RE: The "Transportation Fee @ Wyndham Bonnet Creek

[timeos2]

I own at three other Wyndham resorts that provide extensive amenities and don't charge owners from other Wyndham resorts any fees. Why should I need to pay $84 for a bus that I won't use. This is not big bucks but I think this violates the whole idea and concept of a mini system .

Amen. Why does anyone think there is any acceptable excuse for this?

 

[csxjohn]

I own at three other Wyndham resorts that provide extensive amenities and don't charge owners from other Wyndham resorts any fees. Why should I need to pay $84 for a bus that I won't use. This is not big bucks but I think this violates the whole idea and concept of a mini system .

$84 is big bucks for me for something I was not going to use.

It is enough to keep me away from that resort unless I go with and owner.

 

[csxjohn]

Amen. Why does anyone think there is any acceptable excuse for this?

You are right, this is not acceptable. If the BC owners think that this isn't going to start a liquid brown storm at other Wyndham resorts they are wrong.

If an amenity is going to be provided above and beyond the normal scope of timesharing I don't think the owners should foot the bill. But I also don't think the non owners should subsidize the owners either.

Why not just have everyone staying pay a smaller fee or have the users of the amenity pay what it actually costs.

This trend is going to be a lot of trouble for timeshare trading which was supposed to be a main selling point when this all began. "Hey, you can buy here but you can go here there and everywhere."

 

[MFT]

Went on their Facebook page, and saw this post:

Diane Kleineweber
This is a copy of an email I got and my reply Dear Guest: Thank you for your recent reservation at Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort. As you may know, the resort provides shuttle transportation to and from Walt Disney World® Resort, seven days a week for all individuals staying at the resort. Effective Friday, Feb. 15, 2013, the Bonnet Creek Resort Vacation Condominium Association, Inc. will begin implementing a $12 per unit/per day transportation fee. The fee applies to all reservations, except those made for units to be occupied by deeded owners at Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort, CLUB WYNDHAM Access owners and CLUB WYNDHAM Presidential Reserve owners. Sincerely, Richard Scinta, Resort Manager

But based on the below post, it sounds like Wyndham is at the mercy of the HOA, and are requesting calls to Owner Care so that feedback can be passed onto the HOA.

Maria Johnston
Passing the buck. I'm sure if effects the bottom line it will change. Dear Madam, Thank you for your e-mail. The implementation of the transportation fee that include all our guest arriving on or after February 15th, 2013, excluding the following: Wyndham Bonnet Creek Owners, Club Wyndham Access and Presidential Reserve Owners is a decision made by the Home Owners Association, we understand your concerns however the resort management has no control over the changing the conditions of the implemented fee. If you have any questions related to your ownership please contact Owner Care at 1-800-251-8736. We would be more than happy to provide your feedback to our Home Owners Association and we regret if this affect in any way your stay at our resort. Sincerely Alecia Palmer Guest Services Administrative Assistant Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort

 

[lcml11]

I sent an email to Carmen Marrow at Bonnet Creek expressing my concerns about the fee for transportation to Disney and this was the reply I received today:

Thank you for your recent inquiry relating to the transportation fee that will be effective at Bonnet Creek.
As noted in the e-mail announcement you received, all guests who stay at the Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort will be subject to the transportation fee. As transportation from the resort to the local theme parks is a benefit provided by the Homeowner’s Association at the Bonnet Creek resort to all individuals staying at the resort, and those who own at Bonnet Creek or are members of CLUB WYNDHAM Access already pay for the transportation as part of their maintenance fees, the Bonnet Creek Homeowners Association Board, which is an owner controlled Board, decided that it was appropriate to apply this fee to all guests staying at the resort. If a person’s name is on the Bonnet Creek deed, then they will not be subject to the fee.
To assure owners and guests were made aware of the fee prior to arrival, notice of the fee was provided. If a guest with a reservation for an upcoming arrival does not wish to pay the transportation fee, they have the option of cancelling their reservation, without penalty, and receive their points back so they can make a reservation at a different resort location.
We hope the above clarifies your questions and look forward to assisting you in the future.
Carmen Morrow
Administrative Coordinator
Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort
Wyndham Vacation Resorts
9560 Via Encinas
Lake Buena Vista, FL 32830

Even though providing transportation isn’t what I would consider appropriate use of maintenance fees, apparently the Board does.

http://www.corporationwiki.com/Flor...tion-condominium-association-inc-4402849.aspx

Please note that their is a Gary Hyde on the Board of Bonnet Creek and an Officer. There is or was a Gary Hyde that was a high up in the Wyndham for profit system. I do not know if it was the same one or not. Do I believe the statement pertaining to being a owner controlled Board? I will think about that. Ops, short thought process. I do not buy it.


Bonnet Creek Resort Vacation Condominium Association, Inc.

Gary Hyde
Director
Vice President

Wyndham Vacation Ownership: Note, Gary Hyde

http://www.linkedin.com/profile/vie...2_*2_*2_*2_*2&pvs=ps&trk=pp_profile_name_link

 

[jjmanthei05]

Went on their Facebook page, and saw this post:

Diane Kleineweber
This is a copy of an email I got and my reply Dear Guest: Thank you for your recent reservation at Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort. As you may know, the resort provides shuttle transportation to and from Walt Disney World® Resort, seven days a week for all individuals staying at the resort. Effective Friday, Feb. 15, 2013, the Bonnet Creek Resort Vacation Condominium Association, Inc. will begin implementing a $12 per unit/per day transportation fee. The fee applies to all reservations, except those made for units to be occupied by deeded owners at Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort, CLUB WYNDHAM Access owners and CLUB WYNDHAM Presidential Reserve owners. Sincerely, Richard Scinta, Resort Manager

But based on the below post, it sounds like Wyndham is at the mercy of the HOA, and are requesting calls to Owner Care so that feedback can be passed onto the HOA.

Maria Johnston
Passing the buck. I'm sure if effects the bottom line it will change. Dear Madam, Thank you for your e-mail. The implementation of the transportation fee that include all our guest arriving on or after February 15th, 2013, excluding the following: Wyndham Bonnet Creek Owners, Club Wyndham Access and Presidential Reserve Owners is a decision made by the Home Owners Association, we understand your concerns however the resort management has no control over the changing the conditions of the implemented fee. If you have any questions related to your ownership please contact Owner Care at 1-800-251-8736. We would be more than happy to provide your feedback to our Home Owners Association and we regret if this affect in any way your stay at our resort. Sincerely Alecia Palmer Guest Services Administrative Assistant Wyndham Bonnet Creek Resort

If this was done by the HOA then why would PR owners be excluded? As far as I know there isn't part of their MF that is pooled across all PR properties. I get (but don't agree with) excluding the fee who are already paying the HOA but if you have a Non-BC PR owner, what is the HOA getting out of them to exclude the fee?

Jason

 

[markb53]

If this was done by the HOA then why would PR owners be excluded? As far as I know there isn't part of their MF that is pooled across all PR properties. I get (but don't agree with) excluding the fee who are already paying the HOA but if you have a Non-BC PR owner, what is the HOA getting out of them to exclude the fee?

Jason

Because I believe PR ownership is similar to CWA ownership in that it is spread across multiple resorts including Bonnet Creek.

Here is a quote from then Wyndham website for bonnet creek:

Includes Presidential ReserveSM Suites
Includes Inventory in CLUB WYNDHAM® Access

 

[vacationhopeful]

If this was done by the HOA then why would PR owners be excluded? As far as I know there isn't part of their MF that is pooled across all PR properties. I get (but don't agree with) excluding the fee who are already paying the HOA but if you have a Non-BC PR owner, what is the HOA getting out of them to exclude the fee?

Jason

Oh, Jason, Jason --- the bus/transportation fee is just a ruse. PR and CWA are excluded because these are the BIG sellers these days with the SALES department. Another Sales Point to be made on presentation - avoid non-owner fees when staying at ANY CWA resort.

As another poster here on TUG has noted, his 1 little old CWA contract now has his MEMBER number identifying him (and his million plus developer brought points) as a CWA owner/member. I wonder HOW long it would take Member Services to cancel his WHOLE ownership if he defaulted on his MFs? There is some legal reason, Wyndham wants to move MORE CWP owners into CWA.

 

[lcml11]

If this was done by the HOA then why would PR owners be excluded? As far as I know there isn't part of their MF that is pooled across all PR properties. I get (but don't agree with) excluding the fee who are already paying the HOA but if you have a Non-BC PR owner, what is the HOA getting out of them to exclude the fee?

Jason

Do not know, when I was pitched Presidential Reserve, it was for three non-Bonnet Creek deeded locations.

 

[lcml11]

Oh, Jason, Jason --- the bus/transportation fee is just a ruse. PR and CWA are excluded because these are the BIG sellers these days with the SALES department. Another Sales Point to be made on presentation - avoid non-owner fees when staying at ANY CWA resort.

As another poster here on TUG has noted, his 1 little old CWA contract now has his MEMBER number identifying him (and his million plus developer brought points) as a CWA owner/member. I wonder HOW long it would take Member Services to cancel his WHOLE ownership if he defaulted on his MFs? There is some legal reason, Wyndham wants to move MORE CWP owners into CWA.

They would have to forclose on the deeded contracts. However, they could probably freeze usage of the whole account. If they did that, I could always unpic the two fixed week contracts at Myrtle Beach and pay just thoughs maintance fees and seperate the LLC owned ones from personally owned ones into two accounts and maintain what maintance fees I could. Westwinds fixed weeks do not have to go through Wyndham to reserve their own week, the Resort prefers notification when the unit will be used, but does not require it. If a guest shows up, they would need to know that. However, it is not my intent to default on anything, and hopefully that will not happen. If I did not unpic the two fixed weeks, the LLC would march on with Gold VIP Status leaving the CWA, Towers on the Grove, the PIC Contract, and a Smokey Mountain contract that I would need to save. As it relates to the PIC contract, getting at that one would be a tough thing to do, they could unpick it but that is about all if I maintained the maintance fees with the actual Myrtle Beach resort involved. Worst case, I would have three fixed week Myrtle Beach fixed week contracts that are all on the Ocean.

I share one of your main points that a CWA points contract can be taken back with a total loss of ownership rights apparently without judicial approval prior to it happening on realitively short notice. That is one of the major reasons I have not taken them up on their kind offers to put various Myrtle Beach and Smokey Mountain points contracts into a new large CWA contract with what they call trade equity.

You point on their being some legal reason for the shift in emphis to CWA is probably reflected on page 46 of the following link.

Vacation Ownership
- Interval/Points reclaimed
- Condition of underlying asset maintained by our property management group
- Asset resold for higher price than original sale

http://www.wyndhamworldwide.com/Por...5-02-wyndham-timeshare-presentation-final.pdf

It appears there is a growing priority on reclaiming usage rights of existing owners for re-sale at a higher price. I guess the PCCs are going to be joined by a hugh competitor.

 

[bnoble]

They would have to forclose on the deeded contracts.

If I recall correctly, CWA is not deeded. The deeds are held by the CWA trust, and you buy a fractional ownership in that trust. No property purchased---no deed. This gives Wyndham at least two important advantages. One: because the trust holds the deeds, the trust votes them, not the "owners". Two: it greatly simplifies the recovery process for non-performing ownerships.

 

[ronparise]

If I recall correctly, CWA is not deeded. The deeds are held by the CWA trust, and you buy a fractional ownership in that trust. No property purchased---no deed. This gives Wyndham at least two important advantages. One: because the trust holds the deeds, the trust votes them, not the "owners". Two: it greatly simplifies the recovery process for non-performing ownerships.

you are exactly right on this. At the last meeting of the CWA poa, in answer to my question they said that they will cancel a membership after about 3 months of non payment.

Im not sure how relevant this is to todays discussion but...

What you may not know is that when CWA takes back (cancels) a membership, Wyndham is obligated to pay the maintenance fees This means the CWA doesnt carry any (or very little) bad debt when they foreclose. And since CWA is nothing but a collection of deeded weeks and udi deeds from various resorts, and since maintenance fees paid to CWA pass right through to pay the resorts maintenance fees (after a little management skim) ; the resorts property owners association's cash flow continues in spite of CWA foreclosures

Wyndham will assist the CWA resorts in their foreclosure process to get non preforming deeds back and into CWA....its a win win for all parties, The resorts, the other owners of the resorts, CWA and Wyndham...the only losers are the folks that will pay 20 cents a point for the newly created and recycled CWA points

 

[massvacationer]

You are right, this is not acceptable. If the BC owners think that this isn't going to start a liquid brown storm at other Wyndham resorts they are wrong.

If an amenity is going to be provided above and beyond the normal scope of timesharing I don't think the owners should foot the bill. But I also don't think the non owners should subsidize the owners either.

Why not just have everyone staying pay a smaller fee or have the users of the amenity pay what it actually costs.

This trend is going to be a lot of trouble for timeshare trading which was supposed to be a main selling point when this all began. "Hey, you can buy here but you can go here there and everywhere."

I agree 100%. I understand that the Bonnet Creek HOA made this decision, so we should complain to them.

But also, I think it may make sense to complain to the Club Wyndham VOA Trust BOD. It seems like resorts need to abide by certain rules in order to participate in the whole Club Wyndham System.

I feel like BC is not following the rules and setting a dangerous precedent. if this policy stands, than owners at other Wyndham Resorts will encourage their HOAs to subsidize maintenance fees through charges to owners at other Wyndham resorts. It will mess-up the whole system.

 

[ronparise]

I agree 100%. I understand that the Bonnet Creek HOA made this decision, so we should complain to them.

But also, I think it may make sense to complain to the Club Wyndham VOA Trust BOD. It seems like resorts need to abide by certain rules in order to participate in the whole Club Wyndham System.

I feel like BC is not following the rules and setting a dangerous precedent. if this policy stands, than owners at other Wyndham Resorts will encourage their HOAs to subsidize maintenance fees through charges to owners at other Wyndham resorts. It will mess-up the whole system.

I agree. This could be just the precident setting first step to all the resorts charging an ammenities fee of some sort.

If I can get the floor at the upcoming meeting (May 16 I think) Ill propose removing Bonnet Creek from the Fairshare Trust

 

[Pietin]

I agree. This could be just the precident setting first step to all the resorts charging an ammenities fee of some sort.

If I can get the floor at the upcoming meeting (May 16 I think) Ill propose removing Bonnet Creek from the Fairshare Trust

Bold move!

Good luck Ron!

 

[massvacationer]

I agree. This could be just the precident setting first step to all the resorts charging an ammenities fee of some sort.

If I can get the floor at the upcoming meeting (May 16 I think) Ill propose removing Bonnet Creek from the Fairshare Trust

Excellent !!!! If folks make enough noise and raise a big enough stink, they may very well change the foolish policy

 

[Rent_Share]

300 Posts in this thread were not enough ?

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=186330

:deadhorse:

 

[bnoble]

300 Posts in this thread were not enough ?

Hell hath no fury like a TUGger charged a fee.

 

[CO skier]

"No Taxation without representation!"

 

[Ginger's Mom]

Abusive!

Hi!
I am new to the group but not Wyn Timeshare.

I find this HOA fee abusive and WILL be emailing to express my sentiments.

1) Some of us live in FL and have a FL Resident Disney pass that gives us free parking in the Kingdom. Why on earth would we need to pay for the shuttle?

2) The limited service is no where near the quality of the Disney system, yet they are charging premium fees.

3) Some of us go to BC just to relax and take day trips, like to Daytona and Mount Dora. We have no need for the shuttle.

I believe this shuttle should should be financed by "user" fees. Why punish ALL of us when only some of us use it?

As usual, I am sure I am when it comes to anything Wyndham!

Anne in SE FL

 

[ronparise]

this was posted on the Wyndham owners forum


According to the front desk at Bonnet Creek collecting the transportation fee is being delayed until at least March 1. Hopefully they are evaluating and will come up with a different plan. We should all keep the pressure on them with emails and calls!

 

[lcml11]

this was posted on the Wyndham owners forum


According to the front desk at Bonnet Creek collecting the transportation fee is being delayed until at least March 1. Hopefully they are evaluating and will come up with a different plan. We should all keep the pressure on them with emails and calls!

I am impressed. Wyndham must be monitoring this thread and saw that you were thinking of showing up at the POA meeting and try and speak. Good job.

The front desk advises that they are currently making changes and the earliest it will go into effect will be March 1st.

 

[bnoble]

I think it is a lot more likely that they haven't yet figured out how to get the front desk systems (that never needed to know who owned what where) connected to the information in the parking-pass body-snatcher systems that actually knows who owns what and how they got there.

 

[am1]

What incentive does the HOA have in getting rid of this fee?

People not wanting to pay the fee will stay at other resort and inventory at Bonnet Creek will be better. Any fees collected will improve the resort or lower mfs. The resale value of bonnet creek timeshares will increase. If you are at Bonnet Creek owner what does the reviews on Trip Advisor or RCI matter.

I am against this fee and hope that it does not spread. Maybe my resorts should impose fees only on Bonnet Creek owners.

 

[ronparise]

I think it is a lot more likely that they haven't yet figured out how to get the front desk systems (that never needed to know who owned what where) connected to the information in the parking-pass body-snatcher systems that actually knows who owns what and how they got there.

Thats probably right...I mean who carries a copy of their deed with them on vacation...But the optimist in me wants to believe that they are rethinking this "everyone pays, except us owners" approach in favor of a user fee. We'll see