Possible Re-Sale Path to VIP Status?

[rrlongwell]

... On RCI today those one bedrooms are renting for $1680 or about $240 a night - I got them for 150K in points - which is about $300 to me in terms of a percentage of my MF) Without VIP I would have paid $1250 as a percentage of MF.

So with VIP I saved $950 X 3 weeks = $2850
Renting on RCI would have cost me = $5040
The three weeks actually cost me $900

I also compared the trip I have to to Kona end of Dec. First part of January - which is renting on RCI for $1950 (2 bdroom) or $279 a night. I rented 4 weeks worth of space - at 115K or about $230 per week to me in MF - Without VIP I would have paid $924 in MF

So with VIP I saved $694 X 4 Weeks = $2774
Renting RCI would have cost me = $7800
The four weeks actually cost me = $920

Not sure I followed your math. I checked the Northeast Windhams, Bonnett Creek, Westwinds, Govenor's Green, and Old Town Alexandria on a spot check for February 10, 2012. This places Winter Resorts and Summer Resorts both in the list.

2-10-2012
Nights Unit Type Points Discount points
Inn on the Harbor 7 No availability
Long Warf 7 3 Bedroom Delux 126,000 47,250 Upgrade effect included
Inn on Long Warf 7 1 Bedroom Suite 56,000 28,000
Bently Brook 7 No availability
Bay Voyage 7 1 Bedroom Suite 56,000 28,000
Newport Onshore 7 2 Bedroom 77,000 38,500
Smuggler’ Notch 7 2 Bedroom Deluxe 224,000 91,000 Upgraded effect included
Newport Overlook 7 No availability
Coconut Malorie 7 No availability
Skyline Tower 7 2 bedroom 178,500 47,250 Upgraded effect included
National Harbor 7 3 Bedroom Deluxe 266,000 94,500 Upgraded effect included
Ridge Top 7 2 Bedroom 155,000 77,500 Shawnee Village
Crestview 7 No availability Shawnee Village
River Villiage 7 No availabity Shawnee Village
Deputy 7 No availability Shawnee Village
Fairway Village 7 No availability Shawnee Village
Bonnet Creek 7 3 Bedroom Deluxe 231,000 94,000 Upgrade effect included
Old Town Alex. 7 2 Bedroom Lock-off 280,000 63,000 Upgrade effect included
Westwinds 7 2 Bedroom Deluxe 56,000 28,000
Governor’s Green 7 2 Bedroom Deluxe 77,000 33,000 Upgrade effect included

For a maintenace fee comparsion, take the average projected maintance fee per 1000 points in your ideal porfolio times the points actually used.

The ability to get a three day holiday weekend for 50 percent off during the Advanced Reservation Priority for the discount window for VIP is also impressive. i.e. National Harbor 3 bedroom deluxe with balcony for 58,000 points for Feb 17, 18, and 19.

 

[vacationhopeful]

Understanding your vacation goals, planning in advance and having very good knowledge of the Wyndham system goes a VERY LONG WAY in usage, minimizing nuisance fees and maximizing benefits while NOT having VIP benefits.

VIP benefits were developed as SALES HOOKS - ego, cheapness, and lottery tickets all combined to "WIN" some benefit. Why to some persons spend $75K on a new car and others are happy at $25K? Why do some persons need to have a foreign expensive car in their driveway over a domestic model? And no one ever says, I just wanted to throw money away by overpaying.

Yes, Platimum VIPs can rent many Wyndham units for less than what it costs almost all other owners to reserve that week. So, it would be cheaper to almost everyone other than a Platimum VIP to rent - esp if YOU think you need to BUY more points to take your family on vacation. Platimum VIPs have to spend lots of time to manage those multiple reservations, to cancel and rebook, to get the FREE unit upgrades, to advertise, to collect money, to complete Guest Certificates, and to deal with a variety of renters and their questions and requests and folibles.

But if your plan is to personally USE a large point membership - even with some VIP level or NOT - you currently can RENT timeshares as John Chase states for less money than your MFs and exchanges fees would add up to.

And if you happen to inherit a Platimum VIP ownership from your parents, do not THINK that you will make money renting all those without a lot of work involving a slew of hours on the computer and the phone. And many of those phone calls are with the general public asking for the Wed-Wed week, the Dec 26 to Jan 3rd, the best unit in the house, a week for $55/night in a 2bdr, etc.

 

[dr_adventure]

Not sure I followed your math. I checked the Northeast Windhams, Bonnett Creek, Westwinds, Govenor's Green, and Old Town Alexandria on a spot check for February 10, 2012. This places Winter Resorts and Summer Resorts both in the list.

.

I'm not sure what you did not follow in my math - nor do I know what your list has to do with my math or the resorts I am staying at.

 

[dr_adventure]

How is your costs basis only $2/1000 points?
That is very low mfs.

50% discount on all reservations.

 

[dr_adventure]

no one says there is no value to Platinum VIP...There is...The question is how much value? and is worth what you have to pay for a retail purchase? (about $150000) ...Thats tough to justify

I would agree if you paid $150,000 - I paid NO WHERE NEAR that and you don't have to.

 

[Ridewithme38]

I would agree if you paid $150,000 - I paid NO WHERE NEAR that and you don't have to.

Yup, i've got to admit, never been to a sales meeting....But seeing this estimates of $120-$250 per 1,000 points to buy into VIP means, i'll never be VIP

 

[ronparise]

I would agree if you paid $150,000 - I paid NO WHERE NEAR that and you don't have to.

First of all your "cost basis" of $2/1000 points is not what I think of as cost basis, This is annual maintenance. and if you have no cost basis you could say its your cost for a vacation. I know the way I think some consider odd, but I think you need to include the cost to buy the points, amortized over some years

so ...ok Ill bite

My estimate was based on paying full retail

Other than:

inheriting your points, where your cost basis is nothing except a dead relative, or

marrying into them, where your costs basis is ....well unlimited. or

PICing in a few 3 bedroom units, and buying the rest from Wyndham, and your cost basis comes down to 7 cents or so a point, which i still cant justify

How do you suggest I become a Platinum VIP on a budget, and so I can rent a few of my weeks to timeos2 for a profit

 

[rrlongwell]

... How do you suggest I become a Platinum VIP on a budget ... QUOTE]


Identifiy an existing VIP owner that has Platinum Status (possable sources: Ebay, Craigs List, Red Week, etc. Offer to take over the management of their account for payment of the maintance fees on the account. This agreement would be best done in written form as a 3-7 year lease of the account. The benifit to the owner is they do not have the costs anytime soon of giving it away. The agreement should also provide that the account be willed to you in the event of death of the owner.

 

[timeos2]

How do you suggest I become a Platinum VIP on a budget, and so I can rent a few of my weeks to timeos2 for a profit

Get me the going rate of $199/week/ 2 bedroom & I'll take you up on it!

 

[Ridewithme38]

How do you suggest I become a Platinum VIP on a budget, and so I can rent a few of my weeks to timeos2 for a profit

He mentioned in a previous thread that his cost was $50,000 for the purchases to be VIP Platinum

 

[BocaBum99]

... How do you suggest I become a Platinum VIP on a budget ... QUOTE]


Identifiy an existing VIP owner that has Platinum Status (possable sources: Ebay, Craigs List, Red Week, etc. Offer to take over the management of their account for payment of the maintance fees on the account. This agreement would be best done in written form as a 3-7 year lease of the account. The benifit to the owner is they do not have the costs anytime soon of giving it away. The agreement should also provide that the account be willed to you in the event of death of the owner.

This is the way to go. I know someone who manages over 100M points doing exactly this idea. However, you need a great system to manage it and it doesn't make that much money.

If I were going to start a Wyndham rental business, this is exactly what I would do.

 

[jjmanthei05]

No, I have gotten one night stays before, they will usually start this on units under 60 days. Same with three night to two night stays. Two nights have shown up as unavailable when three nights were available. The two night stay will then show up latter, you can even sometimes get a upgrade.

You can book 1 night stays through the 10 month window. If you search a resort with a lot of availability you will find a bunch of 1 night stays at the 8, 9 and 10 month window. These are "orphaned" days where for example a sunday to sunday week one person books sun - wed and another person books thurs - sun, wed would be orphaned and available for a 1 night stay. I actually created 2 of these for our trip in March. we needed a 1 night for saturday and a 1 night for sunday the next week. We are staying over in tenn on our drive out and back from myrtle beach. I had a VC look for a saturday to saturday week and book the sunday and monday for that week creating the 1 night available on saturday. I booked the one night and canceled sunday and monday, then did the same thing for the next weekend on the way back. So if you need a 1 night stay you can always make one.

Jason

 

[chapjim]

You can book 1 night stays through the 10 month window. If you search a resort with a lot of availability you will find a bunch of 1 night stays at the 8, 9 and 10 month window. These are "orphaned" days where for example a sunday to sunday week one person books sun - wed and another person books thurs - sun, wed would be orphaned and available for a 1 night stay. I actually created 2 of these for our trip in March. we needed a 1 night for saturday and a 1 night for sunday the next week. We are staying over in tenn on our drive out and back from myrtle beach. I had a VC look for a saturday to saturday week and book the sunday and monday for that week creating the 1 night available on saturday. I booked the one night and canceled sunday and monday, then did the same thing for the next weekend on the way back. So if you need a 1 night stay you can always make one.

Jason

I have a one night reservation December 29th at Fairfield Glade, admittedly not prime time there. Also, we have a one-nighter at Panama City Beach on the 6th of January that upgraded to a 2BR Pres. unit. We did one-nighters in November at Smoky Mountains both ways between No. VA and New Orleans. Again, nothing in prime time.

Most resorts only allow 3, 4, or 7 night reservations during busy seasons just to keep from having orphans. At some point (60 days before check-in?), they probably take anything but at busy resorts, this is more hypothetical than real.

 

[jjmanthei05]

I have a one night reservation December 29th at Fairfield Glade, admittedly not prime time there. Also, we have a one-nighter at Panama City Beach on the 6th of January that upgraded to a 2BR Pres. unit. We did one-nighters in November at Smoky Mountains both ways between No. VA and New Orleans. Again, nothing in prime time.

Most resorts only allow 3, 4, or 7 night reservations during busy seasons just to keep from having orphans. At some point (60 days before check-in?), they probably take anything but at busy resorts, this is more hypothetical than real.

Actually they allow 1 day reservations during prime season. Look at Glacier canyon for July and August there is probably close to a dozen days that have 1 night stays available with no 3+ day stays available. 1 night stays are available as soon as their orphaned even in prime season.

Jason

 

[learnalot]

Most resorts only allow 3, 4, or 7 night reservations during busy seasons just to keep from having orphans. At some point (60 days before check-in?), they probably take anything but at busy resorts, this is more hypothetical than real.

Since the computer still blocks inventory in terms of weeks, two 3-night reservations leave a one night orphan. We have had several single night stays both in and out of prime season. But I have also seen instances where 2 nights are available but it won't allow a single night.

 

[Sloane S]

Since the computer still blocks inventory in terms of weeks, two 3-night reservations leave a one night orphan. We have had several single night stays both in and out of prime season. But I have also seen instances where 2 nights are available but it won't allow a single night.

I was trying to grab 3 nights at Glacier Canyon for 12/30 through 1/2. There were 2 nights each for 12/30 and 1/1, but I could not get the three nights (so I just booked the two 2-nighters and we'll leave early).

 

[jjmanthei05]

I always prefer to book the night of the last day we are there. Then if we use the waterpark, we have a room to go back to and change instead of doing it in a bathroom. If you wanted just the 3 nights you could have(maybe still can) book a 2 night for 1/2-1/3 on a sunday-sunday week leaving sunday as a single day then book the sunday and cancel the 1/2 -1/3 reservation but again I find it much nicer to have the room all day on the day we leave.

Jason

 

[Sloane S]

I always prefer to book the night of the last day we are there. Then if we use the waterpark, we have a room to go back to and change instead of doing it in a bathroom.

That was my thinking as well, and it made it an even easier decision when I realized we are only "wasting" 8K in points.

I called the resort today and they linked the reservations so we won't have to change rooms in the middle of the weekend, and when we get back I'll call and ask to have the HK for the second reservation credited back.

 

[ronparise]

This is the way to go. I know someone who manages over 100M points doing exactly this idea. However, you need a great system to manage it and it doesn't make that much money.

If I were going to start a Wyndham rental business, this is exactly what I would do.

Garrett???

One of the reasons you dont make much money is that he is managing the account for the owners. Garrett gets a commission, but the owner gets the real money, such as it is

 

[ronparise]

... How do you suggest I become a Platinum VIP on a budget ... QUOTE]


Identifiy an existing VIP owner that has Platinum Status (possable sources: Ebay, Craigs List, Red Week, etc. Offer to take over the management of their account for payment of the maintance fees on the account. This agreement would be best done in written form as a 3-7 year lease of the account. The benifit to the owner is they do not have the costs anytime soon of giving it away. The agreement should also provide that the account be willed to you in the event of death of the owner.

I like it,

 

[kev5982]

I agree with John on his #1 is to rent first and #2 is to buy very low resale, maybe a fixed week somewhere. You never know what the lifetime MF's are going to be.

Kevin

 

[jjmanthei05]

... How do you suggest I become a Platinum VIP on a budget ...

Identifiy an existing VIP owner that has Platinum Status (possable sources: Ebay, Craigs List, Red Week, etc. Offer to take over the management of their account for payment of the maintance fees on the account. This agreement would be best done in written form as a 3-7 year lease of the account. The benifit to the owner is they do not have the costs anytime soon of giving it away. The agreement should also provide that the account be willed to you in the event of death of the owner.

I don't think the will part will work because it would have to be willed to a relative according to the member directory to get the benefits to transfer.

Jason

 

[ronparise]

I don't think the will part will work because it would have to be willed to a relative according to the member directory to get the benefits to transfer.

Jason

It dosent say that...I read it as eligible points can be acquired by will OR from a relative

 

[Cheryl20772]

It dosent say that...I read it as eligible points can be acquired by will OR from a relative

I think you are right, Ron. The book says:

"Only Club Wyndham Plus points associated with ownership interests purchased directly through Wyndham Vacation Resorts or its affiliates, ownership interests asquired by will or intestate succession, ownership interests acquired by "Immediate Relative" of Members, or through PIC conversions count toward VIP status."

If they mean what they say, all anyone who wants VIP has to do is get someone to will their VIP points to them. I don't know why Wyndham makes such a point of defining who qualifies as immediate relative after that.

So, if I know my kids don't want our Wyndham points when we are gone, all I need to do to rid the estate of them, is find anyone who wants to be the new owner and put that person in our wills. Do you think?

 

[learnalot]

I think you are right, Ron. The book says:

"Only Club Wyndham Plus points associated with ownership interests purchased directly through Wyndham Vacation Resorts or its affiliates, ownership interests asquired by will or intestate succession, ownership interests acquired by "Immediate Relative" of Members, or through PIC conversions count toward VIP status."

If they mean what they say, all anyone who wants VIP has to do is get someone to will their VIP points to them. I don't know why Wyndham makes such a point of defining who qualifies as immediate relative after that.

So, if I know my kids don't want our Wyndham points when we are gone, all I need to do to rid the estate of them, is find anyone who wants to be the new owner and put that person in our wills. Do you think?

Cheryl and Ron,

I agree that is how it currently reads but they can, of course, change the wording at any time. Seems to me that, once again, discretion is the better part of valor. Some communications and musings are much more appropriate in a less public venue.