Thinking about purchasing deeded week

[Dean]

I would like to support this point because I often forget this now that I own GO and GC. BTW, I co-run an II FB group with 15K members. I am going to cut and paste some your post because your overall full view is spot on. It might not matter to you but I will give Dean from the Tug group credit. If nothing else, it promotes TUG.

Supporting your Bucket point. When I bought my first resale in 1995 Marriott Monarch ($12,500) , I also purchased a 2 bedroom resale Resort World of Orlando ($3,500). They were consecutive summer fixed weeks so I never cared about TDI. I am not sure it was even around. Resort World was my first trader, never having stayed in the 20 years I owned it. I no longer remember the II ratings back than, but it was on par with Marriott. I traded the Resorts for the Monarch and exchanged my Monarch for 130K Marriott Reward Points. Over the years, Resort World minimized the MF increases at the expense of the quality of the resort and hence II rating. The management changed from Resort World to Celebrity and finally Legacy Vacation. I gave it away in 2015. At that point the MF of Resorts was half of the Monarch. I just reviewed my trades. If you notice, there are years I had no exchanges. I started to look for Marriott exchanges within 60 days of travel to make up for lost value. Sometimes my work, desirable availability or air fares did not support this approach. In case it is not obvious, I was tied to a school schedule. If unit size is not listed, it was a 2 bedroom.

Marriott's Monarch at Sea Pines 4 times - 1996-2000 (elected points each year). 440,000 travel award for 4 round trip tickets anywhere in world AA flew plus 2 one week stays at any Marriott and a discount on hertz rental though I do not remember the amount. My wife,2 sons and I did a London/Paris/Madrid/Malaga 23 day trip in 2000. This was when the rewards program was best in breed
Marriott's Heritage Club Labor Day Weekend 2001 ( We wanted to golf this year. All free rounds were at the Heritage Golf Club)
====== This is where I noticed the change in trade value
Marriott's Villas at Doral - Christmas 2002
Star Island Resort and Club - Christmas 2003 (gave this to my BIL)
Marriott Vacation Club Pulse Boston 1 bedroom Christmas 2004
Fort Lauderdale Beach Resort July - 2006 (gave this to my BIL)
Villa Roma Resort Lodges - Christmas 2007 - My nephew from Florida wanted to go skiing.
ESJ Towers Hotel 1 bedroom Thanksgiving - 2008
Water's Edge Resort and Spa 1 Bedroom Labor day 2009
Marriott's Fairway Villas - New Years 2011
Marriott's Aruba Surf Club - Studio April 2013
Marriott's Aruba Surf Club - August (within 60 day Trade) 2013
Marriott's Canyon Villas at Desert - 1 bedroom Christmas 2014
Marriott's Ocean Pointe Studio - Christmas 2015

You're welcome to use anything you deem helpful. I don't need any credit but anything that helps other members and TUG is always good in my book.

 

[DeeCee]

We are owners at Marriott Surfwatch in HH. We purchased a legacy gold week resale 6 years ago. I did not read everything completely through on this thread, so I'm probably off the mark here....but....if I may say, and this is just a suggestion but one that we decided to go with when we bought....buy where you want to stay the most. When we were looking into buying our first timeshare (which is DVC back in 2000, and is a point system) one of the things that kept coming up in my research was to buy where you want to stay the most (home resort with a booking advantage). It was a key point then and a key point when we bought our Surfwatch week. We went with where we want to be the most and when we want to travel there. So for us, gold season allows us to book a Spring or a Fall week each year, which is preferable for our travel times. And, we have done both seasons and love each of them the same.

So, if you are open to suggestions, then that is what I would suggest. We never tried to trade it, makes no sense to me to pay II membership and then pay exchange fees in the hopes that something would come up where and when we want to go. THIS is where and when we want to go every year.
That said, we do have the advantage of using DVC points for trading to other places, even though we only trade out once in a while.

Hope this helps and good luck in your decision.

Dee

 

[jme]

We are owners at Marriott Surfwatch in HH. We purchased a legacy gold week resale 6 years ago. I did not read everything completely through on this thread, so I'm probably off the mark here....but....if I may say, and this is just a suggestion but one that we decided to go with when we bought....buy where you want to stay the most. When we were looking into buying our first timeshare (which is DVC back in 2000, and is a point system) one of the things that kept coming up in my research was to buy where you want to stay the most (home resort with a booking advantage). It was a key point then and a key point when we bought our Surfwatch week. We went with where we want to be the most and when we want to travel there. So for us, gold season allows us to book a Spring or a Fall week each year, which is preferable for our travel times. And, we have done both seasons and love each of them the same.

So, if you are open to suggestions, then that is what I would suggest. We never tried to trade it, makes no sense to me to pay II membership and then pay exchange fees in the hopes that something would come up where and when we want to go. THIS is where and when we want to go every year.
That said, we do have the advantage of using DVC points for trading to other places, even though we only trade out once in a while.

Hope this helps and good luck in your decision.

Dee

Sound and solid advice!
The old adage to "buy where you want to go" is still true. That was the prevailing thought 25 years ago on TUG,
and we followed it and have had nothing but awesome experiences.
And that remained true to this day even after the advent of the Destination Points program in 2010.
We enrolled the weeks that qualified, but have never, and won't, buy more Abound (Destination) Points.
So we have some unenrolled resale weeks, but those are pure gravy.
We seldom use the Abound Points program because of the high point requirements (aka, cost!!), but we can still trade into those properties
by using Interval, thus spending basically only that maintenance fee to accomplish it.
(For example, to stay at another resort in high season using Abound Points, we would need to convert a deeded week (even a platinum week),
but obtain addition points to gain that week, so the cost rises tremendously. Why do that?
If we had purchased Abound Points at some point, there's the high cost of the point requirement, plus the high maintenance fee of the points,
plus the uncertainty of the wait list, etc, etc.)

Some of our friends bought deeded weeks at "other" resorts which required flying, etc,
and they now either have sold them, traded them every year, rented them exclusively, or given the stays away.
I would encourage anyone looking at resale purchases of deeded weeks to couple that "ideal resort and season" with a second purchase,
and that being a lockoff deeded week with a long platinum season that would overlap the initial purchase in case they wanted to split and trade back into that resort,
perhaps to turn it into THREE weeks there.

Another option would be to split trade the lockoffs for those "other resort" stays, wherever that may be.
That combination will be hard to beat in performance over the years, and as for flexibility, it's as good as it gets.
We've been all over this country and also to Europe several times, and would use the same purchase strategy if deciding again.
It makes for visits to so many varied destinations, plus staying at the "home resort" annually if desired, and as the family grows and changes,
it allows easy adaptation of travel plans for including the grown-up kids and also grandkids into the mix. The options evolve with the family.

 

[scoutings]

@Dean
Thanks
I found this very informative
Do I have this right?

In terms of a "HIGH demand request" your analysis is that the traders would be ranked as follows:

Elite resorts

1) Gold Ca Desert weeks ( I assume Plat would be better but a usual higher purchase price excludes it as a "trader")
2) Grand Vista Plat
3) Grande Chateau Plat

Premier resorts

4) Willow Ridge, Harbor Lake, Manor Club all rated about the same

In terms of a non "High demand request" the resorts would be ranked :

1) Gold Ca Desert weeks
2) Grand Vista Plat
3) Grande Chateau, Willow Ridge, Harbor Lake, Manor Club all Plat and all rated about the same

Is that about right?

What is "Gold Ca Desert weeks"?

 

[Pamplemousse]

What is "Gold Ca Desert weeks"?

You’ve dug up an old thread here but I assume Ca means California and so they meant the Palm Desert resorts.

 

[dioxide45]

What is "Gold Ca Desert weeks"?

I would think they are referring to Marriott's Desert Springs Villas 1 or 2 or Shadow Ridge.

 

[scoutings]

I would think they are referring to Marriott's Desert Springs Villas 1 or 2 or Shadow Ridge.

Do you think these all trade the same and still better than all other Marriott's (referring back to Dean's 2 year old post).

 

[dioxide45]

Do you think these all trade the same and still better than all other Marriott's (referring back to Dean's 2 year old post).

I think Palms Desert resorts have lost a lot of their desire as traders because the maintenance fees are nearing $2250 then the additional county property tax billed separately. I wouldn't buy one to use as a trader.

 

[scoutings]

I think Palms Desert resorts have lost a lot of their desire as traders because the maintenance fees are nearing $2250 then the additional county property tax billed separately. I wouldn't buy one to use as a trader.

Thanks @dioxide45

 

[Dean]

I think Palms Desert resorts have lost a lot of their desire as traders because the maintenance fees are nearing $2250 then the additional county property tax billed separately. I wouldn't buy one to use as a trader.

IMO a Gold (White) week in CA desert has been a semi reasonable option in the past but as noted, fees have gone up so much. However, one can often get a Platinum (Red) week there for the range of the other resorts being mentioned. A good Platinum week in season will have more trading power and for some, might be worth the added fees, especially if they'll use it at times. It'll also have better rentability than the other options discussed.

 

[buildsmart]

I purchased a Platinum week LO including the Florida Club 11 years ago though Tug. I have had varied success in trading through II. I have been trying to sell my week on TUG for about a year now. I started at $4500 now I am down to $1500. Everyone speaks of GV as a premier location. Why can't I sell It?

 

[knowlan]

I’ve been a Marriott owner for over 35 years with a total of 15 legacy weeks on Maui (Ocean Club) and in Palm Desert Resort (V1). All weeks in high season. The fees in both locations climbed to the point where Maui was $2800 (before a $600 2 year special assessment) and Palm Desert to $2300. While I believe that owning (to use) is still a good deal for stays of (say) up to 3 or 4 weeks, for anything over that it is more economical to rent a house. For example, our Palm Desert weeks were essentially costing $10K for a month. I have just rented a very nice 2 BR house in high season for $6.5K per month. A larger, nicer one: maximum $8K. We typically stay for 4 to 8 weeks at a time, so renting a house is a huge saving. I’ve used past tense because I’m now in the final stages of selling all 15 of my timeshare weeks.
Goodbye to timeshare and all of the 12/13 month 6 am (Pacific) phone calls to book (amongst other hassles and costs). It was great in the early days but now it is time to move on.

 

[Dean]

I purchased a Platinum week LO including the Florida Club 11 years ago though Tug. I have had varied success in trading through II. I have been trying to sell my week on TUG for about a year now. I started at $4500 now I am down to $1500. Everyone speaks of GV as a premier location. Why can't I sell It?

Many factors including the value is in trading, the fees have gone up and Orlando is overbuilt. The actual value to the seller is around zero by the time you pay any fees. You can likely give it back, Marriott now charges $400 to do so. You can likely get someone to take it and pay the transfer costs. I think this has always been the case with GV generally speaking, for quite some time. I don't recall a time when GV was worth $4500 resale since I've followed this issue including 11 years ago. If you don't want it I'd offer it for free on TUG with seller paying fees. The value of GV is in it's usage as a trader.

 

[DanH]

I highly recommend purchasing the non-Marriott sourced weeks - at least it worked for us.

We purchased outside Marriott 2 weeks back in early 2000's, red season (top season) in Desert Springs Villas and went almost every year. Easy trader. We have since moved to AZ (from OR) and can now drive there. Good advice on picking a resort you frequent the most. Trading on II, especially a year out, has always given us what we wanted in the Marriott system. We rented a couple times using ourselves, and later using Redweek. It was fairly easy, Redweek made it easy. They will send you a tax statement and you use that to deduct your costs for renting and pay on the gain (if any.) I imagine trading to the Caribbean off-peak would be easy - but if you go there a lot and willing to assume the risk, then give it a try.

We took advantage of some one-time offer with Marriott who moved our weeks into their program and we bought 1000 points. Nice to get a few nights before or after a week vacation. It is expensive, but does reduce our II fees for splitting, etc. Is it worth it, I'm not sure. Points are not worth it IMHO compared to booked weeks.

I would be curious to know where in my Marriott docs I would find the FROR clause. (I feel like scanning that document and importing into GROK and asking it questions about my contract.)

 

[DanH]

One more point - with AirBnb there is less demand for rentals of timeshares, just pick a resort and season where there is high demand...that might change over time, but places that are overbuilt like Orlando are harder to rent. We own at Eagle Crest, it is a great, great trader, but not a good renter. I'm not 100% sure why, but I think for that location, there are a lot of shorter stays (less than a week) and people just rent a hotel room or home (like AirBnb) for a few nights.

 

[HudsHut]

Here is a list of units for rent at Marriott Frenchaman's Cove, so you can look at the dates you may typically travel there, and what that might cost if you do not own there.

Marriott's Frenchman's Cove Timeshare Rentals | RedWeek

Rent directly from Marriott's Frenchman's Cove owners, starting at just $386/night. By-owner rates often 25 - 50% lower than the resort's!

www.redweek.com

 

[DeeCee]

“One great advantage of buying resale is that you can usually recover your investment should you want out.“

Good point. I did not read through every post, but do want to share our experience, my math and my two cents.

We were thinking “buy where we want to stay the most” when we started looking at Marriott. This avoids trading, renting, etc because we still can’t wait to get there year after year.

We purchased a Surfwatch Gold Season Garden View 2 bedroom legacy week in Hilton Head, back in 2018 after sitting through a rather pushy point sales presentation. After that presentation, I started doing some research. At that time, MVC week resales actually had a website. We were looking specifically for gold season week because we spend our summers at the beach here at home. I wanted a shoulder season week in a beach resort close to home.

We wound up purchasing directly through Marriott (my husband was more comfortable with that). I do think we overpaid (now that I know more with TUG and resale websites). However, we have no regrets. With the transfer fees and pro-rated MF’s we paid $6000. In our presentation the price for points was around $28,000 with only enough points for 5 nights.

As far as my math, I add the purchase price and the MF’s for each year and divide by how many years we used it. We are way ahead in terms of our out of pocket vs rack rates. That will soften the blow when the time comes to have to sell (get too old to travel we hope!), because I know we won’t get back our $6000.

One thing I think about is leaving it to our adult kids. We don’t want to leave them a commitment of costs, and at this point in time they’re not interested in owning any TS. So I do think about eventually selling….and how that will work out.

In the meantime, to OP, keep up the research there’s a lot of personal specifics to consider and good luck with your purchase and planning!

Have a great day,

Dee

 

[Larry M]

WHAT DO YOU GAIN WITH A DEEDED WEEK?

Everyone seems to be missing a key point here. Deeded week ownership agreements often come with a Sunset Clause. It's a guaranteed exit (with money back). If carefully timed right, it can come at the time when you're ready to stop traveling.

It can also apply when the resort is hit by hurricanes, floods, wildfires, earthquakes, or the deadly trap of deferred maintenance. If this clause is in the contract, it's a simple matter for the board to move the date in closer when one of these situations arises. Been there. Done that. Bought in around 2007 for $1500 including closing. Got a check for $5500 in 2020 when they closed out.

 

[TheTimeTraveler]

I purchased a Platinum week LO including the Florida Club 11 years ago though Tug. I have had varied success in trading through II. I have been trying to sell my week on TUG for about a year now. I started at $4500 now I am down to $1500. Everyone speaks of GV as a premier location. Why can't I sell It?

I'd advise you to place in advertisement in the "TUG Free Timeshare Giveaway Forum" and be done with it. Orlando is seriously overbuilt with motels, hotels and timeshares (leading to higher vacancy rates and too much competition).

Cut the cord and get out now while you still can relatively easily.














.

 

[Hindsite]

WHAT DO YOU GAIN WITH A DEEDED WEEK?

Everyone seems to be missing a key point here. Deeded week ownership agreements often come with a Sunset Clause. It's a guaranteed exit (with money back). If carefully timed right, it can come at the time when you're ready to stop traveling.

It can also apply when the resort is hit by hurricanes, floods, wildfires, earthquakes, or the deadly trap of deferred maintenance. If this clause is in the contract, it's a simple matter for the board to move the date in closer when one of these situations arises. Been there. Done that. Bought in around 2007 for $1500 including closing. Got a check for $5500 in 2020 when they closed out.

I've not seen a sunset clause in an MVC Deeded week, which was the one that you bought in 2007 and then got paid out in 2020? The non-US ones have something similar in terms of the term of the Right To Use. MVC is also quite good when not deferring maintenance and weeks taken back usually end up back with the Developer or in the points system so don't rest with the HoA as a problem that they have to fund the Maint Fees for long term.

 

[suzannesimon]

Everyone here has given you great advice. I would just like to add a couple thoughts. I own 10 Marriott and Vistana weeks. 8 were bought resales. I have 3 fixed week 51’s at Frenchman’s Cove and 1 is a 3 bedroom. I also have a 3 bedroom Gold at Aruba Surf Club which is a lockoff. All the weeks were bought with the thought of renting what we don’t use and it has worked well. Most of them rent at least $1000 over maintenance and the 3 bedrooms more than double maintenance. The 3BR’s also fly off the market in about 2-4 weeks. If I were buying now. I would buy 3 BR gold or platinum weeks at Aruba Surf.

 

[Dean]

I've not seen a sunset clause in an MVC Deeded week, which was the one that you bought in 2007 and then got paid out in 2020? The non-US ones have something similar in terms of the term of the Right To Use. MVC is also quite good when not deferring maintenance and weeks taken back usually end up back with the Developer or in the points system so don't rest with the HoA as a problem that they have to fund the Maint Fees for long term.

There are some but not many and I'm not aware that any of them entitle the expiring owner to value at the ending.

 

[Chucez]

Hi all, totally new on this forum, (moderators please feel free to move this thread if I posted it in the wrong sub forum.)

We have has been a lifelong Marriott loyals when it comes to hotels for both business and vacations (lifetime platinum), we both like the brand and the quality of the property’s, we recently started looking at the MVC, thru my research I quickly realized it just doesn’t make financial sense buying into thru MVC, buy the resale market is intriguing me…

We vacation quite a lot in the Caribbean so purchasing a week at Frenchman’s cove seems enticing with what seems to be a reasonable maintenance fee considering what a comparable weeks stay in a hotel would cost. This bring on a few question which might sound silly for you pros:

1. from what I found on the forum, Frenchman’s cove does NOT have a ROFR, hypothetically, if I win an eBay auction for a deeded week for $1 I just have to pay the yearly maintenance fees after transfer fees etc?

2.I know Marriott won’t allow us to trade our week for Bonvoy points to use at other properties if we buy resale, but I assume I can still use it to trade on II?

3.if we decided to skip a stay one year, how hard is it to rent/let family stay instead? Is it a hassle?

4.do we have an option to extend our stay by paying for extra nights?

5.god forbid a hurricane wipes out the resort, or some serious issue makes it uninhabitable, could we as deed holder be required to pay a special assessment?

6.it seems maintenance fees increase on average 3-6% yearly, is this comparable to other TC company’s?

7. How fast do the weeks book? Let say we get a gold season, what are our actual chances of getting a booking in mid December?

Thank in advance for answering what probably are simple questions!

Just came across this post. Curious as to the out come.
My 2c: Dont buy to recoup maintenance fees by renting; makes no sense, not worth it.
There will be almost no value when you want to exit the situation.

 

[Chucez]

WHAT DO YOU GAIN WITH A DEEDED WEEK?

Everyone seems to be missing a key point here. Deeded week ownership agreements often come with a Sunset Clause. It's a guaranteed exit (with money back). If carefully timed right, it can come at the time when you're ready to stop traveling.

It can also apply when the resort is hit by hurricanes, floods, wildfires, earthquakes, or the deadly trap of deferred maintenance. If this clause is in the contract, it's a simple matter for the board to move the date in closer when one of these situations arises. Been there. Done that. Bought in around 2007 for $1500 including closing. Got a check for $5500 in 2020 when they closed out.

Which resort was this?

 

[Dean]

WHAT DO YOU GAIN WITH A DEEDED WEEK?

Everyone seems to be missing a key point here. Deeded week ownership agreements often come with a Sunset Clause. It's a guaranteed exit (with money back). If carefully timed right, it can come at the time when you're ready to stop traveling.

It can also apply when the resort is hit by hurricanes, floods, wildfires, earthquakes, or the deadly trap of deferred maintenance. If this clause is in the contract, it's a simple matter for the board to move the date in closer when one of these situations arises. Been there. Done that. Bought in around 2007 for $1500 including closing. Got a check for $5500 in 2020 when they closed out.

I assume this was one of the Royal resorts, I don't think that's a common expectation for RTU timeshares. For Aruba resorts I don't think it's completely clear what to expect on the ending of the RTU.