Wyndham is closing a handful of legacy resorts - dedicated chart/tracker located in the first post for this unfolding set of events

[HitchHiker71]

I do have a question though - we have a couple of vacations that used saved up RCI points scheduled for next year (Feb and June). My wife's ex had been paying the fees until we took over this year and there were a bunch of points in RCI, so I made use of them. I'm an AirBnB and VRBO master, but I made this work and am looking forward to the trips. If we get the hoped for result of not paying maintenance fees in 2026, would that impact these RCI reservations? Would hate to arrive and be told that our points no longer apply.

The honest answer is we simply don't know right now. I'm assuming your wife holds no other Wyndham contracts, that the BB contract is the only one in her account. This means that, at some point in time, her Wyndham account will be closed as a consequence of these actions since the only contract in her account is being removed from Club Wyndham effective 1/1/2026 or thereafter. Once her account is closed, if the RCI account that was used to make the reservations is her Wyndham RCI account, that account may or may not also be closed. I've asked this question twice so far in my bi-weekly meetings with Wyndham and have yet to receive an answer. I will ask again this Friday on our next meeting. I'd hope that your wife would be offered the ability to keep her RCI account on her own dime, but again, no one really knows. In so far as the reservations made in RCI, I'm assuming the points that were used were from prior use years that moved into RCI since they were unused within Club Wyndham, so if we assume that those points entitlements were already paid for, again, I'd hope that those reservations and the underlying account would remain intact. Hopefully Wyndham will provide more explicit guidance on these types of questions moving forward. I've got a FAQ section in the 1st post of this thread where I'm adding answers to these types of questions as we learn more from Wyndham and other sources - keep an eye on it moving forward as this question has come up many times over the past couple of months - so I'm trying to get explicit answers from Wyndham to share on this thread. Hang in there.

 

[HitchHiker71]

Do you own at any of the impacted properties? You have a lot of posts here too. As do many others that don't own at any of the properties.

Nope - but I'm the forum moderator - and I'm actually working directly with Wyndham on a bi-weekly basis to get answers - and built and am maintaining the entire tracker that started this thread. What exactly are you doing to help besides filling up the thread with a bunch of theoretical questions/issues? Would it surprise you to learn that I've received no less than 10 DMs about you and a few others filling up this thread with a bunch of posts that ultimately just make it harder for everyone else to discern actual productive information about what is transpiring? I've been asked to move all of these posts into another thread for legal debates several times - but I've not done so yet. Perhaps it's time to do just that now though.

 

[HitchHiker71]

OFFICIAL MODERATOR POST

From this point forward - any/all legal debate topics will no longer be acceptable on this thread. This thread will be maintained strictly for capturing information regarding the impacted resorts. Any/all posts regarding "legal debates" or other associated content will be moved to the follow thread - along with a public warning applied to posts that violate this rule on this thread. I will also add this same verbiage to the 1st post for all to see. Here's a link to the new thread for this purpose. I'll be spending a bit of time moving all older posts under which this new rule applies to that thread.

For any newbies, feel free to post your questions on these actions here in this thread - that is partly the intent of this thread - to bring new TUG members to this post to learn more about what's going on with the handful of resorts leaving Club Wyndham by end of year.

EDIT: I'm through reviewing roughly 50% of this thread's contents - and have moved most of the offending content into the new thread for legal debates. I'll continue this process tomorrow in hopes of getting through the entirety of all content by end of day Thursday.

 

[susieq]

Received this yesterday ... although the envelope says Sept. 27th. Ah well, better late than never. We did do the proxy vote online today, and registered for the virtual meeting...

 

[HitchHiker71]

Received this yesterday ... although the envelope says Sept. 27th. Ah well, better late than never. We did do the proxy vote online today, and registered for the virtual meeting...

Thanks for sharing, please keep us posted on the details from the meeting on 10/13 upcoming.

 

[Greg G]

The honest answer is we simply don't know right now. I'm assuming your wife holds no other Wyndham contracts, that the BB contract is the only one in her account. This means that, at some point in time, her Wyndham account will be closed as a consequence of these actions since the only contract in her account is being removed from Club Wyndham effective 1/1/2026 or thereafter. Once her account is closed, if the RCI account that was used to make the reservations is her Wyndham RCI account, that account may or may not also be closed. I've asked this question twice so far in my bi-weekly meetings with Wyndham and have yet to receive an answer. I will ask again this Friday on our next meeting. I'd hope that your wife would be offered the ability to keep her RCI account on her own dime, but again, no one really knows. In so far as the reservations made in RCI, I'm assuming the points that were used were from prior use years that moved into RCI since they were unused within Club Wyndham, so if we assume that those points entitlements were already paid for, again, I'd hope that those reservations and the underlying account would remain intact. Hopefully Wyndham will provide more explicit guidance on these types of questions moving forward. I've got a FAQ section in the 1st post of this thread where I'm adding answers to these types of questions as we learn more from Wyndham and other sources - keep an eye on it moving forward as this question has come up many times over the past couple of months - so I'm trying to get explicit answers from Wyndham to share on this thread. Hang in there.

I am also going to ask Star Island directly but possibly in your weekly meetings with Wyndham you could ask: For those people still with Wyndham at Star Island (points or whatever) that were not part of the bankruptcy (not in bldgs 20,21,23 and 25), , like regatta333, what is the plan for them? Would Wyndham still have a presence at Star Island, albeit a smaller one?

 

[paxsarah]

The honest answer is we simply don't know right now. I'm assuming your wife holds no other Wyndham contracts, that the BB contract is the only one in her account. This means that, at some point in time, her Wyndham account will be closed as a consequence of these actions since the only contract in her account is being removed from Club Wyndham effective 1/1/2026 or thereafter. Once her account is closed, if the RCI account that was used to make the reservations is her Wyndham RCI account, that account may or may not also be closed. I've asked this question twice so far in my bi-weekly meetings with Wyndham and have yet to receive an answer. I will ask again this Friday on our next meeting. I'd hope that your wife would be offered the ability to keep her RCI account on her own dime, but again, no one really knows. In so far as the reservations made in RCI, I'm assuming the points that were used were from prior use years that moved into RCI since they were unused within Club Wyndham, so if we assume that those points entitlements were already paid for, again, I'd hope that those reservations and the underlying account would remain intact. Hopefully Wyndham will provide more explicit guidance on these types of questions moving forward. I've got a FAQ section in the 1st post of this thread where I'm adding answers to these types of questions as we learn more from Wyndham and other sources - keep an eye on it moving forward as this question has come up many times over the past couple of months - so I'm trying to get explicit answers from Wyndham to share on this thread. Hang in there.

I would expect confirmed exchanges in RCI would work the same way they do for someone fully exiting via Certified Exit - that confirmed exchanges in RCI will be honored (and this is spelled out in the Certified Exit documentation). The owner should save confirmations - electronically, by printing, emails, whatever works best - because the Wyndham-paid RCI account will disappear at some point. But in general, moving points to RCI is a one-way street and I don't think Club Wyndham really knows or cares what happens to those points once they're over there. The biggest catch is the loss of access to the account - but apparently confirmed exchanges are still in RCI's system.

 

[Purduece]

I have a question about Bentley Brook, first heard of the bankruptcy a day ago from a reservation agent at the resort. Then came here to get the details. what I would like to know is will the resort be open after December and can people book into Bentley Brook after this bankruptcy is complete and potential sale? doesn't make sense to me that they would demolish it during peak ski season. The employee I talked to said they didn't know and were starting to look for jobs.
Thanks

 

[BingoBangoBongo]

I don’t own Wyndham (and after this episode never will), but I have read many posts in this thread and would like to know:

1) How can and HOA claim to be on “sound financial footing” and file Chapter 11? I get it that future liabilities are high, but isn’t that the case with any Timeshare operation.

2)Related to that question, how do so many properties fall into this rabbit hole at the same time? It seems like a poorly manage system and ripe for class action lawsuits, that if filed will only make attorneys rich.

Thx

 

[HitchHiker71]

I am also going to ask Star Island directly but possibly in your weekly meetings with Wyndham you could ask: For those people still with Wyndham at Star Island (points or whatever) that were not part of the bankruptcy (not in bldgs 20,21,23 and 25), , like regatta333, what is the plan for them? Would Wyndham still have a presence at Star Island, albeit a smaller one?

Happy to make the ask yes. I'll also confirm if there are actually use cases like this - or if our assumptions are incorrect here. In other words, are there Wyndham intervals at Star Island that are not part of the exit process? I for one don't think there are - I think Wyndham is exiting entirely, I just think folks here are getting confused somehow. But, it's worth asking either way.

 

[HitchHiker71]

I would expect confirmed exchanges in RCI would work the same way they do for someone fully exiting via Certified Exit - that confirmed exchanges in RCI will be honored (and this is spelled out in the Certified Exit documentation). The owner should save confirmations - electronically, by printing, emails, whatever works best - because the Wyndham-paid RCI account will disappear at some point. But in general, moving points to RCI is a one-way street and I don't think Club Wyndham really knows or cares what happens to those points once they're over there. The biggest catch is the loss of access to the account - but apparently confirmed exchanges are still in RCI's system.

Good info and that's my assumption as well - but I don't want to assume anything at this point. I want real confirmation that I can add to our FAQ.

 

[HitchHiker71]

I have a question about Bentley Brook, first heard of the bankruptcy a day ago from a reservation agent at the resort. Then came here to get the details. what I would like to know is will the resort be open after December and can people book into Bentley Brook after this bankruptcy is complete and potential sale? doesn't make sense to me that they would demolish it during peak ski season. The employee I talked to said they didn't know and were starting to look for jobs.
Thanks

The short answer is no - as Wyndham has said - any/all reservations after 12/31/2025 won't be honored. They say it the more polite way - that all reservations up through 12/31/2025 will be honored - because that sounds better than using negativity in any manner. It won't be demolished - it'll be sold and then whomever the purchaser is will do with that property whatever they so desire.

 

[HitchHiker71]

I don’t own Wyndham (and after this episode never will), but I have read many posts in this thread and would like to know:

1) How can and HOA claim to be on “sound financial footing” and file Chapter 11? I get it that future liabilities are high, but isn’t that the case with any Timeshare operation.

Chapter 11 is reorganization, chapter 7 is liquidation (in essence). This has been covered in detail in past posts in this thread - feel free to search the thread for more details. I'll consider adding a FAQ item for this in the 1st post as well.

2)Related to that question, how do so many properties fall into this rabbit hole at the same time? It seems like a poorly manage system and ripe for class action lawsuits, that if filed will only make attorneys rich.

Thx

It's a rip the bandaid off approach. It's actually wise on Wyndham's part to remove a group of resorts rather than a piecemeal approach that just stretches out the pain over a period of many years in comparison. It's intentional in other words. It's akin to company layoffs - you perform WFRs/RIFs all at once across the entire organization - you don't piecemeal it out over multiple events over time. One approach kills morale within a short timespan and gets the worst over with quickly, then the business can move on and rebuild fresh. The other approach makes for constant pain and suffering over a much longer period of time and kills productivity persistently (and therefore revenues in the process) over that longer time period. This is the best approach to take IMHO. Not saying I'm a fan of it - I'm not - I'm losing 3-4 resorts within driving distance due to these actions - so this impacts me directly - but the business approach here at a macro level is sound.

 

[Rolltydr]

How can and HOA claim to be on “sound financial footing” and file Chapter 11? …future liabilities are high…

You basically answered your own question. The only thing that should be added is that a small amount of owners are visiting these resorts so there is almost certainly no payback to spending the money to manage ane maintain them.

It seems like a poorly manage system and ripe for class action lawsuits, that if filed will only make attorneys rich.

Exactly!

 

[shawnee83]

Curious what you are hoping to learn more about?

For one thing, is the desired outcome a sale of the property? It sure seems that way, but I don't think a sale is on the agenda for this meeting. Are there other possible outcomes after the HOA votes to pursue Chapter 11 Bankruptcy?

There are also supposed to be presentations from the law firm and the real estate company. Want to see if there are any additional details. Would like to hear if they have been talking to any potential buyers, although I suspect they will remain silent on this point.

My desired outcome is to be free and clear of my fixed week. I'd like to find out if there is any more information pointing to that resolution.

 

[e.bram]

The BOD is going to dissolve Newport Overlook.
I love it and can not believe it

[moved to this thread]

 

[dioxide45]

Chapter 11 is reorganization, chapter 7 is liquidation (in essence).

What I do find odd about this is, based on many of the communications to owners that we've seen, their intent is actually liquidation. No?

 

[BingoBangoBongo]

Chapter 11 is reorganization, chapter 7 is liquidation (in essence). This has been covered in detail in past posts in this thread - feel free to search the thread for more details. I'll consider adding a FAQ item for this in the 1st post as well.

It's a rip the bandaid off approach. It's actually wise on Wyndham's part to remove a group of resorts rather than a piecemeal approach that just stretches out the pain over a period of many years in comparison. It's intentional in other words. It's akin to company layoffs - you perform WFRs/RIFs all at once across the entire organization - you don't piecemeal it out over multiple events over time. One approach kills morale within a short timespan and gets the worst over with quickly, then the business can move on and rebuild fresh. The other approach makes for constant pain and suffering over a much longer period of time and kills productivity persistently (and therefore revenues in the process) over that longer time period. This is the best approach to take IMHO. Not saying I'm a fan of it - I'm not - I'm losing 3-4 resorts within driving distance due to these actions - so this impacts me directly - but the business approach here at a macro level is sound.

Thanks for the reply. I guess what is surprising to me is that so many resorts are experiencing the same issue at the same time and seemingly no one (HOA's) took the trouble to raise the alarm prior to this mass exit. It's troubling to me that a corporation and HOA were negligent in operating these resorts into the ground, although it appears that some have had recent renovations, which is even stranger. It's like putting a new porch on the front of a house that has burned down.

Reading through the posts it seems like many see this as a way to break free of the maintenance fees, and others like you are losing resorts they like to visit. This process just adds to the perception that timeshares aren't good. I don't fully subscribe to that line of thinking, but there are many areas that are very sleazy. Buyer beware!

 

[BingoBangoBongo]

You basically answered your own question. The only thing that should be added is that a small amount of owners are visiting these resorts so there is almost certainly no payback to spending the money to manage ane maintain them.

But I'm guessing the low level of visits didn't just pop up? This seems like something that had to be festering like an open wound. I realize it's well past the time for first aid, but supports my position that major issues were just being ignored for way too long.

How confident can you be paying MF's at any TS when the HOA says they are financially sound, but fail to mention the low level of occupancy and the long term affects or present a plan to address that?

 

[comicbookman]

But I'm guessing the low level of visits didn't just pop up? This seems like something that had to be festering like an open wound. I realize it's well past the time for first aid, but supports my position that major issues were just being ignored for way too long.

How confident can you be paying MF's at any TS when the HOA says they are financially sound, but fail to mention the low level of occupancy and the long term affects or present a plan to address that?

The low level of occupancy is more a Wyndham problem than an individual owner issue. As long as maint. fees are coming in the HOA doesn't have any issue. But over time Wyndham becomes the majority oener and the low occupancy makes it unatractive for them.

 

[Floridaman76]

But I'm guessing the low level of visits didn't just pop up? This seems like something that had to be festering like an open wound. I realize it's well past the time for first aid, but supports my position that major issues were just being ignored for way too long.

How confident can you be paying MF's at any TS when the HOA says they are financially sound, but fail to mention the low level of occupancy and the long term affects or present a plan to address that?

And the "low level of occupancy" figure has been highly contested at some of the resorts. Some it's clear, some it seems downright fabricated. Bentley Brook is one that supposedly has great occupancy rates yearroundd.

 

[comicbookman]

And the "low level of occupancy" figure has been highly contested at some of the resorts. Some it's clear, some it seems downright fabricated. Bentley Brook is one that supposedly has great occupancy rates yearroundd.

The low level of occupancy is not being claimed by all of the resorts.

 

[dioxide45]

2)Related to that question, how do so many properties fall into this rabbit hole at the same time? It seems like a poorly manage system and ripe for class action lawsuits, that if filed will only make attorneys rich.

There certainly has to be some level of not properly funding reserves. Some of the items mentioned in the communications to owners shouldn't be coming as a surprise. A good reserve study should have turned these things up years if not a decade ago. Upgrading an outdated fire alarm system isn't something you skip and at some point the time comes to do it. Also, for some of the properties, I noticed that the size of the possible upgrades and such is not significant. One property added up to about $3-$4 million. For a resort of the size it isn't that much. I did a quick math and it was about $1400 per unit week owner. Not insignificant as a one time assessment but certainly not significant if spread over the years as reserve assessments are supposed to be.

The HOA is ultimately responsible for making sure reserves are maintained. The problem is that Wyndham controls many of these properties and thus also the BOD of the HOA. It would seem they gave up on these properties long ago and let some of these larger capital improvements fall by the way side. Perhaps they saw the writing on the wall before owners did. They wanted to keep the maintenance fees down for units that likely just sit empty. Those same maintenance fees also push up the cost of fees on CWA points. Something which, it seems they are sitting on an abundance of inventory of and thus also paying the fees. I haven't looked at the Travel + Leisure financials, but no one has really seemed to indicate this as a problem. You would think if they are paying fees for empty rooms, it would show up somewhere?

 

[e.bram]

THANX!
It will we sold cheap to Friends of the BOD!
Worth more than TSes in 2025!

 

[dioxide45]

Today, Oct. 4, we just received our letter from Glade - Wellington HOA. The meeting will be held Friday, October 10, at 11am CT and can be attended both in-person and virtually via "zoom." We are considering attending (virtually) and hope to pass along any news. Here's a PDF with photos of the complete letter/packet sent to us - a total of 8 legal sized pages - in case anyone wanted to peruse the exact wording, similar to what many have reported receiving. Just as an aside notice the budgets shown on pages 4 and 5 - one is the proposed budget with "full" operations, the other is with "limited" operations. Am I right in thinking that this would indicate there might still be a required amount to be paid by owners in 2026?

@HitchHiker71 There is an attachment in the quoted post. I think this may need to be updated in the tracker. I don't even see this association listed. I also think Oak Knoll vote date is incorrect. Should be 10/10 per post #2931. Laurel Ridge may be incorrect too, but not sure.