Travertine stained from grout?

[caribbeansun]

Hi all, we are finishing off our basement and had rough-cut travertine tiles installed last Thursday - DW and I thought they looked great.

Friday they grouted with power grout . Tile looked okay, grout was still wet and we didn't spend very long looking at it.

Saturday morning we looked at the tile and it had seemed to change colour.

At first I thought it was the fact that the grout colour wasn't a great match for the tile and it had of course filled in the holes in the tile but the more I looked at it the more I was becoming convinced that they hadn't prepped the tile properly ie. didn't seal it sufficiently to ensure that the grout wouldn't stain the tile.

I had the owner of the flooring place out to look at it and he started by denying that the tile had changed colour and then talked about using different sealers and colour enhancers to bring the colour back. That was Monday, emailed him today, no response - I'm getting a sense of where this is headed...

I'd be interested if anyone else has had this or a similar experience.

Thanks

 

[catwgirl]

Do you have an extra piece of tile that wasn't laid to compare?

 

[zinger1457]

Tiles can definitely retain the grout color if not properly/completely cleaned after grouting. I've laid tiles in my bathroom and kitchen and it does take a lot of elbow grease, and sometimes multiple cleanings, to get all the grout off the tiles. Take a mixture of water and vinegar, spray on some of the tiles and give a good rub down with a soft cloth. Are you picking up the grout color?

 

[ScoopKona]

I know the answer to this one, without a doubt.

You didn't seal the travertine before it was installed. I guarantee it. You have to seal it first. Then install it. Then grout. Then seal everything again. We sealed ours TWICE, then installed, and then sealed again. 1,500 square feet of it.

Grout is basically cement and pigment. Travertine soaks up that pigment like a sponge. A good coat or two of penetrating sealer -- particularly around the edges -- would have repelled the pigment. There is very little you can do at this point.

Perhaps -- PERHAPS -- a good penetrating sealer might even it out so it isn't as noticeable. Maybe. Depends on how much contrast between the stone and the grout. But I tend to doubt it.

Unfortunately, you should have sealed it first. And your installers probably didn't know because they're used to working with porcelain and ceramic. Most of them are monkeys anyway. I don't let them into my house. I do everything myself to avoid this kind of problem.

It may very well be the case that everything needs to be ripped up and done again. Perhaps a good stone guy can use the same abrasives he uses for diamond polishing, and get you the look you want. But it will probably be cheaper to rip it all up and do it again right. I'll also bet you $5 the installers didn't use the right kind of thinset.

www.johnbridge.com -- it's the TUG of tile.

 

[ScoopKona]

Tiles can definitely retain the grout color if not properly/completely cleaned after grouting. I've laid tiles in my bathroom and kitchen and it does take a lot of elbow grease, and sometimes multiple cleanings, to get all the grout off the tiles. Take a mixture of water and vinegar, spray on some of the tiles and give a good rub down with a soft cloth. Are you picking up the grout color?

NO!

NO VINEGAR!

IT'S TRAVERTINE! ACID WILL ETCH IT. NO. NO. NO. NO. A THOUSAND TIMES NO!

 

[ronparise]

Scoop has it right. Choosing travertine for a floor means choosing a lifetime of maintenance. I think you have to get used to the new color

Travertine is going to stain..its in its nature. You should see the floor under my grandsons highchair

 

[caribbeansun]

Thanks for the input. This is the conclusion I've been coming to.

To be clear it was the store that was to have sealed the tiles and that is, I believe, where the fault lies.

I am 95% of the way there to saying rip it out and reinstall.


On the reinstall:

They sell two versions of travertine - the porous, rough edge, that still has all the holes (this is what they installed) and the pre-filled, polished, smooth edge. I can only assume that since they are the same material just finished differently that they will both have the identical absorbion properties although maintenance of the smooth tile would seem easier as there are no indentations to clean dirt out of.

I'd appreciate your thoughts on the relative maintenance of the two finishes.

Thanks again.

I know the answer to this one, without a doubt.

You didn't seal the travertine before it was installed. I guarantee it. You have to seal it first. Then install it. Then grout. Then seal everything again. We sealed ours TWICE, then installed, and then sealed again. 1,500 square feet of it.

Grout is basically cement and pigment. Travertine soaks up that pigment like a sponge. A good coat or two of penetrating sealer -- particularly around the edges -- would have repelled the pigment. There is very little you can do at this point.

Perhaps -- PERHAPS -- a good penetrating sealer might even it out so it isn't as noticeable. Maybe. Depends on how much contrast between the stone and the grout. But I tend to doubt it.

Unfortunately, you should have sealed it first. And your installers probably didn't know because they're used to working with porcelain and ceramic. Most of them are monkeys anyway. I don't let them into my house. I do everything myself to avoid this kind of problem.

It may very well be the case that everything needs to be ripped up and done again. Perhaps a good stone guy can use the same abrasives he uses for diamond polishing, and get you the look you want. But it will probably be cheaper to rip it all up and do it again right. I'll also bet you $5 the installers didn't use the right kind of thinset.

www.johnbridge.com -- it's the TUG of tile.

 

[caribbeansun]

We had 5-6 which we laid on top of the finished area.

The ungrouted tiles had the expected whites, beiges and browns. The grouted tiles had little colour variation just lighter and darker tones of the same colour (which was the same as the grout).

Do you have an extra piece of tile that wasn't laid to compare?

 

[ScoopKona]

They sell two versions of travertine - the porous, rough edge, that still has all the holes (this is what they installed) and the pre-filled, polished, smooth edge. I can only assume that since they are the same material just finished differently that they will both have the identical absorbion properties although maintenance of the smooth tile would seem easier as there are no indentations to clean dirt out of.

Not exactly. Travertine is basically limestone. Whether the trav is filled, polished, honed, or left "rustic" depends on the quarry. So no two travs are alike. And the pros always take a few representative pieces and try out various sealers on them and check staining with a bit of mixed grout.

Some will absorb pigment like a piece of chalk. (They're geologically not far removed from chalk.) Others are more like marble. (Again, they're geologically close to marble.)

I'll bet you're going to have a big fight on your hands if you insist on a reinstall. You're going to get the "Travertine is a natural stone product, and the customer should expect variance..." song and dance.

 

[ScoopKona]

Scoop has it right. Choosing travertine for a floor means choosing a lifetime of maintenance. I think you have to get used to the new color

Travertine is going to stain..its in its nature. You should see the floor under my grandsons highchair

Travertine needs to be sealed OFTEN. Depending on the stone, at least every year but sometimes every six months. It won't stain if it's sealed OFTEN. Messes also have to be cleaned up immediately, even if the trav was sealed yesterday.

Ours is five years old and looks the same today as it did when we laid it.

 

[caribbeansun]

Again, thank you very much for all the information, much appreciated!!

Yes, I know it's not going to be fun dealing with the flooring place, hopefully they step up and admit their mistake. I want it torn out so I'm prepared to saw off at 50/50 if I have to just to get the issue resolved but we'll see...

 

[ScoopKona]

Again, thank you very much for all the information, much appreciated!!

Yes, I know it's not going to be fun dealing with the flooring place, hopefully they step up and admit their mistake. I want it torn out so I'm prepared to saw off at 50/50 if I have to just to get the issue resolved but we'll see...

I would try a color-enhancing penetrating sealer first. Use it on one of those extra pieces -- preferably grouted the same way the trav on the floor was done. And then see how that looks. If that's too big a hassle, try it in an inconspicuous place. Wipe on, let sit for five minutes, rub off. Repeat once or twice. It might make you happy with your floor again.

Keep in mind the good color-enhancing sealer is NOT CHEAP.

And as I mentioned, there are stone guys out there who can diamond polish the trav, removing 1 mm or so off the top. That should remove the pigment from the grout. Go check out johnbridge.com. This question has been asked and answered over there dozens of times.

 

[Kal]

I had professionals install marble flooring in one of my bathrooms. I could have done it myself, but was concerned about getting very tight seams and a perfectly level floor.

Before the tiles were installed they sealed BOTH sides (top and bottom) twice. Absorption from the bottom is a concern too. When I purchased the flooring I had the option of self-install but even then, the owner of the shop told me I would have to seal both sides before installation.

They did a magnificent job and I'm more assured that I could not get every tile perfectly level. The glossy marble is not the least bit forgiving when it comes to an even reflection when viewed laterally.

 

[christine01h]

I know the answer to this one, without a doubt.

You didn't seal the travertine before it was installed. I guarantee it. You have to seal it first. Then install it. Then grout. Then seal everything again. We sealed ours TWICE, then installed, and then sealed again. 1,500 square feet of it.

Grout is basically cement and pigment. Travertine soaks up that pigment like a sponge. A good coat or two of penetrating sealer -- particularly around the edges -- would have repelled the pigment. There is very little you can do at this point.

Perhaps -- PERHAPS -- a good penetrating sealer might even it out so it isn't as noticeable. Maybe. Depends on how much contrast between the stone and the grout. But I tend to doubt it.

Unfortunately, you should have sealed it first. And your installers probably didn't know because they're used to working with porcelain and ceramic. Most of them are monkeys anyway. I don't let them into my house. I do everything myself to avoid this kind of problem.

It may very well be the case that everything needs to be ripped up and done again. Perhaps a good stone guy can use the same abrasives he uses for diamond polishing, and get you the look you want. But it will probably be cheaper to rip it all up and do it again right. I'll also bet you $5 the installers didn't use the right kind of thinset.

www.johnbridge.com -- it's the TUG of tile.

Thanks for this. I'm having the same problem, now i know what to do. Thanks a lot