Maui Bay Villas (MBV) Resale Tracking

[HuskerATL]

Explain this for me. I’m unsure how you are saying this works.

Folks want out of a SC property and contacts HGV. They push it to a resale broker who tries to sell it and finds a seller but Strand then takes it via ROFR... That is about it. There is always a chance that Strand doesn't take it though.

There are actually some dishonest brokers who know that deeds will be taken via ROFR but find buyers just to get sellers paid and out.

 

[mountainboy]

I thought I would start a thread for resale tracking at MBV since it’s a fairly new resort and just not a lot of info yet on resales. This can be a nice consolidate thread to share resale questions, experiences and for my personal experience I’ll continue to update this thread with my purchase experience.

Purchase: 2 Bedroom Penthouse (2PX)
Points: 38,400 (Platinum)
2025 MF: $3,520.97
Contract Price: $28,000 (full 2025 points). Buyer pays closing and 2025 MFs

For this purchase I am working with Diane at Timeshare Broker Sales. I found Diane here through Tug2 and referrals in the HGVC forum (thank you)

Here is my timeline:

Feb 3, 2025 - Offer of $28k submitted and Diane is coordinating directly HGVC Resale department , informed seller is international (Japan) [List price $68.5k]
Feb 11, 2025 - Offer accepted
Feb 13, 2025 - Buyer Signed Sales Agreement
Feb 14, 2025 - Seller Signed Agreement
Feb 14, 2025 - TRCS Closing Escrow Established and contract moving to HGVC

it's intriguing. compared to a Vegas deed which is 11,200 points and might be $5000 all in you paid six times as much for three and a half times the points; but will save 1/3 or so in MFs every year. Over time you'll come out ahead.

Those maintenance fees might be off. According to hgvcmfs.com the MF for a 2 bedroom penthouse at MBV is $3,520.97 for 2025. The MF per point is .09169 in that case. I attached a screenshot. I would triple check that MF before buying.

I noticed a separate tax line in the MF, and you’re right about the amount. It’s $3520.97. I’ve updated my original post with the new information.

With updated MFs + your other purchases (SeaWorld & Vegas) curious if you had looked into Scotland, Craig Lodges?

You will likely have 38,400 + 2x 11,200= 60,800 points, I believe

This one is 28k + closing fees (with Diane Nadeau+ HGV transfer/activn etc) + MF for 2025= approx 28k + 2.5k + 3.5k= 34k

Craig lodge, from HGV direct resale, Elite qualifying, 11,200 pts, 2 BR approx 4.5k GBP + 195 GBP closing fee; if new to HGV, only 1-time 330 GBP HGV activn fee for all intervals activated at same time (330 each, if already HGV member); ready to use (as RTU) in 2 weeks (vs a bit longer closing with HGV stateside as 'deed' etc) + DEX access (= Maui, Ka'AnaPali Beach club, Cabu Azul etc, 2 yrs out) : 5 such weeks would give one 56k HGV points and HGVC Elite Premier with lots of benefits (like @HuskerATL has kindly shared in many posts here). All for about the 34k, you are spending for just this one...

If you are already past cooling off period, no worries, all good, you still saved a lot off retail & will be using MBV anyways, as above.

If still in cooling off period, may look into it.

(Sorry, friends look out for friends, hence asking; otherwise Happy for the Awesome purchase!
+ for any other newbie like me looking thru it later, for learning).

 

[HuskerATL]

With updated MFs + your other purchases (SeaWorld & Vegas) curious if you had looked into Scotland, Craig Lodges?

You will likely have 38,400 + 2x 11,200= 60,800 points, I believe

This one is 28k + closing fees (with Diane Nadeau+ HGV transfer/activn etc) + MF for 2025= approx 28k + 2.5k + 3.5k= 34k

Craig lodge, from HGV direct resale, Elite qualifying, 11,200 pts, 2 BR approx 4.5k GBP + 195 GBP closing fee; if new to HGV, only 1-time 330 GBP HGV activn fee for all intervals activated at same time (330 each, if already HGV member); ready to use (as RTU) in 2 weeks (vs a bit longer closing with HGV stateside as 'deed' etc) + DEX access (= Maui, Ka'AnaPali Beach club, Cabu Azul etc, 2 yrs out) : 5 such weeks would give one 56k HGV points and HGVC Elite Premier with lots of benefits (like @HuskerATL has kindly shared in many posts here). All for about the 34k, you are spending for just this one...

If you are already past cooling off period, no worries, all good, you still saved a lot off retail & will be using MBV anyways, as above.

If still in cooling off period, may look into it.

(Sorry, friends look out for friends, hence asking; otherwise Happy for the Awesome purchase!
+ for any other newbie like me looking thru it later, for learning).

This is another discussion though. The cost for this is a bit more than we paid for about 100k points between Blvd and Craig.

If it is about 0.068 MF/pt then that part is really good.

 

[Jace]

With updated MFs + your other purchases (SeaWorld & Vegas) curious if you had looked into Scotland, Craig Lodges?

You will likely have 38,400 + 2x 11,200= 60,800 points, I believe

This one is 28k + closing fees (with Diane Nadeau+ HGV transfer/activn etc) + MF for 2025= approx 28k + 2.5k + 3.5k= 34k

Craig lodge, from HGV direct resale, Elite qualifying, 11,200 pts, 2 BR approx 4.5k GBP + 195 GBP closing fee; if new to HGV, only 1-time 330 GBP HGV activn fee for all intervals activated at same time (330 each, if already HGV member); ready to use (as RTU) in 2 weeks (vs a bit longer closing with HGV stateside as 'deed' etc) + DEX access (= Maui, Ka'AnaPali Beach club, Cabu Azul etc, 2 yrs out) : 5 such weeks would give one 56k HGV points and HGVC Elite Premier with lots of benefits (like @HuskerATL has kindly shared in many posts here). All for about the 34k, you are spending for just this one...

If you are already past cooling off period, no worries, all good, you still saved a lot off retail & will be using MBV anyways, as above.

If still in cooling off period, may look into it.

(Sorry, friends look out for friends, hence asking; otherwise Happy for the Awesome purchase!
+ for any other newbie like me looking thru it later, for learning).

I could still do this , I'm not giving up the Maui deed as I want that resort in our portfolio.

Point me the right discussion area to help me understnd HGV memeber vs HGVC owner ? I want to keep this focused on MBV resale.

 

[mountainboy]

I could still do this , I'm not giving up the Maui deed as I want that resort in our portfolio.

Point me the right discussion area to help me understnd HGV memeber vs HGVC owner ? I want to keep this focused on MBV resale.

Perfect! Own where you stay is always nice!

Discussion re HGV(C) Elite benefits:

2025 HGVC, HCNY, HGV Max Club Rules, Fees and Tips

2025 HGVC, HCNY, HGV Max Club Rules, Fees and Tips (1) Hilton Grand Vacations Club (HGVC) 2025 Club Rules & Fees & Resorts Club Point Charts and Open Season Rates - Post #2 2022, 2023, 2024, and 2025 Fee Change Comparison - Post #3 2022, 2023, 2024 and 2025 Open Season Rate Change Comparison -...

tugbbs.com

May search @HuskerATL 's many excellent posts re this & re Craig Lodge etc also

Enjoy the Awesome HGV(C) journey!
TY!

 

[WaikikiFirst]

Points: 38,400 (Platinum) 2025 MF: $3,520.97 Contract Price: $28,000

Nice. If I could get my wife to use more HGVC pts, I'd go for one of those. I wouldn't use them at MBV though.
The simple equation I gave approx 18 months ago says that is worth $36,760 in 2023 $s, so add 10% for inflation and you get $40,528. And again, that means you wouldn't want to PAY $40K for it, but you could get $40K of value out of it, even if you use it for only 10 yrs.

 

[WaikikiFirst]

simple equation

for people who think this TS resale mkt isn't really "well-behaved", even efficient I daresay, do this:
assume $28K + $2k = Ttl Initial Cost. assume you could make 8%/yr on $30K. That = $2400. Add that to the MF and you get approx $6K/yr total carry cost.
Divide $6K by the #Pts. You get $0.16/pt, which is just the MFs that an "avg" HGVC deed that you could buy resale for "not much" pays.

 

[WaikikiFirst]

the sellers lost a ton.

as do all sellers who buy directly from HGVC or these other developers. Disney an exception?
These lost less than you think (but not a LOT less) because they put Yen into a US$-denominated asset while the Yen was depreciating. Over the last 3 yrs, J-Yen has lost 25% vs US$ so they salvaged some value by "being in $s" for TBA period of time.

 

[WaikikiFirst]

also assume given this deed was with the HGVC resale department that could mean the original sellers were in distress or stopped paying

Not necessarily the case from what I was told. HGVC has 3 or 4 or 5 "official" brokers they use to TRANSACT these deeds when the owners contact HGVC about buying it back. Owner still using & paying MF, but wants to sell. If in Japan, they are not sure how to do it, so first contact is to call HGVC. HGVC knows owner won't give it away. HGVC wants/needs a 3rd party assessment of its value before taking it back at "$N". HGVC puts it into the inventory of the 3 or 4 or 5 "official" brokers and one of those handle the transaction. That is what brokers do.
HGVC may well ROFR it, but they want a "fair" price at which they would do that, or else the TS biz gets even worse publicity.
I do believe it was Diane who told me that, but pieces were filled in by > 1 broker.

 

[BingoBangoBongo]

as do all sellers who buy directly from HGVC or these other developers. Disney an exception?
These lost less than you think (but not a LOT less) because they put Yen into a US$-denominated asset while the Yen was depreciating. Over the last 3 yrs, J-Yen has lost 25% vs US$ so they salvaged some value by "being in $s" for TBA period of time.

One thing you don’t take into account there is the increases in MF’s on a low MF vs a higher MF deed. 5% on $1000 MF deed is $50 and would be $90 on an $1800 MF deed. This gets compounded every year.

 

[dayooper]

One thing you don’t take into account there is the increases in MF’s on a low MF vs a higher MF deed. 5% on $1000 MF deed is $50 and would be $90 on an $1800 MF deed. This gets compounded every year.

It all goes up by percentage. If I have the same amount of points via 1 or 2 deeds, it really doesn’t matter. They both will go up. Great reason to own a low MF deed/deeds.

 

[ushulu]

We just sit through a presentation at the property at MBV today. We were offered a 6500 points annual, with $28000 price. We turned it down of cause because I said I will buy from resale. The sales person told me, the resale points can only be used at MBV, we can't go anywhere else. So he will never buy from resale.

He tells me there are points and deeded in MBV....not sure about the difference and price...seems he only offered us points choice.

He tells us doesn't matter how many points you bought, 1 bedroom, 1 bedroom plus, 1 bedroom deluxe, 1 bedroom penthouse....for example, they all have different points, but their maintenances fee is the same!! So buying the more points one but in the same 1 bedroom category gives the best deal on maintenance fee....He said the maintenance fee is tied with bedroom number but not points. So I don't understand like if I bought 38k points for a 1bed penthouse, I am paying 2000 a year for maintenance but if I bought a 20k points for 2bedroom and I am paying more in maintenance fee? It doesn't make sense to me.

He then told us: maintenance fee only goes up 3% per year....

And I don't understand if I bought 38k points 1 bedroom penthouse , when I need a 2bedroom for that year which only needs for example 24k (I made this number up because I don't remember the number but I know its less than 38k points), do I need to wait until all the people who bought 2bedroom booked, then I have a chance to book what ever left? I mean if a point is a point, why there is a bedroom type tied to it?

It is so confusing for Newbie and felt a lot of lies built in....

 

[h2oflyboy]

Indeed, I’m trying to get the facts on the original purchase price but I’m told it’s like 100k+
If I find out the original price I’ll add this to my data above.

On your next Owner's Update - just glance at your data sheet - it'll be there. My resale deed for a 3-BR Penthouse at the HHV GI was valued at $175,000

 

[HuskerATL]

Resale owners can use any property in HGVC, they are lying about that

All HGVC deeds come with associated points so that you can exchange through the system.

MFs are buy unit type so 1 bed, 2 bed, etc. Check the MF sticky at MF examples

Look at the other Hawaii properties in the MF sticky to get an idea of how much they go up each year.

 

[GT75]

We just sit through a presentation at the property at MBV today. We were offered a 6500 points annual, with $28000 price. We turned it down of cause because I said I will buy from resale. The sales person told me, the resale points can only be used at MBV, we can't go anywhere else. So he will never buy from resale.

Even though you sat through a TS sales presentation at MBV, it doesn't mean that the salesperson was selling you something at MBV. Since HGV has purchased both DRI (Diamond) {renamed HVC Hilton Vacation Club) and BG (BlueGreen), they could have been trying to sell you something from those portfolios. HGV has made this so confusing. I believe that they were trying to sell you trust points from HVC/DRI side. I wouldn't recommend purchasing retail or resale HVC/DRI trust points. The MFs are very high (like around 22¢/pt) and it will be very hard to get rid of that purchase.

HGVC side is deeded ownership. So you purchase a deed at a specific resort, unit type, & season. In general, MFs for HGVC resorts are determined by room size for that resort. So, all 1BRs (same for 2BRs, 3BRs etc) at that resort will have the same MFs. Our MF Sticky can explain this better.

2025 Hilton Grand Vacations Maintenance Fees

* Please limit this thread to only the MF specifics and take discussions/commentary to the discussion boards. Thank you! * Owners, please report your Weeks MF's as they are billed (NOT proposed/estimated) in this format: Resort Name/Unit Size Operating Fee Reserve Fee Property Taxes (or note...

tugbbs.com

And I don't understand if I bought 38k points 1 bedroom penthouse , when I need a 2bedroom for that year which only needs for example 24k (I made this number up because I don't remember the number but I know its less than 38k points), do I need to wait until all the people who bought 2bedroom booked, then I have a chance to book what ever left? I mean if a point is a point, why there is a bedroom type tied to it?

(HGVC side only) Anyone can book any resort/room type when the club window opens for that resort. In general, this is anytime less than 9 months from the checkout date using the points in their account. Before this time only owners at that resort could book their specific deed ownership in the season which they own. So, many resale owners just purchase a deed with a good MF/point ratio and book during the club seasons. The key is to plan and book when the club season window opens for the best availability.

I hope that helps a little.

 

[Jace]

We just sit through a presentation at the property at MBV today. We were offered a 6500 points annual, with $28000 price. We turned it down of cause because I said I will buy from resale. The sales person told me, the resale points can only be used at MBV, we can't go anywhere else. So he will never buy from resale.

He tells me there are points and deeded in MBV....not sure about the difference and price...seems he only offered us points choice.
.

@ushulu , unfortunately, you were misled here with a blatant untruth. MBV points are part of the HGVC system and can be used anywhere. However, owning MBV points is definitely a significant advantage because they lead to an amazing place! For those years when you can’t visit the island, these points are valuable throughout the HGVC system. This is why HGVC is one of the best for resale because there are few restrictions on direct access.

 

[WaikikiFirst]

offered a 6500 points annual, with $28000 price ... he only offered us points choice.

almost certainly selling you the ex-Diamond Resorts points trust. HGVC, incl MBV, = Deeds. Those ex-Diamond pts are worth $0 ... unless somehow you find some where the MFs/Pt is down around $0.10 rather than the typical $0.22 & up. idk if that even exists. MAN, I am glad we never go to those meetings. What a headache. Even though I know we'd never buy, it'd be a headache for the day just (sort of) listening to that bull and not telling him/her to "take a hike" (the censored version)

 

[WaikikiFirst]

if a point is a point, why there is a bedroom type tied to it?

First & foremost (aka legally), for HGVC thus MBV etc, it is a DEED. Points have been mapped across the deeds but for HGVC it is a deed. Barbados? affiliate that = RTU? maybe 1 or 2 outliers. also, there is Home Wk, which is tied to a bed type. Reading required.

 

[ushulu]

Resale owners can use any property in HGVC, they are lying about that

All HGVC deeds come with associated points so that you can exchange through the system.

MFs are buy unit type so 1 bed, 2 bed, etc. Check the MF sticky at MF examples

Look at the other Hawaii properties in the MF sticky to get an idea of how much they go up each year.

Thank you so much!!

 

[ushulu]

almost certainly selling you the ex-Diamond Resorts points trust. HGVC, incl MBV, = Deeds. Those ex-Diamond pts are worth $0 ... unless somehow you find some where the MFs/Pt is down around $0.10 rather than the typical $0.22 & up. idk if that even exists. MAN, I am glad we never go to those meetings. What a headache. Even though I know we'd never buy, it'd be a headache for the day just (sort of) listening to that bull and not telling him/her to "take a hike" (the censored version)

This is how they hook us to the presentation. We booked a 1bedroom at MBV just through the hilton app like we book a hotel....when we check in, they gave my husband a note that if he brings this note to an office, he gets 500 HH points...no need to do anything, just bring that card over...so my husband went, then they tell my husband hey you want to sit through a presentation? I give you 100k hhpoints.... and we need a one night stay in Tempa in Apr for our spring break cruise, and it is about 60k points, so my husband said, let's go, lets get that one night stay paid....

 

[HuskerATL]

This is how they hook us to the presentation. We booked a 1bedroom at MBV just through the hilton app like we book a hotel....when we check in, they gave my husband a note that if he brings this note to an office, he gets 500 HH points...no need to do anything, just bring that card over...so my husband went, then they tell my husband hey you want to sit through a presentation? I give you 100k hhpoints.... and we need a one night stay in Tempa in Apr for our spring break cruise, and it is about 60k points, so my husband said, let's go, lets get that one night stay paid....

That is the way they hook a lot of people.... Next thing they know they walk away in tens of thousands of dollars of debt

 

[Jace]

That is the way they hook a lot of people.... Next thing they know they walk away in tens of thousands of dollars of debt

Or you learn and buy resale

 

[Jace]

Update: March 11, 2025 - Hilton waived ROFR and provided Estoppel to TRCS closing. I expect to get the final deed paperwork on March 17.

 

[mountainboy]

Update: March 11, 2025 - Hilton waived ROFR and provided Estoppel to TRCS closing. I expect to get the final deed paperwork on March 17.

1 month for ROFR/Estoppel at HGV (2/15 through 3/11)?

 

[Jace]

1 month for ROFR/Estoppel at HGV (2/15 through 3/11)?

Yes.