Royal Holiday Club and Affina Hotels

[Iowa Rod]

I have been a tugger for some time and I had never heard of Royal Holiday Club. I love NYC and love to travel there. I have often thought about a Manhattan Club purchase. I just came across Royal Holiday Club. How does it work and how do you get to use the Manhattan hotels? Is this a viable option for Manhattan lodging? Any idea how how you get to reserve there and if its difficult to secure a reservation.
Thanks so much,
Rof

 

[Spence]

If you plan in advance, there's lot's to be had, look here. Have you read their Operating Rules, that's how it works, that link was found here. A casual glance finds next and ongoing availability at Affinia Dumont as

13/17/20/24/27/31 Jan07 (beginning of Jan is booked)
3/7/10/14/17/21/24/28 Feb
3/7/10/14/17/21/24/28/31 Mar
11/14/18/21/25/28 Apr (Easter is booked)
2/5/9/12/16/19/23/26/30 May
2/6/9/13/23/26/30 Jun (hole in mid June, JoeMid already got it)
4/7/11/14/18/21/25/28 Jul
and on and on....
Thanksgiving, Xmas, NYs are gone but everything else is there to be had.

..... you get the idea, there is amazing availability and it's very obvious that most members wait to book until the HAVE to pay the maintenance fees, that's why there's nothing left for '06 as MFs were due last Jan and are not due again until Jan07. This is a boon for people that can plan.

There are three Manhattan RHC properties seen here, one or more sizes were available at Affinia Dumont for all the dates shown above, for some reason online the 'Ambassador' units do not show up you have to call for them and for the other properties, as only the Affinia Dumont is searchable online, it is also the cheapest in points required. So now you know how many points you need to buy, Rod.

If you can plan, this is an amazing membership. MFs associated with the points are MUCH lower than for TMC maybe even half and the cost to purchase?

Royal Holiday Club PLATINUM 40,000 Points Timeshare
Item number: 200024204658 only $4350 total. This would've gotten you two weeks in a Studio in low season to almost one week in a 1BR (Sleeps SIX) for New Years! MFs only $830 (eBay post was wrong).

Here another that closed yesterday
Royal Holiday Club PLATINUM Points GOLD CROWN Timeshare
NO RESERVE - 34,250 ANNUAL Points
Item number: 220024966579 only $2347 with MFs $765 (eBay post was wrong). An even better deal if you wanted fewer points.

I wouldn't buy anything smaller than these.

Here's a current auction
TIMESHARE RED 50,000 POINTS/CREDITS AT ROYAL HOLIDAY
NO RESERVE & NO TITLE FEE, PLATINUM PLUS MEMBERSHIP
Item number: 160030914593 MFs are really $895 (eBay post was wrong).
Go for it, looks like I recognize a TUGger has already bid on it.



Can I do any more homework for you?

 

[JoeMid]

Here's a current auction
TIMESHARE RED 50,000 POINTS/CREDITS AT ROYAL HOLIDAY
NO RESERVE & NO TITLE FEE, PLATINUM PLUS MEMBERSHIP
Item number: 160030914593 MFs are really $895 (eBay post was wrong).
Go for it, looks like I recognize a TUGger has already bid on it.

That's a good one! Allows 24month advance reservations (if RHC has the inventory 'loaded.' ) Thus you can get Thanksgiving, Christmas, and NYs in NYC. Higher point contracts have lower MF/pt ratios.

 

[aliikai2]

Yes,

Yes, it is I, and this one is mine, please go find your own!!

Greg

That's a good one! Allows 24month advance reservations (if RHC has the inventory 'loaded.' ) Thus you can get Thanksgiving, Christmas, and NYs in NYC. Higher point contracts have lower MF/pt ratios.

 

[Hoc]

I was one of the two TUGgers who originally alerted those here to the benefits of RHC. At the time, it was easy enough to pick up 25,000 points for around $300 plus the transfer fees. However, my recommendation came -- and still comes -- with a warning, that others who now own and use RHC tend to overlook: They are extremely screwed up administratively.

What does that mean? Well, for example, twice now, I have had to pay two maintenance fees for a year. Even when I was able to prove that I had paid (cancelled check once, credit card statement the other time), they just kept going back and said that the fees had not been paid for 2000, 1999, 1998, etc., until they finally found a year for which I no longer had records. It also means that often I have been unable to get written confirmation of my reservations, despite them telling me many times that they had sent it or would send it again.

Last May, I had made a reservation for two rooms at the Affinia Dumont, for five people. When I got there, they had a reservation for four rooms. When I told them I had only made my reservation for two rooms, they called Royal Holiday Club, who told them that I only had a reservation for one room. So five of us had to crowd into a single room.

When I got back, only points for one room had been deducted from my account. So, I used the rest of the points to make a reservation for Madrid for next April. Six months later, they told me that they had used my 2007 points for April, and I would have to pay another maintenance fee to keep the reservation. So, I did, and next thing I knew, the rest of my 2006 points were gone, as well as my 2007 points.

Often, when you call and ask a question, the answer you get is whatever the service rep wants to make up on the spot without looking. Next time, you will get a different answer. So, you can't rely on what you are told. You need to read the plan documents, because those are the only rights you have.

These are specific examples of their lousy bookeeping and service. I still think it is a good value when you look at cost vs. benefits. However, if you are the type who gets frustrated with incompetence or the kind of inconvenience noted above, RHC is not for you. So, please consider the downside as well as the upside in making your decision.

 

[Whirl]

I agree with HOC, they do have some issues. I, however, have been fortunate enough that I have personally had very few issues and nothing of the magnitude of those HOC and some others seem to have experienced, but I must acknowledge they exist. For instance, I have never had a problem getting confirms. Just this week I had to get an updated confirm to add a guest to the reservation and got it within minutes of hanging up the phone...go figure.



On the other hand, for perspective, having also owned Fairfield ( another great program with a screwed up, but improving, I think, administration) I had to fight far more and more serious battles on numerous and varied issues with them.

But, the point is...while there are so many positives to the overall system, there really is no free lunch. You need some patience.


From casual observation, it seems that patience is inversely correlated with how much you paid for your membership...


Cheryl

 

[RonaldCol]

Time for a Movie ...

I was one of the two TUGgers who originally alerted those here to the benefits of RHC. At the time, it was easy enough to pick up 25,000 points for around $300 plus the transfer fees. However, my recommendation came -- and still comes -- with a warning, that others who now own and use RHC tend to overlook: They are extremely screwed up administratively.

What does that mean? Well, for example, twice now, I have had to pay two maintenance fees for a year. Even when I was able to prove that I had paid (cancelled check once, credit card statement the other time), they just kept going back and said that the fees had not been paid for 2000, 1999, 1998, etc., until they finally found a year for which I no longer had records. It also means that often I have been unable to get written confirmation of my reservations, despite them telling me many times that they had sent it or would send it again.

Last May, I had made a reservation for two rooms at the Affinia Dumont, for five people. When I got there, they had a reservation for four rooms. When I told them I had only made my reservation for two rooms, they called Royal Holiday Club, who told them that I only had a reservation for one room. So five of us had to crowd into a single room.

When I got back, only points for one room had been deducted from my account. So, I used the rest of the points to make a reservation for Madrid for next April. Six months later, they told me that they had used my 2007 points for April, and I would have to pay another maintenance fee to keep the reservation. So, I did, and next thing I knew, the rest of my 2006 points were gone, as well as my 2007 points.

Often, when you call and ask a question, the answer you get is whatever the service rep wants to make up on the spot without looking. Next time, you will get a different answer. So, you can't rely on what you are told. You need to read the plan documents, because those are the only rights you have.

These are specific examples of their lousy bookeeping and service. I still think it is a good value when you look at cost vs. benefits. However, if you are the type who gets frustrated with incompetence or the kind of inconvenience noted above, RHC is not for you. So, please consider the downside as well as the upside in making your decision.

I think it's time for National Lampoon's Timeshare Vacations movie to hit the big screen soon!

I volunteer as consultant to the director.

 

[RonaldCol]

But, the point is...while there are so many positives to the overall system, there really is no free lunch. You need some patience.


From casual observation, it seems that patience is inversely correlated with how much you paid for your membership...


Cheryl

Partially correct, Cheryl.

The price an owner paid has something to do with the amount of patience required in dealing with, and I stand corrected on this, the incompetent personnel within the timeshare industry.

(I personally think the timeshare industry is some sort of god-created black hole that only filters out and attracts the most incompetent people in the world. If there were a studio call for incompetent people, one would naturally go to the timeshare industry to find them in abundance.)

I'm getting distracted from my original response. Regardless of how much timeshare owners paid for their timeshares, patience is required. It's really a matter of fate that one relies on for speedy customer requests.

I do believe the frustration level of timeshare owners who paid retail prices is much higher than those of us who have paid resale pricing. Many times I've found myself sitting on the phone waiting to be the tenth in line to be attended to. At times like these I always think to myself the guy behind me, Mr. Eleven, paid full retail price and he's still waiting after me. This reduces my frustration level considerably.

 

[Blondie]

Spence and the others gave you some great info. I too bought resale- 15,000 points for $500 from Royal Holiday so add in the $395 closing, and another 15,000 on ebay with no closing cost. So, those contracts were combined and I now have one 30,000 points contract. A single point more and I would jump to the next higher level of maint fees (mine are now $600) so I like the 30,000 just fine. But, I had a nightmare of a time as somehow they transferred some back loan into my name from the second purchase. It took 8months and then I got pissed off when they began to deduct $ they thought I owed from a credit card I had used to pay maint fees. So, I sent out tons of registered letters including the BBB of Florida and claimed credit card fraud with VISA, etc, and FINALLY they fixed it. It was a disaster, really and I thought I would pull my hair out. BUT- I used my points to book two summer
'06 weekend stays (one for 3 days and one for 4) in the Affinia Dumont in a beautiful huge one bedroom condo. I am going back this summer of 2007 in the same big suite over July 4,5,6. My daugher lives in NYC so it is just perfect. Plus RHS allows you to rent your units and provides free guest certificates for you. Oddly, with all the crap I went through I will say it is still very worth it. I consider these points the gem in my timeshare portfolio. I do nodt know if it really is of value to be able to book 24 months out. I find that sometimes even within 12 months they cannot take your rez as the inventory is not yet available anyway. You will LOVE your points. Have a good company do the closing and get the guarantee of a clear title and you should be fine.

 

[Hoc]

Oddly, with all the crap I went through I will say it is still very worth it.

Ditto here. But, obviously, we both have a very high tolerance threshhold for incompetence and inconvenience. I just never want to be accused of falsely painting a rosy picture of RHC membership and luring unsuspecting TUGgers into a relationship with the Devil.

 

[Blondie]

Right, Hoc. This membership needs to be accompanied by a huge dose of patience and temerity!

 

[Whirl]

Partially correct, Cheryl.

The price an owner paid has something to do with the amount of patience required in dealing with, and I stand corrected on this, the incompetent personnel within the timeshare industry.

I think we agree here, my response, although unclear, was to imply that one finds being more patient easier the less you paid (inversely related) Versus your view which was more patience is "required" the more you paid (directly correlated). I think we are saying the same thing.

I also agree that patience in general is required throughout much of the timeshare industry. As I mentioned, I have had more difficult encounters with other systems, not just RHC. Even with the big guys like Marriott, you sometimes just have to sit back and take a deep breath.

Not having the sufficient degree of patience to deal with some of timesharing's little wrinkles is precisely why I own fewer weeks than I once did and am now happy to pay more of a top dollar if I can get what I want when I want.

Hoc, you and blondie really do have a high tolerance for inconvenience. Me, not so much. I would be quite done with RHC had those been my experiences, especially on an ongoing, not just one time occasion.

 

[Hoc]

Hoc, you and blondie really do have a high tolerance for inconvenience. Me, not so much. I would be quite done with RHC had those been my experiences, especially on an ongoing, not just one time occasion.

Give it time. It will happen. That's why everyone who buys at RHC just needs to be aware that this is SOP there, and realize that, while you don't pay a lot for your resale RHC membership with money, you do pay with aggravation.

 

[Whirl]

Give it time. It will happen. That's why everyone who buys at RHC just needs to be aware that this is SOP there, and realize that, while you don't pay a lot for your resale RHC membership with money, you do pay with aggravation.

Hey, sounds like you are putting a curse on me! I've had a pretty long run that has been relatively hassle free, probably should have kept my good fortune to myself ... Oh well, lets hope for the best.

Cheryl

 

[JoeMid]

Yes, it is I, and this one is mine, please go find your own!! Greg

I now see from the next bid that you did not put in a max bid of $99.99. Looks like Spence found you out, you cheapskate.

I've not had Hoc's experiences but it was hell 'unifying' my seven accounts. Now that that's done I've been a happy camper. Reservation Confirmations are now showing up online whether I made the reservation online or over the phone. I am leary about paying my MFs in advance to get those 24month or even 12month ahead reservations, I asked for a receipt and have never received one for paying MFs in advance. so far so good. In the early days, before unification thus simplification, I had a row over something on one of the accounts with Concord Services, their hatchet billing company, it was concluded to my satisfaction in short order. I can't remember the details anymore.

 

[Blondie]

So- now it seems to be overkill. I get one or two calls a MONTH from RHC, usually messages as I have not been home when they called, asking if everything is ok, can they assist in any way, yadda yadda yadda- two came this week. I got not one but two letters from RHC (and one from the BBB) stating that my situation is resolved and my account is paid in full. Got another letter yesterday from UPS that I had to sign for, asking since the "dispute" has been resolved would I then sign the letter they sent me stating my dispute is resolved (thanks but NO I will not sign anything)...
They like me; they really like me!!

 

[abc31]

RHC Platinum membership on ebay

I recently started looking into RHC as a means of staying in Manhattan. After Whirl posted a LMR at the Affinia Dumont, I emailed her with some questions & she was nice enough to give me an education.

I started looking on ebay for resales and came across the same listing for the 50,000 RHC plantinum points membership as Spence mentioned. Infact, when I saw Spence as a bidder, I wondered if it was the same Spence I have seen on this BBS.

There was a lot of things that concerned me with this listing, or I would have put in a bid myself. The seller as you mentioned, listed the MF incorrectly and although he added a comment with a correction, he never changed it in the actual listing.

He also listed the transfer fee as $50.00. I sent him a message telling him that I thought it was a $500.00 transfer fee. He then wrote me back saying it is either $50 or $100, not $500. I called RHC and they confirmed that the transfer fee is $500. I emailed back the seller and he never answered me.

The seller also states that he does not want to use a timeshare closing company. Considering all the mis-information in this seller's add, I am hesitating to bid on this auction as I think it would be a bit risky to purchase from this seller especially without a closing company.

 

[abc31]

Sorry, Duplicate post.

 

[Blondie]

It is not unusual for sellers to have misinformation. I think it is more likely that they are clueless than they are dulplicitious. The nice part of this auction is that the contract info is given to you and you can check with RHC about any back fees. (Of course, what they tell you is worthless much of the time!!) Anyway- this auction has a $195 cost which sounds like closing. I would ask them if they guratantee a clear title- period. If you are concerned about getting a good deal which can bite you in the behind, then I would skip ebay and suggest www.holidaygroup.com as I bought one of my packages there. They guarantee a clear title. You can check out what they have (they often have lots of RHC point packages and will take lower offers this time of year) and then offer very low. You will pay around $400 in closing but for an RHC purchase it is well worth it. As I said, all annoying things considered, I still am glad I bought mine. Love the Affinia Dumont!!! Good luck and tell us how you make out with a purchase. This is probably the best info I ever got on Tug, even after my SA buy for $395 and my firesale Pelican week 51 for $950!!!!:whoopie:

 

[eal]

Escrow

NEVER purchase a timeshare without using a closing company that provides escrow. The whole fiasco with Timeshare Liquidators, the story of which can be found at

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26506&highlight=timeshare+liquidators

is a case in point.

 

[Whirl]

I would skip ebay and suggest www.holidaygroup.com as I bought one of my packages there.

Ditto on Holiday Group. While I bought mine a long time ago, they were both through holiday group...They used to auction them on ebay with no reserve, not sure if this is still the case, but they can (or did) help work through some of the rough patches you may initially incur and could generally be purchased for less than the closing costs. I don't think that is the norm anymore, although might still be possible with patience.

Just the path of least resistance. I am not very up on current pricing, so can't tell you if this is the cheapest option, but a quick glance tells me they still seem pretty reasonable.

Also, both my weeks came with almost full year's points that had been rolled forward by the prior owner, so that can be a nice starter bonus, if you get lucky.

Good Luck,

Cheryl