Missed Enrollment to get Travel and Leisure Benefits

[Phoebe24]

My parents have been owners for 30 years. Around the time Wyndham merged with Travel and Leisure, my Dad passed away and my mom didn’t use her points for a few years. We are just now getting informed that she missed the enrollment window which expired in 2024 and she isn’t getting the benefits of travel and leisure. For example, she doesn’t get the benefits of earning Wyndham reward points to pay down maintenance fees.

Wyndham tried to get her to spend more money (a LOT of money) on buying points to restructure her contract to get this benefit. She is already at the Founders level and doesn’t need more points (or more maintenance fees!) and she is in her 80s.

My brother and I need to figure out if this is something we want to inherit or not (because of all the fees). Today we went to a meeting with a Worldmark rep (we happened to be staying at a Worldmark) and the rep said “maybe” she could use some of her equity to pay down future fees and to make a restructure so she can get the travel and leisure benefits which can offset maintenance fees forever. They said this makes owning more attractive to those who may inherit it.

Anyone have input or advice on what they are telling us? I’m especially curious as to what older Wyndham owners did when the merge happened. Did you have to pay more money/buy points to get the maintenance fee deal they say she is missing out on with Wyndham rewards? She has a Wyndham rewards account but it currently doesn’t allow her to earn points on Wyndham stays to pay down fees. I am truly confused right now. I have been through hours and hours of meetings with Wyndham and don’t get straight answers. I feel like I need a lawyer to sort through it.

 

[Floridaman76]

You are new to this, so understand there is no such thing as "Travel and Leisure Benefits". What you or your parents own are good forever. You don't have to sign up for anything, you don't have to go to an "update", no matter what they say. They have been using the merger as an opportunity to lie to people to get them in the door.

You can ignore them, tell them to F off, whatever you want to do. Or you can do like I do, go to the updates, get the monetary reward, and leave.

Everything they say at these meetings are completely bogus and BS. They tend to prey on older people, the whole sales arm is an absolute disgrace.

That said, the ownership itself, and the resorts, are nice, and if you want to end up with it, you can likely make very good use of it.

 

[Phoebe24]

thanks! I am hoping someone can tell me if it is true that there is a way for us to restructure to save money on the fees. My mom pays a tremendous amount in fees and they keep going up every year.

 

[dioxide45]

thanks! I am hoping someone can tell me if it is true that there is a way for us to restructure to save money on the fees. My mom pays a tremendous amount in fees and they keep going up every year.

The best way to do this is to sell (give away) portions of the ownership on the resale market. There is no way to buy more that will save her money on maintenance fees. They'll try to spin using your ownership to convert to Wyndham Rewards to then use those Wyndham Rewards to pay maintenance fees. It isn't a good deal. The maintennace fees you pay on the Club Wyndham points ends up being more than the credit you get toward maintenance fees.

 

[Jan M.]

There's no enrollment period or anything else your mother missed. Stick with the premise that anything said by the concierge/parking pass person or sales person is either a twisted version of a partial truth or an outright lie.

You are never required to go to these supposed updates. Say NO! with a hard stare. Hold out your hand for the writsbands and tell them to stop wasting your time because no is the only answer they're getting and don't even bother calling their manager over to talk to you unless they want that person to have to deal with a scene. Don't give anyone a credit card but the front desk for the temporary security deposit. Anyone else doesn't need to see your card. Unplug the phone in the unit.

If your mother has a hard copy of even a somewhat recent Directory read through the sections about the VIP benefits, the booking and cancellation windows, and moving points forward. Jot down a few notes. Then use your parents login information to log on and play around with making and cancelling reservations.

You don't have to worry about Transaction Fees thise are free to everyone now. I'm guessing your parents have owned long enough to be grandfather with unlimited free Housekeeping Credits.

If your parents are deeded at a specific resort, that's called the home resort and can be booked 13 months out. All other resorts can be booked at 10 months or less. As a Founder's VIP the account gets 5 RARP, Reciprocal Advance Reservation Priority, reservations per year that you can use to book other resorts at 11 months out.

The minimum number of nights you can book is 2 and the maximum number of nights in one reservation is 14. You have 15 full days before the check in date that reservations can be cancelled and the points returned. For reservations made within 14 days if the check in date you have 24 hours to cancel and get the points back.

Within 60 days of the check in date Founder's get a 60% discount on the points needed to book and a free upgrade on the unit size. Upgrades requested after the reservation is made are called automatic upgrades. They're not always reliable. Sometimes you'll see a larger unit sitting there but your reservation doesn't upgrade. Don't waste your time calling in because they're not allowed to do anything but lie to you about why your reservation isn't upgrading. As long as it's still at least 15 days before the check in date you can cancel the reservation and book a new one that upgrades at the time of booking. It's best to make the new reservation before cancelling the one you currently have just in case.

Bonus Time won't be in an older Directory. It's an option within 14 days of the check in date. You can use the points or pay $5 per thousand points instead. No guest confirmations allowed on BT reservations.

Founder's has until the last day of the use year to move points to one of the two next use years. There's a $39 fee to do that and you can do it yourself online. It's best not to wait until the last day because the system gets bogged down and the phone calls get dropped. There's 4 possible use years.
January 1 - December 31
April 1- March 31
July 1 - June 30
October 1 - September 30

If you or any other family intend to take over the account, get yourselves added now. It's a huge headache if you wait until your mother passes to do it. It takes months and typically multiple times submitting the same paperwork. In the meantime you can't use the account, you're paying maintenance fees, and can lose an entire year's points because of the delays.

 

[Phoebe24]

They told us that if she restructures, we would earn 3 Wyndham rewards points for every Wyndham point spent at a condo stay. 15,000 rewards points converts to $50 of maintenance fees. They were saying that just staying in wyndham condos alone would generate a tremendous amount of Wyndham rewards points that would convert to pay maintenance fees. Has anyone been told this?

 

[Floridaman76]

They told us that if she restructures, we would earn 3 Wyndham rewards points for every Wyndham point spent at a condo stay. 15,000 rewards points converts to $50 of maintenance fees. They were saying that just staying in wyndham condos alone would generate a tremendous amount of Wyndham rewards points that would convert to pay maintenance fees. Has anyone been told this?

I don't know how to say this any more clearly than, she was lied to. They are predatory and target older people because they know they are generally more trustful of people and think they are being told the truth.

Use your ownership or get rid of it, don't buy more. At least from Wyndham. If you find later you need more points you can buy them off of ebay for virtually nothing.

Don't let her anywere near what we call the "sales weasels", they are lying theives.

 

[Phoebe24]

LOL. Yes, we were both lied to, unfortunately. And they never will give us anything in writing and I can’t find anything in writing about their policies anywhere. It is ridiculous. There should be laws to protect people from this.

 

[Floridaman76]

LOL. Yes, we were both lied to, unfortunately. And they never will give us anything in writing and I can’t find anything in writing about their policies anywhere. It is ridiculous. There should be laws to protect people from this.

I'm sure they give huge political contributions to the people running the government right now so they can continue their shenanigans

 

[Phoebe24]

probably right. It feels like fraud to me.

I’m concerned about inheriting this. I may need a lawyer to help me make sure I don’t do something wrong and end up having to pay fees for the rest of my life.

 

[HudsHut]

Welcome to TUG @Phoebe24

You are at the right place to learn about the ownership. There are many Wyndham owners on TUG who are experts.
The best use of the ownership is to take vacations while your Mother is able.

Stick around. Read. Ask questions. Read. Ask more questions.
There is a steep learning curve when you first get started.
There are many acronyms, so be sure to ask if you don't understand someone's post.
Start learning how to make a reservation.

 

[Sandy VDH]

I'm staying at Bonnet creek for work. I must have said no 25 times.

Them: We signed you up for 8am tomorrow.
ME: no, I'm at a work meeting then.
Them: then we will sign you up on your check out day.
ME: no, I have a meeting then too. I am here for work.
Them: well is you don't sign up all of your points are closing down.
Me: eye roll. I'm busy I'm not mtg anyone.

And so it goes.....

 

[Luvtoride]

We’re going to a presentation at club 45 in NYC today. Any advice to saying NO SO THEY GET IT.


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[seascapemvy]

We’re going to a presentation at club 45 in NYC today. Any advice to saying NO SO THEY GET IT.


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Wear a TUG shirt.

 

[FL Guy]

You don't have to worry about Transaction Fees thise are free to everyone now.

Not if you call to make the reservation. I posted in another thread about them charging me a $39 Transaction Fee because the system would not permit me to book a waitlist hit using my resale points and I'd already used the 2 Transaction Credits on that resale contract. I was on the phone with Owner Resolutions over an hour arguing with them and them supposedly checking to see if an exception could be made. Ultimately, they said because I hadn't taken screenshots to prove the system wouldn't let me book with my resale points, there was nothing they could do for me, and I'd have to pay the $39 fee unless I wanted to book with developer points.

 

[Jan M.]

Not if you call to make the reservation. I posted in another thread about them charging me a $39 Transaction Fee because the system would not permit me to book a waitlist hit using my resale points and I'd already used the 2 Transaction Credits on that resale contract. I was on the phone with Owner Resolutions over an hour arguing with them and them supposedly checking to see if an exception could be made. Ultimately, they said because I hadn't taken screenshots to prove the system wouldn't let me book with my resale points, there was nothing they could do for me, and I'd have to pay the $39 fee unless I wanted to book with developer points.

My bad, I should've said online transactions are free.

I'm not sure I understand about your experience. Had you already booked that stay and were asking them to refund your money or were they booking the stay for you and charging you? If the second scenario, couldn't they have suggested you try again to book it and taken screen shots if it didn't work that time too? Then when you had the proof they could've waived the fee. Or would my thinking have been too complex for whoever you dealt with?

 

[WaikikiFirst]

I’m concerned about inheriting this. I may need a lawyer to help me make sure I don’t do something wrong and end up having to pay fees for the rest of my life

IF you agree to inherit, you have decided to pay fees for the rest of your life, or jump thru hoops to give it away. The question is: will you use it for the rest of your life? Will you use it enough to make those fees easy to swallow? If not, learn from the lesson you have in front of you

ps: Thanks for the laugh from the headline. I don't own Wyndham, but the whole "missed it" and "benefits" spiel is too funny. It is also universal

 

[FL Guy]

I'm not sure I understand about your experience. Had you already booked that stay and were asking them to refund your money or were they booking the stay for you and charging you? If the second scenario, couldn't they have suggested you try again to book it and taken screen shots if it didn't work that time too? Then when you had the proof they could've waived the fee. Or would my thinking have been too complex for whoever you dealt with?

I had Fisherman's Wharf on waitlist. I got notification it was available and I had until midnight Saturday to book it. I tried to book it online, but the first screen it took me to was opting into a VIP room upgrade, which meant it was booking it with developer points. I backed out of that and called reservations. They told me they could book it for me using my resale points. I told them to do that, then, as they were finishing the booking, they told me they were charging me $39 because I'd already used my 2 Transaction Credits on my resale points. They asked if I wanted to pay the $39 for them to complete the reservation or to cancel the reservation booking. I didn't want to lose the waitlist booking, so I told them to proceed, but then complained why I had to pay the $39 for them to do it when it was a system problem that it wouldn't let me book it with resale points on my own. She said the only thing she could do at that point was to transfer me to Owner Resolutions to see if they would refund the charge or part of the charge, which OR said they would only have potentially been able to do that if I had documented that the system wouldn't allow me to book it myself.

 

[Sandi Bo]

probably right. It feels like fraud to me.

I’m concerned about inheriting this. I may need a lawyer to help me make sure I don’t do something wrong and end up having to pay fees for the rest of my life.

Welcome to TUG, @Phoebe24, really glad you found "us".

It's a great place to bounce ideas, questions, etc. You'll get lots of "free" advice - and sometimes have to have thick skin. But never be afraid to post questions and experiences here. Lawyers struggle with this at times, too. Honestly, not sure how much a lawyer will help (or hurt). And yeah, it does (often) fee fraudulent, but IMO you almost have to accept it. The money is spent, you have something of value, if you will use it and are willing to put some time into understanding and managing it. It is like drinking water through a fire hose.

The best thing to do would be to stop going to presentations. No matter what, they will lie to get you to attend, they will lie to you in the presentation, as you've seen.

I was very fortunate to get my father to agree to stop buying or exchanging or anything, without calling me. I couldn't get him to stop going to presentations, but at least I got the calls - the salesperson would come on the line, I'd tell them no, hear the deflation in the salespersons voice, and disaster averted.

My Dad's always said you couldn't do anything with Wyndham for free. And to plan on spending about $20K each transaction. Because in order to "fix" your account, you'll need to buy more points to facilitate the exchange/upgrade/whatever it gets called at the time. I think that holds true to this day.

Never (ever) take advice from the sales people. Not about anything, not about how things work or how you can offset fees, title for inheritance, etc. Ask here You can call and ask, but even then, the Vacation Counselors (VC) or Title Services, whoever, may not give you correct information.

I am more than grateful for the Founders account my family enjoys (this includes siblings, kids, nieces, and nephews). Never would I have purchased a timeshare on my own, but here I am - we've learned the ins and outs and we've have countless family vacations / reunions, etc.

Good luck with everything, good you are learning the ropes now.

 

[weems637]

Reward Points: typically you get these points from usage of the credit card that the Sales Department will be more than happy to sign you up for. Don't do this either....

 

[TUGBrian]

We’re going to a presentation at club 45 in NYC today. Any advice to saying NO SO THEY GET IT.


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Survive Timeshare Sales Presentations: Tips to Avoid Costly Mistakes

Discover essential tips and uncover common sales tactics designed to pressure you into costly decisions during timeshare presentations. Stay informed and protect yourself.

tug2.net

 

[TUGBrian]

very happy you found TUG before you or your parents threw away many thousands of dollars on a lie!

 

[easyrider]

I’m concerned about inheriting this.

You aren't legally obligated to inherit anything so don't worry about it.

The reason to keep this is because it's paid for and can be transferred to you with all of the membership benefits it now has. The main reasons to be rid of it is the maintenance fee is not affordable, you wouldn't use it, or anything really. If you do plan on keeping it, transferring the membership before a death is easier, imo.

Bill