Marriott Aruba Ocean Club Owners Being Ripped Off By Marriott - READ IF AN OWNER

[Zac495]

I voted the same as everyone else. Does anyone know if and when will will get billed for the assessment. I loss my job and I need to prioritize my bills!! Timeshare falls towards the bottom.

I'm so sorry, Lora. I think very soon - I heard April...
PS - I got my proxy and will vote with everyone else. I think our fees will be down next year - I believe Allen is going to be our knight in shining armor.

 

[guam14]

Rec'd materials and voted as you suggest. Hope this moves us toward some type of settlement of this outrageous situation.
I think the individuals who have suggested that if owners do not like the situation to sell out are not exactly financially astute. Who is going to buy with these problems and in this economy? We are really between a rock and a hard place. In a better economy I would be a seller. Funny since I have brought two buyers to Marriott - luckily they both bought at the Surf Club. Ask me when I would ever recommend Marriott again?

I got my Proxy as well. I am not going to tell anyone what to do but here is what I am going to do.

1) I am not checking Frank Knox I am putting in Allan Cohen's name in line 2 as he will be my proxy for all voting members.

2) I am not going to select any of those items so Allan can vote for the any candidate including proposing a new candidate. If you are following me DO NOT CHECK THE LAST ITEM AS IT PREVENTS ALLAN FROM VOTING FOR A CANDIDATE. The group of concerned owners will propose alternative candidates.

3) The same as #2, I will not be selecting any of the 3 choices

4) I will select vote allowing Allan to place all votes on my behalf.

With over 1000 concerned owners and more every day, we will have A big block of votes and hopefully make a difference in the election.

In the meantime the call for a special meeting will move forward. At this time there are a few days left for those wishing to opt out and then the request will go through. An email will be sent to all owners who have signed up.

 

[lll1929]

I'm so sorry, Lora. I think very soon - I heard April...
PS - I got my proxy and will vote with everyone else.

Thanks Ellen.

I was thinking April as well, but I continue to check my acct and no bill. I guess I won't worry about it.

 

[marksue]

Lora,

Sorry to hear about your job. Depending on what you do I may know some head hunters fo you to talk with. As for the assesments it was initially supposed to be in June but Frank, Melissa and Steve, voted to move it to april and next years will be do with your MF. THis is after it was announced to everyone that both years would be June.

Another item on the proxy's. Isnt it a conflict of interest when a person running for the board has his name as the person to be the proxy for those who can not be at the meeting? Do you think Frank would vote for some besides himself? Another reason there is a lack of trust of this board.

 

[Quilter]

I confess I haven't read this entire thread, just beginning and ending bits. This is what I believe is going on--correct me if I'm wrong.

Marriott bought a building with roof problems
Marriott sold timeshares in said building without correcting structural problems
Refurbishment time comes around and Marriott wants owners to pay to fix roof
BOD President gets removed (why?)
New BOD President does not insist Marriott should be responsible for roof
Owners want Marriott to pay for roof portion of refurbishment

What I'd like to ask:

If the roof has been a problem for so many years, why didn't the previous BOD President get Marriott to fix it earlier?

Thanks,
Suzzanne

 

[ecwinch]

If the roof has been a problem for so many years, why didn't the previous BOD President get Marriott to fix it earlier?

He did and was ousted for his efforts when the BOD decided to work things out with MVCI rather then enter into litigation. Your timeline is correct from one point of view, here is another.


Marriott bought a building
Marriott sold timeshares in said building
Roof was discovered to have problems
BOD President begins evaluating legal action against MVCI
BOD decides not to pursue legal action and try to work things out with MVCI, against President's recommendation
Refurbishment time comes around and Marriott wants owners to pay to fix roof. MVCI chips in a % to cover the remaining time on the roof warranty (as they should - they are the contractor)
BOD President gets removed by pro-Marriott board
Change in budget (added staff) combined with inflation in Aruba results in a sharp spike in m/f
Owners begin questioning actions of duly elected BOD, and the conspiracy theory develops

 

[lovearuba]

read the letter from the previous president

I think the main key points that I believe came from a letter Alan Cohen the previous president documented. It is within this thread. He was a credible person who was always open to speak with the owners at the ocean club. The new one has no direct contact.

 

[AwayWeGo]

Too Simple ?

Owners want Marriott to pay for roof portion of refurbishment

What if they split the roof refurbishment costs -- the owners pay 1/2 & the timeshare company pays 1/2 ?

I know -- too simple. Right ?

But if the owners opt to sue the timeshare company instead, they're apt to spend all the roof repair money (& then some) on lawyers -- & then at the end of the process they may or may not succeed in forcing the timeshare company to spring for a new roof.

If the owners succeed, they won't have saved any money -- i.e., for what they paid the lawyers, they could just as well have paid 1/2 the roof cost.

If they don't succeed, the lawyers will have all their money that could have gone toward fixing the roof -- & they still won't have a new roof.

Too bad some people would rather be right than be happy.

So it goes.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[ecwinch]

Alan,

Actually if you read one of the replies from the BOD, it would appear that MVCI is stepping in to pay a pro-rated portion based on the expected life of the roof. Like a warranty would.

Just like if your tires go out on your car and you have a 25,000 mile warranty. They pay a pro-rated portion based on the mileage used. They do not pay the entire cost of the tire. Roof warranties are the same.

Thanks

 

[Quilter]

So the past President wanted to pursue legal action against Marriott instead of working out an agreement? The rest of the Board was in favor of foregoing legal fees, time and trouble and therefore pay part of the roof repair? Is there a chance Marriott will split the cost of the repair 50/50?

Thanks again,
An Owner

 

[ecwinch]

I think the main key points that I believe came from a letter Alan Cohen the previous president documented. It is within this thread. He was a credible person who was always open to speak with the owners at the ocean club. The new one has no direct contact.

LoveAruba is referring to this post from Marksue regarding Alan Cohen's Letter. Pg. 2,
Pg.3


Ideally it would be from Alan himself. Apparently he can only read TUG, and cannot post here because he is on the BOD. MarkSue has indicated that this is the copy he received.

 

[ecwinch]

So the past President wanted to pursue legal action against Marriott instead of working out an agreement? The rest of the Board was in favor of foregoing legal fees, time and trouble and therefore pay part of the roof repair? Is there a chance Marriott will split the cost of the repair 50/50?

Thanks again,
An Owner

That is correct. Also the uncertainity of any legal proceedings.

It has not been reported that they are withdrawing the offer. The last correspondence from the BOD indicated that MVCI was going to pay 47% and offer no-interest financing to reduce the impact to the owners.

It is also important to note, that for the most part, these actions have already been taken. The effort toward a more pro-owner BOD (which is a good thing), is really seperate from the roof issue. Besides being willing to resume legal action, a new BOD would be forced to adhere to any binding agreements the sitting board made. MVCI is no dummy, they would not make the 47% offer without consideration.

 

[Quilter]

Okay, I've read Mr. Cohen's letter. Yes, I always appreciated his open communication through email.

The 47% offer by Marriott sounds like they are trying to work with the owners. If this is so, then couldn't it be concluded that the current BOD has actually represented the owner's interests to bring about this offer from Marriott? And without legal action?

This thread makes the current BOD out to be "puppets" of Marriott and not "owner friendly". What I'd like is real evidence that this is, in fact, the case.

The recent posts regarding the proxies seem to be planning a way to oust the current BOD and replacing them with who???? Why are the current BOD members so bad? Facts, please, give me facts. Not fears. Not anger.

 

[tlwmkw]

Quilter,

Apparently the people trying to elect a new BOD want the MF's reduced and the costs of the refurbishment reduced also. I believe they feel this could be done if there were a new BOD (though it's not really clear how this could be achieved). The people who are upset feel that MVCI should pay all of the roof costs and not just the 47% that they have pledged. There has been talk of class action lawsuits but that talk seems to have died down as they have realized that they will likely get nothing if they persist in this approach.

Marksue and Lovearuba are the most active in this and they haven't really addressed what the eventual goal of ousting the current board would be.

Overall I think there is a perfect storm of things that occurred- the defective roof was discovered, the board threatened legal action which then lead to the shutdown of communication from the board for legal reasons, Marriott agreed to pay some costs but not all, and then the costs of the property rose at the same time that a refurbishment was due, and then to top it off the worldwide economic situation collapsed making everyone a little poorer than they used to be. Combine all this with the lack of transparency and people became very suspicious of the BOD and of Marriott. I think once all this dies down and the roof is fixed, and the refurb is done then the situation will improve because this is one of the best resorts in Aruba and will be better after the refurb.

 

[Quilter]

It just happens that this showed up in my inbox tonight. Sounds to me like the new BOD has been busy and proactive for owners. Also appears that Marriott is doing a decent job.


April 2009


Dear Fellow Aruba Ocean Club Owners:

As was promised earlier in this year, I wanted to give to you continual updates on our investment in Aruba Ocean Club. We have made tremendous progress on a number of items as listed below:

UPDATES:

I: BUILDING

(A) Roof, (B) Windows, (C) Structural, (D) Environmental

A. Roof: The new roof has been completed to our highest expectations. We have had the installation inspected by no less than four industry professionals, including our insurance company, and are very pleased with the results. We have a 10 year comprehensive warranty and the ability to extend that warranty for an additional 10 year period. The cost of the new roof was 48% Marriott Vacation Club® International, 52% Aruba Ocean Club.

B. Windows: Due to the failed seals, we replaced a majority of the double pane windows throughout our buildings at no cost to the Owners. In addition we have a supply of 500 additional windows on site should there be any failures in the future. All windows, installation, shipping and reserve supply were paid 100% by Marriott Vacation Club International.

C. Structural: At the request of the Board, our building has been reviewed and evaluated for the live load capacity of the roof structure, the drainage capacity of the roof, as well as for the current condition of any exposed or hidden structural members by a professional, licensed structural engineer. In accordance with this scope of work, confirmation was received that the building is in good condition.

D. Environmental: After water penetration, sustained from our old roof and Hurricane Omar, our building has been evaluated and tested for any possible environmental concerns such as mold and mildew. I am pleased to inform you that our building received a clean bill of health not only from our own environmental consultant (which is also an Aruba Ocean Club Owner) but also those engaged by Marriott Vacation Club International and, as well as from insurance authorities.

II: 10 YEAR RENOVATION

(A) Activities, (B) Timeline, (C) Model

A. As Owners we are investing $14 million dollars in a total renovation of our property. Marriott Vacation Club International is contributing $2 million dollars to our overall costs. This renovation will be a totally new villa to include new bathrooms, furniture, flat screen televisions, carpet and many other items. We will also renovate the lobby, commons areas and hallways of all of our buildings.

B. We are well on our way with this project and will have sample boards on display in our Lobby in May 2009.

C. We will also have a completed model unit on display by late July 2009. By mid 2010 we will all be enjoying completely new villas.

III: OPERATIONS

(A) General Manager, (B) Integration

A. We are making substantial progress on improving the efficiency of our daily operations. Lower utility rates, combined with the impact of the newly installed roof, windows and air conditioning system, have dramatically decreased our energy costs. Additionally, we now have a dedicated General Manager versus a shared manager. He will work closely with each of us as we visit the property for a quality vacation.

B. We have tried to utilize the best features of an integrated campus while at the same time protecting our unique location. The back room operations such as personnel, purchasing, phone systems and security remain combined with our sister properties (Hotel, Aruba Surf Club) to save on cost issues. The amenities we enjoy such as pool, palapa and beach remain dedicated only to Aruba Ocean Club Members. I believe that is the best balance for Aruba Ocean Club.

IV: MAINTENANCE FEES–2009 and 2010

2009 Maintenance Fees were driven by several increases beyond our control, including in utility costs, water expenses and inflation in Aruba. The additional repair cost of Hurricane Omar was also unanticipated. We have also been faced with a good bit of deferred maintenance from prior spending decisions.

I am pleased to report that finances continue to improve as we move through 2009. One prime example is our 2008 year end operating results were $600,000 better than projected. Additionally, at the end of the first quarter of 2009, our electricity costs were $150,000 under budget. Other budget items have also declined and stabilized. If lower utility rates and savings, resulting from investments we have made in roof, windows and the new corridor air conditioning system continue as forecasted, an additional surplus of $500,000 for 2009 could be generated. Should we achieve our currently projected year end forecast it would clearly allow us to budget a maintenance fee decrease for 2010. I believe this is good news for our Owners.

Finally, I also want to encourage all Owners to please cast your Limited Proxy for the upcoming Annual Meeting. This meeting and election will set our direction for the next few years.


Regards,


President, Aruba Ocean Club

 

[ecwinch]

It just happens that this showed up in my inbox tonight. Sounds to me like the new BOD has been busy and proactive for owners. Also appears that Marriott is doing a decent job.

Quilter - you need another glass of kool-aid. Get back in line and get your pitchfork and torch, and quit asking so many questions. All this talk of proof and evidence. Hmmph!

And since you already are an owner, next will come the posts asking if you work for Marriott. Usually they try to disqualify you for not being an owner, and then it is that you are a Marriott mole.

 

[marksue]

Yes work is being done. The big issue is the lack of transparency. Once Allan was forced out all forms of communications was removed from the AOC website. No one has said why they did that. Why do all communications’ have to go through a Marriott employee, who is a contractor to the owners? Why is the current board except for Allan refusing to speak with owners? Why has Allan been blocked from reading emails from concerned owners? When Allan proposed to let owners have a say regarding delaying the refurbishments why did the board ignore him and refuse to vote on the motion? Why when Mr. Marriott was in Aruba meeting with folks in the hotel, did Dirk and Corey arrange an AOC meeting at the same time to keep angry owners from speaking with Mr. Marriott?

There is nothing new in Frank's letter; we have been hearing the same thing once a month. You also have to wonder why now that the proxy's have been sent out, is Frank sending an email to owners repeating the same thing Marriott has wanted him to say?

What is being accomplished may be the best thing possible for the owners, but the total lack of transparency, lack of open communications, the way the nomination process was handled, and conflict of interest with Frank Knox being a proxy leads to total distrust of the BOD and Marriott. Why is Frank not reminding everyone about the upcoming assessment in his letter? He doesn’t want to remind us that it is coming. Come on Frank time to stop the games.

Maybe if there was more communication from the board the owners would trust the current BOD and Marriott.

People have reached out to the financial analyst who cover Marriott and let them know one of the reasons Marriott TS business is being impacted and pointing them to this site.

What we want is a BOD that is accessible to the owners and will represent the owners. Until this issue gained momentum there was nothing coming from the BOD or Marriott. If we had not done a thing we would still not know what is going on and would probably be in a worse position that we are today.

 

[ecwinch]

This is a long thread, so for the newcomers who have a life, I will summarize some of the answers to Marksue's questions:

- Due to term limits, Alan Cohen was scheduled to leave the board this year. A succession plan was put in place, and Alan was replaced early this year as BOD President and continues to serve on the board. That there was a succession plan has been disputed.

- The current BOD decided that communications from owners should be routed through the newly created GM position at the Ocean Club. The BOD said that this was done since most items were best answered by him in his role in the day to day operations. He would forward any questions he could not answer to the BOD.

- No one knows why Alan is being blocked from reading e-mails, but I have speculated that Alan was perceived as undermining the BOD. For instance by providing a list of owner e-mail addresses to Marksue

- There is no record that Alan's motion to allow owners to vote was seconded by another member of the BOD. Otherwise they would have voted as a matter of procedure.

- There is no evidence that the angry owners requested a meeting with Mr. Marriott during his island visit. The owners meeting is a standing meeting regularly scheduled at the OC.

- Frank holding the proxies is a matter of procedure, and in accordance with his position as board president

- The BOD has sent numerous communications to owners in an effort to communicate better

- The communications might say the same thing as MVCI is saying as it is the truth

- Marksue's efforts have definitely raised awareness of this issue, and made the BOD improve their communications. He should be congratulated for his efforts.

Just trying to add some balance. If I have any of the facts in error, please let me know.

 

[Quilter]

Thanks for all the responses.

Sorry, I'll pass on the sweet drink that contains questionable ingredients.

 

[billhall]

out of town until April 27th

We've been out of town for a couple of weeks and won't be back until the 27th. Is there any way for us to vote our Marriott Aruba proxy from Hawaii? We've always appreciated Allan's help and communication. Thanks!

 

[marksue]

Bill,

You can try to call Marriott and ask them to send another one to you in Hawaii.

 

[lovearuba]

this thread

This is the point... yeah Marksue and everyone else that tried to get some of the issues addressed, it was worth it.

 

[marksue]

To all newcomers this addresses the inaccuracies presented in Eric's summarization.



-

Due to term limits, Alan Cohen was scheduled to leave the board this year. A succession plan was put in place, and Alan was replaced early this year as BOD President and continues to serve on the board. That there was a succession plan has been disputed.

a) There was no succession plan. This was done through a vote by the remainder of the board and Marriott. At no point in time was there a plan. If there was Allan would have shared that with the owners.

- The current BOD decided that communications from owners should be routed through the newly created GM position at the Ocean Club. The BOD said that this was done since most items were best answered by him in his role in the day to day operations. He would forward any questions he could not answer to the BOD.

a) This move occurred only after removing Allan as president. Most of the questions owners had were for the board,, yet there was no answers at all. I know for a fact that many owners wrote and Frank would never respond to owners, nor would they get a response from Corey. All meeting minutes were removed from the website as well as most previous communications to owners.

- There is no record that Alan's motion to allow owners to vote was seconded by another member of the BOD. Otherwise they would have voted as a matter of procedure.

a) There was an owner on the call when Allan made his proposal and the board said they would not vote on it. There should be minutes of all meetings made available to owners’, yet you will never see them. Even the minutes of the annual meeting are inaccurate. I was there so I know what they wrote as minutes are not true.

- There is no evidence that the angry owners requested a meeting with Mr. Marriott during his island visit. The owners meeting is a standing meeting regularly scheduled at the OC.

a) This meeting was not the normal weekly meeting,. It was a different day and time. The owners knew of Mr. Marriott’s visit and were told that he decided he was not coming to the hotel. The owners were told they would hold a special meeting and what do you know the special meeting was the same time Mr Marriott did show up. There are owners who are part of this effort that were in Aruba at the time and are direct witnesses to these events, so there is plenty of evidence.

Frank holding the proxies are a matter of procedure, and in accordance with his position as board president

a) It may a matter of procedure, but with the lack of trust this is a clear case of conflict of interest. If the BOD wants to regain the owners trust they would have done something different. In the past when the president was running he could not be the proxy per Marriotts governence.

The communications might say the same thing as MVCI is saying as it is the truth

a) SOme of what they say may be the truth but when requested to back up with documents that support what they are saying they refuse to show them to owners. In fact some of what is being told to us contradicts what used to be on the AOC website.

Why has the board passed a rule that anything discussed in board meetings can not be shared with owners? As owners we deserve the right to know about any discussions that occur that impact our property.

 

[ecwinch]

Marksue:

I respect the fact that you are fighting the good fight, and are passionate about your cause. I have said that in this thread many times.

I respect the fact that you want to view every action in a light that is least favorable to the BOD, and in a manner that supports your cause.

As your fellow owner (Quilter) opined, what is absent from your rhetoric is evidence or fact to support your opinions. As best as possible I attempted to present the facts that have been documented in this thread. I attempted to do so as impartially as possible, and I am sorry you find my efforts inaccurate. As noted by LoveAruba multiple times - I am not an owner. I am simply trying to balance the discussion.

For instance your interpretation that the board refused to vote on a motion made by Alan. Without a second from another board member, no vote is required. It rules of order 101. If you cannot get a second, then you certainly are not going to win the vote. Your reply ignores this point entirely.

I would be far less involved in this thread if more facts were documented by other owners. 95% of the "facts" come from you, or e-mails sent to you by other anonymous parties. It would be helpful if those other owners posted their first hand account here. For instance this fact - "Why has the board passed a rule that anything discussed in board meetings can not be shared with owners?" or Mr. Marriott's visit. Where is the supporting evidence? Were you there or is this hearsay?

I will leave to the other readers to compare the two responses and reach their own conclusions.

 

[marksue]

I post for many owners who contact me and have first hand knowledge of what has occurred. They reason many don’t post is they are afraid of repercussions from Marriott and that it will impact their ability to get the weeks they want for their vacations. There was an owner on the call, and his words were posted on here previously, where the board refused to second Allan’s attempt to let owners have a say in delaying the refurbishment. Of course anything Allan has said since he was forced out of president has gone on deaf ears.

There were many owners who were in Aruba when Mr. Marriott visited and the facts are what they are. You don't have to believe it but there were enough people I heard from in Aruba that I stand by what I have stated 100%.

The board passed the rule of no sharing because they do not want the owners to have knowledge. With knowledge we are a strong force that can hold them accountable. If they do not want to be accountable then they shouldn’t be on the board.

You have to wonder why so many people still contact Allan to find out what is going. Eric, you are not an owner as you state, and you have not gotten calls from owners. I have gotten many calls and emails from people having just returned or on their way to Aruba discussing their experiences.