Monarch Grand Vacations Transition to Diamond Resorts (DRI)

[dougp26364]

Question I have about DRI is that they have built this timeshare business by purchasing resorts that were in "bad shape" as "in need of cash". So with this purchase, DRI has to finish building Cabo Azul, finish the Cancun in Vegas and decide what to do with the property that is on the Big Island of Hawaii. The property in Hawaii has not even started to build. It is just the acreage that DRI has now. The Cabo Azul resort is the resort that DRI really wanted. DRI has yet, to my knowledge, to build any buildings on any of their properties. I will be following this to see how they come out.

I wouldn't count on that. I doubt they have to finish anything. Construction costs are much higher than aquiring resort groups in trouble. If it's in DRI's best interest to build, they'll build. If not, they won't. I believe DRI has enough inventory to sell for the next several years without having to spend the money to build even more inventory.

The only resort I'm aware of that was built by DRI has been Polo Towers. They have upgraded existing resorts, completed renovations and improvements that needed to be done but, I'm not sure they've done any new construction.

DRI has it's hands full at the Point at Poipu on Kauai where there was a massive water intrusion problem. There is a lot of construction and construction expense going on at that resort and, there's a massive special assessment to pay for that construction.

I haven't seen the property so I don't know what phase it was in. Perhaps there is construction that needs to be done to make the resort reasonable. Perhaps the resort is built out enough to call it a resort.

I can name a few resorts where projects have been started but aren't likely to be completed. With Marriott there's the builds in Vegas, Marco Island and Branson. HGVC has a project in Vegas on the N. end of the strip that's only half completed and likely won't see the third or fourth tower. HGVC also cancelled an announced build at Lake Las Vegas. French Quarter Resort and Grand Regency Resorts in Branson will never be built out as proposed (original developer is insolvent). Wyndham halted a project in Vegas that never even got started. I'm sure there are dozens more incidences of projects started but never completed as proposed.

Other companies have land that either sits idle or has been sold. It's possible DRI will sell the land for the proposed Hawaiian property.

There is not a lot of new buidling going on in timeshareland. Right now there's more mergers, aquisitions and bankruptcy. It might not be that way ten years from now but, that seem to be the name of the game for the time being.

 

[dougp26364]

The Kona Reef Resort, a DRI affiliate resort and the developer Pacific Monach land are "next" to each other. So DRI could use the land to "improve" Kona Reef. Your guess is as good as mine so we will see want happens.

If it's an affiliated resort then DRI does not manage it. If DRI doesn't manage it, then they can't make improvements to it.

 

[fluke]

I also would say there is almost no chance DRI would ever build in Hawaii. Their current model has worked out extremely well for them - don't expect a change.

DRI has a history of selling off property from new acquisitions. It is far more likely that they would sell the land to bankroll a new aquisition of another distressed property - that would be their pattern.

 

[truebrit]

Doug, we were invited to this presentation, after a quick overall look at the program we were all herded into the movie theater to see the typical sales pitch in video form complete with all the testimonials imaginable. We have all seen these films before and I for one hate them. I hated them with MGV and I hate them with DRI. I had my coffee taken away from me at this point with the sales rep saying he gets in trouble if he lets drinks in the theater. What am I? Twelve? After the film it was more about how great Steven Cloobeck is and the "meaning of yes" and wasnt he great on "Undercover Boss". After I constantly asked "how much?" and after anothe quick tour of Europe and Hawaii in the choice book, I was offered the following: upgrade with 11000 points for $40 THOUSAND dollars, 7500 points for around $25000 or 4000 points for $18000. Doug this was ALL i was offered. No straight exchange of weeks to points, no, as someone else said" we will waive the fees if you join today" Nothing. We only got the 2500 points at $6000 after we got home because 2500 points at the sales office was $7500. ( remember that was a special deal from her manager due to our loyalty of 9 years) So please tell me Doug, what more should they have offered? What are other people getting at other sales offices? I would love to know if there is a deal out there for me. The ones that were offered are definately not right. Its also funny how when you buy points, the best price I got was $2.29 each, the price is sooooo different when you want to pay main. Fees. I think you quoted $0.04 per point. Whose taking who to the cleaners here?

 

[fluke]

Doug, we were invited to this presentation, after a quick overall look at the program we were all herded into the movie theater to see the typical sales pitch in video form complete with all the testimonials imaginable. We have all seen these films before and I for one hate them. I hated them with MGV and I hate them with DRI. I had my coffee taken away from me at this point with the sales rep saying he gets in trouble if he lets drinks in the theater. What am I? Twelve? After the film it was more about how great Steven Cloobeck is and the "meaning of yes" and wasnt he great on "Undercover Boss". After I constantly asked "how much?" and after anothe quick tour of Europe and Hawaii in the choice book, I was offered the following: upgrade with 11000 points for $40 THOUSAND dollars, 7500 points for around $25000 or 4000 points for $18000. Doug this was ALL i was offered. No straight exchange of weeks to points, no, as someone else said" we will waive the fees if you join today" Nothing. We only got the 2500 points at $6000 after we got home because 2500 points at the sales office was $7500. ( remember that was a special deal from her manager due to our loyalty of 9 years) So please tell me Doug, what more should they have offered? What are other people getting at other sales offices? I would love to know if there is a deal out there for me. The ones that were offered are definately not right. Its also funny how when you buy points, the best price I got was $2.29 each, the price is sooooo different when you want to pay main. Fees. I think you quoted $0.04 per point. Whose taking who to the cleaners here?

I don't believe Doug was suggesting that there are any specific deals out there. He was just stating the obvious - the timeshare salesman gets paid for selling timeshares - so you are likely getting the presentation that is best for salesman. He is suggesting(and I do to) that you follow up with corporate DRI to explore other options. Let's face it most timeshare salesman could have been pushing used cars last week - I have witnessed a lot of shady practices(even amongst those sometimes hallowed Starwood and Marriott reps).

So get concrete answers about what you can convert, what it will convert for, and what it will cost you. If you don't like the offering don't take it. DRI cannot stop you from using your current properties the way you have always used them.

 

[Kal]

...So get concrete answers about what you can convert, what it will convert for, and what it will cost you...

Concrete means IN WRITING. Remember, if you purchase something it will most always include a line item similar to this: "any information obtained verbally cannot be relied upon and is without merit".

How special is that!

 

[truebrit]

Veronica Dillon, the "specialist" at DRI, cannot give concrete answers in writing so the answer is still no. I would really like to try the program but DRI is making it impossible. They offered a trial for $2500 but I am sure that opens up another can of worms. The more I learn about DRI the more I understand they do nothing that does not benefit DRI first. The owners and members always seem to come second which is sad when its the latter that makes it all possible. MGV is like that too but it just seems to a lesser degree.

 

[dougp26364]

Doug, we were invited to this presentation, after a quick overall look at the program we were all herded into the movie theater to see the typical sales pitch in video form complete with all the testimonials imaginable. We have all seen these films before and I for one hate them. I hated them with MGV and I hate them with DRI. I had my coffee taken away from me at this point with the sales rep saying he gets in trouble if he lets drinks in the theater. What am I? Twelve? After the film it was more about how great Steven Cloobeck is and the "meaning of yes" and wasnt he great on "Undercover Boss". After I constantly asked "how much?" and after anothe quick tour of Europe and Hawaii in the choice book, I was offered the following: upgrade with 11000 points for $40 THOUSAND dollars, 7500 points for around $25000 or 4000 points for $18000. Doug this was ALL i was offered. No straight exchange of weeks to points, no, as someone else said" we will waive the fees if you join today" Nothing. We only got the 2500 points at $6000 after we got home because 2500 points at the sales office was $7500. ( remember that was a special deal from her manager due to our loyalty of 9 years) So please tell me Doug, what more should they have offered? What are other people getting at other sales offices? I would love to know if there is a deal out there for me. The ones that were offered are definately not right. Its also funny how when you buy points, the best price I got was $2.29 each, the price is sooooo different when you want to pay main. Fees. I think you quoted $0.04 per point. Whose taking who to the cleaners here?

First, I'm not certain what the current offers are from DRI for conversion

Second, sales staff is often from the previous management company and has not been fully trained.

Third, sales staff often won't give you all your options. They'll only give you the options that make them the most $$

Fourth, contact DRI's sales department via their website at https://www.diamondresorts.com/contact.aspx . Ask them if you can join THE Club without buying additional points. Someone had mentioned in their presentaion that if they bought more points, the joiner fee would be waived. If they're waiving a joiner fee then there must be a fee to simply join THE Club without buying additional points.

Finally, THE Club definately does not work for everyone. However, it sounds as if you could be interested in THE Club if you can join without having to buy additional points. If that's the case I would do as I've said and go directly to DRI's website sales department. Just because a former MGV club salesman told you one thing does not mean he told you everything.

If there is still a way to join THE Club without buying points, it's still not inexpensive. We paid $2,995 a few years back to join. It was enough money we had to think about it. In the end, I looked at our past usage, the points our weeks were worth in THE Club and compared past usage and expenses with what it would have cost to do the same in THE Club. In the end we were able to determine that we were leaving money on the table by not being in THE Club. In fact, based on the expenses of THE Club at the time and projected future usage of our weeks, we determined that it would take approx. 3 years for us to break even on the cost of joining THE Club. After three years our calculations turned out to be correct.

I also mentioned that using points to pay MF's should NOT be a consideration for buying additional points and I explained why. Will a timeshare salesman try to sell that as a benefit? You bet they will. Is it a good deal? Heck no it's not. You must be informed going into a presentation and, if you're not, you need to do as you're doing now and inform yourself. Per the TUG home page: Knowledge is power.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

I also mentioned that using points to pay MF's should NOT be a consideration for buying additional points and I explained why. Will a timeshare salesman try to sell that as a benefit? You bet they will. Is it a good deal? Heck no it's not. You must be informed going into a presentation and, if you're not, you need to do as you're doing now and inform yourself. Per the TUG home page: Knowledge is power.

Beyond that, using points for anything other than reservations in any system (not just DRI) will almost never be a good deal. Using points for anything other than reservations should be a last resort, when the points are in your account and (meaning that you've already paid for them) and there isn't any reasonable way you can use them for reservations.

 

[truebrit]

Joining this group was the best thing I could have done as I have received VERY valuble advice and great points have been made by all. Thank You Doug for all your positive feedback regarding DRI. I am glad you are enjoying your membership. I have learned more from all of you than I did from Ms. Dillon or the sales staff. I am glad we waited but I think we will wait a while longer to see how MGV plays out. And if we decide to convert I will check the DRI site first.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

I have learned more from all of you than I did from Ms. Dillon or the sales staff.

There are some of us here, doug for example, who know more about the workings of the DRI system than 95% of the sales staff. Like any organization DRI feeds its sales staff info to sell the product. That's not the same as the info to use the product.

 

[pedro47]

To the OP, I will second Doug, The Club does work !

 

[fluke]

Joining this group was the best thing I could have done as I have received VERY valuble advice and great points have been made by all. Thank You Doug for all your positive feedback regarding DRI. I am glad you are enjoying your membership. I have learned more from all of you than I did from Ms. Dillon or the sales staff. I am glad we waited but I think we will wait a while longer to see how MGV plays out. And if we decide to convert I will check the DRI site first.

I think waiting and educating yourself is very prudent action in the world of timesharing. Never let yourself be pressured into an action by sales staff - in general the least knowledgable people within the organization.

I think you have time the official announcements about MGV acquisition are only a month or two old. There may not even be a definitive conversion set up yet - but don't think that will stop salesman from trying to sell you points.

Times of transition are often full of choas.

 

[timeos2]

We have been satisfied members of The Club since Sunterra formed it in 1998. But you should NOT give up your deed (IMO). If you do you lose voting and deeded rights at the resort you own & "gain" a blended fee that includes a hefty overhead (and often averages higher than the straight annual fee is at the home resort) as well as getting no meaningful vote in the operations as your vote is easily overwhelmed by the massive control of DRI ownerships.

The Club itself works great and with our deed intact if we tire of it we simply drop out. No muss, no fuss. Nothing to worry about selling or giving away - and it only cost us $1100 to buy in (more now - I tink it's $2900). IF you want into the DRI Club system that is the way I wold recommend. I would never recommend paying to give up your deed to them. Ever.

 

[fluke]

If you wanted to call DRI corporate I would suggest calling owner enhancement department at 1.866.804.9049. See what they can tell you.

 

[truebrit]

And the useful information just keeps coming!!, I thank you all again

 

[dougp26364]

We have been satisfied members of The Club since Sunterra formed it in 1998. But you should NOT give up your deed (IMO). If you do you lose voting and deeded rights at the resort you own & "gain" a blended fee that includes a hefty overhead (and often averages higher than the straight annual fee is at the home resort) as well as getting no meaningful vote in the operations as your vote is easily overwhelmed by the massive control of DRI ownerships.

The Club itself works great and with our deed intact if we tire of it we simply drop out. No muss, no fuss. Nothing to worry about selling or giving away - and it only cost us $1100 to buy in (more now - I tink it's $2900). IF you want into the DRI Club system that is the way I wold recommend. I would never recommend paying to give up your deed to them. Ever.

I have to put in my two cents on the worth of voting rights. Basically, I feel it's over rated. Once the trust membership grows to a certain level voting rights become a moot point. Since the trust votes in a block and owners are never in step with each other, if they even vote at all, it doesn't take much for the trust to have it's way with anything put before the HOA.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

I have to put in my two cents on the worth of voting rights. Basically, I feel it's over rated. Once the trust membership grows to a certain level voting rights become a moot point. Since the trust votes in a block and owners are never in step with each other, if they even vote at all, it doesn't take much for the trust to have it's way with anything put before the HOA.

I agree totally with Doug here, and I want to play out the scenario a bit.

What is going to happen is that as DRI runs it's sales program, some portion of Monarch are going to buy in, and their ownerships will be added to one of the DRI trusts. What those owners are doing is swapping their Monarch ownership for ownership in one of the DRI trusts.

At that point, those people are no longer Monarch owners; they are owners in a DRI trust. When they cast their vote for directors, they vote for directors of the trust, not for directors of the resort. Since it is the trust that now owns the Monarch ownership, it's is now the trust that votes those memberships. So, if 10% of the Monarch owners convert, now there is a bloc of 10% of Monarch ownership, represented by the DRI trust. And since that trust always votes as a bloc, that vote is huge. In practical terms. at somewhere around 10% of ownership the trust essentially controls what happens at the resort.

*****

What does that mean for those Monarch owners who don't convert? It means that like it or not, the future of their resort is going to be controlled by the trust. So even if you decide you don't want to join the DRI Club, you still need to recognize that for practical purposes DRI is going to call the shots at your resort. Of course, Monarch was already calling the shots, so what is happening is that DRI will replace Monarch as your liege.

If you decide you don't like that change you should bail at the first good opportunity.

 

[nightnurse613]

More (late breaking news). We recently attended an owners update. After not buying 6,000 more points for $30,000 (ALL of these figures are best recollection and are probably NOT accurate) Their main selling point was letting us buy more points at the "old price" ($2) versus the new price $6. But only a certain amount. At the end of the deal they wheeled out 15K points for $2000 AND would allow us to keep the "old price" for 18 months (in case we changed our mind). We were actually ready to sign up for that until we finally realized that THOSE points could NOT be used for reservations - only car rentals, ancillary services, etc). In the end they got me to sign up for an II Credit Card - which I am about to cancel.....

 

[timeos2]

What does that mean for those Monarch owners who don't convert? It means that like it or not, the future of their resort is going to be controlled by the trust. So even if you decide you don't want to join the DRI Club, you still need to recognize that for practical purposes DRI is going to call the shots at your resort. Of course, Monarch was already calling the shots, so what is happening is that DRI will replace Monarch as your liege.

If you decide you don't like that change you should bail at the first good opportunity.

While I cannot speak to Monarch (but since it is not an original DRI resort the following may apply) here's why it IS critical that an owner holds on to their effective voting rights at the resort - not club - level:

- The Resort is actually run by the owners. Not controlled by DRI (or any other developer).
- The Developer (in this case DRI) does get a say - maybe by units directly owned or through the Trust/Club - as they hold a seat or more on the BOD. However, they do not hold the majority and in fact State law/regulations prevents them from ever regaining control of the resort HOA Board as they are the subsequent Developer. So the individual owners, not DRI, get to say how the resort is operated, who is the management, set the fees, etc. If those critical areas are turned over to any Developer/Club/Trust then owners are at the mercy of that Developer/Operator and we all see (look at Hawaii) what can happen when they hold the control.

- Resorts and owner have fought to get these rights yet too many hand them away without a thought when presented with a costly way to give up their deeds and join a trust or club. No thanks. The voluntary method - no giving up of the deed - is less costly, less risky and we retain our rights. It also gets us access to the Club resorts & features. We also get a (meaningless) vote about the Club, but as stated it can be easily overridden by the massive votes controlled in the Trust by DRI.

We have been approached many times to convert to Trust ownership but, after we saw what happened to those that did (mostly higher, not the promised lower fees among other issues) we are never even tempted to make that change.

 

[nightnurse613]

The Villas of Sedona may have an innovative approach - if it's not too late. They are proposing an amendment that you can only have one member on the BOD "identified with, related to, employed by, affiliated with, or otherwise representative of any one person or entity, or any parent, subsidiary or affiliate thereof."

 

[Etgmom]

Monarch grand transitions to dri

I am in Cabo azul in Cabo
Went to diamond owners presentation
They offer u double points
In our case it would be 17 k to
Convert to diamond lol

And we are existing diamond resorts members
We were basically told if we don't buy into
Diamond now in a few yrs we will not get into
Cabo azul because the diamond pool is larger

Not happy timeshare owners now
They say 60 percent of mg members have
Already converted

 

[dougp26364]

I am in Cabo azul in Cabo
Went to diamond owners presentation
They offer u double points
In our case it would be 17 k to
Convert to diamond lol

And we are existing diamond resorts members
We were basically told if we don't buy into
Diamond now in a few yrs we will not get into
Cabo azul because the diamond pool is larger

Not happy timeshare owners now
They say 60 percent of mg members have
Already converted

NEVER trust a timeshare sales person who uses fear as a reason for you to spend money. IMHO, what you've been told is a lie and nothing else. Don't worry about your ownership. Nothing will change.

DRI has a strong history of keeping trust inventory and weeks inventory seperate. If you're not reading a lot of complaints from weeks owners with DRI not being able to get into their home resorts, then it's not going to happen at your resort.

 

[csalter2]

You'll Be Fine

I am in Cabo azul in Cabo
Went to diamond owners presentation
They offer u double points
In our case it would be 17 k to
Convert to diamond lol

And we are existing diamond resorts members
We were basically told if we don't buy into
Diamond now in a few yrs we will not get into
Cabo azul because the diamond pool is larger

Not happy timeshare owners now
They say 60 percent of mg members have
Already converted

I would not worry too much about this. I have been in DRI for a whiile and getting into your home resort should not be a problem. I can't even believe they're saying that when tourism to Mexico is so low right now. Cruise lines have even altered their routes there. That in itself should tell you something about the salesperson.

 

[fluke]

I am in Cabo azul in Cabo
Went to diamond owners presentation
They offer u double points
In our case it would be 17 k to
Convert to diamond lol

And we are existing diamond resorts members
We were basically told if we don't buy into
Diamond now in a few yrs we will not get into
Cabo azul because the diamond pool is larger

Not happy timeshare owners now
They say 60 percent of mg members have
Already converted

Just another salesman utilizizing any tactic to make a sale. If I were you I would try to get in contact with Corpaorate DRI and ask some questions. But don't jump in to anything. I am not even sure whether DRI has a real setup to handle the MGV people yet. We have seen alot of conflicting posts here.

You could try to contact owner enhancement department at DRI (866.804.9049) and see what they say.