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Anyone making 'sell everything' market moves?

taterhed said:
Woooo Wait!
The market is almost even and climbing!!!

Let's all run out and buy expensive champagne on our credit cards!!!
:D

Uh oh, wait....it might be dropping again. Take it back, take it back! :eek:
Click to expand...

Hell, yes !

I'm putting all my cash into timeshare futures !

What could go wrong ?

-
 
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There was an incredible half-day buying opportunity this morning. The Dow was down 1100 points shortly after the open. One financial ETF on my watch list opened 27% down and within 20 minutes was only down 5%. I just watched it, and everything else on my trading screen and missed the opportunity. I just didn't have the balls to go all in in this sort of turmoil, but that's how traders make their money. Volatility is their friend.
Missed opportunity is the story of my trading!
 
I know the feeling. Opportunity knocks- I complain about the noise.
 
Last week on Monday we sold most of our stock. I haven't even consider owning a mutual fund since 2006 or so. The reason we sold were the market indicators were looking bad. The DJT is way off. Trucking and exports are way off.


http://www.dat.com/resources/trendlines

http://wolfstreet.com/2015/08/13/us...rts-fall-off-chart-cass-inttra-ocean-freight/

Many stocks were and are nearing the death cross. The dow has accomplished this death cross last week Tuesday and foreign markets have been tanking.

For us it made sense to bail out and pursue other investments. We have been looking for something for a while and decided on a 27 kw solar system that provides a 25%+ roi and with incentives is paid off in 4 years. This also comes with a 30% federal tax credit.

Also, this year, long term capital gains are capped at 15%.

Bill
 
easyrider;1796027...... We have been looking for something for a while and decided on a 27 kw solar system that provides a 25%+ roi and with incentives is paid off in 4 years. This also comes with a 30% federal tax credit. Also said:
Bill ... did a 10KW system about 10 years ago. 50% state grant, lousy tax credits at the time (15%) .... BUT great SRECs paying $650 per each Kilowatt sent back onto the grid.

SRECs down to $140 each (make 13 per year) plus FREE electric for my roost.

No taxes on SRECs ... no taxes on FREE electric ... AM HAPPY CAMPER!
Click to expand...
 
Holding firm. Mostly in dividend stocks. If the market continues to correct I may buy more.

Also have some mutual funds in one 401k and a previously rolled over IRA. Not sure I will keep them permanently as they seem to swing more when the market is turbulent. Too many people get scared and take their money out when they need to stay put...
 
normab said:
Holding firm. Mostly in dividend stocks. If the market continues to correct I may buy more.

Also have some mutual funds in one 401k and a previously rolled over IRA. Not sure I will keep them permanently as they seem to swing more when the market is turbulent. Too many people get scared and take their money out when they need to stay put...
Click to expand...
And then how do you time the re-entry?!

If you sold last Thursday and reinvested this AM you would be doing well but who knew that.

Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk
 
SMHarman said:
And then how do you time the re-entry?!
Click to expand...
Best part of not selling: not having to figure out when to get back in.
Topped only by The True Best Part of not selling: enjoyed run-up.

Only bad part about not selling: it will take a very serious and prolonged downturn to average down in many of my holdings bought in the past 4-5 yrs. Many are still quite above 100% return. Not such a bad problem to have, but takes a lot longer to become a buyer.
 
geekette said:
Best part of not selling: not having to figure out when to get back in.
Topped only by The True Best Part of not selling: enjoyed run-up.

Only bad part about not selling: it will take a very serious and prolonged downturn to average down in many of my holdings bought in the past 4-5 yrs. Many are still quite above 100% return. Not such a bad problem to have, but takes a lot longer to become a buyer.
Click to expand...

It's easy to sell, but much more difficult to time re-entry. There was a brief golden opportunity to make quick money this morning, but markets could well turn south again by the end of the day. So, it's not for the faint of heart, or those of us that can't afford to loose what they've got.
 
Ironwood said:
It's easy to sell, but much more difficult to time re-entry. There was a brief golden opportunity to make quick money this morning, but markets could well turn south again by the end of the day. So, it's not for the faint of heart, or those of us that can't afford to loose what they've got.
Click to expand...

For me, it's easy - I own what I want to own, no reason to sell to buy back later. I am definitely one that cannot afford to lose anything, it's taken way too long to get what I have!! I don't need an absolute bottom to buy, I just need good value.

I save on broker fees and stress by owning quality companies I don't ever have to sell. Sure, maybe some day one of my companies might go bust, but it doesn't need an entire market correction to blow itself up and would show signs of deterioration in advance of BOOM.

Really, how many of the companies with suddenly lower priced stock are doomed?
 
When the masses are panic selling, that's when the smart investors are loading up.

This may or may not be the bottom, but I'm in for the long run.
 
I have my doubts about this event being a good time to buy on the drops. The only reason the markets in the US didn't do a complete tanking today was due to the "plunge protection team" getting involved, imo.

Todays point movements looked very manipulated to me. While I was watching, I had to wonder how the heck can the points move so freakishly fast up and down near closing.

Bill
 
Rolling stock loss

Almost all our investments except real estate are in stocks via ETF"S now. I have a rolling stock loss of 5% on them and if they go down 5% from their high they sell. Almost all have sold. I had this in the 2008 turndown at 10 % and sold. The problem is when to get back in. As soon as I see the Asian markets rise I will reinvest. With China having problems with growth- theirs still is 4 or 5 % and I don't think will be down much longer . might be oversold today.
I like ETF"S as costs are low and unlike mutual funds you can sell in the middle of the day. ETF"S will be getting a larger share of the market as more people understand them and more articles are written.
We have been retired almost 20 years and live comfortably from our real estate rental. retirement pensions and social security and do not need to withdraw from our stocks. When it goes down we are losing our children's inheritance and charity contributions.When it goes up it is quite the opposite.
We have been very fortunate and built and sold three homes in the San Francisco Bay which had gone up rapidly in value.
 
easyrider said:
I have my doubts about this event being a good time to buy on the drops. The only reason the markets in the US didn't do a complete tanking today was due to the "plunge protection team" getting involved, imo.

Todays point movements looked very manipulated to me. While I was watching, I had to wonder how the heck can the points move so freakishly fast up and down near closing.

Bill
Click to expand...

Most trading is done by algorithms. Almost Zero to do with the real value of an enterprise and everything to do with making money by trading. I focus on dividend paying stocks so a return is based on making money and distributing it, not ups and downs of stock price. You can't beat the high speed computer based trading.

Cheers
 
Yeah, let's sell it all, like lemmings, and lock in the losses... NOT.
But as others say, over the long haul, this too shall pass.

I did see all our contributions + gains for 2015 wiped out... too bad, so sad.
But I was already 55% in bonds + bond funds, which has softened the blow.
At least w-individual bonds, you will get your $$ back if you hold to maturity.

.
 
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x3 skier said:
Most trading is done by algorithms. Almost Zero to do with the real value of an enterprise and everything to do with making money by trading. I focus on dividend paying stocks so a return is based on making money and distributing it, not ups and downs of stock price. You can't beat the high speed computer based trading.

Cheers
Click to expand...

These freakish up and down point movement were likely caused by the 1200 times trading was halted today.

http://money.cnn.com/2015/08/24/inv...elloff-circuit-breakers-1200-times/index.html

Bill
 
I didn't even look to see what's happened to our investments today.
Luckily, our broker advised us some time ago to keep ~5 years' cash in my IRA (to supplement things like pension and SS). According to him, based on long-term history, the 5 years would likely tide you over any major crashes.

At times, I've thought that's too conservative, but it definitely does give you some peace in times like today.
 
Interesting Ride

Feel lucky because I planned well years ago in advance. Yes, lost a ton the last few days (on paper) but even those were just off my gains. Sitting where things are unless I see something cheap to buy.
House is paid for, decent pension, decent savings, quality stock holdings.
I sit back and tell my wife how many thousand we gained or lost on paper more of a game in my mind then real. Learned almost 40 years ago to not worry and just let things ride as long as you feel you own/invest in the best companies.
After 2008 we went down almost 300,000 and it all came back plus more. It might be a bumpy ride but we still get to where we are headed.
 
Why do people feel the gains or losses are just on paper until you sell. By selling you lock in a loss or a gain but they are still very much real even if you do not sell. It does make the losses easier to take but they are still losses even if it was from your earlier gains.

I do feel this is a good way to think for non liquid assets but for stocks it is a way for the heavy traders to take billions from us without us getting upset.
 
am1 said:
Why do people feel the gains or losses are just on paper until you sell. By selling you lock in a loss or a gain but they are still very much real even if you do not sell. It does make the losses easier to take but they are still losses even if it was from your earlier gains.

I do feel this is a good way to think for non liquid assets but for stocks it is a way for the heavy traders to take billions from us without us getting upset.
Click to expand...

Because it is just paper, point in time. Pick any 2 goal posts of time to determine whether you have a gain or loss. How meaningful is that?? Are you down from March or from buying 5 years ago or from a week ago?

Consider buying 100 shs of Stock X at any price. Price goes up, you have 100 shs, price goes down, you have 100 shs. Where is the loss??

Only by selling those 100 shs do you make anything "real". Everything else is just normal market gyrations usually having nothing to do with the quality of the company you own, and not stealing shs from you. Adding, maybe, via dividend reinvestment.

I have super long haul mindset, these things are very easy for me to tune out with decades of experience. Being a dividend investor, market bottoms are welcomed because for me, more shares = better, no matter the price.
 
I understand all that you are saying. But a $50 000 loss on "paper" or for "real" is still $50 000.

I do believe it is to the heavy traders advantage for us to brush off paper losses.

I am against government control but would be for a way for stocks to be valued based on the company being traded and not on how one can make money buying and selling shares. Not sure if it is possible and a large portion would be against it. Possibly very high capital gains on short term trades or not allowing capital losses on short term trades.

geekette said:
Because it is just paper, point in time. Pick any 2 goal posts of time to determine whether you have a gain or loss. How meaningful is that?? Are you down from March or from buying 5 years ago or from a week ago?

Consider buying 100 shs of Stock X at any price. Price goes up, you have 100 shs, price goes down, you have 100 shs. Where is the loss??

Only by selling those 100 shs do you make anything "real". Everything else is just normal market gyrations usually having nothing to do with the quality of the company you own, and not stealing shs from you. Adding, maybe, via dividend reinvestment.

I have super long haul mindset, these things are very easy for me to tune out with decades of experience. Being a dividend investor, market bottoms are welcomed because for me, more shares = better, no matter the price.
Click to expand...
 
I think the problem arises when you HAVE to sell- like if you are using the money for your retirement income. Can't live just on Social Security. Think of the people who only have one social security check and live in a state like NY or California!

The other issue is- it is possible for stocks./mutual funds to go to "0". Then what?
 
easyrider said:
These freakish up and down point movement were likely caused by the 1200 times trading was halted today.

http://money.cnn.com/2015/08/24/inv...elloff-circuit-breakers-1200-times/index.html

Bill
Click to expand...

Cause or effect? The halts are to prevent the type of gyrations caused by rapid trading.

As I suggested, the advent of rapid trading via high speed computers makes things like this happen and leads to lots of money for the high speed trading firms to the detriment of others.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/historic-profits-for-high-frequency-trading-firm-today-1440446251

Sorry but to read the whole article you have to have a subscription but the teaser gives the gist of the story.

Cheers
 
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