"You Cannot Do Good Business With Bad People" - Warren Buffet

[TolmiePeak]

I agree with the Original Poster.

Marriott Vacation Club has turned into a highly suspect, unscrupulous enterprise.

I believe the current leadership of MVC/MVW will do all that they can to screw MVC Owners, and to take advantage of them.

If you are an earlier purchaser of MVC timeshare, you were likely told about "Mr. Marriott's values being the foundation of MVC." What a lie that turned out to be.

It is just companies following the American Way. Disney is pretty much runs the same way now.

 

[Dean]

So BG works much the same as HGVC and Vistana.

Similar. If one has VIP status they can request a points reservation early but it's not confirmed NOW until the time has passed for the owners of the weeks themselves have not done so. I can request up to 15 months out but I don't get the confirmation until generally after close on the last day members could select their underlying week which have a set check in date. I've never not gotten my request when done this way. There's a 2 night minimum except for Lodge Alley Inn Charleston which only has a 1 night minimum and La Cabana in Aruba which has a 3 night minimum. I can also reserve on cash at 48 days out except for La Cabana which is 90 days out. For high end options like high demand times and Presidential weeks, using cash and canceling to get the points back is a great deal, esp since I get 10 free cancelations a year.

 

[ljmiii]

I'm not convinced, it might be better if there were more people enrolled, but still lacking. While Club points do seem to work well for people, they are terrible value relative to using MVC weeks in II....

There is no doubt that many people like yourself who find that II works for them would continue to use it. Nor is there doubt that people would continue to complain about the 'skim' and that their deed isn't sufficiently valued in points compared to its 'real' value.

Or for that matter that demand would continue to outstrip supply in places like the Caribbean and that Orlando would still have excess inventory. But systems where everyone can trade for points do have better points inventory than ones that don't.

 

[Dean]

There is no doubt that many people like yourself who find that II works for them would continue to use it. Nor is there doubt that people would continue to complain about the 'skim' and that their deed isn't sufficiently valued in points compared to its 'real' value.

Or for that matter that demand would continue to outstrip supply in places like the Caribbean and that Orlando would still have excess inventory. But systems where everyone can trade for points do have better points inventory than ones that don't.

Piggy Backing off your post. I'm always amused by the skim issue and the consternation over it. No one has to participate if they don't want to. The reality is that every points system must have a way to absorb orphaned days or to control them in some way. Having floating weeks and converting to a points system offers some challenges in this area compared to systems that either started as a points system like DVC where this was built in up front or systems where the underling week is fixed as noted above and thus the options for reserving on points are also locked in to those fixed weeks. Plus if almost everyone ends up in points, it doesn't matter. With MVC having a hybrid where there are a lot of points and a lot of weeks being used, it's a bigger challenge. It also gives the opportunity to adjust the seasonable demand based on a ton of data. IMO the bigger issue isn't the skim but rather the degree of discrepancy between properties. This is an issue that will never be solved so we have to decide whether to suck it up or vote with our feet and $$$ and move on.

 

[WBP]

Rest assured, no monies from MVC sales are being used to keep resorts up to Marriott standards. MF pays for all of that.

In the places where MVC generates revenue, at MVC resorts, e.g. Marketplace, food and beverage outlets, I wonder who pays to capitalize those MVC profit-generating operations (profit generating for MVC, not for the HOA or timeshare owners). Capitalize, as in physical plant improvements, etc.

 

[WBP]

It is just companies following the American Way. Disney is pretty much runs the same way now.

I believe Disney, at Disney Vacation Club, does a superior job to Marriott Vacation Club. We are Marriott loyalists, and brand loyal to Marriott, and grateful of the job that Marriott Resort Operations leadership and their teams do, however, there is something very wrong with the people at the top of MVC/MVW, in my opinion, as evidenced by their latest move RE “Guests of Owner,” inside of 30 days, prior to check-in.

 

[jwalk03]

In the places where MVC generates revenue, at MVC resorts, e.g. Marketplace, food and beverage outlets, I wonder who pays to capitalize those MVC profit-generating operations (profit generating for MVC, not for the HOA or timeshare owners). Capitalize, as in physical plant improvements, etc.

Ocean Pointe is building a new poolside restaurant right now. They discussed it at the owners welcome breakfast when I was there 2 weeks ago- and said that all of the funds for the construction are coming from MVC. No HOA money is being used.

 

[Dean]

I believe Disney, at Disney Vacation Club, does a superior job to Marriott Vacation Club. We are Marriott loyalists, and brand loyal to Marriott, and grateful of the job that Marriott Resort Operations leadership and their teams do, however, there is something very wrong with the people at the top of MVC/MVW, in my opinion, as evidenced by their latest move RE “Guests of Owner,” inside of 30 days, prior to check-in.

DVC has also seen a decline in how they handled things on the sales side as well as how they treat resale owners and owners in general. They are still the top but not as solid as they once were. I think this started with the 08/09 downturn and sales fell off.

 

[frank808]

Ocean Pointe is building a new poolside restaurant right now. They discussed it at the owners welcome breakfast when I was there 2 weeks ago- and said that all of the funds for the construction are coming from MVC. No HOA money is being used.

MVC is probably going to lease the space out and collect rent. Or run the restaurany and not have to pay any lease. Probably the HOA is not going to see any monies from this space. So generous of MVC!

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[sponger76]

So BG works much the same as HGVC and Vistana.

Except all BG Priority Use Periods are for a fixed week and unit. There are no floating weeks, you either use your PUP or you are essentially electing poibts.

 

[dioxide45]

Except all BG Priority Use Periods are for a fixed week and unit.

True, I am mainly speaking to the automatic conversion of unreserved or unconfirmed inventory to Club use at some date in time.

 

[jwalk03]

MVC is probably going to lease the space out and collect rent. Or run the restaurany and not have to pay any lease. Probably the HOA is not going to see any monies from this space. So generous of MVC!

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Looking at the original condo docs. The restaurant space in question is listed as "reserved for the exclusive use of the developer." So it is their space to use as they see fit- but they are required to "pay for all expenses of maintaining, repairing, and operating the commercial unit." They also "Shall share in the Condominium Common Expenses"

 

[Dean]

Except all BG Priority Use Periods are for a fixed week and unit. There are no floating weeks, you either use your PUP or you are essentially electing poibts.

True, as I noted, although they do not restrict reservations to just that unit/week alone if the same unit type is available consecutively like Wyndham tends to do.

 

[frank808]

Looking at the original condo docs. The restaurant space in question is listed as "reserved for the exclusive use of the developer." So it is there space to use as they see fit- but they are required to "pay for all expenses of maintaining, repairing, and operating the commercial unit." They also "Shall share in the Condominium Common Expenses"


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So MVC basically put a positive spin on nothing. We are doing this and members should be happy because "no funds from HOA" to build it. So generous of MVC to use their own funds for their sole benefit.


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[Johncavmusic]

Many threads describe the lies, manipulation and deception of MVC sales team. Other threads describe MVC actions that take rights away from owners; like the new push for using a guest form more than 30 days ahead.

If you are reading here on TUG you should know that most MVC sales[people are Bad People. You should realize that MVC management is frequently making rules that harm owners (They really screwed us at Hyatt Coconut)

The obvious direction is to stop buying ANYTHING directly from MVC. You can buy secondary deeded weeks, secondary Points, rent on Redweek, rent points transferred into your account (vacationpointexchange.com). Just stop buying directly from MVC. They will lie to you about what you are getting. They will cheat you by omitting important facts.

I would also say stop taking those sales tours with juicy bonuses. The signup bonuses are not free. MVC sales people confuse and minipulate people into buying. One day you will be the sucker that falls for a new trick.

Yes, I have become angry at the lies, manipulation and rules changes. But, you can PM me if you want to know what I really think.

Please post the lies you were told!

I sat down at a sales meeting on July 27th at the Sheraton Broadway Resort in Myrtle Beach. What started out as a great deal, slowly morphed into a different deal. They bought back our two TS and sold us an all new FLEX TS with the extra points. But afterwards we found out that we lost all our pts for 2025, because the new Pts doesn't start until 2026. I have 10 days to rescind and will do so tomorrow. And then when we had time to breathe, we found out that we paid a premium for less points than we had purchased a year ago........I am doing some research today on what advantages we picked up by going to all 'FLEX' and will decide by tomorrow on whether to rescind the whole deal. Right now, we are heavily leaning to rescind!!

 

[dioxide45]

I sat down at a sales meeting on July 27th at the Sheraton Broadway Resort in Myrtle Beach. What started out as a great deal, slowly morphed into a different deal. They bought back our two TS and sold us an all new FLEX TS with the extra points. But afterwards we found out that we lost all our pts for 2025, because the new Pts doesn't start until 2026. I have 10 days to rescind and will do so tomorrow.

What two timeshares did you already own?

 

[Superchief]

I sat down at a sales meeting on July 27th at the Sheraton Broadway Resort in Myrtle Beach. What started out as a great deal, slowly morphed into a different deal. They bought back our two TS and sold us an all new FLEX TS with the extra points. But afterwards we found out that we lost all our pts for 2025, because the new Pts doesn't start until 2026. I have 10 days to rescind and will do so tomorrow. And then when we had time to breathe, we found out that we paid a premium for less points than we had purchased a year ago........I am doing some research today on what advantages we picked up by going to all 'FLEX' and will decide by tomorrow on whether to rescind the whole deal. Right now, we are heavily leaning to rescind!!

We had a similar experience in Hilton Head at Ocean Pointe sales center. We were trying to get rid of some high MF, low point weeks but they added double the points we needed and at a much higher cost. Sales manager was a total liar and his numbers didn't match the contract proposal. We rescinded immediately the next day after I had a chance to look at the details.

 

[4Reliefnow]

Your username is suspicious. If someone PM's you, are you going to have an exit service to sell?

My regular user name is known to MVC. I think it is best to use this pseudonym when calling them bastards and liars. I am not selling any exit service (you hurt my feelings). I have helped three friends dispose of weeks at Hyatt (Coconut Cove and Pinion Point), Westin and MVC (Timber Lodge and Sabal Palms). Thousands of MVC owners want out, and the suckers who bought points retail are the hardest hit. I also advise people at my home resort. I don't own like rickandcindy, but I am in the top 2% (4 resorts over a dozen weeks plus points)

 

[4Reliefnow]

IF, big IF, Marriott decides to let us all bring our deeded resale weeks after 2010 (whatever the date was), would you even do it? Would you say, "Okay, I will convert my Marriott's Willow Ridge (Shadow Ridge, Grand Chateau) to Marriott because you are offering to do it free." Or would you say, "No thank you because the ongoing added cost to me is not worth it."

Would it depend on how many weeks you could enroll for free?

What would make you bound (jump) into Abound with both feet and without worrying about remorse later on?

They have a program to enroll secondary market weeks. Just buy 5,000 points ($70,000) to enroll five weeks. That is common at Grand Residences to enroll a secondary fraction. I have assisted a GR owner in dumping his 5,000 points. MVC Should have an open buy back for points, say 40% of market. The gimmick is to get an owner to sell at $3 and use ROFR or give up and give the points to MVC for free.

 

[Dean]

They have a program to enroll secondary market weeks. Just buy 5,000 points ($70,000) to enroll five weeks. That is common at Grand Residences to enroll a secondary fraction. I have assisted a GR owner in dumping his 5,000 points. MVC Should have an open buy back for points, say 40% of market. The gimmick is to get an owner to sell at $3 and use ROFR or give up and give the points to MVC for free.

The market is closer to $3 a point so 40% of that is pretty low. The actual value of the points is far less than 40% of the list price.

 

[wuv pooh]

So MVC basically put a positive spin on nothing. We are doing this and members should be happy because "no funds from HOA" to build it. So generous of MVC to use their own funds for their sole benefit.


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Well some people b*tch that Marriott is using HOA money and stealing the revenue. That is false. So:

Other people b*itch that Marriott is using their own property to try and make themselves a profit and are not being "generous" to the owners.

Guess Marriott has to deal with bad (by OP definition) people also.

I personally don't want to be in the restaurant business, but am very happy for Marriott to provide dining options that are convenient to the resorts while they or their partners take the risk.