VSN Features/Benefits Reduction and Elimination Post Abound Launch [Call to Action]

[FTEddie]

It will be nice to have the costs of these programs finally revealed. I, like others, am unsure if my resale purchased VOIs that qualify in all ways regarding VSN participation and deed dates, will require an additional sum to participate in Abound. I know what it says in the announcement, but there is just enough ambiguity to keep me wondering.
I do not think I will be required to pay more, but will be nice to have any question laid to rest.

 

[CPNY]

Since "enrolled" isn't capitalized, I doubt it is defined anywhere. Mandatory weeks are certainly in VSN, they just don't qualify for certain special benefits (like Bonvoy conversion, resort credit, etc).

post 686 shows what’s considered VSE enrolled and what isn’t. I think we all discussed that it looks like the VSE enrolled was hit with a white out pen for that unauthorized mandatory resale so we don’t know if that was just a sales tactic to try to get them to retro the unit with another purchase. I think it’s safe to say we need more clarification on what Marriott considers “enrolled”

CLOSED: Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana & Marriott Ownerships (Marriott Link + Vistana Discussion)

From the points chart, the island view has the same points as the ocean view. Not sure if they will change it later. Based on the charts, island view might get over 7k points, which will be a great points generator compared with any other Marriott resorts. Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk...

tugbbs.com

 

[wjarcher]

post 686 shows what’s considered VSE enrolled and what isn’t. I think we all discussed that it looks like the VSE enrolled was hit with a white out pen for that unauthorized mandatory resale so we don’t know if that was just a sales tactic to try to get them to retro the unit with another purchase. I think it’s safe to say we need more clarification on what Marriott considers “enrolled”

CLOSED: Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana & Marriott Ownerships (Marriott Link + Vistana Discussion)

From the points chart, the island view has the same points as the ocean view. Not sure if they will change it later. Based on the charts, island view might get over 7k points, which will be a great points generator compared with any other Marriott resorts. Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk...

tugbbs.com

View attachment 63488

It was sales tactic ("disgusting" if the owner ended up buying more to retro). On a similar printout for my Vistana weeks, all of my mandatory resales are marked as Y which matches with what is announced in terms of the enrollment eligibility

 

[FTEddie]

It was sales tactic ("disgusting" if the owner ended up buying more to retro). On a similar printout for my Vistana weeks, all of my mandatory resales are marked as Y which matches with what is announced in terms of the enrollment eligibility

One the reasons there is ambiguity. What was said in the past. Which salesman was embellishing? Maybe neither as rules were perhaps changing day to day. We don’t know what was happening internally at MVC about what VSN VOI’s would be “grandfathered” into Abound.
Will be a relief to see the final “final” rules and fees.

 

[dioxide45]

post 686 shows what’s considered VSE enrolled and what isn’t. I think we all discussed that it looks like the VSE enrolled was hit with a white out pen for that unauthorized mandatory resale so we don’t know if that was just a sales tactic to try to get them to retro the unit with another purchase. I think it’s safe to say we need more clarification on what Marriott considers “enrolled”

CLOSED: Thread Dedicated to the Upcoming/Anticipated Integration of Vistana & Marriott Ownerships (Marriott Link + Vistana Discussion)

From the points chart, the island view has the same points as the ocean view. Not sure if they will change it later. Based on the charts, island view might get over 7k points, which will be a great points generator compared with any other Marriott resorts. Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk...

tugbbs.com

View attachment 63488

I have the same sheet from one of our past presentations. For our two mandatory resales, they both indicate VSE ENROLL=N and VSE ENROLL ELIGIBLE=Y. What to take from that is anyone's guess.

 

[CPNY]

I have the same sheet from one of our past presentations. For our two mandatory resales, they both indicate VSE ENROLL=N and VSE ENROLL ELIGIBLE=Y. What to take from that is anyone's guess.

So it seems that mandatory resales aren’t actually enrolled. Then again, the 8/8 date makes me think mandatory resales will be included.

 

[dioxide45]

So it seems that mandatory resales aren’t actually enrolled. Then again, the 8/8 date makes me think mandatory resales will be included.

Perhaps.

 

[CPNY]

Perhaps.

Perhaps I have too many timeshares for what I need lol.

 

[dioxide45]

Perhaps I have too many timeshares for what I need lol.

You probably do... But can you ever have too many?

 

[CPNY]

You probably do... But can you ever have too many?

Yes yes I can lol. I’ll probably be selling this one bedroom as soon as it transfers

 

[robertk2012]

I’ll take it

Yes yes I can lol. I’ll probably be selling this one bedroom as soon as it transfers

 

[TravelTime]

It will be nice to have the costs of these programs finally revealed. I, like others, am unsure if my resale purchased VOIs that qualify in all ways regarding VSN participation and deed dates, will require an additional sum to participate in Abound. I know what it says in the announcement, but there is just enough ambiguity to keep me wondering.
I do not think I will be required to pay more, but will be nice to have any question laid to rest.

Me too. I am really wondering if there will be fees or point purchases attached to what they say is being “able to use Abound.”

 

[Grandma2016]

What also doesn't materially impact earnings or disrupt operations much is giving a handful of loyal owners an extra 2 hours in the unit on the first and/or last day of their vacation...

They may have too many Chairman to expand this benefit systemwide (presumably because of the enrolled pre-2010 Legacy week owners), but I doubt the number of 5-Star owners is as high percentagewise and they could have easily kept that benefit for Staroptions reservations within Vistana. It's almost like they don't want an MVC Chairman guest to overhear that request in the lobby and get all riled up as to why they can't get the same benefit too. Perhaps that makes more sense to them in the grand picture, but they will be alienating some people who spend a lot of money in the past... And that still doesn't excuse cutting the banking period to one year - VSN is a completely different exchange that Abound-only members can't access anyway. Staroptions are a different animal, used only at a handful or resorts, only at 8 months out and the banking rules and deadlines don't have to be the same.

Honestly the early check in and late checkout is something we will miss...it is so irritating as we have been loyal owners since it was first developed.

 

[Ken555]

Honestly the early check in and late checkout is something we will miss...it is so irritating as we have been loyal owners since it was first developed.

I’ve learned that with all travel companies, loyalty is one way only.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[TravelTime]

IMO, there are many problems with Marriott. They have a poorly trained “Wild West cowboy” salesforce that they can’t control or do not want to control. They need to start selling timeshare with honesty rather than lies.

Then they are rolling out an integrated program without any corporate marketing. They should be trying to communicate a message of how the gains of getting Abound access (more resorts, possible equivalent trades, 12 month reservation window, adding up all your ownerships for higher Abound status even if you do not convert into Club Points and a few others) offset the losses of reduced banking time.

They should also provide some rationale as to why they are making the specific changes they are making, like reduced banking time for SOs, even if it is a bit of corporate spin. I think other losses are so small as to not matter but they should explain this too.

They could also nicely market how to efficiently use Abound points to make great trades that are equivalent or better. They could develop charts and show what you can get in Abound club points vs VSN/SOs. As an Abound and Vistana owner, I know I can get great trades to stretch my Abound points. I even know you can get great trades with 2000-4000 points that are equivalent and sometimes even better than using SOs.

If they are, indeed, allowing developer purchases and resale mandatory purchases to enroll for free, they need to promote this heavily to current Vistana owners who qualify.

 

[jabberwocky]

I have the same sheet from one of our past presentations. For our two mandatory resales, they both indicate VSE ENROLL=N and VSE ENROLL ELIGIBLE=Y. What to take from that is anyone's guess.

Our profile report from our July tour shows our mandatory resale WKORV/N week as Y for both VSE ENROLL and VSE ENROLL ELIGIBLE.

We did not retro that week (only our SDO plat).

The mandatory resale is included in our total annualized election value. For this reason I think they are enrolling the mandatory resale weeks without a fee.

 

[Grandma2016]

Our profile report from our July tour shows our mandatory resale WKORV/N week as Y for both VSE ENROLL and VSE ENROLL ELIGIBLE.

We did not retro that week (only our SDO plat).

The mandatory resale is included in our total annualized election value. For this reason I think they are enrolling the mandatory resale weeks without a fee.

Thats what our report showed at our update earlier this month.

 

[FTEddie]

The more I read and absorb from these announcements, the more comfortable I am with the belief that no additional fee will be needed for VSN VOIs to be eligible to participate in Abound. Not 100% but pretty close. Will keep a positive attitude. It would not be the best marketing move by Marriott to get this far and then announce more money is needed.

 

[jabberwocky]

The more I read and absorb from these announcements, the more comfortable I am with the belief that no additional fee will be needed for VSN VOIs to be eligible to participate in Abound. Not 100% but pretty close. Will keep a positive attitude. It would not be the best marketing move by Marriott to get this far and then announce more money is needed.

Just wait. At the next sales presentation they will come up with some sort of whopper on why you need to buy more Abound points.

 

[alexadeparis]

I really can't pinpoint the reason for the 1-year banking other than aligning VSN and Abound deadlines. But it's neither here nor there... why does that even matter? They own II too and didn't make any alignments there...

With the Elite program, they probably took the view that VSN Elite was providing an incentive to sell product. If they are not selling Vistana product anymore, then VSN Elite is simply dismantled. Those who paid top dollar for some of those lost benefits will just have to live with it. Now they will upsell Abound points to get people to higher Abound Elite levels.

Per the Q&A:

The ELQC is something else. I believe it was like phantom SOs to boost you into an elite level if you were super close to being the next level without having to buy another unit. What they are saying is those would not become Abound points, just what your VOIs generate.

 

[CPNY]

It’s unfortunate that elite owners lose up to 2 months to bank star options, lose late check out/early check in, and banking time. All of that with a much higher club fee. I’m not an elite owner so this doesn’t affect me.

 

[DanCali]

The ELQC is something else. I believe it was like phantom SOs to boost you into an elite level if you were super close to being the next level without having to buy another unit. What they are saying is those would not become Abound points, just what your VOIs generate.

Read it again, and I believe you are correct! It's been a while since I saw that Phantom Staroptions term

So, if they haven't canceled the VSN Elite program they can definitely keep the benefits going...

 

[robertk2012]

I think October 31 is fair. The shortening of the time to use will be disappointing for many. For me the loss of the early checkin and late checkout hurts.

 

[DanCali]

For me the loss of the early checkin and late checkout hurts.

It is a pretty unique benefit. I didn't think much of it until buying into 5-Star but you can actually get another 1/2 day of vacation if you have the room until noon and a late afternoon flight.

Maybe the plan if to offer that benefit at the "Emperor" level - those with 25K+ points

 

[SVOTransplant]

For folks thinking VSN will always exist and Abound is just a layer… you’re probably right technically speaking. But practically, the insider is right.

Gresham’s law - Bad money drives out good money.

I own multiple weeks in Hawaii. I would never, ever, use these weeks in VSN again. Why? Because I can get two to three times the trading power of SOs by using Abound Club Points. The program will effectively remove the most valuable units from the network, dismantling it piece by piece until all that remains is a husk for legal reasons.

If tug is helping folks maximize their value, the recommendation to owners of any high value week becomes…. Use Abound to maximize what you can get for it. Beats SOs and then some. If there isn’t Abound inventory for those lower valued VSN properties, well, good thing there’s tons of other options in Abound.