Living thru Hell Week Aruba right now

[optimist]

[inappropriate comment deleted]

Every year this thread rears its ugly head and with a sickening feeling I read the comments knowing it is eventually going to degenerate to this one, that was deleted.

The truth is, if someone is active enough to post here then they already know about "this week" and should avoid booking at that time if it really bothers them.

Why not just make a sticky that lets people know about the issues associated with this week so that we are done with new threads concerning "a certain group of people" every year, around this time.

 

[csxjohn]

..Why not just make a sticky that lets people know about the issues associated with this week so that we are done with new threads concerning "a certain group of people" every year, around this time.

Read the stickys at the top of the Marriott forum and you'll see this one.

http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=204519

I'd like to see this expanded to other areas and resorts.

 

[SueDonJ]

Every year this thread rears its ugly head and with a sickening feeling I read the comments knowing it is eventually going to degenerate to this one, that was deleted.

The truth is, if someone is active enough to post here then they already know about "this week" and should avoid booking at that time if it really bothers them.

Why not just make a sticky that lets people know about the issues associated with this week so that we are done with new threads concerning "a certain group of people" every year, around this time.

I don't now and never have had a problem with folks posting their experiences at the Aruban complex every year sometime in January. In fact I think it's one of TUG's greatest strengths, that we can advise each other about any number of things which folks may want to avoid at resorts all over the world.

I personally don't have a problem with the group involved at Aruba being "outed" without insult but, apparently, for some folks it's impossible to separate simply naming the group from disparaging the group. In deference to the folks who see insult, I suggest that anyone who needs to know should search TUG for "Marriott Aruba January" or something similar - there are a number of threads going back years on the topic.

As of a few weeks ago there is now a sticky in the Marriott forum - "Event Weeks" at Marriott Resorts - which serves a self-explanatory purpose. But I still appreciate threads which detail what's currently happening at any resorts, and don't think it's necessary to automatically close every thread related to this particular situation. We mods will continue to selectively edit posts in order to remove info which may be construed (correctly or wrongly) as insulting, but I prefer to leave the threads open so that witnesses have a place to report what they're seeing now.

 

[Ridewithme38]

I personally don't have a problem with the group involved at Aruba being "outed" without insult but, apparently, for some folks it's impossible to separate simply naming the group from disparaging the group.

There is a difference between naming the group, which has already happened in this thread, "NYS Private School Students" and incorrectly naming them based on bias. That is the disparaging part.

 

[SueDonJ]

There is a difference between naming the group, which has already happened in this thread, "NYS Private School Students" and incorrectly naming them based on bias. That is the disparaging part.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't think that simply attributing a race/sex/religion/whatever label to a group is an insult in itself. For example, it's possible to call me an Irish Catholic Bostonian without me seeing it as an intent to insult me and all those like me.

But, as I said, with this particular topic deference is being given to those who do see insult in such a practice. There's no need to further debate whether insult is intended or not.

 

[Ridewithme38]

We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't think that simply attributing a race/sex/religion/whatever label to a group is an insult in itself. For example, it's possible to call me an Irish Catholic Bostonian without me seeing it as an intent to insult me and all those like me.

But, as I said, with this particular topic deference is being given to those who do see insult in such a practice. There's no need to further debate whether insult is intended or not.

But would it be more accurate to say 'stay away from the Bar's in Boston during Red Sox playoff games there are alot of Irish Catholics in them and the bars tend to have fights and the people drink too much" or Stay away from the Bar's in Boston during Red Sox Playoffs because they can get very busy with a lot of people drinking too much and getting into fights.

One reinforces a negative stereotype for no reason, since the 2nd one is just as accurate information. When you are attributing hell week to anything beyond 'NYS Private school students' you are reinforcing a negative stereotype that doesn't need any help.

 

[SueDonJ]

But would it be more accurate to say 'stay away from the Bar's in Boston during Red Sox playoff games there are alot of Irish Catholics in them and the bars tend to have fights and the people drink too much" or Stay away from the Bar's in Boston during Red Sox Playoffs because they can get very busy with a lot of people drinking too much and getting into fights.

One reinforces a negative stereotype for no reason, since the 2nd one is just as accurate information. When you are attributing hell week to anything beyond 'NYS Private school students' you are reinforcing a negative stereotype that doesn't need any help.

Like I said, Ride, there's no need to debate it. Any further attempts to do so will be deleted.

 

[Old Hickory]

We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't think that simply attributing a race/sex/religion/whatever label to a group is an insult in itself. For example, it's possible to call me an Irish Catholic Bostonian without me seeing it as an intent to insult me and all those like me.

On my only trip to Aruba we saw way too many people wearing Boston Bruins jerseys and Boston Red Sox caps. But they were nice folks, regardless.

 

[jimf41]

On my only trip to Aruba we saw way too many people wearing Boston Bruins jerseys and Boston Red Sox caps. But they were nice folks, regardless.

And don't forget that us Irish Catholic New Yorkers have a bigger warship parked in our harbor than those uppity Irish Catholic Bostonians.

As far as the "hell week" threads this year, I think they've been pretty civil and to the point. The only mention of bias seems to be from the folks that are warning against it.

 

[Beaglemom3]

And don't forget that us Irish Catholic New Yorkers have a bigger warship parked in our harbor than those uppity Irish Catholic Bostonians.

QUOTE]

Oh yeah ? We have a few ballistic submarines just parked off shore................
(Even worse - Red Sox T-shirt wearing Irish Catholic Bostonians ) :hysterical:


Edited to add: I've been to the Aruba Marriotts and would like to go again.
I appreciate the information on this thread as to a very, very, very busy time there and I will plan around it.

I am in the dark about who the group is and would rather not know. It's an "obtuse benefit" !

I've been to Daytona during bike week and all the bikers were friendly and polite, but their bikes were extremely loud and I wince at loud noises. So, I avoid Daytona during bike week.



-

 

[topmom101]

I am confused, why are so many people trying so hard to hide or cover up the facts? I believe that people need to be accountable for their actions. Only recently have I become aware of this ongoing problem at the Surf Club. But it seems to me that if people go out of their way to avoid this particular travel week or look for compensation from Marriott for being forced to endure a hellish vacation then a REAL problem exists. So why not point a finger to the culprits? I don't get it. I don't care who they are; white, black, yellow, catholic, Jewish, protestants, new yorkers, bostonians.

I am so tired of the political correctiveness. If people behave badly, say so. Hold them accountable. You expect Marriott to step up and yet some of you aren't even willing to say it like it is. Do you act the same while on vacation? Do you destroy or thrash property? Do you allow your children to run wild disrespecting people? Well, if not, why in the name of God, would you protect them?

I love the fact that some of you are coming up with various ways to be politically correct in ways to describe this group, some as far as labeling them private school kids. Well, let me tell you something. I highly resent that. My husband and I made tremendous sacrifices to give our 3 children the best private/catholic school education we could afford and they are well mannered, productive and respectful young adults.

Let's not reinforce horrendous behavior. How fair is that to the families that work hard all year long and look forward to their yearly January vacation? We throw them under the bus in favor of the bullies? Because that's what you are doing when your solution to them is " have another drink, switch your travel week, go to another beach". Right is right and wrong is wrong. Period.

Maybe I am having a bad day but this is wrong in so many ways.

 

[BJRSanDiego]

If just one goes viral (facebook might help) ...Sometimes one has to shine a light on the problem for it to be seen, recognized and then dealt with in an appropriate fashion.

I took a look at the two Marriott Aruba Facebook pages and was surprised that no one has posted any displeasure. All that I saw were a variety of very old "feel good" comments. No negative comments at all!

I know from past personal experience that Marriott Corporate monitors those pages and that they are quite responsive to negative comments. In one case, I received a call from the president of the Marriott facility (where I was staying) only 3 hours after I posted on FB. As a result of my FB post, they fixed a problem for which I had previously made them aware but which they weren't originally willing to address. Yes - - only 3 hours and the problem fixed!

So I heartily recommend that people negatively affected by the "hell week" post their displeasure on-line.

There is also a Marriott customer care hot line: 800-860-9384

But I think that FB is more visible and will get more action.

 

[WFP]

The two of us were in Boston for the w/e, at the custom house. I wont say too much but one of US wore a Peyton Manning Bronco's Jersey to several bars. It was a feminine cut jersey...so make your own inference. Luckily, the wearer is also half Irish .

The so called bartender's bartender at the CH, well I guess if you are not a friend of his he doesn't treat you that well.

I have no problem with providing all identifying information regarding the perpetrator's of unacceptable behavior. It just must be done in a manner that is focused on the identity with no editorial spin or worse.

/WFP

 

[Ridewithme38]

some as far as labeling them private school kids. Well, let me tell you something. I highly resent that. My husband and I made tremendous sacrifices to give our 3 children the best private/catholic school education we could afford and they are well mannered, productive and respectful young adults.

But, they ARE private school children, the vacation period is specific to NYS school breaks, because of that, the only real inference that can be made is that these are NYS Private school children.

Just because you have raised well mannered, productive and respectful young adults, that does not mean that ALL private school children are that way......

 

[LDT]

If I were an owner at Aruba Surf Club or Ocean Club I'd be contacting Marriott execs and my resort boards with my concerns. As an onsite guest, whether owner or not, I'd be insistent on meeting the resort GM in order to voice my concerns in person.

IMO it's ridiculous that Marriott allows this to continue year after year after year!

I have sent email after email, letters to the board of directors and even Mr. Marriott himself voicing my concern after running in to this group a few years back. All you get is phone call saying that they have every right to be there just like anyone else. Sadly, the Marriott Corp is all about money. They could care less about us owners.

 

[SueDonJ]

I am confused, why are so many people trying so hard to hide or cover up the facts? I believe that people need to be accountable for their actions. Only recently have I become aware of this ongoing problem at the Surf Club. But it seems to me that if people go out of their way to avoid this particular travel week or look for compensation from Marriott for being forced to endure a hellish vacation then a REAL problem exists. So why not point a finger to the culprits? I don't get it. I don't care who they are; white, black, yellow, catholic, Jewish, protestants, new yorkers, bostonians.

I am so tired of the political correctiveness. If people behave badly, say so. Hold them accountable. You expect Marriott to step up and yet some of you aren't even willing to say it like it is. Do you act the same while on vacation? Do you destroy or thrash property? Do you allow your children to run wild disrespecting people? Well, if not, why in the name of God, would you protect them?

I love the fact that some of you are coming up with various ways to be politically correct in ways to describe this group, some as far as labeling them private school kids. Well, let me tell you something. I highly resent that. My husband and I made tremendous sacrifices to give our 3 children the best private/catholic school education we could afford and they are well mannered, productive and respectful young adults.

Let's not reinforce horrendous behavior. How fair is that to the families that work hard all year long and look forward to their yearly January vacation? We throw them under the bus in favor of the bullies? Because that's what you are doing when your solution to them is " have another drink, switch your travel week, go to another beach". Right is right and wrong is wrong. Period.

Maybe I am having a bad day but this is wrong in so many ways.

Over the years on TUG there have been multiple reports to the mods asking for the topic to be forbidden and/or immediate closure of any related threads. A compromise of not naming the group, so as to inhibit perceived insult, has been enacted instead.

It might not be the ideal solution but it's one that works for TUG purposes - to advise about a negative situation at particular resorts. It's not necessary to know the "who" in order to do that.

Owners/guests of the resorts are certainly able to escalate their concerns off-TUG to those in a position to do something concrete about it, and that's what I strongly suggest. I agree with you that how it's being handled now by Marriott is only a deflection, and a poor one at that.

 

[Ridewithme38]

Over the years on TUG there have been multiple reports to the mods asking for the topic to be forbidden and/or immediate closure of any related threads. A compromise of not naming the group, so as to inhibit perceived insult, has been enacted instead.

Hmm, i didn't realize i shouldn't have been mentioning the group, i am sorry. I thought NYC Private School children would have been politically ok.

 

[SueDonJ]

I have sent email after email, letters to the board of directors and even Mr. Marriott himself voicing my concern after running in to this group a few years back. All you get is phone call saying that they have every right to be there just like anyone else. Sadly, the Marriott Corp is all about money. They could care less about us owners.

It's so discouraging to hear this but we do, repeatedly. I only keep repeating the suggestion because eventually there must be strength in numbers?

 

[SueDonJ]

Hmm, i didn't realize i shouldn't have been mentioning the group, i am sorry. I thought NYC Private School children would have been politically ok.

Ride, it's very easy to see through your spin. Knock it off.

 

[EKniager]

I am confused, why are so many people trying so hard to hide or cover up the facts? I believe that people need to be accountable for their actions. Only recently have I become aware of this ongoing problem at the Surf Club. But it seems to me that if people go out of their way to avoid this particular travel week or look for compensation from Marriott for being forced to endure a hellish vacation then a REAL problem exists. So why not point a finger to the culprits? I don't get it. I don't care who they are; white, black, yellow, catholic, Jewish, protestants, new yorkers, bostonians.

I am so tired of the political correctiveness. If people behave badly, say so. Hold them accountable. You expect Marriott to step up and yet some of you aren't even willing to say it like it is. Do you act the same while on vacation? Do you destroy or thrash property? Do you allow your children to run wild disrespecting people? Well, if not, why in the name of God, would you protect them?

I love the fact that some of you are coming up with various ways to be politically correct in ways to describe this group, some as far as labeling them private school kids. Well, let me tell you something. I highly resent that. My husband and I made tremendous sacrifices to give our 3 children the best private/catholic school education we could afford and they are well mannered, productive and respectful young adults.

Let's not reinforce horrendous behavior. How fair is that to the families that work hard all year long and look forward to their yearly January vacation? We throw them under the bus in favor of the bullies? Because that's what you are doing when your solution to them is " have another drink, switch your travel week, go to another beach". Right is right and wrong is wrong. Period.

Maybe I am having a bad day but this is wrong in so many ways.

I don't comprehend the point of this post. The "culprits" have been pointed out, i.e., a large group of misbehaving kids, typically in Aruba during NYS Regents exam week. What more is relevant? If you don't care about the color of their skin or their religious beliefs what are you complaining about? You say, "If people behave badly, say so." It was said and has been annually. Who has been protected? What is politically correct? No other information is important to the story.

Not all Irish people get drunk at bars. Not all Jewish people negotiate hard with jewelers. Not all black people do drugs. And so on. Leaving irrelevant descriptors out, or what I think of as "noise" is just common sense. Being considerate of others does not equal political correctness. Mother's use to teach their children that "two wrongs don't make a right." The offenders have been pointed out. We don't need to do it with a broad brush or in a disrespectful manner.

 

[chris5]

I don't comprehend the point of this post. The "culprits" have been pointed out, i.e., a large group of misbehaving kids, typically in Aruba during NYS Regents exam week. What more is relevant? If you don't care about the color of their skin or their religious beliefs what are you complaining about? You say, "If people behave badly, say so." It was said and has been annually. Who has been protected? What is politically correct? No other information is important to the story.

Not all Irish people get drunk at bars. Not all Jewish people negotiate hard with jewelers. Not all black people do drugs. And so on. Leaving irrelevant descriptors out, or what I think of as "noise" is just common sense. Being considerate of others does not equal political correctness. Mother's use to teach their children that "two wrongs don't make a right." The offenders have been pointed out. We don't need to do it with a broad brush or in a disrespectful manner.

Well, there is value in "shaming" an organization for the misconduct of its members. The offenders as far as I can tell have not been outted. Mind you, I said organization, not ethnic, religious or racial group. This happens all the time. When rowdy students act up, it's fair to say where these students go to school, whether it's PS 29, Notre Dame University, Morehouse College, or Yeshiva University. That would be relevant to me.

Outrageous behavior by members of a particular organization is a poor reflection on the organization and the organization itself might take some action. It's useless to me to say that these folks are from New York or are Jewish, Black, Indian, or White-- as it tars everyone from New York and linkeage with general groups is meaningless, so I agree with you there.

I do understand the point made by the rant to which you responded. It does seem to me that there might be an element of political correctness and over-sensitivity here. I do agree we ought to be careful how we label "nuisance weeks." I'd be interested in how the folks (and organization or families) who are misbehaving at week 3/4 in Aruba identify the week in question and perhaps we ought to use their description of the week. I'm sure they would take offense at us calling their week, Hell Week. And if they don't take offense, maybe a Satanist would take offense.

 

[psguru]

It's not the NYC Private School families. That's a different week. It's crowded by by no means is it the "Hell Week" people are referring to.

Those who have been down there when this group is there (I've been way too many times when they're there and will never again) know who I'm talking about. It's a horror show. We check every year when their break is because they don't have a traditional Christmas break.

The kids have no accountability because
a. their parents are not around at all
b. they've been told they're entitled to do as they please
c. they think the world revolves around them

Some of my favorites over the years...
- a 3 year-old in the lazy river by himself
- a group of kids playing football in the lazy river
- a kid walking over to my table as a waitress was taking our order and interrupting to tell her to get his food immediately
- a kid playing blackjack at $50 a hand, hitting on 18 routinely
- the Marriott Hotel lobby taken over until about 5am
- high school age girls struggling to walk on the beach with high heels on

The biggest problem is that Marriott still allows them to stay there because of the crazy amount of money they spend between conference rooms, the casino and the bar.

I'm going down in February so i'm in the clear!

 

[EKniager]

Well color me surprised. This is news!

I've always been under the impression there was just one "Hell Week" and it was during the NYS Regents Exam week. Are there now two Hell Weeks? You know... a second one when "they're there."

 

[vacationhopeful]

Personally, I had little interest in ever going to Aruba before ... think coral rock in big span of salt water ... think Holloway ... now I have NONE. And I really don't care which month or week.

Sorry, but there must be other islands in all the seas on Earth ... why would you ever subject yourselves and dear family members to this crap? I would be hitting social media like Facebook, U-Tube & LinkedIn.com, etc ... and be unnamed... get the dumb faced "idiots" to like your post and add comments. The more hits the better ... If you can't fight them, join them and let them sink themselves like the rotten apples that they are.

Pictures of chairs in the pool, trashed fitness center -- 3 days of THAT -- without your name (can't threaten the un-named) ... videos of the kids idea of fun (lazy river, gambling, wilding, threats) ... and areas shut down due to damage....

Be creative -- Marriot is too busy counting their profits for that week --- wonder how happy they will be to see the other 51 weeks being less profitable with all those "fun" posts circulating all over the internet.

 

[SueDonJ]

Well color me surprised. This is news!

I've always been under the impression there was just one "Hell Week" and it was during the NYS Regents Exam week. Are there now two Hell Weeks? You know... a second one when "they're there."

I'm wondering, too. Although there's been confusion in other years, too, where the timing didn't coincide exactly with the NY Regents Exams. Unless there's a different explanation I think the FAQ thread is okay mentioning Weeks 3 or 4, "usually corresponding to …"