Were we tricked into selling our timeshare with Capital Vacations?

[TravelJoy]

We were pressured, strong armed into paying $10,000 to sell our timeshare. Our timeshare resort set up the appointment and we spent 7
hours at a place in a "tag team" high pressured sales push to get us to sign. At one point I thought the guy was going to hit us I felt
like a prisoner in this place, and they tried everything but waterboarding us. The place was Capital Vacations.
We are a college educated, business owning, couple who fell for the high pressure tactic of desperate sales people. It was a tag team method
of sales, when one couldn't close the deal another would sit down with us and almost aggressively verbally abuse us. It was worthy of Jerry
Springer really. We paid $10,000. to sign over the deed but still pay a $50.00 fee monthly on top of the lump sum. We have "points" now
supposedly but have requirements to attend more meetings one of which is a dinner and meeting for new Capital Vacation members.
Also, interestingly we were hastily handed a contract of 20 or so pages by another "contract person" to sign with a preface saying read this
before agreeing to a contract with the place closing for the day, us exhausted, worn down and hungry, claiming defeat.
We regret being so short sighted and falling for this high pressure sales technique. Did we make one big huge mistake?

This seems very recent, if you are within the cancellation period, don't think too much about it and rescind.

 

[vacation911]

I'd be willing to bet a nickle that OP is talking to Capital Vacations to "get the facts." And will be convinced not to listen to anyone here.

Thats what I was thinking

 

[Snazzylass]

Interesting, and of course terrible for the OP. I was at a T/S last month, not CV. I've been going to this same resort for many, many years. First time I was told to go see a fellow in a back room to get my parking pass.

Years ago, this same back room housed the concierge who helped with reservations to local attractions AND, the notorious Owner Update. So, same idea.

This time, I tried to politely decline the presentation. Eventually agreed to it. I'm not an enthusiastic audience but I do pay attention to see what I can learn, to try to figure out what makes these salespeople so darn enthusiastic - basically, they are lying through their teeth and are great actors. They are making stuff up.

Next we move to the closing table where I just can't see the value. Next, the heavy guns are brought in. Seriously, it's all I can do to keep a straight face with the amount of gold jewelry Mr. Vegas is wearing. I always wonder why these people are still working if they are so successful?

Again I politely decline. I sign a paper & get spending $$ for my trouble. Odd that the OP has not returned. I have been told that Salespeople are the easiest people to close/sell to. So, it's not surprising that they would get duped. Wish he'd found TUG sooner.

 

[rapmarks]

Interesting, and of course terrible for the OP. I was at a T/S last month, not CV. I've been going to this same resort for many, many years. First time I was told to go see a fellow in a back room to get my parking pass.

Years ago, this same back room housed the concierge who helped with reservations to local attractions AND, the notorious Owner Update. So, same idea.

This time, I tried to politely decline the presentation. Eventually agreed to it. I'm not an enthusiastic audience but I do pay attention to see what I can learn, to try to figure out what makes these salespeople so darn enthusiastic - basically, they are lying through their teeth and are great actors. They are making stuff up.

Next we move to the closing table where I just can't see the value. Next, the heavy guns are brought in. Seriously, it's all I can do to keep a straight face with the amount of gold jewelry Mr. Vegas is wearing. I always wonder why these people are still working if they are so successful?

Again I politely decline. I sign a paper & get spending $$ for my trouble. Odd that the OP has not returned. I have been told that Salespeople are the easiest people to close/sell to. So, it's not surprising that they would get duped. Wish he'd found TUG sooner.

Op doesn’t realize he would get good responses here. He was venting

 

[FunnyFarm]

CV points chart shows a week in a standard 2 BR is 140,000 to 225,000 (depending upon week) for all but weeks 1 through 9.

But none of those charts are going to show how much inventory the CV points trust actually owns ... so you have no idea what is even theoretically possible to reserve.

And then there's the issue that CV sells multiple levels of access to whatever inventory is actually in the trust. If you're just a single week owner who has converted to CV points (think that's called Preferred in CV terminology) you are bottom of the stack in priority, i.e. higher levels of ownership can reserve month(s) ahead of you.

That's really crappy if CV sells low tier memberships with shorter reservation windows. I bet buyers are unaware of this limitation until it's too late, then upsold to get more points and get what they thought they had in the first place.

 

[gravityrules]

That's really crappy if CV sells low tier memberships with shorter reservation windows. I bet buyers are unaware of this limitation until it's too late, then upsold to get more points and get what they thought they had in the first place.

Yes, there are 4 tier levels.
From lowest to highest, CV points required, max reservation window
Preferred - <300K 10 months
VIP Silver - 300K to 499,999 11 months
VIP Gold - 500K to 999,999 12 months
VIP Platinum - 1M and up 13 months

Other tier differences too as you would expect. Higher tiers get more lead time to snap up last minute deals, etc.

 

[Tia]

Speaking of Capital Vacations, nothing related to this specific topic. One resort they manage Capital placed 3 of their own employees on the HOA board of 5 in Oct at annual elections, having transferred deeds two days before to them I understand. Unfortunately Owners failed to vote in enough numbers. Capital had obtained the last of the developer weeks from Wyndham a while back . Imagine they will use them in their own points program.

 

[LannyPC]

to try to figure out what makes these salespeople so darn enthusiastic...

Money.

 

[gravityrules]

Speaking of Capital Vacations, nothing related to this specific topic. One resort they manage Capital placed 3 of their own employees on the HOA board of 5 in Oct at annual elections, having transferred deeds two days before to them I understand. Unfortunately Owners failed to vote in enough numbers. Capital had obtained the last of the developer weeks from Wyndham a while back . Imagine they will use them in their own points program.

They did the same thing to MROP. Only 2 of the original 9 MROP board remain, others were said to have 'resigned', conveniently replaced with CV employees/appointees.
So much for the announced MROP/CV 'partnership', it looks more like MROP has been assimilated by the Borg.

 

[Snazzylass]

That's really crappy if CV sells low tier memberships with shorter reservation windows. I bet buyers are unaware of this limitation until it's too late, then upsold to get more points and get what they thought they had in the first place.

Not disagreeing but basically, that's my opinion of these Vacation Clubs. The presentation I listened to sounded like pretty much RCI Last Call which one does not need to pay an upfront fee (or take out a loan) plus an additional annual fee. I truly believe some of these outfits are overselling their product. The Vacation Club members are an additional bucket of people making reservations, in addition to Owners with Weeks or Points, RCI trades, and the same T/S advertising on AirBnB.

I shouldn't complain. It keeps the maintenance fees low with all the usage.

 

[Snazzylass]

Speaking of Capital Vacations, nothing related to this specific topic. One resort they manage Capital placed 3 of their own employees on the HOA board of 5 in Oct at annual elections, having transferred deeds two days before to them I understand. Unfortunately Owners failed to vote in enough numbers. Capital had obtained the last of the developer weeks from Wyndham a while back . Imagine they will use them in their own points program.

That's true with other T/S - the "HOA" board is really the current Marketer.

 

[Snazzylass]

Money.

Doh! Well, I guess you can say the same about bank robbers.

I've been in production, the role of bringing in business, also known as sales, all of my life. Even though I excelled at my role, I always limited myself to transactions that allowed me to look myself in the mirror and know I did right by the customer, and the company. It earned me an outstanding reputation and a lot of repeat business over the years. You don't have to ask for referrals if you do a good job. You get them automatically. I was never in the business of lying to people.

I had a manager ask me to do it once and I refused. I told him, look when this is all over, you can go back to IL, but I'll still be here in IN. And, then I'd have to drive further and further to find people I didn't lie to - no thanks! We worked for a bank that is no longer around. He took a job with State Farm.

 

[vacation911]

Doh! Well, I guess you can say the same about bank robbers.

I've been in production, the role of bringing in business, also known as sales, all of my life. Even though I excelled at my role, I always limited myself to transactions that allowed me to look myself in the mirror and know I did right by the customer, and the company. It earned me an outstanding reputation and a lot of repeat business over the years. You don't have to ask for referrals if you do a good job. You get them automatically. I was never in the business of lying to people.

I had a manager ask me to do it once and I refused. I told him, look when this is all over, you can go back to IL, but I'll still be here in IN. And, then I'd have to drive further and further to find people I didn't lie to - no thanks! We worked for a bank that is no longer around. He took a job with State Farm.

The timeshare world, especially with big names like Capital and others, presents an uphill battle for anyone trying to maintain high ethical standards. How can you make a sale with integrity when you know the buyer stands to lose every dollar they spend—plus interest—if they want to get out? Worse yet, once they pay off their timeshare, they often face additional fees, sometimes exceeding $2,000, just to exit the contract.

Sure, you could argue the value lies in the memories created, but is that really a strong enough sales pitch? For most, it isn’t. Success in this field seems to hinge on something else: bending the truth or, at the very least, hiding it.

Granted, most salespeople aren’t initially trained to know all the facts. Many are trained to focus on alternative facts—or partial truths—that paint the timeshare in the best light. However, as time goes on, most figure out the full picture. At that point, they face a choice: continue operating in a system built on half-truths or leave the industry altogether.

Think about it—how often do Developer timeshares generate referrals? Not much, because the product itself is inherently flawed. Many buyers eventually realize this, but it’s too late. The rescission window—the short timeframe during which they can cancel the contract—usually closes before they fully understand what they’ve gotten into.

It’s no coincidence that presentations are often scheduled early in a vacation. The goal is to make the rescission period pass while buyers are still caught up in the glow of their getaway. Timeshares are marketed as an impulse buy, not something backed by happy, long-term customers. The entire system leans heavily on high-pressure sales tactics and luring in people with enticing gifts, hoping they’ll buckle under the pressure. It's an impulse buy.

At the end of the day, it seems like the industry doesn’t rely on satisfied customers—it relies on finding the right kind of vulnerable buyer. Just my opinion, but that’s the harsh reality of Developer timeshares sales.

 

[5finny]

Since this thread has taken this turn I will repost a recent email I received from a former VRI managed resort where I own

WINNERS CIRCLE RESORT Dear Member: Here are the results of the recent annual election at the Winners Circle Beach and Tennis Resort Condominium Owners Association (“Association” or “Winners Circle”). As you are likely aware, there was some delay in publishing these results due to irregularities and uncertainties associated with the manner in which the election was facilitated. Ultimately, three director seats were up for election. The results of the election are as follows: · Kevin Mulvey · Dan McGeorge · Richard Muller It is noted that Richard Muller will be occupying the single seat available to representatives of VRI/Capital Vacations (“VRI/Capital”) and its related entities. While VRI/Capital’s related entities (MROP and CRG Development) used their significant share of votes to attempt to seat three directors, all of whom are executives of VRI/Capital (which is also the Association’s current outside management company and which facilitated the election), the Association’s governing documents prohibit the same. Recall that in 2021, the Winners Circle membership voted to amend its Bylaws to prevent exactly this type of scenario where a corporate entity, and its related entities holding a large share of intervals, could use their votes to place multiple directors on the Board. If this happened, Winners Circle would potentially be perpetually under the control of those related entities. The membership voted to ensure this did not happen and the Bylaws were accordingly amended, consistent with the membership’s will. It is also worth noting that the two VRI/Capital affiliates, Multi Resort Ownership Platform, Inc., aka “MROP,” which has partnered with VRI/Capital for nearly two decades, per its website (see https://www.multi-resorts.com/) and CRG, Development, LLC, which shares the exact same address as VRI (the Association’s outside management company which facilitated the election), have filed suit against the Association in San Diego County Superior Court seeking to have its employees seated on the the Board of Winners Circle. Yes…related entities of the Association’s management vendor are suing the Association to try to force three of its executives to occupy a majority of the Board. A link to the lawsuit is provided here: https://odyroa.sdcourt.ca.gov/cases/CfDJ8GzIvBIU1nBAqaOiy3iA8khkntGiIZlOqayGjc5U57-fMuUv_gZsF-__yYgcWAMJuprAC9lv8u8gMPcoxnLFv5F19Oad_VK4tTMNFi6KTzGkdg4lnkQSS_4CwyNLrcvc9A Whether or not the VRI/Capital affiliates will continue to pursue said litigation, now that the results of the election have been released, is unknown. Irrespective of these hostile actions towards Winners Circle, the Association is prioritizing moving forward and focusing on making the resort the best place it can be for those who matter most: its members. Thank you for your attention to this communication and for your membership in Winners Circle. Sincerely, Winners Circle Resort Board of Directors 550 Via De La Valle, Solana Beach, CA 92075 (858) 755 - 6666

 

[FunnyFarm]

It can't be in the best interest of MROP to have Capital controlling it's board.
There must be a big block of unassigned proxys and surrendered weeks that Capital can control.

I wonder how they would be a willing party to the lawsuit.

Merle Kirkley has been President of the MROP board most years since the days of the near demise of Resorts West and subsequent rescue by Pahio.
I haven't heard of any pushback from his end.

 

[gravityrules]

It can't be in the best interest of MROP to have Capital controlling it's board.
There must be a big block of unassigned proxys and surrendered weeks that Capital can control.

I wonder how they would be a willing party to the lawsuit.

Merle Kirkley has been President of the MROP board most years since the days of the near demise of Resorts West and subsequent rescue by Pahio.
I haven't heard of any pushback from his end.

He is the still MROP board president and head cheerleader for this outcome.

 

[Snazzylass]

The timeshare world, especially with big names like Capital and others, presents an uphill battle for anyone trying to maintain high ethical standards. How can you make a sale with integrity when you know the buyer stands to lose every dollar they spend—plus interest—if they want to get out? Worse yet, once they pay off their timeshare, they often face additional fees, sometimes exceeding $2,000, just to exit the contract.

Sure, you could argue the value lies in the memories created, but is that really a strong enough sales pitch? For most, it isn’t. Success in this field seems to hinge on something else: bending the truth or, at the very least, hiding it.

Granted, most salespeople aren’t initially trained to know all the facts. Many are trained to focus on alternative facts—or partial truths—that paint the timeshare in the best light. However, as time goes on, most figure out the full picture. At that point, they face a choice: continue operating in a system built on half-truths or leave the industry altogether.

Think about it—how often do Developer timeshares generate referrals? Not much, because the product itself is inherently flawed. Many buyers eventually realize this, but it’s too late. The rescission window—the short timeframe during which they can cancel the contract—usually closes before they fully understand what they’ve gotten into.

It’s no coincidence that presentations are often scheduled early in a vacation. The goal is to make the rescission period pass while buyers are still caught up in the glow of their getaway. Timeshares are marketed as an impulse buy, not something backed by happy, long-term customers. The entire system leans heavily on high-pressure sales tactics and luring in people with enticing gifts, hoping they’ll buckle under the pressure. It's an impulse buy.

At the end of the day, it seems like the industry doesn’t rely on satisfied customers—it relies on finding the right kind of vulnerable buyer. Just my opinion, but that’s the harsh reality of Developer timeshares sales.

oh my goodness, of course.

What does it say about your product if you have to give a gift to someone to listen to your presentation?

People should keep that in mind for all the invites for steak dinners from Financial Advisors.

I just naturally have the habit of looking for "Best Practices." I was charmed once by how a Used Car Salesman spoke to me once with such kindness and respect. I incorporated his patter in my calls at a Call Center. Pretty soon, you could hear the whole room saying it which happened a lot with the phrases I used.

So, sure, I was studying the presentation to see what I could learn. Nothing. Lying is cheating.

 

[vacation911]

oh my goodness, of course.

What does it say about your product if you have to give a gift to someone to listen to your presentation?

People should keep that in mind for all the invites for steak dinners from Financial Advisors.

I just naturally have the habit of looking for "Best Practices." I was charmed once by how a Used Car Salesman spoke to me once with such kindness and respect. I incorporated his patter in my calls at a Call Center. Pretty soon, you could hear the whole room saying it which happened a lot with the phrases I used.

So, sure, I was studying the presentation to see what I could learn. Nothing. Lying is cheating.

I think what it says about the product is you are likely in the timeshare industry. Its the common practice for sure.

 

[Tia]

He is the still MROP board president and head cheerleader for this outcome.

What resort is MROP ?

 

[dioxide45]

What resort is MROP ?

It stands for Multi Resort Ownership Plan. A collection of resorts where the MROP owned deeds at multiple properties. Owners who had MROP ownership could then make reservations within the group of resorts. Kind of like the timeshare based points trusts, but on a much smaller scale and usually small independent properties.