Don't buy a timeshare. It's the worst deal they can do.

[davidvel]

I was just quoting what the OP said:

I understand but I don't know what you or the OP mean by "booking price." Also a comparison cannot be made in a vacuum. One needs to know what is being compared. There are certainly times/places/size/view where alternative booking methods are cheaper than the MF, but that doesn't tell anyone anything.

 

[ronandjoan]

I was just quoting what the OP said:

And my post good you how it could be cheaper at nicer places

 

[Hopi]

My maintenance fee last year was $1600. Two Interval Exchanges at $150 per; and one Internal exchange at $40. A skosh less than $2000 for 21 days vacation.

And yes, I do this every year. Some years I get more than three weeks. But three has been a fairly standard amount. Unfortunately, the plan was unilaterally changed on Jan. 1 and I'll have to settle for 2-4 weeks every year instead of 3-5. Oh well.

And, yes, I can get Carmel, SF and Napa pretty much any time I want to go there.

Why? I did my homework.

@ScoopKona
I thought that II's exchange fee was $229. How did you get two Interval International exchanges for just $150 each and one Internal exchange at $40?
Does Gold or Platinum membership have a lower exchange fee?
Also, how do you transform one owned week into 3 weeks (bonus weeks, Getaways, etc.)? Is it guarantee that II gives you these extra weeks?

Thank you for sharing your tips. I am learning and doing my homework!

 

[ScoopKona]

@ScoopKona
I thought that II's exchange fee was $229. How did you get two Interval International exchanges for just $150 each and one Internal exchange at $40?
Does Gold or Platinum membership have a lower exchange fee?
Also, how do you transform one owned week into 3 weeks (bonus weeks, Getaways, etc.)? Is it guarantee that II gives you these extra weeks?

Thank you for sharing your tips. I am learning and doing my homework!

It works different for different timeshare systems.

What you know about timeshares is utterly irrelevant in a world where there are dozens of different systems which all work differently. The trick is to say, "I'd like to do this," and then see if anything works for you.

I can theoretically get as many as 8 weeks on a single maintenance fee. But typically it was more like 3-5. And now that the system has changed, 2-4.

 

[davidvel]

@ScoopKona
I thought that II's exchange fee was $229. How did you get two Interval International exchanges for just $150 each and one Internal exchange at $40?
Does Gold or Platinum membership have a lower exchange fee?
Also, how do you transform one owned week into 3 weeks (bonus weeks, Getaways, etc.)? Is it guarantee that II gives you these extra weeks?

Thank you for sharing your tips. I am learning and doing my homework!

It works different for different timeshare systems.

What you know about timeshares is utterly irrelevant in a world where there are dozens of different systems which all work differently. The trick is to say, "I'd like to do this," and then see if anything works for you.

I can theoretically get as many as 8 weeks on a single maintenance fee. But typically it was more like 3-5. And now that the system has changed, 2-4.

@Hopi, I guess he doesn't want to explain it to you, despite how nice you asked.

 

[ScoopKona]

I guess he doesn't want to explain it to you, despite how nice you asked.

What's there to explain? Buy a week, turn it into points, trade it for three or more weeks. LOTS of timeshare systems work that way. Even more work on the model "buy one with a lockoff, trade for two." Most timeshare owners can wrap their heads around lockoffs.

It's my experience that newbies need to research for themselves to learn that the point-systems actually work. Only then are they interested in learning how they work.

 

[Hindsite]

I am curious though. Can booking price actually be cheaper than MF?

Yes. In the case of MVC timeshares, it has been the case for at least 20 years that low season bookings via marriott.com are often less expensive than the maint fees for weeks during that season.
In the MVC points system it is also possible to use points elected from weeks ownership that have a lower maint cost per point equivalent than the points bought direct. As all points are equal in the booking system, you can then use those points to book hight maint fee weeks and then offer them for rent via redweek etc.

 

[WaikikiFirst]

well, it has been explained 999x in 400 different threads in just the last few years to search:
- buy a 3 or 2 bdrm, exchange for 1 bdrms or studios (throw in the "lockoff" possibilities, which I think have existed since the dawn of TSs)
- buy something in prime season, travel in not-so-prime
- buy something that for a variety of reasons "trades" better due to more Points/MF$. seems to be many kinks in the curves in the various systems there
Important Concept:
newbies need to research for themselves to learn that the point-systems actually work. Only then are they interested in learning how they work

 

[WaikikiFirst]

certainly times/places/size/view where alternative booking methods are cheaper than the MF, but that doesn't tell anyone anything

other than not throw darts when buying a TS and to not broad-brush them in general. but it is the age of the broad-brush

 

[davidvel]

What's there to explain? Buy a week, turn it into points, trade it for three or more weeks. LOTS of timeshare systems work that way. Even more work on the model "buy one with a lockoff, trade for two." Most timeshare owners can wrap their heads around lockoffs.

It's my experience that newbies need to research for themselves to learn that the point-systems actually work. Only then are they interested in learning how they work.

You're not required to explain, but since you went to the trouble of telling them what they thought was irrelevant, you could just as easily have answered what they asked: how to you get trades for $150; what is an internal trade; etc?

Other questions would be do you get free II membership? What system are you in that gives internal trades for $40. What resorts/timeframe/room size are you trading into. You, know just being nice and explaining how you are able to get rooms for $100 a night. Not too hard. That is what TUG is all about. Or just tell them what system you are in and make them go look it up themselves.

 

[Red elephant]

You're not required to explain, but since you went to the trouble of telling them what they thought was irrelevant, you could just as easily have answered what they asked: how to you get trades for $150; what is an internal trade; etc?

Other questions would be do you get free II membership? What system are you in that gives internal trades for $40. What resorts/timeframe/room size are you trading into. You, know just being nice and explaining how you are able to get rooms for $100 a night. Not too hard. That is what TUG is all about. Or just tell them what system you are in and make them go look it up themselves.

This I would like to know as well. I have read a lot thru all the different posts and for the life of me cannot figure this out. How you use one week and able to book for 3-5 weeks with it now down to 2-4 weeks. Sounds like it’s thru Hyatt exchanging via interval but what resorts/timeframes etc ?

 

[Red elephant]

What's there to explain? Buy a week, turn it into points, trade it for three or more weeks. LOTS of timeshare systems work that way. Even more work on the model "buy one with a lockoff, trade for two." Most timeshare owners can wrap their heads around lockoffs.

It's my experience that newbies need to research for themselves to learn that the point-systems actually work. Only then are they interested in learning how they work.

As a newbie I have been reading and researching and still cannot figure this out. Which system allows you to “ buy a week turn it into points and trade it for 3 or more weeks”?
It’s almost insulting to insinuate that because we have not figured this out means we have not done the research or interested in doing the work.
But thanks for letting us know the tiny bit that you have figured out.
Maybe one of the experts on this board can help us out so we can all get the value that you have gotten out of your ownership.

 

[dioxide45]

As a newbie I have been reading and researching and still cannot figure this out. Which system allows you to “ buy a week turn it into points and trade it for 3 or more weeks”?
It’s almost insulting to insinuate that because we have not figured this out means we have not done the research or interested in doing the work.
But thanks for letting us know the tiny bit that you have figured out.
Maybe one of the experts on this board can help us out so we can all get the value that you have gotten out of your ownership.

Generally you buy a 2BR or larger in a high season and use the points to book 1BR or smaller units in low season. This may not work as well with Hyatt since they realigned II point exchange values at the first of the year. Scoop has long touted this but I don't recall him ever sharing that it was through II exchanges. You lose some value that way because you are paying $200+ per exchange. Often when there are certain things systems that work well like this, Tuggers are reluctant to overtly share. Mainly because all good things some to an end, especially if people blab too much about it. I've seen it happen here several times.

 

[Red elephant]

Generally you buy a 2BR or larger in a high season and use the points to book 1BR or smaller units in low season. This may not work as well with Hyatt since they realigned II point exchange values at the first of the year. Scoop has long touted this but I don't recall him ever sharing that it was through II exchanges. You lose some value that way because you are paying $200+ per exchange. Often when there are certain things systems that work well like this, Tuggers are reluctant to overtly share. Mainly because all good things some to an end, especially if people blab too much about it. I've seen it happen here several times.

Oh I see. I can accept this reasoning for not wanting to share. Thank you.

 

[Hindsite]

Oh I see. I can accept this reasoning for not wanting to share. Thank you.

Read enough and you'll piece most of it together. There are a few blanks to fill in yourself but I thought he's been quite clear a number of times and I'm sure MVW would love to assign the "blame" for the Hyatt II points devaluation to TUG/Scoop. I've also see Hyatt owners "brag" on the II facebook pages about what/how much they can get with their ownership so it was a "realignment" waiting to happen.
There's probably an intern (or AI bot nowadays) in Business Intelligence at MVW that has done a comparison of the "value" that the different brands/ownerships in II and come up with a ranking. Its business sense to address the outliers, especially when the MVC points system is almost universally terrible value to use in II.

 

[WaikikiFirst]

This I would like to know as well. I have read a lot thru all the different posts and for the life of me cannot figure this out. How you use one week and able to book for 3-5 weeks with it now down to 2-4 weeks. Sounds like it’s thru Hyatt exchanging via interval but what resorts/timeframes etc ?

seriously? It is right in his footer. "2023 Carmel, Napa, San Francisco." I read his details, better details than most people give, at least 1x, maybe 2.
How many times is enough? The exact #s? I'm not his accountant, and I have no plan to buy the exact week he owns, so no real point to it

 

[ScoopKona]

Oh I see. I can accept this reasoning for not wanting to share. Thank you.

I have no problems sharing. Almost all of my exchanges are through II. There's a guide on how to do exactly what I do at the top of the stickied posts.

The main reason I don't give specifics is because there are many ways to get the same outcome. One of the other name-brand hotel system timeshares might be a much better fit.

The big-picture problem with all the "what should I buy" threads is that most of the replies are variations of "I bought this and you should, too." That isn't advice or information, it's validation.

I will cheerfully explain what's possible. And then if someone is serious, they can learn how, easily. It's not like any of this is top-secret information.

 

[dioxide45]

It's not like any of this is top-secret information.

It certainly isn't top secret, but I was surprised by how many people posted in that II Hyatt devaluation thread. Much more people that I thought were actually using Hyatt to exchange through II. I expected most to be using the internal point mini system. I guess most owners actually do as TUG isn't really the best representation of the overall ownership. Still, I wasn't expecting as many people to be impacted.

 

[davidvel]

seriously? It is right in his footer. "2023 Carmel, Napa, San Francisco." I read his details, better details than most people give, at least 1x, maybe 2.
How many times is enough? The exact #s? I'm not his accountant, and I have no plan to buy the exact week he owns, so no real point to it

That tells us where he traded INTO. There are many people reading who are not the highest level experts, and frankly learning how other systems work is what TUG is about and not as easy as some make it. Many people make vague posts the same way timeshare salespeople do. However, in timeshare the devil is in the details.

I see this all the time on the What Should I Buy board. People talk in generalities but fail to note whether they need to travel on school breaks, etc. Others post about their amazing trades to Tahoe, but fail to note it is in April or May, right after the resorts close. Details about what you used to trade, how much it cost, and what exactly you traded into gives people more information to make those comparisons and judgments for themselves. It seems many people know he uses Hyatt, and that he references the devaluation that occurred. Others who don't know Hyatt wouldn't understand this.

He posted that he gets 3 weeks of travel for $2,000, and the poster simply asked for details about the cost of trades, and the internal trading system. If he chooses to play a mouse game and not just give discreet examples that is fine, but it would probably be the first time he didn't speak freely. I am sure he'll find a clever way to continue to lecture people about the topic.

Did you know there are people that go on internet chat boards, make generalized statements and then force other users to run around in circles chasing the details? There is a name for those kind of people.

 

[davidvel]

This I would like to know as well. I have read a lot thru all the different posts and for the life of me cannot figure this out. How you use one week and able to book for 3-5 weeks with it now down to 2-4 weeks. Sounds like it’s thru Hyatt exchanging via interval but what resorts/timeframes etc ?

Not sure why he couldn't just lead you to his own sticky: https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/h...as-few-words-as-possible.354983/#post-2956503

Well, yeah, I do know why.

 

[ScoopKona]

He posted that he gets 3 weeks of travel for $2,000, and the poster simply asked for details about the cost of trades, and the internal trading system.

And I replied with the costs. $1600 maintenance fee; 2x $150 II exchanges and a $40 internal exchange.

The problem, which you're going to continue to ignore, is that all of these systems work differently. The exchange fees are different from system to system. The internal exchange fees are as well; and they change depending on the internal trade. The maintenance fee is going to swing wildly based on location. There are a lot of variables.

And there's also the problem that everyone says they're flexible. But in reality most people aren't. People say they're detail oriented. But in reality most people aren't. Everyone also claims to be a good driver and a generous tipper. People claim lots of stuff. Telling people "this is perfect for you" doesn't do ANYONE any favors.

It's like the old Vaudeville gag, "How do I get to Carnegie Hall? Practice."

It's not the expected answer -- but it's the best answer.

 

[SteveinHNL]

That tells us where he traded INTO. There are many people reading who are not the highest level experts, and frankly learning how other systems work is what TUG is about and not as easy as some make it. Many people make vague posts the same way timeshare salespeople do. However, in timeshare the devil is in the details.

I see this all the time on the What Should I Buy board. People talk in generalities but fail to note whether they need to travel on school breaks, etc. Others post about their amazing trades to Tahoe, but fail to note it is in April or May, right after the resorts close. Details about what you used to trade, how much it cost, and what exactly you traded into gives people more information to make those comparisons and judgments for themselves. It seems many people know he uses Hyatt, and that he references the devaluation that occurred. Others who don't know Hyatt wouldn't understand this.

He posted that he gets 3 weeks of travel for $2,000, and the poster simply asked for details about the cost of trades, and the internal trading system. If he chooses to play a mouse game and not just give discreet examples that is fine, but it would probably be the first time he didn't speak freely. I am sure he'll find a clever way to continue to lecture people about the topic.

Did you know there are people that go on internet chat boards, make generalized statements and then force other users to run around in circles chasing the details? There is a name for those kind of people.

@ScoopKona has been pretty transparent about how he uses the system. He is one of the reasons I bought into the Hyatt legacy (weeks) sytem, fka Hyatt Residence Club, nka Hyatt Vacation Club. Scoop owns a Hyatt week in Florida that give him 1880 points per year for his MF (probably about $1800/year now). He divides his 1880 annual points into midweek stays at Carmel (about 800 points for 4 nights), and puts the balance into Interval, where you can get a week in a studio for about 400-500 points/week. So yes, he was able to turn his one-year MFs into 3-4 weeks in nice places like Carmel, Napa, and Europe. But he makes it clear he is fine and happy with with staying in hotel rooms/studios, which many TS people are not wild about. His travel style is to get a lot (of stays) out of a little (1 TS, 1 MF). He picks decent spots in nice locations, is not too picky about the room because he spends most of his time outdoors exploring, not inside relaxing. This is what I have learned from him by reading and asking him. And of course, it should be mentioned that all Interval exchanges require payment of the Interval Exchange fee, so that has to be tacked on to find out the true cost.

 

[SteveinHNL]

For me, I own a diamond Hyatt Legacy week (fka Hyatt Residence Club, nka Hyatt Vacation Club) worth 2,200 points and I am in the process of purchasing another. I use them almost exclusively to stay in 3 resorts. Hyatt High Sierra around early Sept. just after the summer season (1400 points), 4 nights in Carmel (800 points), and a week in the Hyatt Kaanapali which is just awesome (2200 points). I pay about $1650 per year for each 2200 diamond week. Each of these reservations costs about $40 on the internal Hyatt owner's dashboard/site. I like staying in these particular resorts every year (have only done Kaanapali once, which was last month, which is why we are buying the additional week for the points to go back), and I love the value. When we have more time, we will supplement these vacays with a return to European travel and maybe some cruising, none of which will be related to timeshare vacationing. But to the point of the OP thread topic, I think buying a timeshare is a smart thing to do, if it suits your vacation and lifestyle, you understand the costs, and you know how to use what you are buying.

 

[davidvel]

@ScoopKona has been pretty transparent about how he uses the system. He is one of the reasons I bought into the Hyatt legacy (weeks) sytem, fka Hyatt Residence Club, nka Hyatt Vacation Club. Scoop owns a Hyatt week in Florida that give him 1880 points per year for his MF (probably about $1800/year now). He divides his 1880 annual points into midweek stays at Carmel (about 800 points for 4 nights), and puts the balance into Interval, where you can get a week in a studio for about 400-500 points/week. So yes, he was able to turn his one-year MFs into 3-4 weeks in nice places like Carmel, Napa, and Europe. But he makes it clear he is fine and happy with with staying in hotel rooms/studios, which many TS people are not wild about. His travel style is to get a lot (of stays) out of a little (1 TS, 1 MF). He picks decent spots in nice locations, is not too picky about the room because he spends most of his time outdoors exploring, not inside relaxing. This is what I have learned from him by reading and asking him. And of course, it should be mentioned that all Interval exchanges require payment of the Interval Exchange fee, so that has to be tacked on to find out the true cost.

Thank you Steve, you explained it far better and faster than him. (I have seen the Hyatt thread now, but never have looked there before and I didn't even know he owned Hyatt. Probably the same for others reading.) I think @Hopi was just trying to figure out how it was done, not knowing all the background you had, and the exchange fees seeming low. Thanks to you it seems we finally got an answer. Sure didn't need to go on so long.

 

[ronandjoan]

@ScoopKona
I thought that II's exchange fee was $229. How did you get two Interval International exchanges for just $150 each and one Internal exchange at $40?
Does Gold or Platinum membership have a lower exchange fee?
Also, how do you transform one owned week into 3 weeks (bonus weeks, Getaways, etc.)? Is it guarantee that II gives you these extra weeks?

Thank you for sharing your tips. I am learning and doing my homework!

For me, I own a diamond Hyatt Legacy week (fka Hyatt Residence Club, nka Hyatt Vacation Club) worth 2,200 points and I am in the process of purchasing another. I use them almost exclusively to stay in 3 resorts. Hyatt High Sierra around early Sept. just after the summer season (1400 points), 4 nights in Carmel (800 points), and a week in the Hyatt Kaanapali which is just awesome (2200 points). I pay about $1650 per year for each 2200 diamond week. Each of these reservations costs about $40 on the internal Hyatt owner's dashboard/site. I like staying in these particular resorts every year (have only done Kaanapali once, which was last month, which is why we are buying the additional week for the points to go back), and I love the value. When we have more time, we will supplement these vacays with a return to European travel and maybe some cruising, none of which will be related to timeshare vacationing. But to the point of the OP thread topic, I think buying a timeshare is a smart thing to do, if it suits your vacation and lifestyle, you understand the costs, and you know how to use what you are buying.

Thanks Steve. You have clarified a lot to tell us that Timesharing can be a great way to vacation … and playing the point game.
But… learn the rules to the game — whichever game you play — and WIN!!