Wyndham is closing a handful of legacy resorts - dedicated chart/tracker located in the first post for this unfolding set of events

[gerena]

I apologize in advance if this is a dumb question. Please be kind if it is.

My family has had seven or eight Wyndham contracts over the past 30 years. Every single one of them has been linked to a specific resort and specific units. And in most cases, but not all, a specific timeframe. So I've never seen a contract that is just for "points", and not directly tied to a resort and specific units.

Are there contracts that are literally just "points"? And if so, is that what we will be offered as a "swap", and how can we trust that Wyndham doesn't just sell (or swap) more points than are actually supported by the underlying properties?

Hello Buckeye479.
This is not a dumb question at all. We are in this type of owership. My parents bought 3 weeks at Fairfield Glade around 1985--all two bedrooms. Both they, their grandchildren and my husband and I have enjoyed vacationing there. One is an AB week, so it can be split into 2 bedrooms. I have since inherited these weeks. These are for 3 weeks at a designated time at Fairfield Glade. There are deeded contracts for these weeks. We chose to never switch to points because it was much more money and we were advised by our original salesperson (not with Wyndham any more) to never change from weeks. So this was honored even after my parents both died. The points idea has merit, but not enough for us to make the switch with much more money.

We have never had a "points" contract. We don't intend to take the swap as not sure if the value would trade fairly since we have weeks.

Although the Glade has been a great place to vacation (and they recently did a nice renovation in the Oak Knoll section) we like variety so we deposit in RCI. My parents went overseas a lot and we have traded overseas, too. Both have traded all over the US too.

Before we were aware of the bankruptcy, I had deposited our weeks in RCI. That trading power is safe there. I have checked with RCI and a few days ago I called FFG.

I have usually paid our maintenance fees with Wyndham FFG a year in advance. That becomes a problem now because ---will I get those fees back? So I decided to deposit them in RCI for safety. Once I deposited, I got the usual notice that they are being verified. Nothing unusual, but I didn't have high hopes it would really happen.

Called Fairfield Glade just to see if I would be refunded for our 2026 maintenance fees I had paid in advance. She said, "Yes, we would be refunded sometime next year." I told her that I had deposited the 3 remaining 2026 weeks and she said that they would not be confirmed since RCI knew about the bankruptcy. I accepted the answer thinking that would be the case; still holding out for the refunded 2026 maintenance fees.

About a day after this I got a CONFIRMATION that two of the 2026 weeks were now with RCI. These are the AB weeks. Hmmm. So don't know how or if a refund will play out there or not. But they can be used to vacation along with the many other weeks deposited there. I have yet to hear from the one October week that is still "being verified."

Hope this isn't too confusing and ask anything else. No dumb questions. I "think" the majority of posters on here may have the "Points" weeks. I have no idea how those work in trading with RCI and other resorts.

 

[Arimaas]

Alright, we got a lot going on, so let me try to get this right. Here is December's bill ($232.88). About $80 less than November's bill ($314.23). Also, it appears that December's bill is about $20 different than what the annual statement says fees will be for 2026. I'm not sure where they got $232 from, because with the correct program fees, my monthly charges should be about $242. I'd love to say let's just trust them to figure it out, but, well, ya. Also, I don't know why it's changing in December as opposed to January.


December

View attachment 118950

November

View attachment 118951

Annual Statement

View attachment 118953
View attachment 118952

Ok. Got the annual Wyndham statement over the weekend. The monthly payment is now $253.62 - which is about $20 more than the November estimate printed. The PFs list the 154k FG contract, but the list of contracts don’t have the FG. There is that disclaimer about the changes in fees based on closures.

I understand that this is all unfolding, and I’m sure some here will tell me we already beat this dead horse, or it’s a problem to make programming changes, or it will be corrected down the road, but it’s real poor form to have the PFs listed for the contracts that are not there. If the contracts were able to be deleted, I don’t see why the PFs couldn’t have been updated in kind.

While i understand what’s going on, the vast majority of folks don’t. If someone takes the swap, the monthly payment changes anyway. No reason to include phantom PFs that don’t exist since they are not associated with a contract on the itemized statement. Also, let’s hope in January they bill the correct PFs. Forgive me for not having faith (and no, I’m not a conspiracy theorists).

 

[shawnee83]

I apologize in advance if this is a dumb question. Please be kind if it is.

Actually, as a fixed week owner, I've had the same question too. The sales pitches have been so focused on getting me to buy (and just annoying in general) that they never really explained this. Not that I'm interested in swapping, but just wondered how it is supposed to work.

 

[carlbarry]

I just called the Swap hotline for the third time. I haven't received any physical letters or email about the swap (I own at Star Island).
I had called on November 24 and told I would be called back. Never happened.
Now I was told they are starting a new program called "Harvest" where the owners will be able to do the swap on their own.
However--and this being Wyndham, no surprise here--the form is not loading on her computer. So she will have to call me back when it loads and she can start filling it out.

 

[buckeye479]

Actually, as a fixed week owner, I've had the same question too. The sales pitches have been so focused on getting me to buy (and just annoying in general) that they never really explained this. Not that I'm interested in swapping, but just wondered how it is supposed to work.

Thank you for the reply. I should have mentioned something else in my original question. While every one of our contracts are legally linked to a property (specific unit, specific season, etc), we carry out our day-to-day interactions with Wyndham in points. Where those points are is completely irrelevant to me (perhaps naively). I've been traveling to Fairfields and Wyndhams for many years, but have actually never been to 2 of our "Home" resorts.

I looked up what we actually have, and we have "CONVERTED Float Weeks", "CONVERTED Fixed Weeks", which of course are linked to a specific unit.
I also have UDI contracts, but those too, are specifically linked to a unit (For example, Pagosa Perigrine, Building 6, Units 7811 and 7812).
My understanding (perhaps incorrect), was that every Wyndham contract (even contracts for "Points") are rooted in a fixed based of available points, because that's the only reality that I have ever known. And this also caused me to believe that no matter how much I distrust Wyndham, that they can't wander too far off the reservation because they can't sell what they don't have.

So, back to my original question - I'm wondering if the offer I will get will be similar to all of my current contracts. For example - "We're offering you 154,000 points at Resort X to replace the points you are losing at Patriots Place". Or will we just receive a contract for generic points not linked to anything?
I don't think this matters much for how I would carry out my day-to-day travel plans. But I would like to know for 2 reasons - 1) If the swaps are not tethered to something real, then what is keeping Wyndham from selling unlimited points, and 2) I am intensely curious about how this whole house of cards, ponzi, scheme, or whatever you want to call it, holds together.

And one more thing. I suppose the answer could be that I would be offered a contract directly with "Club Wyndham Access". However, I did not think that you could buy directly into CWA. I had believed that you became a part of CWA INDIRECTLY by owning at a resort that was part of CWA. I would also appreciate it if anyone can provide clarity around that relationship.

 

[paxsarah]

So, back to my original question - I'm wondering if the offer I will get will be similar to all of my current contracts. For example - "We're offering you 154,000 points at Resort X to replace the points you are losing at Patriots Place". Or will we just receive a contract for generic points not linked to anything?

It will be "We're offering you 154,000 points in Club Wyndham Access to replace the points you are losing at Patriots Place."

Club Wyndham Access isn't deeded at the level of the owners, who simply receive a "certificate of ownership." However, the CWA trust holds many deeds for units/UDI points at something like 80+ different resort locations, and Wyndham can only sell as many CWA points as there is deeded inventory held in the trust. So the points are still backed by real deeded inventory, it's just that the deeds are not held by the individual owners but by the trust on behalf of all CWA owners.

 

[CO skier]

I did not think that you could buy directly into CWA. I had believed that you became a part of CWA INDIRECTLY by owning at a resort that was part of CWA. I would also appreciate it if anyone can provide clarity around that relationship.

Most of developer sales are now Club Wyndham Access (direct ownership). There is also an active resale market of CWA ownerships. Search ebay for "Club Wyndham Access Timeshare For Sale.

 

[HitchHiker71]

Hope this isn't too confusing and ask anything else. No dumb questions. I "think" the majority of posters on here may have the "Points" weeks. I have no idea how those work in trading with RCI and other resorts.

There are RCI weeks accounts and RCI points accounts. If you own weeks, you deposit those weeks into an RCI weeks account. If you own points, you deposit those points into an RCI points account. Weeks currency vs points currency essentially. Others more familiar with using RCI can likely compare the trading power of weeks vs points when booking using RCI for some real world examples hopefully.

 

[HitchHiker71]

Ok. Got the annual Wyndham statement over the weekend. The monthly payment is now $253.62 - which is about $20 more than the November estimate printed. The PFs list the 154k FG contract, but the list of contracts don’t have the FG. There is that disclaimer about the changes in fees based on closures.

Good to hear that the disclaimer is there as per what I was told by Wyndham, though it sounds like it's in the small print which isn't good.

I understand that this is all unfolding, and I’m sure some here will tell me we already beat this dead horse, or it’s a problem to make programming changes, or it will be corrected down the road, but it’s real poor form to have the PFs listed for the contracts that are not there. If the contracts were able to be deleted, I don’t see why the PFs couldn’t have been updated in kind.

While i understand what’s going on, the vast majority of folks don’t. If someone takes the swap, the monthly payment changes anyway. No reason to include phantom PFs that don’t exist since they are not associated with a contract on the itemized statement. Also, let’s hope in January they bill the correct PFs. Forgive me for not having faith (and no, I’m not a conspiracy theorists).

The contracts weren't removed from the account, per @comicbookman posting above when I asked, the contracts are still resident in the account. I think what you're saying is that they were not included on the mock/draft statement, which is what we're seeing across the board so far. Best guess the fact that the contracts were not removed from the account, means that the PF calculation still "sees" that contract. Ideally Wyndham would have a flag on each contract indicating whether it's active or inactive, and when inactive, it's not included in the PF calculation, but that's just speculation on my part, since I have no understanding of how the back-end systems actually work behind the scenes. I do agree it's confusing though. While I can understand that it's a mock/draft statement, as you have stated, a lot of folks don't understand the nuances along this line, which only serves to sow confusion for most impacted owners.

 

[HitchHiker71]

I apologize in advance if this is a dumb question. Please be kind if it is.

My family has had seven or eight Wyndham contracts over the past 30 years. Every single one of them has been linked to a specific resort and specific units. And in most cases, but not all, a specific timeframe. So I've never seen a contract that is just for "points", and not directly tied to a resort and specific units.

Are there contracts that are literally just "points"? And if so, is that what we will be offered as a "swap", and how can we trust that Wyndham doesn't just sell (or swap) more points than are actually supported by the underlying properties?

Yes, there are contracts that are literally just points. These are RTU or trust/membership based contracts, like Worldmark or CWA (Club Wyndham Access) for example. There are also deeded points contracts, which we affectionately term CWS (Club Wyndham Select) around here, which is defined in the Wyndham glossary (located here for future reference: https://clubwyndham.wyndhamdestinations.com/us/en/help/glossary)

Folks who own fixed weeks contracts own DI or Divided Interest contracts, which are typically 1/52 of the unit in scope (hence the term Divided). A converted fixed week is essentially a grant of the equivalent number of points for the underlying interval week - which behaves like a UDI (Undivided Deeded Interest) contract. A UDI contract - which is points only - is a deeded contract that essentially behaves like a RTU (Right-To-Use) type ownership - but still has an underlying deed - just not to any particular interval/interest (hence the term Undivided). A trust based ownership, like Worldmark or CWA, is basically a RTU points only membership/ownership type. You buy a Right-To-Use the trust via your points - which is the currency in the system - in essence. Club Wyndham Plus is the name of the exchange used allow member resorts to facilitate the transfer of points currencies from the owners, much like RCI weeks is the exchange system used to facilitate TPUs that are used to trade exchanged weeks. Same with the RCI points exchange, it simply uses points instead of TPUs/weeks. So, at a very basic level, there are points trading systems and weeks trading systems.

Probably one of the bigger differences between the points systems and the weeks systems is when you own a fixed week - you're entitled to either use that week every year, or trade it via the RCI weeks system, but you always have that week to use unless you opt to exchange it. In the points system, because it's more RTU oriented, you do not have entitlement to any particular piece of inventory, you simply have entitlement (or a right to use ) to use your points to book inventory in the points system (in this case Club Wyndham Plus), along with everyone else that owns points in the system, within the rulesets established by the Club. This means more "competition" for desirable rooms and resorts, so IMHO the points systems are more "competitive" when it comes to getting what you may want, especially if you want to book larger rooms during prime/high seasons at popular resorts. This is why UDI contracts allow booking in the ARP window (10-13 months), so you are then only competing with other UDI owners at that resort for the ARP inventory (and same with other CWA owners that have access to ARP inventory at CWA resorts where the trust owns deeds at those resorts). Again, it gets complex rather quickly, but at a high level, because the points ownerships don't tie back to any "fixed" inventory ownerships, it's a bit more competitive when it comes getting what you want, and as the old saying goes, "the early bird gets the worm," hence why you'll often see points owners either booking right at 13 months out if they can via ARP, or right at 10 months out if ARP is not available for their desired vacation spot.

On the plus side, you don't have to "deposit" your points anywhere - you can spend them freely at any member resort, never having to worry about TPUs or anything similar, at least as long as your points stay within the Club, you can book at any Club Wyndham resort you like, and if you own developer points, you can also use Club Pass for a fee to book Worldmark resorts to boot. If you want to book using RCI for any reason, you can simply book any RCI points participating resort using RCI points (which is automatically provided when you convert to a Wyndham points ownership), similar to how you use your TPUs today to exchange weeks via your RCI weeks account.

 

[Floridaman76]

I would think that weeks owners who have RCI memberships would have the RCI Points membership and would deal in TPU's, not the weird RCI points system CW owners deal with. Maybe someone who is a weeks owner could opine on that?

But one would speculate that if the only RCI membership is tied to your week that is going away, you would lose your points. But if you make a booking, your booking should stay intact.

 

[paxsarah]

There are RCI weeks accounts and RCI points accounts. If you own weeks, you deposit those weeks into an RCI weeks account. If you own points, you deposit those points into an RCI points account. Weeks currency vs points currency essentially. Others more familiar with using RCI can likely compare the trading power of weeks vs points when booking using RCI for some real world examples hopefully.

This isn't entirely accurate in terms of how Club Wyndham owners interact with RCI.

If someone owns an unconverted fixed week in Club Wyndham, they deal directly in RCI Weeks and exchange using TPUs. As I understand it, they also have to provide their own RCI account, it's not included with their Club Wyndham ownership (because they're not paying a program fee - unless they also happen to own Club Wyndham points).

If someone owns Club Wyndham points (converted fixed week, UDI Select, or CWA), they deposit those points into a proprietary RCI/Wyndham portal account. This shouldn't be confused with "RCI Points" which is a separate type of timeshare currency. The points deposited into RCI remain denominated in Club Wyndham points in RCI - there's no direct conversion rate between Club Wyndham points in RCI and RCI Points or TPUs, for instance. The trading power of Club Wyndham points in RCI is completely determined by a crossover chart that takes into account unit size and season only:

It doesn't matter where you own your points, that's what your points will get you. (Sometimes there are last minute discounts but it's basically at the level of what you can already get via Last Call.) Also note that the seasons on this chart are not the same as Club Wyndham's seasons nor individual resorts' seasons in RCI. Basically you can just figure out the season by looking at the points cost of a unit in RCI and referring back to this chart.

The standard type of RCI access in this minisystem portal is RCI Points. That is, that's what owners with PlusPartners receive. This allows them to have access to RCI Nightly Stays as well as RCI Points and RCI Weeks inventory. Owners without PlusPartners only have access to RCI Weeks inventory (which I know sounds counterintuitive since we're still booking with points, but it is what it is). We can only book full weeks or those "prepackaged" 2 night, 3 night, etc, listings but not on a night by night basis.

 

[shawnee83]

I just called the Swap hotline for the third time. I haven't received any physical letters or email about the swap (I own at Star Island).

I sent an email on 11/29 replying to the points swap offer. Got an automated reply saying they'd get back to me in 7-10 business days.

They have not.

 

[Floridaman76]

T-Minus 15 days to ARMAGEDDON!!!!!

 

[carlbarry]

I sent an email on 11/29 replying to the points swap offer. Got an automated reply saying they'd get back to me in 7-10 business days.

They have not.

I called yesterday morning. I was told that there is a big backlog, so they have started a program called "Harvest" which will allow owners to do the transfer on-line themselves. She tried to register me for it and--big Wyndham surprise--it wouldn't load on her computer. But no worry--she'd call me back in a few minutes when it did. Now 24 hours later . . .

 

[bnoble]

We are Kauai Beach Villas owners, so not exactly in this process. But, similar to those who are, we have no line items in our annual MF summary document for the two weeks, but we do have the points that would have been part of those weeks in our Program Fee total. We were billed for a monthly total that includes those (higher-than-accurate) program fee this month via Paymentus. @HitchHiker71 I think you've said that these are only "temporary." Do you have any sense for when the charges will be corrected and, if so, whether or not we'll be refunded for the months we paid extra?

I can almost justify paying the full Program Fee amount this month, b/c I had access to those points during 2025 and arguably this is justifiable. But, it definitely should not include that amount in January.

 

[HitchHiker71]

We are Kauai Beach Villas owners, so not exactly in this process. But, similar to those who are, we have no line items in our annual MF summary document for the two weeks, but we do have the points that would have been part of those weeks in our Program Fee total. We were billed for a monthly total that includes those (higher-than-accurate) program fee this month via Paymentus. @HitchHiker71 I think you've said that these are only "temporary." Do you have any sense for when the charges will be corrected and, if so, whether or not we'll be refunded for the months we paid extra?

I can almost justify paying the full Program Fee amount this month, b/c I had access to those points during 2025 and arguably this is justifiable. But, it definitely should not include that amount in January.

Correct, technically the annual assessments are mock or draft statements subject to change, and there should be verbiage in the small print that indicates this fact. IMHO it should be in bold large print this year especially, at least for any/all impacted owners that are dealing with resorts exiting the system for whatever reason. When is KBV going to exit Club Wyndham? If it's 12/31/2025 then I'd surmise you should see the PFs change starting 1/1/2026, though I cannot say when exactly the change would transpire in the actual back end systems and show up in the billing portal.

 

[hjsweet2002]

Not sure if this was addressed before but when will Wyndham remove points for contracts that were given back and no swap was made

 

[chapjim]

T-Minus 15 days to ARMAGEDDON!!!!!

Kinda like Y2K!

 

[chapjim]

Not sure if this was addressed before but when will Wyndham remove points for contracts that were given back and no swap was made

Since they are next year's points, probably next year. This was addressed before and I think that was the answer.

I'm holding 350,000 resale points in my 2026 account, waiting for them to be transferred out.

 

[nibble4bits]

Kinda like Y2K!

Best Buy says to turn your computer off before 10am on December 27th 2025!

 

[HitchHiker71]

Not sure if this was addressed before but when will Wyndham remove points for contracts that were given back and no swap was made

After the date the resort is removed from Club Wyndham best estimate. So if the resort is exiting CW after 12/31/2025, I’d surmise the contract will be made inactive on 1/1/2026 and points from that contract will be removed from the account at that point in time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[bnoble]

When is KBV going to exit Club Wyndham?

Ceases timeshare operations at the end of calendar 2025

 

[Jan M.]

Kinda like Y2K!

I did a search about Y2k and coped this.

"Y2K wasn't a hoax; it was a genuine, potentially severe, technical problem that was successfully averted by diligent, large-scale IT work. The lack of apocalypse was a testament to the success of the fix, not the absence of the threat."

Before the end of the year as a precautionary measure, and for my own records in regards to the points, I take screenshots or pictures of our point balances, reservations, and contracts. I've posted this before and am saying it again. I can't stress enough how important I think it is to do that this year. Especially for anyone who owns at one of the resorts or resort sections leaving our system.

Think about what I quoted from my search on Y2K. Then think about your own experiences, and what you know of other owners experiences, with our Wyndham system. Also the level of accuracy, or lack thereof, that we know happens with title transfers and other changes.

I know it sounds like I'm bad mouthing Wyndham, their IT Department, the Title Department, and whichever other departments are involved. That isn't my intent. What I am trying to say is that this is a much larger undertaking than most of us realize and that we should expect the involved departments to be able to handle with only minimal problems.

 

[nibble4bits]

this is a much larger undertaking than most of us realize and that we should expect the involved departments to be able to handle with only minimal problems

Correct, and if you think it's confusing for just one person, it's gotta be confusing for the IT people that have to program out this sort of thing, usually on older or antiquated systems, system-wide, and probably with "we need this done by yesterday" notice.