SURF CLUB and OC owners- let Marriot know how we feel

[m61376]

We stayed @ Marriott Aruba 6 years ago. It was obvious then that the place was crowded. Very crowded. Too many people, too little space on the beach and @ the pool. Since that time Marriott, has built another development. Why are you complaining? When you bought, you knew there was only X amount of beach space. Where did you think they were going to put everybody?? If you don't like it, sell.

Crowded is a relative term. Thousands of people flock to Waikiki beach every year and love it; now, that is what I call a crowded beach. Even during peak season I don't feel the beach at the SC is crowded; we had plenty of room all around us. Yes, from what I have heard it is crowded Christmas week, just like every other place in the Caribbean, but otherwise (except I'd guess President's week) it is not overcrowded. The expanded beach area was largely unused (was first being spruced up) while we were there and there was a lot of unused space, ample for the new villas. The pool area was likewise being expanded and they are considering adding another pool if needed.

I still feel it is a wonderful place. This is not a scathing attack on the Surf Club but a protest over a new policy that has been instituted which I think is awful. In an effort to improve a workable, albeit flawed system, they are substituting a system which, IMHO, has the potential to ruin an otherwise incredible vacation. This is the first place I have actually enjoyed sitting out and mellowing for the week on the beach and I want to preserve that ability.

In their defense, I have already received responses from 2 individuals, one of whom I have had a back and forth e-mail "conversation" with. I do not feel this policy was instituted to extract blood from owners in the form of additional fees or out of disregard for owners. I do feel it was and is a misguided attempt to improve a flawed system. It is clear to me that they are responsive to their owners and, as I stated above, need to hear from people who are unhappy with the new system.

When they instituted the trial system they were getting a lot of positive feedback and have mistaken this to mean that it was a good system. In general, the trial period was during a busy but not busiest time and, from what others have told me, people who wanted to continue staying on the beach in the afternoon were able to switch palapas just by seeing a free one (not having to stand in line again, not having to pay another fee). In addition, for the most part owners had not been down for about a year and this was the first time they had the opportunity to view and enjoy the expanded beach area and see the docks moved, so that engendered a positive overall resposne with the beach, regardless of the palapa policy, since things were much better than they were last year.

This shouldn't be viewed as a forum to condemn Marriott or the Surf Club. I still think it is a wonderful resort. I just want to make sure that my family and I can continue to enjoy a wonderful vacation there and to force them to reconsider what I feel is a policy that will be detrimental to our enjoyment of the resort.

 

[Eric]

This is of course your opinion and not fact and despite what you think, you may be in the minority

When they instituted the trial system they were getting a lot of positive feedback and have mistaken this to mean that it was a good system.

 

[IslandJoe]

My daughter was with me at the Ocean Club last week and I observed that the new system seems to be working. Granted you aren't guaranteed a palapa all day but you do get one. I saw at least 20-25 palapas unused every day as late as 11-noon every day at the Surf Club. Just thought everyone should check it out before they get thier blood pressure out of whack.

 

[m61376]

This is of course your opinion and not fact and despite what you think, you may be in the minority

When they instituted the trial system they were getting a lot of positive feedback and have mistaken this to mean that it was a good system.

Eric- yes, you are right- I am voicing an opinion. What confuses me is why you are constantly attacking me. If you have first hand familiarity with the resort and disagree, that's fine. In fact, if I was the only one who feels the way I do, then I would have to accept it. However, from other people who I have spoken to I know I am not the only one.

It is possible that imposing a fee will have discouraged enough of a call for the palapas as the above poster suggests. However, given that they couldn't reserve enough of them in advance over the peak winter months, I am fairly certain that it will be an awful system during peak time. While it makes sense to assess the program when things aren't as busy, it does give a different impression on how things work. I know in January there certainly weren't 25-30 palapas free at 11-12:00 as the above poster suggested, not even one day.

 

[Eric]

Opinions are great, its just how you say it

""When they instituted the trial system they were getting a lot of positive feedback and have mistaken this to mean that it was a good system""

That tells me you are saying they are wrong. Wrong in YOUR opinion but maybe not the masses. Any company will do what the majority wants and MANY people still won't like it but if its the fairest way, then the rest have to get over it.

This is of course your opinion and not fact and despite what you think, you may be in the minority





Eric- yes, you are right- I am voicing an opinion. What confuses me is why you are constantly attacking me. If you have first hand familiarity with the resort and disagree, that's fine. In fact, if I was the only one who feels the way I do, then I would have to accept it. However, from other people who I have spoken to I know I am not the only one.

It is possible that imposing a fee will have discouraged enough of a call for the palapas as the above poster suggests. However, given that they couldn't reserve enough of them in advance over the peak winter months, I am fairly certain that it will be an awful system during peak time. While it makes sense to assess the program when things aren't as busy, it does give a different impression on how things work. I know in January there certainly weren't 25-30 palapas free at 11-12:00 as the above poster suggested, not even one day.

 

[Smooth Air]

This "discussion" reminds me of "a thing" some of us got into a couple of weeks ago. I posted to say I was not happy w/ a couple of things @ Ocean Pointe: One being what I consider to be loud, very bad bar music that intrudes upon our peace & quiet; the other being "chair hogs" who claim their territory @ 7:00AM. Well, guess what? Turns out that I am in the minority on both these issues. It was interesting to see things from the other guy's perspective. With respect to the music, some people absolutely love the "happy" tunes! And, with respect to the "Chair hogs" I was encouraged to "get over it" & go sit on the grass! These responses helped me to see that I was making a very big deal about nothing. Maybe , just maybe, you are doing the same here with "the new palapa Policy." Go to the Aruban equivalent of Target & buy a chair w/ an umbrella, pour yourself a cool one & just chill!

 

[m61376]

Eric- What you have stated, albeit somewhat acrimoniously (and your reason for that escapes me), underscores my point. The management cannot state that "most" people are happy with the policy unless they have polled the owners to determine if the majority like the new policy. The fact that they have had a limited number of complaints over the few weeks that they tried it does not mean that the majority of owners like the new policy, yet that is exactly what they are assuming. Just because a lot of people haven't been yelling and screaming about it doesn't mean most people like it and, furthermore, in the two week trial it is safe to say that they were gauging the reactions of less than 4% of the owners during that timeframe.

 

[Eric]

Would you prefer they say most people "so far" Geez, give it up

People love to complain so YES they would be yelling and screaming just like you are. Even though its only 2 weeks, my guess is if it works to 2 weeks it will work for 52 weeks and again, you will have to get over it.

Just because a lot of people haven't been yelling and screaming about it doesn't mean most people like it and, furthermore, in the two week trial it is safe to say that they were gauging the reactions of less than 4% of the owners during that timeframe.

 

[Eric]

That is 100% what I am saying. Resorts do thier best and just because you don't like something or agree with it, doesn't mean it's wrong.

This "discussion" reminds me of "a thing" some of us got into a couple of weeks ago. I posted to say I was not happy w/ a couple of things @ Ocean Pointe: One being what I consider to be loud, very bad bar music that intrudes upon our peace & quiet; the other being "chair hogs" who claim their territory @ 7:00AM. Well, guess what? Turns out that I am in the minority on both these issues. It was interesting to see things from the other guy's perspective. With respect to the music, some people absolutely love the "happy" tunes! And, with respect to the "Chair hogs" I was encouraged to "get over it" & go sit on the grass! These responses helped me to see that I was making a very big deal about nothing. Maybe , just maybe, you are doing the same here with "the new palapa Policy." Go to the Aruban equivalent of Target & buy a chair w/ an umbrella, pour yourself a cool one & just chill!

 

[m61376]

Sheesh- the purpose of my post was not to get into a diatribe with any of you or to be subject to your derision. I find that really disappointing. My purpose was simply to voice my concerns and alert people to the fact that the management is under the impression that most people are happy with the new policy. If that is, in fact, the case I will have to learn to live with it or make alternative arrangements. However, if others feel it is not in their best interests, I am simply suggesting that they let management know how they feel so that hopefully they will be responsive to their owners.

Receiving sarcastic comments from people who may not even be owners at the resort in question (and even if you are) is not called for!

 

[Eric]

You need to read your first post. You state the policy is NOT acceptable to the majority of owners. You don't know that yet think everyone agrees with you.
You mention many people are VERY upset with the new policy. What, 2 TUG members emailed you ? You are doing exactly what you are accusing Marriott of doing which is asking a few people and thinking thats the majority.
As you have been told already, chill out and let the resort try and do what's best for the majority of the owners. That may or may not be you so except that.

I apologize for starting a new thread but I wanted to attract attention to this thread; I am pretty upset and I hope others will join me and let management know that their new palapa policy of morning and afternoon reservations (only half day availability), all made in advance and for a fee, is NOT acceptable to the majority of owners!

It is apparent that many people are VERY upset with the new palapa policy. As per my correspondence with the Vice President of the BOD, the Boards of the OC and the SC have adopted a new palapa policy under the mistaken impression that this works best for most people.

 

[m61376]

Not that I have to defend myself to you, but I have actually spoken to several more than 2 owners and no one is happy with the policy. The most positive response I have heard is that they wanted to wait and see for themselves when down there next month. Believe it or not, Tug is not the only venue to talk to owners and, moreover, I happen to know several personally.

I have freely admitted that I don't know how the majority of owners feel. Just like Marriott did a small sampling and they don't really know how the majority feels. My post was an attempt to get people to voice their concerns not only on message boards (and, btw, Tug is not the only message board to be actively discussing this; I actually learnt about it elsewhere), but directly to the powers that be who can modify the system.

Thankfully, unlike you, the Marriott management apprears, at least, to be responsive to the concerns and opinions of their owners and is receptive to hearing them and will hopefully act accordingly. It is in everyone's best interest (except perhaps yours, if you are even an owner there) to let them know how you feel so that the Surf Club can continue to be a fabulous property and in high demand both for personal use and to retain its trading power, which is why we all invested in it.

PS- your statement: "That may or may not be you so except that."- what I take exception to is your attitude; obviously, iIF (and that's a big IF) most people are truly happy with the new system of waiting in lines and musical chairs, then that's their perogative and I will, obviously, have to accept that .

 

[Eric]

Ahh, actually you have not. You said the complete opposite. Your exact quote is
"
all made in advance and for a fee, is NOT acceptable to the majority of owners!"

[QUOTE=m61376

I have freely admitted that I don't know how the majority of owners feel.

 

[m61376]

Eric- this bantering should end. Obviously you are intent on blasting me for some unknown reason. I don't even know if you are a SC owner, so have a vested interest in the topic, or just like being nasty to a stranger. If you bothered to take my post in the context in which it was written, it was intended to generate interest in getting people to complain to the management to convince them that they were wrong stating that most people were happy with this. I read numerous comments, all negative, before I made this post; the intent was that complaining on a bulletin board doesn't effectuate change- we have to let the powers that be know we are unhappy and, if the sentiment is as expressed by the others I have heard from, to let them know that in fact the majority of owners are unhappy. If it turns out that I am wrong, like I said before, then I don't have to like it but when you buy a condo or coop- and a timeshare is like purchasing a piece of one- you cannot make independent decisions like in your own home and have to go along with the majority. Except in a condo or coop there is a vote, and my point here was that an assessment of the feelings of all the owners was never done.

If you own at the SC then you are certainly entitled to express your opinion. If you don't, please stop giving me a hard time just for the purpose of being nasty.

 

[jerseygirl]

M61376 -- Don't let Eric bother you. He defends Marriott regardless of the issue. You're definitely not the first, nor probably the last, to be on the other side of his mean spirited posts. My theory (since he first started posting): He's a Marriott sales rep.

 

[m61376]

THANKS!! I was wondering there....

 

[Eric]

Blasting you ? Please, All I am saying is you went of on a rant and spouted things that were not true.Actually I just pointing out what specifically you said which is that MOST owners don't like the new system when it fact you meant, "I don't like the new system so everyone should agree with me and get them to change it"

What part of " Most owners don't like the new system" was taken out of context ?
You said it and had no facts to back it up, END

Eric- this bantering should end. Obviously you are intent on blasting me for some unknown reason. I don't even know if you are a SC owner, so have a vested interest in the topic, or just like being nasty to a stranger. If you bothered to take my post in the context in which it was written,

 

[m61376]

I give up trying to convince you of what I meant. Your mind is obviously closed. It is interesting that in all your negative commentary you do not mention any first hand expereince with the system, nor offer any positive or negative constructive criticism. You are just being obstreperous, which makes one wonder what your motives are....

 

[Eric]

You said what you meant. You are now just trying to backtrack because what you said made no sense and you were stating the opinion of a few yet made it sound like you knew what the majority wanted. I have given positive criticism, you were just to busy trying to NOT admit your statement was not based on facts. What I said was all HOA's try and do whats best for the masses and will do that most times BUT that still means alot of people won't be happy with thier decision.

I give up trying to convince you of what I meant. Your mind is obviously closed. It is interesting that in all your negative commentary you do not mention any first hand expereince with the system, nor offer any positive or negative constructive criticism. You are just obstreperousness, which makes one wonder what your motives are....

 

[m61376]

OK- I will clarify things to make YOU happy- if others feel that the new palapa system is not in their best interests, please write the Marriott Board members and let them know how you feel about it. They are under the impression, from their limited surveyance done over a 2 week period, during which most members did not voice complaints, that most members were happy with the new policy. From my limited discussions with other members I feel the majority of people really will be unhappy with this new policy and, if that is the case, instead of complaining to each other by posting on BB we need to let the powers that be know we are unhappy and request that they modify the policy for everyone's benefit so that, in fact, the majority of owners are happy with it.

Now, I hope that makes you happy too Eric- I am not backtracking, btw, as once again you acrimoniously suggested- that was the intent of my original post. Too bad you are too narrow-minded to have seen it that way.

BTW- when I suggested that you give positive criticism I did not mean that you positively should criticize me. Once again, you seem to need clarification. What I meant was that, if you are an owner at the SC and/or have first-hand knowledge of the property, and can offer either positive or negative criticism or suggestions regarding the palapa policy, that would be much more welcome than a personal attack on me.

 

[Eric]

I have not once said anything bad about you yet you just called me narrow-minded so it seems you are a hypocrite . Actually I do own there and don't spend my time complaining about shade on the beach because if I want shade, I go to my room. Its vacation, why is it people from NY can never relax.

BTW
The intent of your original post was to let people believe you were right in your opinion and owners should be up in arms when in fact it seems most people like the new system and you are just causing trouble. Its a shame owners can't leave well enough alone.

OK- I will clarify things to make YOU happy- if others feel that the new palapa system is not in their best interests, please write the Marriott Board members and let them know how you feel about it. They are under the impression, from their limited surveyance done over a 2 week period, during which most members did not voice complaints, that most members were happy with the new policy. From my limited discussions with other members I feel the majority of people really will be unhappy with this new policy and, if that is the case, instead of complaining to each other by posting on BB we need to let the powers that be know we are unhappy and request that they modify the policy for everyone's benefit so that, in fact, the majority of owners are happy with it.

Now, I hope that makes you happy too Eric- I am not backtracking, btw, as once again you acrimoniously suggested- that was the intent of my original post. Too bad you are too narrow-minded to have seen it that way.

BTW- when I suggested that you give positive criticism I did not mean that you positively should criticize me. Once again, you seem to need clarification. What I meant was that, if you are an owner at the SC and/or have first-hand knowledge of the property, and can offer either positive or negative criticism or suggestions regarding the palapa policy, that would be much more welcome than a personal attack on me.

 

[m61376]

Please, don't start down that "people from NY" route....

I go to Aruba to relax on the beach. If I want to stay inside I can enjoy the comforts of my own home. Admittedly, I don't like to burn to a crisp...I never did, but after burying a close friend due to melanoma last year I am poignantly aware that being a sun worshipper is not all it's cracked up to be.

Oh- I am glad you own there, am glad you don't look for shade, and am absolutely amazed that you are so omnicient that you know that most people like the new system.

I guess my personality is not passive enough to just "leave well enough alone." I think Marriott runs a great facility and great resorts in general but, like me, they are not perfect.

 

[qlaval]

GEEEE!
Eric I can't hardly understand why after making your point you have to be the one with the last word on somebody thread...
m61376 is probably one of the nicest contributer to this forum.
Patient and generous in her writing and always eager to help others even the newbie who needs lots of infos.

Why I'm adding this to the debate?
Because if m61376 wasn't such a nice contributer to this board I might have understand why you're doing what you're doing....but frankly I can't see why.
Now you're into where people come from next what it will be? Race...
Come on make your point add a little if you want but why the obsession to have THE truth.
Do you always need to win? Even if you're right? Come on give the lady a break...

 

[hipslo]

GEEEE!
Eric I can't hardly understand why after making your point you have to be the one with the last word on somebody thread...
m61376 is probably one of the nicest contributer to this forum.
Patient and generous in her writing and always eager to help others even the newbie who needs lots of infos.

Why I'm adding this to the debate?
Because if m61376 wasn't such a nice contributer to this board I might have understand why you're doing what you're doing....but frankly I can't see why.
Now you're into where people come from next what it will be? Race...
Come on make your point add a little if you want but why the obsession to have THE truth.
Do you always need to win? Even if you're right? Come on give the lady a break...

I find I am able to identify most of Eric's posts on any topic before reading the signature line. Not based on what he says, but on how he says it. I am often quite taken aback by his tone. I find this quite puzzling. I also think I'd probably put more stock in his point of view if it were stated more respectfully.

 

[TUGBrian]

knock off the silly argument and get back to the topic at hand...

I think it was something marriott related? =)