No Explanation

[Carolinian]

I find it very curious that RCI has not chosen to try to provide their resort affiliates with any explanation of the class action lawsuits. This months ''RCI Affiliate Connections'' newsletter had not a word to say on the subject, and there has been no special letter from one of the higher ups.

The word is traveling, and since RCI always want to put their spin on things, I am surprised they have not done so yet on this. Perhaps part of their problem is that anything they say may damage their relationship with resorts, but saying nothing also has that effect.

I have heard from someone connected with one of the class actions suits that one of the law firms involved has had thousands of calls from individual RCI members concerned about RCI's policies and supporting their action. The law firm was surprised by the massive outpouring, which is far more than the typical class action.

I heard from someone who was at the last ARDA convention that the lawsuits were the talk of the convention, and most people other than RCI itself (at least publicly) considered them to have a great deal of significance for the industry.

At some point, it seems to me, RCI has to start trying to do some damage control outside of the lawsuit itself. I am quite surprised that they haven't started yet.

 

[PerryM]

No big deal to RCI

My guess is that RCI feels they will win and this is no big deal.

Anyway, Cendant/RCI won’t have to pay a penny – they will just raise the annual dues and increase the fees if they should lose – no big deal. It’s not like the average RCI member is going to do anything drastic like use another exchange company.

So to RCI it’s a win-win: A) if they win they will just increase the rate of rentals and B) if they lose we, the members of RCI will pay the legal bills, and they will still increase the rentals.

It’s their company to run anyway they see fit. Only the lawyers will win this battle.

I recommend to all owners that they join RCI and just rent their units out for cash and then turnaround and rent a cheap rental from RCI – thanks RCI.

The Internet did not exist when RCI and II started down the path of matching timeshare reservations from one owner to another owner. Now with the internet we can do the same exact thing ourselves – who needs an exchange company?

 

[JeffV]

Sounds like a much wiser move rather than feed the rumor mongers who are obviously waiting with bated breath.

 

[Carolinian]

What is happening with the lawsuits is that the word is spreading to both resorts and individuals about RCI's rental activities, and people who did not pay attention before are doing so now. That has to have an impact. I hope that other exchange companies will take this issue straight to consumers and resorts.

I would hope that the threat of fee increases to pay for the defendant's misdeeds encourages the plaintiffs attorneys to demand a term that requires court approval of any fee increase by RCI for an extended period.

The internet really is not an excuse for RCI's rentals. Its like blaming the gun instead of the person who pulls the trigger.

 

[PerryM]

Blame your resort for this

As long as RCI and II don’t violate any state/federal law they are free to run their companies anyway they want – not the way the lawyers want them to.

If RCI’s general council has done his/her job right RCI will come thru this just fine; if not maybe they can be sued for malfeasance – some other lawyer will make a bunch of money.

Here’s my prediction which all of you can mark and review later – 5 years from now RCI and II will increase at least 50% in size and none of this will mean anything. The developers seem to break new sales records all the time and RCI and II have the “in” with the developers and they will just increase in size too.

Renting, by the exchange companies, is here to stay and I believe it adds much to the bottom line of both RCI and II and that’s why they exist – to reward the investors who bought stock and took a risk with them.

There are just too many other avenues available to the timeshare owner to get a raw deal from the exchange companies – it takes $15 to run an ad which will allow you to get cash for your week and then rent from VRBO or RCI for a great vacation.

I am still a member of RCI, RCI Points, and II and don’t plan to cancel my memberships anytime soon – I just find our exchanges to be in our favor at the present time. When I decide that they don’t offer me anything, I’ll cancel our membership.

The market place is the best place to settle these disputes – if RCI members feel they are being screwed then they are free to leave.

Ultimately this comes back to the HOA/Developer – if your resort is not dual affiliated with II and RCI and XYZ why not? Why the “cozy” relationship with one exchange company over the other? This is where these disputes should be fought.

This is the REAL culprit here – your resort has limited your exchange choices and just what are you doing to correct it? The answer is of course nothing – the owners seem to be fat, dumb, and happy – the American way. (I'm referring to the timeshare ownership pool as a whole)

 

[timeos2]

No explanation needed. They don't have to tell the resorts that some money grubbers have set themselves up for a big payday. Quote the Eagles: "Old Billy was right".

If anyone can prove that at least 1% of RCI members know of the suit I'd be very surprised. They would still need at least 10 times more participants to have a meaningful "uprising" among the membership. As Perry says, RCI knows they can't lose so broadcasting it by official pronouncement would only hurt them not help. They'll be quiet, it will most likely go away or they will pay some small settlement to the lawyer leeches. Either way the membership will pay so ultimately the owners lose. But thats exactly what the government control advocates wanted so they will eventually get at least part of their wish. It won't be the part they asked for but it will cost us all as government intervention always does. It's win-win for RCI and the lawyers - lose-lose for the members no matter what happens.

 

[Pit]

Re: Blame your resort for this

Renting, by the exchange companies, is here to stay and I believe it adds much to the bottom line of both RCI and II and that’s why they exist – to reward the investors who bought stock and took a risk with them.

That's the key. Many owners mistakenly believe that RCI/II exist for the purpose of providing them with exchanges.

 

[Carolinian]

Re: Blame your resort for this

Actually, state consumer protection laws are quite broad. North Carolina's says, for example, that ''unfair or deceptive acts or practices in or affecting commerce are unlawful'' Both class action lawsuits cite the New Jersey consumer protection laws as a basis for the lawsuit. Some on these boards are under the mistaken impression that unless RCI violates the T& C it has written for itself then it is home free, but it does not work that way. A number of major law firms that specialize in this type of action are involved and these firms do not invest a lot of their own money, which such an action takes, unless they have thoroughly researched the law and believe they have a very strong case.

The argument that members are free to leave just doesn't wash when the company involved is, like RCI, a quasi monopoly. At resorts that are not dual affialiated, most owners do not know that they can use another exchange company. They are effectively prisoners of RCI if they want to exchange.

Hopefully, the independents will agressively use the spotlight on RCI rentals to woo resorts and members and create a real competitive environment in timeshare exchanging. Free market principles just do not apply to an industry that is largely an oligopoly at present, as it is in the US and many other markets. Go to Australia / New Zealand, on the other hand where there are seveal major players which most timeshare owners know they can use, and you will find lower costs and other more customer-friendly policies even at RCI.

As to developers, their share of the overall timeshare market has tumbled in recent years as they have moved more in the direction of points, while the resale portion of the market has soared.

As to HOA's being to blame, most affiliation contracts have exclusivity language that RCI or II has put there saying they cannot deal with other exchange companies, which too often may intimidate the HOA.
It is not the HOA's fault that the language is there, but they should get legal advice to find out that such language likely would violate anti-trust laws.

I have long suggested that the most proactive thing Tuggers can do is to let your HOA know what is going on, if they don't know already, and suggest 1) dual affiliation with both RCI and II and 2) educating the members on their ability to use the independent exchange companies.

On the OBX some resorts have dual affiliated since the Cendant takeover of RCI and others have taken advantage of the free postage offers from one or more independent exchange companies to mail out their brochures with the HOA newsletters.

And BTW, I think you mean ''counsel'' rather than ''council''.

As long as RCI and II don’t violate any state/federal law they are free to run their companies anyway they want – not the way the lawyers want them to.

If RCI’s general council has done his/her job right RCI will come thru this just fine; if not maybe they can be sued for malfeasance – some other lawyer will make a bunch of money.

Here’s my prediction which all of you can mark and review later – 5 years from now RCI and II will increase at least 50% in size and none of this will mean anything. The developers seem to break new sales records all the time and RCI and II have the “in” with the developers and they will just increase in size too.

Renting, by the exchange companies, is here to stay and I believe it adds much to the bottom line of both RCI and II and that’s why they exist – to reward the investors who bought stock and took a risk with them.

There are just too many other avenues available to the timeshare owner to get a raw deal from the exchange companies – it takes $15 to run an ad which will allow you to get cash for your week and then rent from VRBO or RCI for a great vacation.

I am still a member of RCI, RCI Points, and II and don’t plan to cancel my memberships anytime soon – I just find our exchanges to be in our favor at the present time. When I decide that they don’t offer me anything, I’ll cancel our membership.

The market place is the best place to settle these disputes – if RCI members feel they are being screwed then they are free to leave.

Ultimately this comes back to the HOA/Developer – if your resort is not dual affiliated with II and RCI and XYZ why not? Why the “cozy” relationship with one exchange company over the other? This is where these disputes should be fought.

This is the REAL culprit here – your resort has limited your exchange choices and just what are you doing to correct it? The answer is of course nothing – the owners seem to be fat, dumb, and happy – the American way. (I'm referring to the timeshare ownership pool as a whole)

 

[PerryM]

Marital Arts and Timeshares

Carolinian,

Thanks, once again, for the spelling lesson – I blaze along typing 100 WPM and my spelling checker and I catch 99.9% of the errors; good enough for chat room work. I've instructed my spelling checker to compensate accordingly.

I place 100% of the blame on the HOA and if they can’t elect a President with some backbone they deserve to suffer in the side affects of a poor leadership and a monopoly.

The answer to RCI being a monopoly does NOT rest with RCI; it rests with the rules that dictate a monopoly – many resorts are dual affiliated and this gives the resort owners much more flexibility.

To show that this is no big deal, WorldMark, owned by the same company that owns RCI, is dual affiliated with RCI AND II and with others. If an RCI sister company can be BOTH RCI and II affiliated why are we even discussing this topic?

Do we really need exchange companies anymore? I rent our unused timeshares and use that money to rent cheap RCI rentals for our vacations – I love cheap RCI rentals. If RCI wants to rent at fire sale prices then I would be foolish to pass up such a good deal. If RCI want’s to set up the rules to rent fantastic weeks at Motel 6 prices why fight it – join the vacationers who want to see this happen.

Timesharing is like Martial Arts – understand your opponent and take advantage of their weak (week?) points and capitalize on your strong points. To put up a fight and try to fix their week////weak areas is futile.

Last year I used our RCI Points and reserved week 51 at the Park Plaza in Park City UT while I rented out our week 51 for 5 times the MF. If RCI Points wants to price week 51 so low (in points) I’m not about to fight them but to take advantage of their stupidity.

 

["Roger"]

Re: Blame your resort for this

....As to developers, their share of the overall timeshare market has tumbled in recent years as they have moved more in the direction of points, while the resale portion of the market has soared.....

This sounds like the Jerry Sikes line: People are buying resale, not because the cost is twenty to thirty percent what it costs to buy from a developer, but because they don't want to buy points. Do you find this claim credible?

 

[timeos2]

Resale points - not as many out there

This sounds like the Jerry Sikes line: People are buying resale, not because the cost is twenty to thirty percent what it costs to buy from a developer, but because they don't want to buy points. Do you find this claim credible?

In as few words as the BBS lets me use: No.

People want to buy resale points because they are also at a steep discount but there aren't any where near as many on the market as weeks. That is the far more telling fact than the farfetched idea that people are buying resale to avoid points.

 

[PerryM]

Phony-baloney

I don’t know how many of you buy rare coins but we did. Back 20 years ago, before the internet, the Mom and Pop coin stores sold coins to each other at ever increasing prices – the astronomical growth of rare coins was reported in Barrons and other financial papers suggesting that rare coins were another type of investment vehicle to consider.

Well the market imploded as the rudimentary internet allowed the average coin investor to talk among themselves; without the coin dealers. The coin market lost 60%-80% of its value in the blink of an eye.

I think we are witnessing the same phony-baloney with timeshares and I would not be surprised if a market implosion hits this over inflated market too. Even resale prices may crash to pennies on the resale dollar. Once a panic sets in, folks sell at ANY price they can get. Timeshares have the maintenance fees which will cause folks to panic even faster.

The prices charged by the developers can’t be justified by the real world. True, Marriott can charge $35,000 for a one week villa that has a MF of $800 and prop up the market so FF can charge $37,000 with a MF of $1,100 and the market goes up and up.

Will this scenario happen? I don’t know but the more the consumers get to talk to each other the more reality sets in.

This phony-baloney market is reflected in the RCI rental prices. If the rental market says that the timeshare is worth $600 for the week and the MF is $900 and it cost $37,000 to buy it – just how is the $600 rental wrong?

RCI stepped into this mess when it began renting over inflated timeshare villas that have no reality to what they are really worth. It’s not RCI’s fault for bringing the news to the timeshare world – don’t shoot the messenger.

 

[BocaBum99]

Rentals?

What rentals? Is someone renting timeshares?

Only a few people in the vocal minority care about this issue enough to do much about it. There may be a settlement and a few rules changes. But, nothing much will change.

I'll know it means something when it hits the cover of Businessweek, Fortune, Forbes, The Wall Street Journal or Barron's magazine. Until that happens, it's just a fungus on an ant in Africa.

I heard the talk of ARDA was illegal immigration. Many resorts are trying to figure out what to do is they can't hire illegal aliens for housekeeping services. Now that's the talk of the industry. It's on every single day in the news and it impacts more people. Wow, it's on the news at this very moment.

 

[Carolinian]

Any market is based on supply and demand. Increase the demand or tighten the supply and the price goes up. Flood the market with supply or kill the demand, and prices go down.

Before the big exchange companies got involved in rentals, the supply was what individual owners put up for rent. There may be places like Hawaii where there have been reports on these boards of oversupply from that source driving down rental prices, but that is not the case most places. Looking at the traditional owner outlets in places like east coast beaches and the Caribbean and even newer internet outlets for owner rental weeks there, the prices have generally held firm. On the OBX they seem to go up every year.

What has happened is that the big exchange companies are dumping lots of inventory flooding the market with a deluge of supply, and driving prices down. That does not reflect the ''real'' market. It reflects the market under the artificial condition of big exchange companies diverting supply in large quantities from the exchange market to dump in the rental market. And, yes, it is VERY appropriate to blame the big exchange companies for that.

And I guess you also think RCI should get a medal when people can't seem to get exchanges anymore, due to the rentals, as well??? Or for kicking the financial props out from under the resorts?

Perry,our perspectives are different. You look at the exchange industry from the perspective of the big exchange companies. I look at it from the perspective of the HOA's and the individual members. When the HOA's sneeze, the members catch the cold. Screw up HOA economics, and it will be the members who pay for it in higher m/f's.

And don't you think the exchange company should be blamed for putting intimidating language in affiliation agreements to discourage resorts from working with other exchange companies?

 

[Carolinian]

Re: Rentals?

For the timeshare industry, the front page of publications like Timesharing Today are what determines if it is big news for the industry. BTW, it IS the lead story on the front page of the current issue of Timesharing Today.

What rentals? Is someone renting timeshares?

Only a few people in the vocal minority care about this issue enough to do much about it. There may be a settlement and a few rules changes. But, nothing much will change.

I'll know it means something when it hits the cover of Businessweek, Fortune, Forbes, The Wall Street Journal or Barron's magazine. Until that happens, it's just a fungus on an ant in Africa.

I heard the talk of ARDA was illegal immigration. Many resorts are trying to figure out what to do is they can't hire illegal aliens for housekeeping services. Now that's the talk of the industry. It's on every single day in the news and it impacts more people. Wow, it's on the news at this very moment.

 

[PerryM]

The ugly truth...

VRBO has 55,000+ timeshares, condos, quarter shares, and homes up for rent – is the rental market over saturated?

One can guess as to whether the market it in over supply or over demand but I assume that the market is in balance – the right balance of supply and demand which the price reflects at the moment.

Sad to say that those bloated timeshares aren’t worth the price that the vast majority of owners paid (Developer price with 14.99% financing which doubles the purchase price).

The rental market is vicious – the true worth of a property is reflected in that rental price. If a villa commands $600 per week in a high demand time just what is the timeshare worth? $15,000? $35,000? $60,000?

If the villa commands $600 rental and the MF is $900, what does this tell us about the value of the timeshare?

Bottom line; RCI’s rental program is exposing the bloated prices of timeshares and the unrealistic value the owner has of their unit. As long as this stays “in house” in the RCI system we can each kid each other on our units worth.

Once RCI and II started renting timeshares to the general public and had to price them correctly, the ugly truth of bloated timeshare prices becomes obvious to everyone. Blaming RCI and II for the truth is to NOT face the truth.

 

[timeos2]

And I guess you also think RCI should get a medal when people can't seem to get exchanges anymore, due to the rentals, as well??? Or for kicking the financial props out from under the resorts?

There is a big difference between getting a fair exchange vs the old days of the give aways. The level of fair trades seems to be better while the give aways have in fact been stopped.

Perry,our perspectives are different. You look at the exchange industry from the perspective of the big exchange companies. I look at it from the perspective of the HOA's and the individual members. When the HOA's sneeze, the members catch the cold. Screw up HOA economics, and it will be the members who pay for it in higher m/f's.

It has been stated correctly many, many times if a resort/HOA has built their economics on RCI trades for value that is a big problem and it's not RCI's. They only have to look out for RCI shareholders. This dog doesn't hunt.

And don't you think the exchange company should be blamed for putting intimidating language in affiliation agreements to discourage resorts from working with other exchange companies?

Again, it is a simple pencil line through the language if a resort/HOA doesn't want it to read that way. If they don't take that step it is the resort not RCI at fault. And by the way, the language in the II agreement is far more intimidating than that in the RCI standard form. Who is the really the bad guy on that front?

 

[BocaBum99]

TST is irrelevant - Here's the proof

For the timeshare industry, the front page of publications like Timesharing Today are what determines if it is big news for the industry. BTW, it IS the lead story on the front page of the current issue of Timesharing Today.

TST has 25,000 subscribers. Since there are 3M owners of timeshares in the US, their subscriber base represents less than 1% of timeshare owners. I would hardly call that relevant to the timesharing market. 99% of timesharing consumers know nothing about Timesharing today. I guess you didn't know that.

If anything, I'd say that Endless Vacations is the source of information for timesharers. That magazine is read by 1.5M timesharing consumers. That is 50% of the timesharing population.

So, I'd say that timeshare rentals is pretty much not even in the consciousness of most timesharers except for what they are offered by RCI or II.

I wouldn't be surprised if more timesharing people are influenced by the National Enquirer than they are by Timesharing Today. I am quite sure that more timesharers read it than TST.

 

[AwayWeGo]

Does Anybody Actually Read The R.C.I. Mag?

Endless Vacations is the source of information for timesharers. That magazine is read by 1.5M timesharing consumers.

Maybe.

Then again, not everybody who gets it reads it.

Ours generally goes straight onto the recycle stack.

That's not to say anything is wrong with Endless Vacations.

Shucks, I'm paying for it -- maybe I ought to read it, or at least thumb-check it now & then.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.

 

[Timeshare Von]

Let me start out this rant by stating that some of my best TS friends are points owners in the FF system. With that being said, and here's my bias with FF as a fixed weeks owner . . . those in the points systems out there are milking the supply right out of RCI. They are getting dog studios (blue or greens - whatever a green is!) for a minimal number of FF points and trading for primos like Kona. Their points may have originally represented say two weeks, but through point management, they are getting four or five weeks of vacation out of the RCI system.

When I first started studying the FF point system, the sales rep at FF Washington/Alexandria showed me how my then current two weeks (three considering one is a lockoff unit) converted to points, plus one more week I would have to buy in the form of points would get me as much as seven weeks of vacation in the FF system to trade in at RCI. He said that FF "needed" my other weeks because they (FF) didn't have enough weeks inventory for everyone to get what they wanted.

I had to scratch my head at "owning four weeks worth" and taking out seven! Seems I just added to the deficit by at least three weeks.

I for one would love to see RCI get back to the strict adherance of "like for a like exchange" so that people using these 28k FF points weeks aren't taking out premium weeks from the inventory. I seem to recall reading on the FF Web site that a week at FF KHV is like 216k points and yet through RCI, some FF owners are getting those weeks for less than a fraction of that.

This is just one of the inequities created by the system as it is currently designed and administered by RCI. I would like to see something done to restore the concept of "what you own is what you get" within RCI. I think that is a bigger problem, frankly, than the speculation that RCI is renting out spacebanked exchange weeks.

Just my two cents worth . . . please do not crucify me I still love you all. I can't fault the owners for using the system for all they can. I would just like to see this loophole closed.

Yvonne

 

[Timeshare Von]

Re: TST is irrelevant - Here's the proof

If anything, I'd say that Endless Vacations is the source of information for timesharers. That magazine is read by 1.5M timesharing consumers. That is 50% of the timesharing population.

I think that Endless Vacations is pretty much useless unless there is an article on an area I'm planning to vacation in the near future. I really enjoyed the issue that featured Alaska, given we're going there next month.

The marketing/advertising in it is simply too much . . . and not something I want to see page after page.

Ordinarily, the magazine sits in the bathroom for idle reading material until the next one arrives

Yvonne

 

[Carolinian]

Re: The ugly truth...

In terms of flooding the market, one has to consider numbers.

When the Seasons chain jumped ship from RCI to II, they put out a newsletter (which I wish was still up on their website) that explained it to their members with a well aimed broadside at RCI over both points and rentals. That was in the earlier days of RCI rentals, before they had as many outlets as they now do, and at that time the Seasons article said RCI was renting hundreds of thousands of spacebank deposits to the general public.

Those numbers clearly show why exchange company rentals can depress the price by flooding the market.

Is the rental price in balance for a deliberately flooded market? Probably. Would it be absent that deliberate flooding of the market? Probably not.

RCI's actions not only hurt t/s owners who want to exchange and can't find what they used to find because RCI is renting out the inventory. They also compete with t/s owners who want to exchange and find the price depressed by competition from RCI flooding the market. RCI's callous manipulation of the market hurts the ability to exchange, it hurt rental prices for those who want to rent, and it hurts resale prices. Timeshare owners are hurt on all fronts. That's why I cannot understand why a certain group on these boards will always loudly defend RCI to the hilt regardless of what they do and how it hurts timesharers and timeshare resorts.

VRBO has 55,000+ timeshares, condos, quarter shares, and homes up for rent – is the rental market over saturated?

One can guess as to whether the market it in over supply or over demand but I assume that the market is in balance – the right balance of supply and demand which the price reflects at the moment.

Sad to say that those bloated timeshares aren’t worth the price that the vast majority of owners paid (Developer price with 14.99% financing which doubles the purchase price).

The rental market is vicious – the true worth of a property is reflected in that rental price. If a villa commands $600 per week in a high demand time just what is the timeshare worth? $15,000? $35,000? $60,000?

If the villa commands $600 rental and the MF is $900, what does this tell us about the value of the timeshare?

Bottom line; RCI’s rental program is exposing the bloated prices of timeshares and the unrealistic value the owner has of their unit. As long as this stays “in house” in the RCI system we can each kid each other on our units worth.

Once RCI and II started renting timeshares to the general public and had to price them correctly, the ugly truth of bloated timeshare prices becomes obvious to everyone. Blaming RCI and II for the truth is to NOT face the truth.

 

[Carolinian]

Again, the 45-day window IS a FAIR EXCHANGE. Late inventory is depressed inventory in the leisure travel market. A late deposit gets a much lower trading power, so remaining last minute spacebank inventory also, logically has a much reduced trading power.

If you really want to talk about fair exchange, why should owners in the overbuilt areas with their glut of inventory be able to trade into areas which a much more favorable demand over supply curve? Those are massive trades up! If you really want like-for-like, perhaps overbuilt areas should be restricted to trading into other overbuilt areas.

If you think trades seem to be better, you don't seem to be reading the same t/s boards that I am!

You think it is the resort's fault that their business plan is designed to dovetail with RCI's??? What were they suppposed to do; guess what RCI might do in the future?? Blame the HOA? They weren't even around when the developer set things up. Blame the developer? Heck RCI was providing them with films and other materials hyping the RCI business plan. What were they supposed to do - swim against the current to devise something else? RCI's fingerprints are all over the way this was set up, regardless of what RCI's defenders on these boards say.

As to lining out part of RCI's contract, there are many resorts where no one would date to challenge the 9000 lb gorilla that way. In reality it does work, but size intimidates many from the get-go.

There is a big difference between getting a fair exchange vs the old days of the give aways. The level of fair trades seems to be better while the give aways have in fact been stopped.



It has been stated correctly many, many times if a resort/HOA has built their economics on RCI trades for value that is a big problem and it's not RCI's. They only have to look out for RCI shareholders. This dog doesn't hunt.



Again, it is a simple pencil line through the language if a resort/HOA doesn't want it to read that way. If they don't take that step it is the resort not RCI at fault. And by the way, the language in the II agreement is far more intimidating than that in the RCI standard form. Who is the really the bad guy on that front?

 

[Carolinian]

Re: TST is irrelevant - Here's the proof

Endless Vacation is NOT independent. It is owned by RCI. They will not even let Timesharing Today advertise in it. IF TST is so inconsequnetial, why is RCI so afraid of them that they will not let them advertise???

Are you trying to say that the same RCI which is not even talking to its resorts about the lawsuits would write a major story for its members about the very same subject???????? Does that make any sense at all?

While more people may have EV arrive in the mail, TST may still have more people actually reading it!

TST has 25,000 subscribers. Since there are 3M owners of timeshares in the US, their subscriber base represents less than 1% of timeshare owners. I would hardly call that relevant to the timesharing market. 99% of timesharing consumers know nothing about Timesharing today. I guess you didn't know that.

If anything, I'd say that Endless Vacations is the source of information for timesharers. That magazine is read by 1.5M timesharing consumers. That is 50% of the timesharing population.

So, I'd say that timeshare rentals is pretty much not even in the consciousness of most timesharers except for what they are offered by RCI or II.

I wouldn't be surprised if more timesharing people are influenced by the National Enquirer than they are by Timesharing Today. I am quite sure that more timesharers read it than TST.

 

[PerryM]

Show me the numbers

Carolinian,

Flooding the market with timeshare rentals is easy to proclaim; but just what does it mean?

The rental markets I follow (Maui, Whistler, Park City, Orlando, Steamboat, Lake Tahoe) this would mean about 25+ units all dumped on the same day for a holiday week. Half would be rented with no problems, half of the remaining would be rented before the 30 day mark leaving 25%, or 6 units for fire sale prices. This is assuming an aggressive pricing plan (High rents to start with)

If all 25+ units were dumped at fire sale prices, they would be snapped up so fast that none would remain after 60 days; leaving other owners to rent at the normal price-gouging rates we love.

I’d need to see proof of “dumping” and fire sale prices – I just can’t imagine why this is needed in order to rent the villas.

If you mean off-season or shoulder-season then dumping a huge quantity of villas at fire sale prices would depress the market and have many un-rented.

However, most reasonable folks would not dump 25+ units on the market – each would compete with the other. When I rent multiple holiday weeks I list just one and when it’s gone I don’t remove the ad – I have more to rent with the same ad.

Now the RCI rentals I have taken the time to investigate suggest that RCI has priced them a little on the low side in order to move fast. They must know their market – they are a billion dollar company – I can’t imagine that the nite cleaning crew is in charge of timeshare rentals – they know exactly what price to charge in order to quickly move their inventory.

To suggest otherwise would require many examples to add credence to the phrase “dumping or flooding the market” – it’s just to easy to proclaim without any supporting evidence.

I must return to the sad fact that many timeshares, especially non Gold Crown, deserve the Motel 6 rates charged – they’re dumps with a kitchen and a living room. Even the villas that just qualify for Gold Crown status can be in 25+ year old resorts that sit next to brand new “all suite” hotels with mini kitchens.

If you want to see what renters think of your timeshare just look up your timeshare on http://www.tripadvisor.com/. Many will proclaim that this is not a fair representation of their timeshare – it is from the eyes of the renter.

Conclusion: RCI knows what it is doing (renting timeshares) and the low rental rates reflect the little demand for these villas (at a specific time of the year). No evidence has been presented to conclude otherwise.

As Jerry Maguire would say “Show me the numbers”.