Need Feedback)

Hi Everyone, I built a tool last night to help me figure out if booking with SO or CP are a better option depending on the resort and dates. I can never decide if I should convert my VOI to CP and needed to visualize it. Looking for feedback from you all to decide if I should keep building it...

tugbbs.com

Thanks!

The Sheraton Flex ownership is one of the trust ownerships sold as bundles of "HomeOptions" that can be used to book stays at the Sheraton resorts included in the trust during the period between 8 and 12 months prior to check in. If you were to look to make a reservation for one of those resorts during that period, you would be able to see that it is costed in HomeOptions rather than StarOptions. Once you get within 8 months of check in, the HomeOptions can automatically shift to being StarOptions useable at any VSN resort through the VSN provided there is availability there; during that period you would be competing with all VSN members rather than only the Sheraton Flex owners for the availability allocated to Sheraton Flex.

The representation within the Vistana website where it shows you how many options you have for the current year and the next several years does include the designation of your ownership as being "HOME OPTIONS INTERESTS," "WEEKLY OWNERSHIP INTERESTS" and "STAROPTIONS." The final designation only applies to Banked or Restricted StarOptions. The election portion of the website admittedly lists what you are electing as being StarOptions but that's technically not correct because what you are giving up in exchange for the Abound Club Points is the right to make a home resort reservation during the usage year, not just the right to make a VSN reservation. That is similar to what you give up if you elect a weekly ownership interest - the right to use the weekly ownership to its fullest purpose (12 months out at the resort you own in the unit type you own or 18 months out for a fixed week ownership).

Mine is deeded but I see where it says Home Options if I press Details on this box.
I guess because I have never tried to make any reservation more than 8 months out that I have not experienced that.
Maybe some day this would matter, but I cannot imagine making a reservation even 8 months from now, definitely not further out.

This is my "What I own" page:

I have the big packet with all the documents in it from my last "upgrade" in 2023 when I bought the Marriott ownership level.

 

[sponger76]

I can elect exactly how many StarOptions I want to turn into MVC Club Points (in increments of 1000 Star Options). I don't have HomeOptions as that doesn't appear anywhere on my Vistana website. I bought Sheraton Flex Star Options in Jan 2020 and added to it in 2023 to reach 81k to be a Marriot "Owner" level that allows me access to MVC clubs.
In 2024 I put roughly half my StarOptions into Club points. This year I elected all of them into Club Points.

It appears you don't fully understand the product that you bought. If you own Sheraton Flex, you actually do own HomeOptions. When booking at the Sheraton Flex home resorts more than 8 months in advance, you are using HomeOptions. They only become StarOptions if booking less than 8 months in advance, or if you bank or borrow them.

 

[Jimster480]

It appears you don't fully understand the product that you bought. If you own Sheraton Flex, you actually do own HomeOptions. When booking at the Sheraton Flex home resorts more than 8 months in advance, you are using HomeOptions. They only become StarOptions if booking less than 8 months in advance, or if you bank or borrow them.

I understand that now. They never explained the HomeOptions thing and I personally never used it. In the last 6 years of ownership I have mostly only used Interval for my businesses and family members. Never have I reserved 8 months in advance, nor do I think that I likely will in the future.

 

[iowaguy09]

Yikes, cover up that Contract Number!

As stated earlier for points ownerships, you can only convert the full VOI (all 81,000) or convert it in increments of 20,000. So it is possible to convert up to 80,000, but then you are left with 1000 "orphan" Staroptions. They do become Staroptions because once you convert all or part of the VOI it cannot be converted back into what it originally was. But the remaining 1000 can be used like any other Staroptions you have at the time, or else you lose them at the end of the use year. So if the number converting is that close, it would make sense to just convert the entire 81,000 VOI.

 

[iowaguy09]

On the "Vistana" website (I know, it's now the "One Big Happy Family" website), there are numerous videos and presentations that explain all of this. Plus the stickies at the top of the TUG BBS chats have a wealth of knowledge in them.

Shameless plug: buy a 1-year TUG membership for $15. Worth every penny!

 

[dioxide45]

Yikes, cover up that Contract Number!

As stated earlier for points ownerships, you can only convert the full VOI (all 81,000) or convert it in increments of 20,000. So it is possible to convert up to 80,000, but then you are left with 1000 "orphan" Staroptions. They do become Staroptions because once you convert all or part of the VOI it cannot be converted back into what it originally was. But the remaining 1000 can be used like any other Staroptions you have at the time, or else you lose them at the end of the use year. So if the number converting is that close, it would make sense to just convert the entire 81,000 VOI.

I though you can convert in 1000 point increments with a minimum of 20,000?

 

[Jimster480]

Yikes, cover up that Contract Number!

As stated earlier for points ownerships, you can only convert the full VOI (all 81,000) or convert it in increments of 20,000. So it is possible to convert up to 80,000, but then you are left with 1000 "orphan" Staroptions. They do become Staroptions because once you convert all or part of the VOI it cannot be converted back into what it originally was. But the remaining 1000 can be used like any other Staroptions you have at the time, or else you lose them at the end of the use year. So if the number converting is that close, it would make sense to just convert the entire 81,000 VOI.

I can convert in 1000 point increments, as you see my own screenshot shows that I have 0 left for this year because I elected them all.

I though you can convert in 1000 point increments with a minimum of 20,000?

I thought it was 10000 minimum.

On the "Vistana" website (I know, it's now the "One Big Happy Family" website), there are numerous videos and presentations that explain all of this. Plus the stickies at the top of the TUG BBS chats have a wealth of knowledge in them.

Shameless plug: buy a 1-year TUG membership for $15. Worth every penny!

The Vistana website is often outdated for what they are doing. It is pretty incredible how behind they are on their own things to say the least.

 

[Eric B]

Mine is deeded but I see where it says Home Options if I press Details on this box.

I'm not sure that is entirely accurate. You have a certificate of ownership in a trust rather than a deed to a specific unit in a specific week. For many of the resorts, reservation rights are floating units and weeks within a season so the owners don't get their deeded units typically, but the deeds are tied to a specific period of time in a specific place.