Westin Lagunamar: Chair Hogs, and the lack of seating at the pools

[zentraveler]

Psychiatrist here and I could speculate for a while about the psychological rationale about this pool chair nonsense (hint - it is not about the pool chairs): sense of power, sense of control, competitive advantage, pissed off at someone else... take your pick.

But none of that helps the OP, and blahblah18, I feel immensely sorry for you and your family just trying to occupy chairs for your real, present family - or BIS, butts in seats, what FlyerTalk calls actual flyers rather than people with multiple credit cards as is the love of the airlines these days. People like these chair hogs (which are among the worst I have read on TUG) make the other decent people infuriated for good reason, and they never end up in my office wondering why they do such selfish, hurtful things to others. For no rational reason.

But I do appreciate your idea about throwing items in the pool . True story: we flew to Costa Rica to a very nice resort years ago and arrived hot and tired after a day of travel. We went down to the pool to cool off and there was a woman in the pool talking loudly on her cell phone in this gorgeous, peaceful setting. I tolerated it for a while and finally said to my husband, in what I thought was an out of hearing range comment, "I swear, if she doesn't stop talking I am going to throw that phone in the pool". She quietly stopped talking and started to enjoy the pool. (That will likely not work for the folks you are dealing with but...)

 

[PamMo]

We’ve been to resorts that strictly enforced a rule that one person can hold two chairs - but only if somebody is physically present in one of the loungers. There were plenty of chairs for everyone. It was wonderful!

We’ve also been at other resorts (WKORVN was the worst) where we had to leave our towels on the pool deck while we swam, while 90% of the deck chairs were “occupied” by ghosts.

 

[bizaro86]

The best way to get anything changed at a TS resorts is to complain about it to sales.

If multiple people at Lagunamar tell salespeople they aren't interested in buying because the lack of pool chairs/pool chair enforcement is wrecking the resort experience it'll get fixed.

 

[Superchief]

We’ve been to resorts that strictly enforced a rule that one person can hold two chairs - but only if somebody is physically present in one of the loungers. There were plenty of chairs for everyone. It was wonderful!

We’ve also been at other resorts (WKORVN was the worst) where we had to leave our towels on the pool deck while we swam, while 90% of the deck chairs were “occupied” by ghosts.

I think this rule is fair and reasonable. If a group wants to hold four lounge chairs, then two people need to be present. I also think four lounge chairs per group should be the limit unless they are actually occupying the chairs.

 

[jp10558]

I guess I have no idea what the chairs are for, and we're lucky that we go off season and later in the day and tend to see a sea of empty chairs... Are you supposed to like tan on the chair or something? If so, I would think it should be like a restaurant table - you're not tanning, you're not keeping the chair. If you're in the pool, what do you need a chair for? If you're not currently in the chair, or maybe a 10 minute bathroom break, what do you need a chair for? If it was me, I wouldn't go through all this tagging stuff, I'd say if there's junk on a chair, and no person in it, that junk goes to lost and found.

 

[dioxide45]

I guess I have no idea what the chairs are for, and we're lucky that we go off season and later in the day and tend to see a sea of empty chairs... Are you supposed to like tan on the chair or something? If so, I would think it should be like a restaurant table - you're not tanning, you're not keeping the chair. If you're in the pool, what do you need a chair for? If you're not currently in the chair, or maybe a 10 minute bathroom break, what do you need a chair for? If it was me, I wouldn't go through all this tagging stuff, I'd say if there's junk on a chair, and no person in it, that junk goes to lost and found.

People like to get out of the pool for a while and sit, dry off, perhaps have a drink or some snacks. Some people get in the pool for a while, then get out and sit on the chair. Some people stay in the pool longer than on the chair. Some longer on the chair than in the pool As long as you are actively at the pool, then all should be good.

Perhaps this is something that the so called AI could be used for. Setup some cameras and have the cameras monitor the chairs. A software algorithm should be able to highlight the chairs on a TV screen if no one has had a butt in the seat for x amount of time. Then someone can go check on the chair. No sensors needed. If a traffic camera can sense a car in a lane to change traffic signals, then this is something that could be accomplished. This would also help with those lazy people that just leave their wet towels behind on a chair too. Those people irk me also!

We also go down to the pools late and stay in the off season. So this doesn't impact us as much. Though it can be a real issue for destination resorts like Lagunamar. The pool is where everything is at. Go down mid afternoon and the chairs are all taken. It only starts to dwindle around 4pm.

 

[Ken555]

Perhaps this is something that the so called AI could be used for. Setup some cameras and have the cameras monitor the chairs. A software algorithm should be able to highlight the chairs on a TV screen if no one has had a butt in the seat for x amount of time. Then someone can go check on the chair. No sensors needed. If a traffic camera can sense a car in a lane to change traffic signals, then this is something that could be accomplished. This would also help with those lazy people that just leave their wet towels behind on a chair too. Those people irk me also!

That's an interesting thought! Would you be okay with your maintenance fees going up to cover this system?

On a more serious note, do you think these resorts and their parent companies would be able to manage facial recognition properly, considering the inherent privacy concerns? Personally, I have my doubts, especially since they’ve struggled to get our reservation system working reliably after all this time.

When I last visited WKORV I was up at 6am or so every morning for a walk. Each day I saw the same man holding six chairs in a prime location reading his book or on his phone. My unit looked out over this area and he was alone past noon on the days I checked. Until and unless people are financially impacted, or perhaps otherwise inconvenienced, I doubt they will change their ways.

FWIW, I really like the idea of limiting holding chairs to two per person.

Now if the resorts would only enforce a policy.

 

[dioxide45]

That's an interesting thought! Would you be okay with your maintenance fees going up to cover this system?

Perhaps the added costs could be offset by having fewer pool concierges to monitor the chair situation. Though we know Marriott doesn't play that way. They just add more things and don't reduce staff to off set it. Reduced staff in Mexico probably wouldn't have a significant impact anyway give that wages are lower. Though it could help for US based resorts. Though I find little to no enforcement of chair policies at US based resorts.

 

[daviator]

I suspect that some people reserve more chairs than they will need just because they don't want to sit next to any stranger. So it's even worse than blocking chairs for family members who are unlikely to show up, it's just pure selfishness, at least in some cases.

When nobody is around the "reserved" chairs, I have no qualms with removing the towels and items and moving them or handing them to a staff member to go in the lost and found. If the person or people ever show up – which rarely happens – I just say that the chairs were unoccupied when we sat down, and that they should probably ask the staff to see if they have their items. I don't want a confrontation so I feign ignorance.

 

[grgs]

I guess I have no idea what the chairs are for, and we're lucky that we go off season and later in the day and tend to see a sea of empty chairs... Are you supposed to like tan on the chair or something? If so, I would think it should be like a restaurant table - you're not tanning, you're not keeping the chair. If you're in the pool, what do you need a chair for?

At Lagunamar, my husband and I typically spend most of the day poolside. We've done most of day trip sight seeing on earlier trips. We're coming now for warm weather and relaxing. We're early risers, so we can usually get a couple of chairs that will work out. We're usually at the chairs most of the time, but we'll go in the pool to cool off, walk a bit, etc. Usually one of us stays at the chairs, though.

We'll be here next week, too, so we'll see how it goes once the Week 52 folks leave.

If anyone wants to chat, send me a PM. It's nice to meet other tuggers. : )

 

[blahblah18]

Today’s anecdote from Lagunamar:

Was beside a woman this morning who was grumbling about concierge enforcement…

“I mean I get I was only one person holding seven lounge chairs, but…”

She was keeping 7 unoccupied chairs from being used by any guests. And the concierge request to let others be able to use them annoyed her.

You can’t make this $&@@ up. Unbelievable.

But at least it means the concierges are trying to do something, at least when it’s blatantly obvious.

 

[PcflEZFlng]

We used to own WLR, but we never actually went there; we bought it for and used it as a trader within Vistana, which worked out well for us. Had we ever gone, the pool would have been the main attraction for us. Given all the chair hog complaints I keep reading about, it doesn't seem we missed much!

 

[jp10558]

We also go down to the pools late and stay in the off season. So this doesn't impact us as much. Though it can be a real issue for destination resorts like Lagunamar. The pool is where everything is at. Go down mid afternoon and the chairs are all taken. It only starts to dwindle around 4pm.

Ahh, this at least partially explains it then - I haven't been to a "pool is where everything is at" location yet, and we tend to work during the day or go out to see the sights, shop, eat, etc. So often 6PM is the earliest we would get to the pool, except for my BIL, who only wants a place to keep his phone and towel, so setting it near the pool or in a locker is fine. I wonder how many people just setting a towel and say flip flops down would just as well use a locker if they existed? (IDK if Langunamar has lockers too). I think at the very least "no holding chairs for someone else" for more than maybe 10 minutes (run to the restroom or go get a drink) would be reasonable.

And with lockers, if you're in the pool for an hour or two, I don't really personally see the issue in finding another chair when you decide to get out vs holding a chair for the day. I'm also very tempted to consider financial / tech systems as these get ever smaller and cheaper. Maybe something like those light switches in some hotels where the only way to "save a chair" is to have a keycard in the top of the chair that's easily visible to everyone, and every 30 minutes it's in the chair it charges the room $50(increasing with inflation or MFs) to pay for the system, discourage chair hogging, and offset MFs. If you're personally sitting in the chair, you don't need a card as you're not "saving" the chair, you're using it. If you're gone for 20 minutes using the restroom or pool no charge. If you want to hold it all day you pay $$$ for the rental at that point. I guess we don't even need to limit the cards per person, they can pay $100 an hour for how many ever chairs they'd like to be empty for some reason. And any chair with stuff on it without a card it's fine to remove the stuff to a lost and found bucket and start using it yourself or put your own card in.

People using the chairs responsibly have near 0 extra cost or hassle really. People who actually want to keep strangers away or have a bunch of chairs "just in case" pay for the privilege (and I'll bet there's going to be a lot less people wanting to pay $300-$600 an hour for 4-7 chairs as suggested up here for 6 days in addition to getting up at 6am). This would also enable a basically "live view" of occupied or free chairs on a website and screens kind of like the parking sensors in newer garages that tell you if there are free spaces on a level, how many, and have a green or red light you can see down the rows.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Today’s anecdote from Lagunamar:

Was beside a woman this morning who was grumbling about concierge enforcement…

“I mean I get I was only one person holding seven lounge chairs, but…”

She was keeping 7 unoccupied chairs from being used by any guests. And the concierge request to let others be able to use them annoyed her.

You can’t make this $&@@ up. Unbelievable.

But at least it means the concierges are trying to do something, at least when it’s blatantly obvious.

I am glad they are guilting her.

Why not create a rule that you can only hold a maximum of one extra chair per person present? My family has been known to share chairs to put their towels while they play in the pool.

 

[blahblah18]

Another example fresh from Lagunamar this afternoon…

(I realize I’m beating a dead horse now, but humor me)

We arrived at the pool a little after 9am.

It is currently 2:12 pm.

This sweet set-up had been blocked off by a Hog when we arrived at 9am. As of right now - a full 5 hours later - nobody has ever been here. Not once.

They hogged what is easentially a private cabana with shade for the day — but never used it.

Two towels + one bag of beach toys enjoyed some deluxe pool accommodations all day.

No concierge enforcement. The space is about 20 steps from a towel hut.

It is not my job as a customer to monitor this, nor to request enforcement, nor to demand that staff do what they are supposed to do.

And in spite of a strong desire, I managed to not fling all of their “hogging props” into the nearest garbage can.

 

[WorldT]

Does this have an option for reservations? Did they have to pay to keep this? If no, I will have a hard time not getting those things moved.

 

[dioxide45]

Does this have an option for reservations? Did they have to pay to keep this? If no, I will have a hard time not getting those things moved.

No options to rent cabanas at Lagunamar. They are all first come first serve.

This one isn't as bothersome as very few people use those chairs far away from the pool. Still, they shouldn't leave their stuff there all day. They could have just come down at 2:30pm and it would probably still be open.

 

[blahblah18]

This one isn't as bothersome as very few people use those chairs far away from the pool

The rules should apply everywhere. Common decency towards others should apply everywhere. The location of the lounger isn’t really relevant.

And for what it’s worth, some would think they’re a great location given that they provide some nice shade.

 

[Tucsonadventurer]

We can typically get spots by the beach when the pool is full and just walk back and forth. In Maui we use our beach chairs on the lawn close to the pool until things open up. It is incredibly annoying but I'm not going to let it spoil my vacation

 

[okwiater]

We were just at Lagunamar during Christmas week and had this issue. Fortunately we were in building 14, close to the small pool, and were able to find chairs consistently by that one.

I think reducing the number of held chairs to 2 per person—ie. One occupied and one not—would make a huge difference, combined with more aggressive and visible enforcement. Make the maximum “empty” time limit 15 minutes and then belongings go to lost-and-found. But this needs to be done CONSISTENTLY.

The main issue really comes down to the learned behaviors of guests that result from *INCONSISTENT* enforcement. At MVC Ko’Olina, we observed over several days that chairs sat around unoccupied for hours with no enforcement. So we started modeling the behavior necessary and “reserved” chairs as it was the only way to ensure we got any. Then, like magic, one day they started tagging chairs and threw our stuff in lost and found after 30 minutes. I was upset, but only because of the inconsistency. If they had been doing that from the start, we wouldn’t have needed to reserve chairs to begin with.

TLDR: resorts should have one policy and CONSISTENTLY enforce it, or they should have no policy at all and let human behavior sort it out.