Timeshare crunch - NYTimes article/ TUG and more mentioned

[rickandcindy23]

Your river view is lovely, Cindy. It would be nice spending a vacation there in the summer or when there is snow.

It really is beautiful there, especially those units along the river. The decks are something they did right, using TREX decking several years back, and it cost us a pretty penny. This resort is in serious need of new furniture and carpet, and updated bathrooms.

We have new kitchens already, and we added King Select Comfort beds 18 months ago. So many things need to be done. The exteriors look great right now. I would love to get rid of almost every sofa sleeper tomorrow and get something classy and smaller scale, instead of dwarfing the living area. And the wood furniture is too blocky, but it is solid oak, and it is very contemporary. That style is just not "in" anymore.

There are so many things I would improve, if only we had unlimited money. Philip (PA- on TUG) keeps telling Rick that he better loosen up with our personal checking account, because Twin Rivers cannot afford what I want to do NOW!

 

[tombo]

Sales are one time events - how about permanently reducing the prices of ALL Marriott units a flat 25% to 50%?

Why are timeshares not subject to the forces of the free market like the rest of real estate?

(Are timeshares getting TARP money? If so, raise the prices!)

Perry, where have you been? While you have been gone terrible things have been happening!!! Timeshare sales have left the mythical sales propping value of ROFR and become subject to the forces of the free market. Bottom Feeders are buying Marriott weeks at ridiculously low prices and ROFR is not doing anything to stop the bottom feeders from actually becoming owners!!!! Marriott hasn't ROFR'd a single week at any price for many months!!!!

I remember you proudly proclaiming that Marriott weeks might sell cheap on e-bay but you were glad to know that thanks to ROFR the bottom feeders would never actually become owners and you would never have to lay next to them at the pool. Look left and right the next time you are at a Marriott or Westgate pool because there is a good chance that a bottom feeder will be in the lounge chair next to you. Heck Planet Hollywood has become Planet Bottom Feeder and it probably has more bottom feeder sales than retail sales.

Yes things have changed while you were gone, but your stinging sarcastic wit has been missed, even by us bottom feeders. Heck things have changed so much that us bottom feeders can now listen to your predictions for the timeshare industry and witticisms in person as we lay next to you at the Marriott or Westgate pool. You will of course be buying your drinks from the poolside bar while us bottom feeders will be drinking out of our styrofoam coolers, but we will still be rubbing elbows and bonding as fellow owners.

 

[Pat H]

That picture in the avatar is from our Hawaii trip on Maui four years ago, very shortly after I recovered from a serious health issue and was able to travel after a period of time of a few years when I just couldn't. I no longer dye my hair, and it was longer then, too. I think I should dye my hair again; I had no idea I was so gray! :rofl: Seriously, I look so old.

Why is it that when women's hair turns gray, they look old but men look "distinguished"? A couple of times I've thought about letting the gray grow out but after a little while, I lose my nerve. I'm pretty sure I'm very close to totally white hair now.

 

[PerryM]

Buy hi - sell lo; or is it the other way around?

Perry, where have you been? While you have been gone terrible things have been happening!!! Timeshare sales have left the mythical sales propping value of ROFR and become subject to the forces of the free market. Bottom Feeders are buying Marriott weeks at ridiculously low prices and ROFR is not doing anything to stop the bottom feeders from actually becoming owners!!!! Marriott hasn't ROFR'd a single week at any price for many months!!!!

I remember you proudly proclaiming that Marriott weeks might sell cheap on e-bay but you were glad to know that thanks to ROFR the bottom feeders would never actually become owners and you would never have to lay next to them at the pool. Look left and right the next time you are at a Marriott or Westgate pool because there is a good chance that a bottom feeder will be in the lounge chair next to you. Heck Planet Hollywood has become Planet Bottom Feeder and it probably has more bottom feeder sales than retail sales.

Yes things have changed while you were gone, but your stinging sarcastic wit has been missed, even by us bottom feeders. Heck things have changed so much that us bottom feeders can now listen to your predictions for the timeshare industry and witticisms in person as we lay next to you at the Marriott or Westgate pool. You will of course be buying your drinks from the poolside bar while us bottom feeders will be drinking out of our styrofoam coolers, but we will still be rubbing elbows and bonding as fellow owners.

So many folks seem to either like me or hate me that I now Blog, full-time, for a living; I now make money either way Cut my teeth here, thanks TUG.

I've lost touch with timeshares, been very interested in Destination Clubs, but don't plan to buy anything in 2009. Not sure how 2010 will be.

There are bargains to snap up - but today's bargain is tomorrows outrageous price. My advice is to hold pat and that even $1 timeshares on eBay are way over priced.

Still waiting for Marriott to permanently lower prices and acknowledge that even timeshares are subject to the laws of supply and demand.

I wish everyone here well...

 

[tombo]

So many folks seem to either like me or hate me that I now Blog, full-time, for a living; I now make money either way Cut my teeth here, thanks TUG.

I've lost touch with timeshares, been very interested in Destination Clubs, but don't plan to buy anything in 2009. Not sure how 2010 will be.

There are bargains to snap up - but today's bargain is tomorrows outrageous price. My advice is to hold pat and that even $1 timeshares on eBay are way over priced.

Still waiting for Marriott to permanently lower prices and acknowledge that even timeshares are subject to the laws of supply and demand.

I wish everyone here well...

Destination Clubs are another great investment. :roflC's make a $300,000 penthouse at Westgate's Planet Hollywood seem like a great deal

We were both always against DC's. It was one of the rare things we agreed upon. Time has proven us to be correct and unfortunatelly many have lost a bunch of money with no future vacations or assetts to show for their "wonderful DC memberships". HCC, Tanner, Portofino, Lusso and numerous other DC's have filed Bankruptcy recently or will be filing soon leaving "members" with nothing. If you think a $1 timeshare is overpriced, wait until your Destination Club you paid $100,000 to $500,000 to join files bankruptcy and your money is worth zero and you have nowhere to vacation. At worst if I buy a dollar timeshare I can only lose a dollar.

Wasn't it your quote that "a destination club is where a bunch of suckers give money to a guy to buy himself properties which he then makes the suckers pay him to rent annually"? I assume that you are blogging negativelly about DC's since they are the biggest risk out there. I wouldn't join a $300,000 DC if they had a $30,000 joining special because I don't feel like throwing $30,000 away.

Don't be a stranger here on TUG.

 

[PerryM]

Destination Clubs are another great investment. These DC's make a $300,000 penthouse at Westgate's Planet Hollywood like a great deal.:rofl:

We were always against DC's. It was one of the rare things we agreed upon. Time has proven us to be correct and unfortunatelly many have lost a bunch of money with no future vacations or assetts to show for their "wonderful DC memberships". HCC, Tanner, Portofino, Lusso and numerous other DC's have filed Bankruptcy recently or will be filing soon leaving "members" with nothing. If you think a $1 timeshare is overpriced, wait until your Destination Club you paid $100,000 to $500,000 to join files bankruptcy and your money is worth zero and you have nowhere to vacation. At worst if I buy a dollar timeshare I can only lose a dollar.

Wasn't it your quote that "a destination club is where a bunch of suckers give money to a guy to buy himself properties which he then makes the suckers pay him to rent annually"? I assume that you are blogging negativelly about DC's since they are the biggest risk out there. I wouldn't join a $300,000 DC for $30,000 because I don't feel like throwing $30,000 away.

Don't be a stranger here on TUG.

My exact quote to the definition of a Destination Club:

"8 folks get together and buy a rich guy a condo and then pay him rent to use it".

Ritz-Carlton Destination Club has completely changed the DC market. I refer to them as DC Version 2. They have:

• 100% ownership
• 100% transparency
• 100% free market oriented in resales with a ROFR
• 100% free of the "3 in/1 out" way to resign from a DC
• 100% Points oriented - Marriott should adopt their system

When the real estate market turns around Marriott is in great position to totally own and redefine that market. I expect great things from the Ritz in the future. The Ritz will be #1 in the number of members shortly and I doubt the other DCs will even bother to try to keep up.

I'd suggest that anyone interested in the next step above a timeshare investigate them and the Ritz. There will be a resale market to the Ritz to buy in.

The other DCs are toast - they are burning as we speak...

 

[tombo]

My exact quote to the definition of a Destination Club:

"8 folks get together and buy a rich guy a condo and then pay him rent to use it".

Ritz-Carlton Destination Club has completely changed the DC market. I refer to them as DC Version 2. They have:

• 100% ownership
• 100% transparency
• 100% free market oriented in resales with a ROFR
• 100% free of the "3 in/1 out" way to resign from a DC
• 100% Points oriented - Marriott should adopt their system

When the real estate market turns around Marriott is in great position to totally own and redefine that market. I expect great things from the Ritz in the future. The Ritz will be #1 in the number of members shortly and I doubt the other DCs will even bother to try to keep up.

I'd suggest that anyone interested in the next step above a timeshare investigate them and the Ritz. There will be a resale market to the Ritz to buy in.

The other DCs are toast - they are burning as we speak...

Ritz lost their funding and had to back out of their Maui location last fall.

http://www.destinationclubforums.com/f5/lehman-bankruptcy-cuts-funds-maui-ritz-1360.html

Now the bankruptcy courts restored some of their funds and Marriott is picking up the slack.

http://www.professionaltravelguide....Kapalua-Bay-venture-secures-funding-p1881947/


Not a good start and almost a disastrous one. Who is to say that their next expansion doesn't fail due to ack of funds or investors forcing the Ritz Carlton DC division to file bankruptcy themselves.


If you have $100,000 or more to invest buy a vacation home or condo, own it, use it anytime you want, and travel to other locations on rental income you make from renting out a home or condo you personally own. Owning is much safer and much better return on investment if you ever want to sell since property over time appreciates in value.

Good luck to you, but I wouldn't consider investing in ANY DC period.

 

[PerryM]

Ritz lost their funding and had to back out of their Maui location last fall.

http://www.destinationclubforums.com/f5/lehman-bankruptcy-cuts-funds-maui-ritz-1360.html

Now the bankruptcy courts restored some of their funds and Marriott is picking up the slack.

http://www.professionaltravelguide....Kapalua-Bay-venture-secures-funding-p1881947/


Not a good start and almost a disastrous one. Who is to say that their next expansion doesn't fail due to ack of funds or investors forcing the Ritz Carlton DC division to file bankruptcy themselves.


If you have $100,000 or more to invest buy a vacation home or condo, own it, use it anytime you want, and travel to other locations on rental income you make from renting out a home or condo you personally own. Owning is much safer and much better return on investment if you ever want to sell since property over time appreciates in value.

Good luck to you, but I wouldn't consider investing in ANY DC period.

I'm simply describing what I think is the best DC out there - it's totally different than all the other DCs and its a Marriott.

The resale market will take a year or so to become active and that's a lifetime away with today's real estate market.

I don't recommend anyone do anything with real estate until the market shows signs of recovering and everyone concerned readjusts their prices and business plans.

But this is an ideal time to learn - costs nothing.

I have published, in-depth, articles how the Ritz Point system could easily be adopted by Marriott timeshares - heck even access to the other system if desired.

 

[dioxide45]

Well crud, there goes all those cheap weeks. Now I will have a whole bunch more people bidding against me for those cheap E-Bay weeks because of the article.

 

[taffy19]

Ritz lost their funding and had to back out of their Maui location last fall.

http://www.destinationclubforums.com/f5/lehman-bankruptcy-cuts-funds-maui-ritz-1360.html

Now the bankruptcy courts restored some of their funds and Marriott is picking up the slack.

http://www.professionaltravelguide....Kapalua-Bay-venture-secures-funding-p1881947/


Not a good start and almost a disastrous one. Who is to say that their next expansion doesn't fail due to ack of funds or investors forcing the Ritz Carlton DC division to file bankruptcy themselves.


If you have $100,000 or more to invest buy a vacation home or condo, own it, use it anytime you want, and travel to other locations on rental income you make from renting out a home or condo you personally own. Owning is much safer and much better return on investment if you ever want to sell since property over time appreciates in value.

Good luck to you, but I wouldn't consider investing in ANY DC period.

But you didn't read the latest news. Here it is.

 

[Kona Lovers]

It really is beautiful there, especially those units along the river. The decks are something they did right, using TREX decking several years back, and it cost us a pretty penny. This resort is in serious need of new furniture and carpet, and updated bathrooms.

We have new kitchens already, and we added King Select Comfort beds 18 months ago. So many things need to be done. The exteriors look great right now. I would love to get rid of almost every sofa sleeper tomorrow and get something classy and smaller scale, instead of dwarfing the living area. And the wood furniture is too blocky, but it is solid oak, and it is very contemporary. That style is just not "in" anymore.

There are so many things I would improve, if only we had unlimited money. Philip (PA- on TUG) keeps telling Rick that he better loosen up with our personal checking account, because Twin Rivers cannot afford what I want to do NOW!

Is this by any chance a subtle warning that there's a Special Assessment around the corner?

Marty

 

[rickandcindy23]

Is this by any chance a subtle warning that there's a Special Assessment around the corner?

Marty

No special assessments, not ever. We just want to get a cash flow enough that we can do some things, and I want them done now. But I am not willing to pay, so we will wait until the time is right.

The point of the giveaway is you get the week, reasonable fees, and we no longer have 14% bad debt, which is costing all of us our reserve fund. I have already been inundated with phone calls and emails, and the people are just googling 'Twin Rivers Colorado" to find our board. Very easy to find my email address and phone number that way.

We actually just got done with special assessments, which the old board put into place for various things that are mostly now done. The exteriors took much of that money, and they look really nice. We also remodeled the kitchens with that cash, bought the Select Comfort King Beds, the flatscreen televisions, DVD players, and bedspreads/ drapes (even though the spreads and drapes are not what I would have picked). It's never enough, unless you do what Vistana did and charge everyone $2K for a SA and do it all at once, basically gutting the units. We will not do that to anyone. The old board was keeping the fees low, too low, and then assessing for remodels and exterior work. Not a good idea.

 

[Kona Lovers]

That's good to hear. Looks like you'll be getting plenty of takers from the sounds of the response. Best wishes.

Marty