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Transferring a timeshare to an LLC to dispose of

wdinner

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
44
Reaction score
2
Location
Pt Washington, LI
I'm looking for an approach to rid myself of several timeshares and would love some feedback on whether the following is valid and legal.

I currently own 3 timeshares that I wish to dispose of.
I was going to create Limited Liability Company - LLC (not sure what state is best for this), with myself as the sole proprietor.

Transfer the deeds for the 3 timeshares to the LLC.

Ignore the future requests for payment for maintenance and let the timeshare companies sue the LLC for non-payment. And if they wish, foreclose against the LLC for the properties.

Will this work?
Thanks
Bill
 
This not a new idea - it's been around for awhile - and it's fraud.

The timeshare management companies are aware of this type of fraud, commonly called a "Viking Ship," and they can simple refuse to transfer the timeshare to the LLC in their records.

Instead of doing something so risky - why not try to give your timeshare away to someone who wants it - at no cost to you.

MORE INFO: How can I give my timeshare away on TUG
 
If one of them is the Marriott, there is no need to deed it to the LLC to unload it. You could always call Marriott and see if they are taking listings for it through their resale department. If not, you could easily give it away using the techniques mentioned in the link Denise provided.
 
what efforts have you made thusfar to give these timeshares away to willing owners for free? and what did the resorts say when you contacted them to request they accept the units back?
 
I'm looking for an approach to rid myself of several timeshares and would love some feedback on whether the following is valid and legal.

I currently own 3 timeshares that I wish to dispose of.
I was going to create Limited Liability Company - LLC (not sure what state is best for this), with myself as the sole proprietor.

Transfer the deeds for the 3 timeshares to the LLC.

Ignore the future requests for payment for maintenance and let the timeshare companies sue the LLC for non-payment. And if they wish, foreclose against the LLC for the properties.

Will this work?
Thanks
Bill
As soon as you said you wanted to run it as a sole proprietor, I believe that's one thing the government looks at is this just an attempt to avoid the liability of a sole proprietor?

You need a lawyer.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
 
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I have not recently called the companies, so I will do so. It did not occur to me to search for the term "viking ship" prior to starting this thread.

As to the question of avoiding liability - one of the primary reasons to create an LLC is to avoid the liability. The're not called LLCs for nothing.

I have and have had several business, all are structured as some type of corporation and the primary reason for doing so was to limit my exposure.
 
pretty sure the goal of an LLC is to limit unintended exposure....not to offload bad debt you have already created without consequence.
 
If the object of creating the LLC is to default and put the obligation of continued maintenance and eventual foreclosure on the backs of other owners, what would YOU call it other than fraud?

I cannot back this approach.

Jim
 
It's not just fraud. It's totally unethical and immoral. You're screwing all the other owners in many ways.
 
I would first try to sell or give them away. If that doesn't work contact the hoa either directly or through the management company to give it to them If they don't want it or can't suggest any alternatives, stop paying. They will probably talk to you then. If not, default and let them foreclose. There are likely going to be consequences like a hit to your credit and perhaps a default judgement and maybe a 1099 but none of that stuff is the end of the world.
 
Very clever idea. Learn something new everyday in here!

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 
I think you didn't read between the number 1 and the 11th posts. :doh:

Unless, you think fraud is clever? :ignore:
I did read the entire thread.

Timeshare owners are boxed in and put into a position of desperation in the event of getting out from under them. I'm not going to do something like that myself and at the same time I'm not going to look down the bridge of my nose judging someone because they are trying to be creative in getting out of something that carries a punch.

The system is governed by unethical people. As a result, how can you fault a man that's being governed by those very people?

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
 
I really think all LLC's should be illegal. So much fraud- not only in the timeshare business but in real estate and elsewhere. I can't believe the government allows this to go on.
 
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I really think all LLC's should be illegal. So much fraud- not only in the timeshare business but in real estate and elsewhere. I can't believe the government allows this to go on.

that wouldnt change anything that birddog31 said "Timeshare owners are boxed in and put into a position of desperation in the event of getting out from under them."

unless the corporations you want to disallow include Wyndham, Marriott and every other corpopration that deals in timsahares... All the HOAs too


The fact is its not the corporate structure thats at fault, its the fact that there is in many cases no effective secondary market for the crap. Every HOA should provide an exit path for their owners. They dont (except default and foreclosures.) Thats what should be illegal,. I cant believe we allow that
 
My $0.02 worth...

I really think all LLC's should be illegal. So much fraud- not only in the timeshare business but in real estate and elsewhere. I can't believe the government allows this to go on.

I have absolutely no use or respect for attempts to hide behind the anonymity of a convenient corporate veil contrived and created solely as a "timeshare exit strategy" to (attempt to) exercise without any consequences if / when the ownership happens to become "inconvenient" or when the cash profits from rentals stop rolling on in.
The applicable standards of proof for a criminal fraud case may be beyond the appropriate scope of this particular discussion however.

I can understand and appreciate the creation and legitimate use of a LLC in other business arenas. For example, if a legitimate business enterprise fails after it's founder(s) have invested their own (now lost) money, should all of that founder(s)' other personal assets (real estate, motor vehicles, bank accounts, etc.) then also become exposed and available to be attached and liquidated, potentially leaving people without even so much as the roof over their heads?

It's admittedly a very subjective distinction that I make here. In the failed legitimate business example, individuals lose their initial invested money. Hopefully, few other voluntarily invested individuals also get hurt. However, the contrived LLC skulking away from timeshare ownership responsibility immediately and directly hurts lots of other blameless individual owners who then have to immediately (and involuntarily) pick up the financial slack to keep the place afloat. Let's not just conveniently ignore the fact that the timeshare facility hasn't failed, it's only that the LLC timeshare owner has skulked away into the mist. The other remaining (non-LLC) timeshare owners never "invested" in the contrived LLC, they only bought into their timeshare intervals and property, knowingly and voluntarily accepting their contractual responsibilities.

To suggest that "the HOA should just take back" ownerships that people previously (freely and willfully) chose to purchase (...and not from the HOA, I should point out) is just a terminally lame and entirely unpersuasive bit of illogic. The HOA might choose to do so, if in the best interests of all other owners, but the HOA certainly has no legal or moral or ethical obligation or responsibility to do so. The HOA responsibility is to always look out for the best interests of all owners there.

It could certainly be argued that this is a very subjective "pick and choose" viewpoint. It is indeed --- no doubt about it and I will readily admit that without apology.
I also readily acknowledge that this perspective is from that of a small, independent timeshare facility interval owner, without regard to any of the "big chains" with deep pockets lurking "behind the curtain". Meanwhile however, there will be no anonymous LLC timeshare ownerships accepted or acknowledged at any of the independent timeshare facilities at which we own intervals, including one where I sit as an elected BoD member. Don't like it? Thinking "you can't just do that"? Sue us! :)
 
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I continue to be amazed that the knee jerk reaction of many is "you need a lawyer". For what? To do the research that OP can easily do for himself at no cost?

George
A person that has himself as a lawyer, has a fool for a lawyer. Would you really set up an LLC without one?
The OP already said he has done this in the past. Is he here to get info or justification?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
 
A person that has himself as a lawyer, has a fool for a lawyer. <snip>

No further comment on LLC, but perhaps you meant to use the word client here instead? :confused:
 
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As others have said, first contact the resorts and ask them to take back the ownerships. Just see what they say. Marriott and DRI have taken back ownerships and some other independent HOAs have other programs.

If that is not successful, post it for free here on TUG. Read this:
http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=132509

Another option is to transfer the ownerships to someone who already has bad credit and is willing to take the credit hit from foreclosures.


It's not just fraud. It's totally unethical and immoral. You're screwing all the other owners in many ways.
This is a subject that is hotly debated here on TUG. Not all of us think it's immoral or that doing this will hurt other owners. I happen to believe that it's perfectly fine to do IF other methods of disposal have been unsuccessful. I don't think anyone should have to be burdened by timeshare ownerships they don't want so long as they've made a good faith effort to unload them in ways that are less drastic.

On my moral compass there are a tons of things that are way way worse than Viking Ships. For example, anything that actually endangers public safety is more ethically problematic IMO, for example sneaking more people into your suite than is legally allowed by the fire marshal or parking in handicapped or fire zones. I think the case that Viking Ships harm other owners is a hard case to be made unless the blame is equally shared by inflexible HOAs.
 
Explanation requested...

<snip> I think the case that Viking Ships harm other owners is a hard case to be made unless the blame is equally shared by inflexible HOAs.

I don't want to discuss or debate a scale or continuum of "immorality" or other assorted matters or degrees of right and wrong mentioned within other parts of your post.

That much being very clearly stated, I would very much like to hear the logic behind the apparent (and apparently recurrent) belief that any HOA anywhere somehow has any responsibility or obligation to "take back" any timeshare ownership that someone previously voluntarily purchased entirely of their own free will (...and not purchased from the "inflexible" HOA in the first place, it is both critically important and highly relevant to note).
Why would you (or anyone else willing to chime in) believe that any HOA anywhere should just happily accept someone else's freely chosen personal responsibility? :shrug:

I cannot even begin to grasp the logic. If you are willing to attempt to explain the logic behind that particular thought process, I am definitely all ears. :confused::shrug::confused:
 
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A person that has himself as a lawyer, has a fool for a lawyer. Would you really set up an LLC without one?

I am not a lawyer but with one exception have done all my legal work myself for about 50 years now. It has always worked out well. And yes, I would set up an LLC myself. Let me hasten to add that I would not set one up for OP's purpose though.

George
 
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