Marriott points no value: resale

[dioxide45]

I'm curious as to how the MF on 1,000 points can be $575. Thought the MF/pt currently amounts to $0.41. That information is easy to obtain and/or verify.

The $2,095 amount? There's no way I know of to independently verify the $2,095 or the components thereof.

Accordingly, I have little confidence in the accuracy of any of the representations made by the seller in this listing.

I think they are adding the $165 DC fee in to the MF amount. $410+$165=$575.

 

[thinze3]

Why is the transfer fee so much higher than the last auction?

$2095 now for 1000 points vs $1595 then for 1500 points

 

[windje2000]

I think they are adding the $165 DC fee in to the MF amount. $410+$165=$575.

That's probably it, and inherently assumes they can join.

 

[kjd]

What's wrong with someone paying an initiation fee to get to use the point system? We all had to pay one albeit less, $695 or $1,995. Marriott has created a cash machine for themselves and at the same time cleverly screwed the legacy owners. Charging for nothing but the priviledge to do business with them, while always promising new resorts that are never to be built. We resale buyers who are legacy owners got into this mess cheaper than those that will come after us. That's about the only consolation we have. The DC legacy owners do have a better situation than weeks owners that aren't enrolled. There are some new advantages compared to what we've had but the initiation fee doesn't justify it.

As long as Marriott keeps up the level of service at their resorts my complaints are minor ones. Even though they have killed the resale market for those wanting to sell, Marriott timeshares are still a good vacation situation as long as you use them. If anyone is unhappy, they should sell, take their loss and move on. That's why there's an Ebay.

 

[jont]

What's wrong with someone paying an initiation fee to get to use the point system? We all had to pay one albeit less, $695 or $1,995. Marriott has created a cash machine for themselves and at the same time cleverly screwed the legacy owners. Charging for nothing but the priviledge to do business with them, while always promising new resorts that are never to be built. We resale buyers who are legacy owners got into this mess cheaper than those that will come after us. That's about the only consolation we have. The DC legacy owners do have a better situation than weeks owners that aren't enrolled. There are some new advantages compared to what we've had but the initiation fee doesn't justify it.

As long as Marriott keeps up the level of service at their resorts my complaints are minor ones. Even though they have killed the resale market for those wanting to sell, Marriott timeshares are still a good vacation situation as long as you use them. If anyone is unhappy, they should sell, take their loss and move on. That's why there's an Ebay.

I see nothing wrong with paying an initiation fee for resale points, as long as those points have full priviliges. But why would marriott want to compete with resales of points when they are trying to sell them retail and have an almost endless supply?

 

[SueDonJ]

Was reading this thread and saw this listing tonight on eBay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/260928105687?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

So do we think the "initiation fee" is what the seller is calling the MVC transfer fee for $2095? Are the points free and clear then?

Interesting/negative reviews about this eBay seller in this thread, thought it was worth noting because it's the only seller of resale DC Points that we've seen so far.

 

[dioxide45]

Ebay bidding ended at $1.00 on this one.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260928105687

 

[thinze3]

20 cents on the dollar - not bad

I tried to get the seller to split the transfer fees with me to no avail. Consequently, I wouldn't bid on it. I did, however, get two emails from Marriott telling me the process and the fees involved. There is also going to be an "education fee" that is not stated in the eBay listing.

 

[windje2000]

I tried to get the seller to split the transfer fees with me to no avail. Consequently, I wouldn't bid on it. I did, however, get two emails from Marriott telling me the process and the fees involved. There is also going to be an "education fee" that is not stated in the eBay listing.

The education fee is waived if you already own points.

If you don't already own points, that fee can be anything Marriott wants in its sole judgement and discretion.


(See post 19 of this thread)

 

[jont]

I tried to get the seller to split the transfer fees with me to no avail. Consequently, I wouldn't bid on it. I did, however, get two emails from Marriott telling me the process and the fees involved. There is also going to be an "education fee" that is not stated in the eBay listing.

Education fee? that's a good one. Who gets the education, Mariott?:hysterical:

 

[thinze3]

Yes. Here is the quoted from the email. If you "bought points from Marriott" you will not have to pay the fee. Everyone else does. Even legacy members.

The New owner will have to pay an education ($300 per owner) and initiation fee ($200 per BI with a $2000 minimum). And then they would have full access to the program.

If they only have enrolled weeks and then purchase BI's on the external market, they would have to pay the education fee.

 

[SueDonJ]

I tried to get the seller to split the transfer fees with me to no avail. Consequently, I wouldn't bid on it. I did, however, get two emails from Marriott telling me the process and the fees involved. There is also going to be an "education fee" that is not stated in the eBay listing.

I wonder if there are non-legal ownership materials given to DC Points purchasers that explain the program in owner-friendly terms, and the "education fee" simply translates to the costs for those materials? I have no idea, but direct purchasers of Weeks used to get several professionally-designed pamphlets and books that were pretty valuable when trying to figure out the whole program. I still have and refer back often to the 3-ring binder "Owner Reference Guide" that we were given way back when.

 

[tjkahn]

We resale buyers who are legacy owners got into this mess cheaper than those that will come after us. That's about the only consolation we have. The DC legacy owners do have a better situation than weeks owners that aren't enrolled. There are some new advantages compared to what we've had but the initiation fee doesn't justify it.

Hi, new TUG member here. I've owned at Marriott Timber Lodge, 2 BR platinum ski since 2003. I'm trying to evaluate what I should/need to do. My week is worth 4,325 points, but I don't quite understand the statement above. What is the big advantage of converting my week (or more accurately, what is the disadvantage to me if I don't). I suppose if you lock off and exchange each year, you do save in fees ($165 vs. $75 lock-off, plus $79 - $99 for each domestic exchange, plus$59-$89 for interval membership). The problem for existing owners that don't enroll would be if a large percentage of legacy owners do enroll, and II would not get their deposited inventory. But it doesn't seem as though a large percentage of owners have convertated their legacy weeks, and with the exception of fee savings (which would take a while to make up given the $595 fee to convert), is there a compelling reason to deposit my week? I've been reading threads for two days and despite all the information out there, I can't make a clear choice. My gut tells me since Marriott wants everyone to convert, you shouldn't.

 

[Davidr]

We did the tour in August at Oceana Palms. The salesperson swore that Marriott would buy back your points at $0.60 on the dollar. :hysterical: I didn't want to be rude so I didn't call her a liar to her face.

 

[jimf41]

What is the big advantage of converting my week (or more accurately, what is the disadvantage to me if I don't).

But it doesn't seem as though a large percentage of owners have convertated their legacy weeks, and with the exception of fee savings (which would take a while to make up given the $595 fee to convert), is there a compelling reason to deposit my week?

The advantages and disadvantages vary for each of us and it mainly depends on how you use your week. Do you use it, trade it or rent it? If you use it I'd advise not to convert. If you trade it then I'd advise converting as you get a fairly high amount of points. I've never rented so I don't have any idea if that would be advantageous to you or not.

If your unit is a lockoff and you routinely lock it off and trade one or both of the units I think you'll get your money back pretty quickly so I would convert if that's what you do.

Right now you still get 800 one time use points that can be used for one year from the conversion date. That pretty much makes the $595 fee a wash.

 

[catvag]

Marriott not the company they used to be

We own At Marriott in Kauai, Maui & Aruba and love our 4 independents much more. I received no reminder to move 2011 Destination Points to 2012 by 6/30, and received misinformation from my vacation advisor. All I can get is a non-Marriott trade through Interval, no help from upper management, no consideration for 20 years of ownership. The new point system is a heavy handed sell, not all info, restrictions and dates disclosed during meetings, empty promises from advisors. With no trust in this company, I plan to sell - or get out somehow - in 2014. In his book, Mr. Marriott said the success of his company was due to the quality of its employees - not so much anymore!

 

[timesharegirl101]

Converted weeks to Points, points will not transfer resale

I work for a title company and timeshares re-seller and from our understanding according to Marriott any timeshare that have been converted to the MVC points, the points will not transfer on the resale market. They will be converted back to the original week, assuming that Marriott doesn't exercise it's ROFR.

I also know someone who just went through training with Marriott and verfied this information, as well as telling me that if you buy a week resale and want to "upgrade" to point you have to wait 5 years. Although I am sure for the right price that could change.

Marriott like Wyndham has become increasingly hard to deal with regarding resales and make it harder for owners to resell thier timeshares by putting unfavorable restrictions on the people who buy from the resale market.

 

[TheTimeTraveler]

I work for a title company and timeshares re-seller and from our understanding according to Marriott any timeshare that have been converted to the MVC points, the points will not transfer on the resale market. They will be converted back to the original week, assuming that Marriott doesn't exercise it's ROFR.

I also know someone who just went through training with Marriott and verfied this information, as well as telling me that if you buy a week resale and want to "upgrade" to point you have to wait 5 years. Although I am sure for the right price that could change.

Marriott like Wyndham has become increasingly hard to deal with regarding resales and make it harder for owners to resell thier timeshares by putting unfavorable restrictions on the people who buy from the resale market.

Whoever said that the points would transfer in the resale market? I think it's been made very clear that any private resale (i.e. other than Marriott) occurring after 6/20/2010 is ineligible for both Marriott Destination Club Points and Marriott Reward Points.




.

 

[SueDonJ]

I work for a title company and timeshares re-seller and from our understanding according to Marriott any timeshare that have been converted to the MVC points, the points will not transfer on the resale market. They will be converted back to the original week, assuming that Marriott doesn't exercise it's ROFR.

I also know someone who just went through training with Marriott and verfied this information, as well as telling me that if you buy a week resale and want to "upgrade" to point you have to wait 5 years. Although I am sure for the right price that could change.

Marriott like Wyndham has become increasingly hard to deal with regarding resales and make it harder for owners to resell thier timeshares by putting unfavorable restrictions on the people who buy from the resale market.

If you own Marriott Weeks and enroll them in the new Destinations Club, you're not actually changing your original ownership at all. Enrollment just means that you've gained another usage option, which is that you can elect on an annual basis to convert your Weeks to DC Points for use in the DC Exchange Company or the DC Collections. (If your Weeks were purchased by you on the external market prior to enrollment you also gain the usage option to elect annually or EOY to convert your Weeks to Marriott Rewards Points. Prior to the inception of the DC, this option did not transfer with an external resale.) Enrollment by itself, and/or a conversion one year from Weeks usage to DC Points usage, does not constitute a permanent conversion of Weeks to DC Points for the life of your ownership. It is correct that if you enroll your Weeks and then subsequently sell them, your enrollment in the DC system will not transfer with the sale.

As it stands now, the only resale Marriott Weeks that can be enrolled in the DC are those which were purchased prior to 6/20/10, or those which are purchased from the Marriott Resales office (but only if the buyer also purchases a DC Points package at the same time.) All other resales purchased after 6/20/10 are NOT eligible to be enrolled in the DC. Don't know where the "5 years" you've heard of is coming from but it's the first time such a thing has been reported to TUG, Marriott hasn't released an official statement that verifies it, and none of the governing docs for the program specifically support it. (IOW, I wouldn't believe it.)

Purchasing and re-selling Marriott DC Points - the topic of this thread - is a totally different animal than enrolling and subsequently re-selling Marriott Weeks. While I agree that the inception of the DC does further restrict usage of Weeks resales (along with the devaluation that appears to be a factor of DC Points resales,) as noted Marriott has always restricted external Weeks resales by not allowing the MRP-exchange option included with direct purchases to transfer to the new owner. Of course we owners don't like to see resale devaluations but Marriott isn't exactly a new player in that game.

 

[n777lt]

If you own Marriott Weeks and enroll them in the new Destinations Club, you're not actually changing your original ownership at all. Enrollment just means that you've gained another usage option, which is that you can elect on an annual basis to convert your Weeks to DC Points for use in the DC Exchange Company or the DC Collections. (If your Weeks were purchased by you on the external market prior to enrollment you also gain the usage option to elect annually or EOY to convert your Weeks to Marriott Rewards Points. Prior to the inception of the DC, this option did not transfer with an external resale.) Enrollment by itself, and/or a conversion one year from Weeks usage to DC Points usage, does not constitute a permanent conversion of Weeks to DC Points for the life of your ownership. It is correct that if you enroll your Weeks and then subsequently sell them, your enrollment in the DC system will not transfer with the sale.

As it stands now, the only resale Marriott Weeks that can be enrolled in the DC are those which were purchased prior to 6/20/10, or those which are purchased from the Marriott Resales office (but only if the buyer also purchases a DC Points package at the same time.) All other resales purchased after 6/20/10 are NOT eligible to be enrolled in the DC. Don't know where the "5 years" you've heard of is coming from but it's the first time such a thing has been reported to TUG, Marriott hasn't released an official statement that verifies it, and none of the governing docs for the program specifically support it. (IOW, I wouldn't believe it.)

Purchasing and re-selling Marriott DC Points - the topic of this thread - is a totally different animal than enrolling and subsequently re-selling Marriott Weeks. While I agree that the inception of the DC does further restrict usage of Weeks resales (along with the devaluation that appears to be a factor of DC Points resales,) as noted Marriott has always restricted external Weeks resales by not allowing the MRP-exchange option included with direct purchases to transfer to the new owner. Of course we owners don't like to see resale devaluations but Marriott isn't exactly a new player in that game.

Thanks for taking the time to spell all this out! This post deserves its own sticky.

 

[OutAndAbout]

We did the tour in August at Oceana Palms. The salesperson swore that Marriott would buy back your points at $0.60 on the dollar. :hysterical: I didn't want to be rude so I didn't call her a liar to her face.

I heard the same story, although after a long pause, added the caveat that the points wouldn't be bought back immediately because Marriott has to resell them first and it would take 8-10 months to resell them..

 

[m61376]

I heard the same story, although after a long pause, added the caveat that the points wouldn't be bought back immediately because Marriott has to resell them first and it would take 8-10 months to resell them..

How fast would they back-track if asked to ut that in writing? :hysterical:

 

[thinze3]

We own At Marriott in Kauai, Maui & Aruba and love our 4 independents much more. I received no reminder to move 2011 Destination Points to 2012 by 6/30, and received misinformation from my vacation advisor. All I can get is a non-Marriott trade through Interval, no help from upper management, no consideration for 20 years of ownership. The new point system is a heavy handed sell, not all info, restrictions and dates disclosed during meetings, empty promises from advisors. With no trust in this company, I plan to sell - or get out somehow - in 2014. In his book, Mr. Marriott said the success of his company was due to the quality of its employees - not so much anymore!

Even Marriott knew (knows) the value of their timeshare business was next ti nil. That's why they spun off the timeshare segment as a separate company (VAC). The timeshare business was dragging down the "hotel management" portion (MAR) of the company and the stock price.

Now that the timeshare business is independent, my guess is that it can only get better going forward. Let's hope for good management decisions.