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Living thru Hell Week Aruba right now

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Sunbum

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I have never witnessed any asylum, but when I do, I will certainly take a picture of it. I mean, I take pictures of food when it's served to me, certainly I can make room on my camera for some asylum pictures.

EC, certainly you took some pictures at the Bronx Zoo when you visited - why wouldn't you take pictures of something you have decided to give it's own title to: "Hell Week in Aruba"?

EC - Did you really witness something? Or did you just overhear a second hand, uncorroborated conversation in the Lazy River about child misbehavior?

We are at 11 pages now, and we still have no real evidence that something has actually happened in Aruba that's worthy of an 11 page discussion.

Still waiting for somebody to post a clickable link.....and when you do, please CAPITALIZE IT!

Oops....looks like we are now on page 13

The Trip Advisor thread has 17 pages, 168 comments before it got closed. It is an awesome, day by day report of the happenings of Hell Week 2013.

http://www.tripadvisor.ca/ShowTopic-g147247-i144-k6062681-Hell_Week_0-Aruba.html
 

PamMo

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... Many years ago when we were staying at the Hyatt (pre OC), a guest threw his drink on a waitress at the pool because it was not made correctly. She did not make it. The Hyatt management gave her paid time off until that guest went home. The guest was told he and his family could not return to that Hyatt...

That is an example of good management. I would not want to vacation in, and certainly would not want to own, a resort that does not expect and maintain a certain level of civility among its guests.
 

Mr. Vker

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TUGBrian

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I do find it very disheartening that so many folks seem to want this issue swept under the rug and not discussed at all.
 

Fern Modena

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And *I* find it very disheartening that so many folks want to discuss this item over and over and over, and beat it like a dead horse. What ever happened to "search?"

I also find it disheartening that it must take so much of the moderators' time (I was once one) because some people must resort to characterizations and third party "he said, she said" descriptions of happenings.

So, TUGBrian, I guess it depends on which side of the fence you see things from, doesn't it? Your post is #329, hardlyy what I'd call "swept under the rug."

Fern

I do find it very disheartening that so many folks seem to want this issue swept under the rug and not discussed at all.
 
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TUGBrian

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not particularly.

I guess I would see your point if the same person created a new thread every year they visited just to complain. (id certainly agree that would be a bit silly)

Should we delete everyone who posts a scammer complaint and only have one thread on that on the forums. It is clearly a topic that many want to discuss, its clearly a topic many owners are/were still unaware of until reading this thread.

Sure there may be a few bigoted jerks we have to reign in (and believe me, they exist on both sides of the fence from the emails/messages ive gotten)....but given the points above, I see no reason not to have folks discuss it.

To many "old salts" its old news, and you may be tired of hearing/reading about it, but to many more in the timeshare world, its certainly eye opening and informative.
 

piper_chuck

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And *I* find it very disheartening that so many folks want to discuss this item over and over and over, and beat it like a dead horse. What ever happened to "search?"
Sorta hard to "search" for something one does not know about. This thread has brought awareness of this situation to a new group of users who had no idea it was happening.

And as far as discussion goes, this is a discussion board. If you don't like the thread, nobody's forcing you to read it.
 

swaits

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As someone who has no idea what Hell Week means, I have a few things to add here.

This thread is incredibly useful to me. If even half of these things happened on my vacation I'd be furious. Knowing about it is extremely valuable.

So, thanks to the forum owner and moderators for letting it persist,

Next, I had NO idea this had anything to do with a specific religion until Laura brought it up. Up to that point, from my POV, this was entirely about poorly behaving people. Only one person made it "hate speech" (which it clearly isn't), that was Laura.

Lastly, I will chip in $100 toward sending Laura to Hell Week as a TUG reporter. Let's get the facts on this. Laura?

Cheers!
 

Fern Modena

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I guess you didn't read the entire thread (or didn't understand what you were reading) if you didn't know that the people being complained about were members of a specific religious group. I even explained part of this (which someone else amplified to better explain things I hadn't mentioned) and somebody linked to the specific group.

Next, if you want to play nice, volunteer yourself, not someone else. And use your head. Third party reports are notably unreliable. The (few) people in the thread who have been there during the week know what they saw, and them I believe.

Fern



As someone who has no idea what Hell Week means, I have a few things to add here.

This thread is incredibly useful to me. If even half of these things happened on my vacation I'd be furious. Knowing about it is extremely valuable.

So, thanks to the forum owner and moderators for letting it persist,

Next, I had NO idea this had anything to do with a specific religion until Laura brought it up. Up to that point, from my POV, this was entirely about poorly behaving people. Only one person made it "hate speech" (which it clearly isn't), that was Laura.

Lastly, I will chip in $100 toward sending Laura to Hell Week as a TUG reporter. Let's get the facts on this. Laura?

Cheers!
 

davidvel

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not particularly.
To many "old salts" its old news, and you may be tired of hearing/reading about it, but to many more in the timeshare world, its certainly eye opening and informative.
I've been on TUG for almost 6 years, posted a few times on Marriott forums, but knew nothing about this until this year (never had an interest in Aruba). The thread is certainly fascinating, and although I would freely debate the complex social issues at play, I appreciate the job the mods do to not allow that.

I do agree that it would be nice to have some more concrete "evidence" about the specifics (is there really a bond?), behaviors (photos/video), but obviously there is ample evidence of the disruptions and apparent cultural differences.
 

Sunbum

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I do find it very disheartening that so many folks seem to want this issue swept under the rug and not discussed at all.

Thank you Brian. Keep up the good work:D This is way too important to just make it go away!
 

Mamianka

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Regents week

No intention to hang the OP out to dry. But the term "hell week" IS regents week, when the ny Jewish schools are off and they come down to Aruba for vacation. So yes, it is referring to this group, because every other non homeschooled kid is IN SCHOOL that week. If the behavior is as folks say it is, that is sad. It is also sad that we still call it hell week, knowing full well (as tug history shows) what this week is referring to. Can't it just be called "regents week Aruba"? Or Aruba week 3 (or 4 this yr). Or better yet, stop creating the thread year after year, so we can stop having posts about "them" and "those people". . Enough already .[/QUOTE

You are WRONG. I am a career NYS teacher - as are other on this forum. During Regents Week, mid-year and final exams for half-year HIGH SCHOOL courses are given. All elementary and middle school students are in normal school that week, for normal hours. SOME HS students will not be required to be at school every day, so parents *might* choose to vacation then - especially if they have ONLY HS -age children, who miraculously do not have ANY exams - which is rare; I asked my private flute students this week, at their lessons, what was going in on school, and they said that there are a LOT of tests, exams, extra sports practicesand even one-week *fun* classes - and the school is pretty full!. However, as I have explained several times before, PRIVATE schools - religious, secular, charter schools - ANY kind - need only fulfill their amount of days an hours of instructional time - so can keep their school OPEN, or CLOSE them at their discretion, essentially. The problem week this year actually was a full week BEFORE Regents week began; do not paint residents of NY state and their school-age children with your brush. This entire discussion is NOT about anything religious, ethnic, or anything else - it is about a GROUP from the same school that chooses to vacation together, and their intolerable behavior. This could be a sports academy, a performing arts school, a charter school, or ANY private school that determines its own calendar, and then runs a large group trip. Our concern here is their horrendous behavior - period. Those of us who have invested our money, time and planning in a nice family vacation need to KNOW when optimum travel times are - and when to think twice. We think about rainy season, cold, hurricanes, snowstorms - and this is hardly different in our planning - except the previous are acts of God, or seasonal - and Hell Week is created by crude behavior, and the MARRIOTT corporation looks the other way - away from the chaos, and towards the bank.

I do not own at Aruba, and we have only a possible interest of going there - but despite the cold and snow here in NY state in January, I would now NOT EVER think of going in mid-January - and am VERY GRATEFUL that this was brought to my attention, and that there is Sticky about other things I might wish to avoid. We drive down to NYC often for concerts, etc. - but NOT THIS WEEK - I hear that there are a few extra people in town because there is *some kind of sports thing* going on??? Really?? Hmm - very good to know. At least New York's Finest (and New Jersey's Finest, too) will ensure that insofar as is possible, everyone will behave themselves this week and weekend. Unfortunately, they have no jurisdiction over a private resort community in Aruba.
Mamianka
 

EKniager

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Just booked Saturday 1/31/15 at Surf Club. :banana::cheer:

I'll take pics and document behavior if "they're there" and we witness anything abnormal.

(Nothing but warm thoughts on this cold and snowy Carolina morning.)
 
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joewillie12

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Just booked Saturday 1/31/15 at Surf Club. :banana::cheer:

I'll take pics and document behavior if "they're there" and we witness anything abnormal.
Don't forget to take the photos of the women wearing almost nothing in the pool someone mentioned previously. I think those will unlock the answers we are looking for.:clap:
 

chris5

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I guess you didn't read the entire thread (or didn't understand what you were reading) if you didn't know that the people being complained about were members of a specific religious group. I even explained part of this (which someone else amplified to better explain things I hadn't mentioned) and somebody linked to the specific group.

Next, if you want to play nice, volunteer yourself, not someone else. And use your head. Third party reports are notably unreliable. The (few) people in the thread who have been there during the week know what they saw, and them I believe.

Fern

I think a huge part of the problem with this discussion is the imprecision of the language used by people who post in this thread, period. People who are being complained about are not from a specific religious group. The complaints do not evolve around the religion of that specific group. The complaints go to the behavior of that specific group. This has been repeatedly stated over and over again in this thread.

The specific group is from a religious organization in Brooklyn New York. But you treat this discussion as if its maligning Sephardi or the greater Jewish religious community. (And in discussing Sephardi it would be helpful to your own credibility if you didn't leave out the specific geographical area where this specific group has roots, Lebanon or Syria!) If this were a discussion about a specific group running amok that was organized by a Black Baptist Church in Harlem, a Catholic Church with Irish American parishioners in Boston, or an Amish Church in Pennsylvania, I'm sure Protestants, Catholics or the Amish wouldn't be treating that discussion as an assault on their faith or culture!

I understand completely that the discussion could be irritating and can be downright infuriating to those who share a common religious bond with the specific group, especially when the discussion includes elements of antisemitism or stereotyping. But the moderators have skillfully removed even the mere suggestion or implication of anti-Semitic remarks or stereotypes.

Regarding your comment about third party hearsay or reports. This is a discussion board, not a trial. Normally, we don't subject participants to strict proof of the veracity of their comments or observations. We should all take comments and observations with a heavy grain of salt. Third party reports can be unreliable or reliable -- it depends.

This is a fascinating discussion for a number of reasons, including the attempts to chill discussion by playing the religion card.

BTW, if anyone wants to give me his or her timeshare stay at week 3 or 4 in January at AC or SC next year, I'll be happy to consider going and reporting back my findings in a TUG discussion thread. Right now, I'm having difficulty convincing my wife to go with me to Aruba during Hell Week. We were at OC in February 2009 and had a great time there, which is when we first heard of the stories of Hell Week from guests there. And like many others, this thread is the first time I've heard about it discussed on TUG.
 

Conan

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This is a fascinating discussion for a number of reasons, including the attempts to chill discussion by playing the religion card.
Your post makes many good points, but the sentence above gives it an unfortunate spin.

TUG as I think we all know has a policy of excluding certain hot button topics, among them religion and politics. It's not fair to use loaded phrases like 'chill discussion' or 'religion card' to characterize that policy.
 

piper_chuck

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If this were a discussion about a specific group running amok that was organized by ... an Amish Church in Pennsylvania...
No disrespect meant to chris or the Amish, but the thought of a group of Amish running amok is fascinating. ;) I'll leave it at that rather than speculating on how they might choose to let loose.
 
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piper_chuck

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Your post makes many good points, but the sentence above gives it an unfortunate spin.

TUG as I think we all know has a policy of excluding certain hot button topics, among them religion and politics. It's not fair to use loaded phrases like 'chill discussion' or 'religion card' to characterize that policy.
I think the sentence you are commenting on is spot on. There have been many posts from members who were not part of the TUG leadership who have attempted to chill discussion by playing the race/religion card. The thread was created to report on behavior and some people have taken offense at mention of the group that organized this event.
 

EKniager

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I've got to agree with Conan. There are a number of buzz words or phrases that have ideological baggage, and whether we like it or not, they are code words that are polarizing, e.g., entitlement, political correctness, XXXX card, etc.

Instead of parrotting political-speak, we should all strive to present dialogue that is more specific and not button pushing. For example, if we stick with the "what" and not the "why" we'd be better off. There is no reason to say, "The kids are rude (the what) because of their entitlement (the why)." How would we know? It implies something and taints the conversation.

Just one person's two cents. Who knows, it might lessen the confrontation and argumentative nature of these threads.:shrug:
 

chris5

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Your post makes many good points, but the sentence above gives it an unfortunate spin.

TUG as I think we all know has a policy of excluding certain hot button topics, among them religion and politics. It's not fair to use loaded phrases like 'chill discussion' or 'religion card' to characterize that policy.

I'm not criticizing or characterizing TUG policy. I'm making my own observation about what I think is occurring with some of the critics of the discussion here. We get one recent late entry into this discussion who claims we're Jew Bashing! We get a few other folks who claim we shouldn't comment on such sensitive issues because we're not part of the religious community to which this specific group belongs.

How else would you describe the attempts by critics of discussion who wish to cease discussion of this specific group by throwing up road blocks to airing concerns (first, it was let's shut down the thread, then it was let's not name the specific entity causing the problem, then it was let's say this is "just kids being kids," then it was let's not discuss it anymore because we can search prior threads that lay bare this problem, and now it's "we need strict proof" of the observations.)

I admit this was loaded language, and I struggled with using that last sentence. But it is the way I see it here.
 

Miss Marty

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It doesn`t matter if you are on vacation in Aruba or in Charleston


You don't mess with Jim!


Jim Cantore delivers weather, knee to young man in Charleston
while tracking Winter Storm Leon, live for the Weather Channel
from the College of Charleston South Carolina campus.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvmmIHl8YzY
 

Ridewithme38

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You have fun on vacation by laying still on a beach or by a pool. Kids have fun by running around playing catch and rough housing. Different strokes for different folks.

This is just people wanting everyone around them to only act the way they want.
 
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