Newport Coast Villas 2012 MF... % change?

[l2trade]

Just got my NCV 2012 MF online today:

Fiscal Year Description Due Date Amount Due
2012 Operating Fee 2012-01-06 704.48
2012 Reserve Fee 2012-01-06 197.34
Total Charges $901.82

Does anyone have historical MF totals for this resort?

 

[dmharris]

No, but that's cheaper than Grande Vista in Orlando with no ocean view. But then, Florida does invite hurricanes on a regular basis. On the other hand, California has a penchant for earthquakes. (See me arguing with myself?).

 

[chalee94]

looks like your 2012 number doesn't include taxes. but still a small increase IMO...

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=133029&page=3

Newport Coast 2011

2011 Reserve Fee 2011-01-07 163.20
2011 Operating Fee 2011-01-07 714.54
Total Charges 877.74
Taxes 147.36
Total $1025.10


SubTotal 2010 - 862
Taxes $147.54
Total $1009.54

2011 increase 1.46%

 

[ajlm33]

looks like your 2012 number doesn't include taxes. but still a small increase IMO...

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=133029&page=3

Hooray for small increases (<2%) :whoopie:

Thank you HOA !!!

 

[l2trade]

looks like your 2012 number doesn't include taxes. but still a small increase IMO...

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=133029&page=3

I didn't include taxes because they are billed separately and vary GREATLY by owner due to crazy unintended consequences of prop 13. My taxes were less than $60 bucks on the last villa I bought. If resale prices continue to fall, perhaps I should sell one villa and buy another just to lower my taxes?

 

[camachinist]

If you don't mind the process, the Orange County tax assessor has a procedure for property tax relief. It might be more frustrating but potentially less costly than selling and buying.

Thanks for the info on the MF's. To me, that's surprising, since I was expecting a hike after they built out and the subsidy tapered off.

 

[MOXJO7282]

Very pleased with this. Let's hope this is a trend.

Last 3 years MFs without taxes are
2010 - $862
2011 - $877
2012 - $901

This resort seems to be managed well.

 

[dioxide45]

2011 MFs are in this thread.

Newport Coast is post 67.

 

[camachinist]

As a point of past reference, when we bought in 2004, the NCV MF's were 633.54 per week, indicating a ~70% increase in 8 occupancy years.

 

[jimf41]

As a point of past reference, when we bought in 2004, the NCV MF's were 633.54 per week, indicating a ~70% increase in 8 occupancy years.

A little more accurate description would be to say that you've had a 5.15% increase in each of the last 8 years. That's pretty good IMO.

If you had a 70% increase in MF your bill this year would be $1127 instead of $901

 

[camachinist]

What's 633 divided by 901?

633/901 = 70.37

I'm looking at the aggregate change, irrespective of inflation. I'm not looking at the creative methods accountants use to 'look at' numbers. My dad did that professionally. I'm simply looking at what I paid then and what I pay now and the difference. It's 70.37% more. A 100% increase would be twice 633, or 1266. Pretty simple.

What was the rate of inflation in each of the last eight years?

Year 	Jan 	Feb 	Mar 	Apr 	May 	Jun 	Jul 	Aug 	Sep 	Oct 	Nov 	Dec 	Ave
2011 	1.6 	2.1 	2.7 	3.2 	3.6 	3.6 	3.6 	3.8 	3.9 	  	  	  	 
2010 	2.6 	2.1 	2.3 	2.2 	2.0 	1.1 	1.2 	1.1 	1.1 	1.2 	1.1 	1.5 	1.6
2009 	0 	0.2 	-0.4 	-0.7 	-1.3 	-1.4 	-2.1 	-1.5 	-1.3 	-0.2 	1.8 	2.7 	-0.4
2008 	4.3 	4 	4 	3.9 	4.2 	5.0 	5.6 	5.4 	4.9 	3.7 	1.1 	0.1 	3.8
2007 	2.1 	2.4 	2.8 	2.6 	2.7 	2.7 	2.4 	2 	2.8 	3.5 	4.3 	4.1 	2.8
2006 	4 	3.6 	3.4 	3.5 	4.2 	4.3 	4.1 	3.8 	2.1 	1.3 	2 	2.5 	3.2
2005 	3 	3 	3.1 	3.5 	2.8 	2.5 	3.2 	3.6 	4.7 	4.3 	3.5 	3.4 	3.4
2004 	1.9 	1.7 	1.7 	2.3 	3.1 	3.3 	3 	2.7 	2.5 	3.2 	3.5 	3.3 	2.7
2003 	2.6 	3 	3 	2.2 	2.1 	2.1 	2.1 	2.2 	2.3 	2 	1.8 	1.9 	2.3
2002 	1.1 	1.1 	1.5 	1.6 	1.2 	1.1 	1.5 	1.8 	1.5 	2 	2.2 	2.4 	1.6
2001 	3.7 	3.5 	2.9 	3.3 	3.6 	3.2 	2.7 	2.7 	2.6 	2.1 	1.9 	1.6 	2.8
2000 	2.7 	3.2 	3.8 	3.1 	3.2 	3.7 	3.7 	3.4 	3.5 	3.4 	3.4 	3.4 	3.4
1999 	1.7 	1.6 	1.7 	2.3 	2.1 	2 	2.1 	2.3 	2.6 	2.6 	2.6 	2.7 	2.2

 

[windje2000]

What's 633 divided by 901?

633/901 = 70.37

I'm looking at the aggregate change, irrespective of inflation. I'm not looking at the creative methods accountants use to 'look at' numbers. My dad did that professionally. I'm simply looking at what I paid then and what I pay now and the difference. It's 70.37% more. A 100% increase would be twice 633, or 1266. Pretty simple.

What was the rate of inflation in each of the last eight years?

Year 	Jan 	Feb 	Mar 	Apr 	May 	Jun 	Jul 	Aug 	Sep 	Oct 	Nov 	Dec 	Ave
2011 	1.6 	2.1 	2.7 	3.2 	3.6 	3.6 	3.6 	3.8 	3.9 	  	  	  	 
2010 	2.6 	2.1 	2.3 	2.2 	2.0 	1.1 	1.2 	1.1 	1.1 	1.2 	1.1 	1.5 	1.6
2009 	0 	0.2 	-0.4 	-0.7 	-1.3 	-1.4 	-2.1 	-1.5 	-1.3 	-0.2 	1.8 	2.7 	-0.4
2008 	4.3 	4 	4 	3.9 	4.2 	5.0 	5.6 	5.4 	4.9 	3.7 	1.1 	0.1 	3.8
2007 	2.1 	2.4 	2.8 	2.6 	2.7 	2.7 	2.4 	2 	2.8 	3.5 	4.3 	4.1 	2.8
2006 	4 	3.6 	3.4 	3.5 	4.2 	4.3 	4.1 	3.8 	2.1 	1.3 	2 	2.5 	3.2
2005 	3 	3 	3.1 	3.5 	2.8 	2.5 	3.2 	3.6 	4.7 	4.3 	3.5 	3.4 	3.4
2004 	1.9 	1.7 	1.7 	2.3 	3.1 	3.3 	3 	2.7 	2.5 	3.2 	3.5 	3.3 	2.7
2003 	2.6 	3 	3 	2.2 	2.1 	2.1 	2.1 	2.2 	2.3 	2 	1.8 	1.9 	2.3
2002 	1.1 	1.1 	1.5 	1.6 	1.2 	1.1 	1.5 	1.8 	1.5 	2 	2.2 	2.4 	1.6
2001 	3.7 	3.5 	2.9 	3.3 	3.6 	3.2 	2.7 	2.7 	2.6 	2.1 	1.9 	1.6 	2.8
2000 	2.7 	3.2 	3.8 	3.1 	3.2 	3.7 	3.7 	3.4 	3.5 	3.4 	3.4 	3.4 	3.4
1999 	1.7 	1.6 	1.7 	2.3 	2.1 	2 	2.1 	2.3 	2.6 	2.6 	2.6 	2.7 	2.2

The calculation is the increase (in dollars) over the original amount (in dollars) or

($901-$633) = $268

$268/$633 = ~42%

That's the same as 901 over 633. That amounts to 1.42 or 42% more.

(I think you reversed the numerator and denominator when you used 633 over 901.)

The growth rate is 4.5125% per annum -- compounded annually over 8 years

 

[camachinist]

Yes, correct. I did that. It should have been 901-633/633 for the aggregate. My apologies.

On the positive side, the thread caused me to look at inflation numbers and how the MF's correlate. That's good information.

I will say I'm going to be scrutinizing the annual reports more closely now that I have time to do it and comparing to on-site inspections by myself and tenants, whose feedback has been invaluable over the last couple years. Since Marriott/Spinco owns a huge block of NCV, it'll be interesting to watch on both the fronts of MF's, since the trust has to pay them too, as well as on what and how the money is being spent.

What I've seen is, in aggregate, those MF's have been increasing and rental rates have been declining, both on the private and Marriott side. I just looked at a villa for next Saturday for a week and can get it on MARSHA for 175.00/nt, or 1225 + tax (about 17.50 per night) for the week. That's actually about the same as what I pay in MF's and property taxes, since my taxes are higher due to buying developer and platinum RE taxes are higher than gold. Interesting numbers.

 

[ScubaKat]

I wonder if anyone has been tracking historic hotel room rate changes and how that would compare to the increase in MFs?

 

[jimf41]

I wonder if anyone has been tracking historic hotel room rate changes and how that would compare to the increase in MFs?

From the American hotel and lodging industry website:

THE LODGING INDUSTRY
The average room rate was $98.07 in 2010 - down from $97.85 in 2009. The average room rate was $107.18 in 2008, $104.24 in 2007, $97.97 in 2006, $91.06 in 2005, $86.26 in 2004, $82.80 in 2003, $82.68 in 2002, $83.91 in 2001, and $85.11 in 2000.

 

[jimf41]

Yes, correct. I did that. It should have been 901-633/633 for the aggregate. My apologies.

No apology necessary for me. I've made my share of goofball math errors on this site.

 

[ScubaKat]

So taking the info from the 2010 thread for historic MFs for Manor Club compared to the average room rate... this is what it looks like... :ignore:

Of course this does not include other facts that I would much rather be in a timeshare unit than a hotel room... but I just wanted to see trends..

From the American hotel and lodging industry website:

THE LODGING INDUSTRY
The average room rate was $98.07 in 2010 - down from $97.85 in 2009. The average room rate was $107.18 in 2008, $104.24 in 2007, $97.97 in 2006, $91.06 in 2005, $86.26 in 2004, $82.80 in 2003, $82.68 in 2002, $83.91 in 2001, and $85.11 in 2000.

 

[Superchief]

Don't forget hotel tax and parking

For hotel rooms. don't forget to add taxes, parking, and internet fees. Most taxes have increased because localities like to tax outsiders who don't vote (see rental cars), and parking often excedes $20 per day at resorts.