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Lake Okanagan Resort info wanted

This is what I received today from LOR about MF going forward:
"3. What is the projected MF increase for 2020, 2021, 2022 and 2023 for option 1 and 3?

For Terrace and Lakeside 1 bedroom unit, we projected 2020 MF is going to be between $1,260 and $1,500 depending on the type of leases. The cost includes the first stage of renewing the septic system, and increase of operational costs.

With nation-wide increase on operational costs, septic system stage 2 upgrade and other critical maintenance to upkeep the 40 year old building, unfortunately we cannot provide maintenance fee forecast for 2021, 2022, 2023 and beyond as we do not have accurate numbers at this point. As the letter indicates, the building is reaching its life and we foresee many critical maintenance projects that will need to be undertaken in the near future."

So it's nothing still impossible to make a decision, they mismanaged the money building new pier and doing whatever they wanted and now we have to finance this. It's like gold rush again for Okanagan: they want to terminate roughly 2,000 owners and owners themselves have to pay roughly $3,000 per contract for the "honor" of been terminated decades ahead of time so the resort makes roughly $6,000,000 and gets rid of owners.
Brilliant move if they can pull it off.
My feeling is they don't want to continue with this bunch of time share owners, that's why they are so ambiguous about fees so people would be scared to continue and would just want out. They are saying above that they "foresee many critical projects", they don't need to foresee anything just bring an engineering company that will tell you what's wrong and how much it will cost.
 
We all got the same email you have quoted above. They are trying to intimidate us into terminating our leases and it may work for them as the future is very uncertain for us timeshare owners.
I have written to my MP, MLA and CBC's "Go Public" and " Consumer Matters" at Global News and perhaps if a lot of us did that we might get a response.

According to BC Legislation, Business Practices and Consumer Protection Act,

http://www.bclaws.ca/civix/document/id/complete/statreg/04002_04#section19


19 A direct sales contract, future performance contract or time share contract must contain the following information:

(e) a detailed description of the goods or services to be supplied under the contract;

(f) an itemized purchase price for the goods or services to be supplied under the contract;

(g) other costs payable by the consumer, including taxes and shipping charges;


I am not a lawyer but I think this means LOR must tell us the cost of maintenance fees as it is a service they are providing under a timeshare contract. Are there any lawyers in our group who can comment?
I sent an email to LOR telling them this but they have not replied.

 
Emil said:
We all got the same email you have quoted above. They are trying to intimidate us into terminating our leases and it may work for them as the future is very uncertain for us timeshare owners.
I have written to my MP, MLA and CBC's "Go Public" and " Consumer Matters" at Global News and perhaps if a lot of us did that we might get a response.

According to BC Legislation, Business Practices and Consumer Protection Act,

http://www.bclaws.ca/civix/document/id/complete/statreg/04002_04#section19


19 A direct sales contract, future performance contract or time share contract must contain the following information:

(e) a detailed description of the goods or services to be supplied under the contract;

(f) an itemized purchase price for the goods or services to be supplied under the contract;

(g) other costs payable by the consumer, including taxes and shipping charges;


I am not a lawyer but I think this means LOR must tell us the cost of maintenance fees as it is a service they are providing under a timeshare contract. Are there any lawyers in our group who can comment?
I sent an email to LOR telling them this but they have not replied.
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We
 
We have contacted our lawyer and will be meeting with him next week to see where we stand legally in all of this. We own a 3 bedroom/ biennial and want out but not with any of the options they have offered. We will post what our lawyer tells us after our meeting with him. I'm hoping Emil , who posted that he has contacted the news media about this , will also post any results from going that route. Maybe getting some negative publicity will make them rethink what they are trying to do, i.e. raise funds on the backs of the timeshare owners because of mismanagement on their part, like Fairmont Resort property owners did and then Northwynd.

In the long Timeshare Q and A email we received,
16. Is there sufficient space at Lakeside Inn to ensure availability of my week?
It’s a first come first serve policy for the room and the season

If many timeshare owners decide to go the " transfer timeshare agreement" route, chances of getting a week during the summer months will be next to impossible. They have already oversold all the timeshare units, a common practice with timeshare companies and some of those units are privately owned, which I also don't understand. I thought all the units in this place were timeshare units but now see that you can go on HomeAway, or Trip Advisor and rent units in Terrace building and maybe Lakeside, and other buildings there as well. So if you choose to transfer your timeshare agreement to Lakeside 1 bedroom unit, you are going to be paying an exorbitant fee to do so , on the iffy chance of getting an available unit when you want it. For the same price or lower, you could rent out one of those units through VRBO or HomeAway or Trip Advisor.
So much for the " anti- inflation, pay for future years' vacation at today's prices etc.. " garbage that was spewed during their sales pitch when we bought 20 years ago.
 
6,000,000 to get rid of everyone. They paid what? 9.1 million?? what a deal for them what score! And to stay you lose your 3 bdrm unit that sleeps 8 easily , get moved into a 1 bdrm unit that sleeps only 4 and pay double or triple the fees. How can that be legal?
 
Unhappycustomer said:
We have contacted our lawyer and will be meeting with him next week to see where we stand legally in all of this. We own a 3 bedroom/ biennial and want out but not with any of the options they have offered. We will post what our lawyer tells us after our meeting with him. I'm hoping Emil , who posted that he has contacted the news media about this , will also post any results from going that route. Maybe getting some negative publicity will make them rethink what they are trying to do, i.e. raise funds on the backs of the timeshare owners because of mismanagement on their part, like Fairmont Resort property owners did and then Northwynd.

In the long Timeshare Q and A email we received,
16. Is there sufficient space at Lakeside Inn to ensure availability of my week?
It’s a first come first serve policy for the room and the season

If many timeshare owners decide to go the " transfer timeshare agreement" route, chances of getting a week during the summer months will be next to impossible. They have already oversold all the timeshare units, a common practice with timeshare companies and some of those units are privately owned, which I also don't understand. I thought all the units in this place were timeshare units but now see that you can go on HomeAway, or Trip Advisor and rent units in Terrace building and maybe Lakeside, and other buildings there as well. So if you choose to transfer your timeshare agreement to Lakeside 1 bedroom unit, you are going to be paying an exorbitant fee to do so , on the iffy chance of getting an available unit when you want it. For the same price or lower, you could rent out one of those units through VRBO or HomeAway or Trip Advisor.
So much for the " anti- inflation, pay for future years' vacation at today's prices etc.. " garbage that was spewed during their sales pitch when we bought 20 years ago.
Click to expand...
I have not heard back from " Consumer Matters" at Global News. I had a brief response from CBC's "Go Public" saying that they would read my submission and get back to me if they would run it but they haven't got back to me.
 
Emil said:
Do you plan to sign the letter or just ignore it and pay the 2019 maintenance fees?

LOR think that the CPI restriction does not apply to repairs to sewer system and electrical upgrades. In their email of 16 Nov they state the following:

15. Can LOR increase fees more than the contract stipulates which is only can be increased based on CPI of previous year.

Yes, CPI does not apply to emergency repairs for your unit.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately I'm not a lawyer but reading the contract, I don't see how they can charge for emergency repairs because that's a special assessment and the contract says no special assessments are allowed.

I was planning to sign the letter to cancel the contract in 2023. If they try increase fees more than CPI, I'd definitely take them to small claims court.
 
CharMontana said:
I also received the letter from LOR and have left a message for my lawyer to give me some direction. LOR are the ones that want us to break the contract by paying to cancel. If we pay then we are breaking the contract. They should be paying us for our timeshare and then they can break the contract.
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Will be following this as we too, are being scammed by LOR.
 
It seems to me this is extortion, plain and simple. I feel I am being forced to pay LOR and give up my rights to my timeshare. Unfortunately I was out of the country before these notices were sent out, so I can’t get a lawyer to review my contract. Would it even be worth hiring a lawyer. The cost could end up being more then the pay out to LOR. Bravo LOR you played that well.
Where did all the maintenance fee money go? Did it pay for the a portion of the new Villas? Just a thought!
 
Considering the number of owners involved, I am surprised at the lack of interest in this mess. I would have thought that everyone would be anxious to share their thoughts, legal responses, etc. While I am dealing with more serious medical and personal problems, I will keep checking here and post any information I may come across. It is too early for me to decide on a response as they all have serious shortcomings.
 
RippedOffAgain said:
Considering the number of owners involved, I am surprised at the lack of interest in this mess. I would have thought that everyone would be anxious to share their thoughts, legal responses, etc. While I am dealing with more serious medical and personal problems, I will keep checking here and post any information I may come across. It is too early for me to decide on a response as they all have serious shortcomings.
Click to expand...
There is a Facebook page with lots of discussion going on, but you have to request to join the group.
Not sure if this link will get you there
https://www.facebook.com/groups/251552458822207/?ref=group_header
Some of them in the group have sent their Timeshare agreements to a lawyer in Penticton who is advising them that the best approach may be to negotiate with LOR on the cheapest way to get out of the timeshare agreement. This is what we are planning to do. We are seeing our lawyer on Tuesday and I will post his recommendations after meeting with him. I would not sign anything, or send LOR any money based on any of those options they gave.
 
We saw our lawyer today and his advice is to pay to get out of the timeshare agreement. He said the vary your timeshare choice ( transfer to a 1 bedroom at Lakeside) does not state that there will be no termination fee on the terms and conditions page. So if you choose that option, you still may have to pay a termination fee in 2023.
Here is what the lawyer (from Penticton)that some members have asked for advice on the Facebook group page says


Good Evening: I received the following email back from the lawyer this evening... I hope this helps some of you decide what to do...
Hi Kim, here are some thoughts from looking at the different agreements today:
I'm surprised by how many variations of leases have been used. I've seen, I believe, 11 agreements so far.
Of those 11, the ones dated before January 1995, do not have a restriction on the increase in annual use fees. Unfortunately, one from September 1994 doesn't have a limit, but yours in January 1995 does.

Then, by 2004, a whole new agreement doesn't have a limit.

Here's where things get even more complicated. There was a dispute at a very similar timeshare at Fairmont Hot Springs. The owners had leases that were almost word-for-word the same as the one lease I saw from 2004, and the company wanted to drastically increase the annual fees. The owners fought the increase, and didn't pay their annual fees while the case worked through the courts. In the end, they lost, had to pay their lawyers and the company's legal fees, had to pay their annual fees plus interest, and were still stuck in the leases.
For anyone with a recent lease, probably anyone after 2004, they should do whatever they can to buy out of the lease. Fighting is very likely to be unsuccessful, for them.
For anyone with an old lease, probably anyone before January 1995, even though the language is quite different than the Fairmont case, they're unlikely to successfully fight it, for the same reasons that the Fairmont owners lost.

That leaves the handful of people between 1995 and about 2002-2004, whose agreements say specifically that the annual fees will not increase by more than twice the annual consumer price index.
For this group, I think the options are to demand that your annual fees do not increase faster than you agreed to, but you still do not have a right to terminate the agreement before its time is up.
 
BevL said:
I'd wager that some of the northwynd people will be weighing in on this.

In the meantime, I wouldn't be sending any money in to anybody.

When you say you're attempting to contact the resort, what do you mean they're not responding? Somebody must still be answering the phone over there, I'd guess.

And I think there are still units available for exchange through RCI although they're shut down for maintenance so I can't check. Could be wrong about that though.

Anything to do with Northwynd is a big mess, that's for sure.
Click to expand...

Yes there is someone there that is handling the hotel, I phoned and then drove there and walked through a suite at the Terrace and at the Lakeside. Disgusting how they have let it rundown. Both buildings appear to be in the same condition, furniture, carpets, very dated. I also spoke to a lady in Vancouver and emailed her at customercare@lakeokanagan.com. I received a standard response back and re emailed her with further questions with no response. The number I reached Lake Okanagan at is 1-250-769-3511 the number I reached someone in Vancouver at is: 1-844-769-2656 I was also given customercare@lakeokaganan.com as an alternate email. Let's get together for the benefit of all
 
01520717 said:
Fairmont timeshare owners had a similar thing happen to them. They went to court and the courts sided with the property owners so the people with timeshares have to pay the amount asked for by the property owners plus any other amounts owing due to missed fee payments in prior years, etc.

Unfortunately, the letter from LOR spells out the options and outcomes fairly clearly. The best thing you can do is check your timeshare agreement to see if it had a clause limiting the fee increases such as the one Unhappycustomer posted above. If it does, then fees will continue increasing at roughly the same rate as they have in the past.
Click to expand...
But did you notice that the letter and options are missing words and very poor grammar...no lawyer would have created such a document and let LOR send it out. I believe this is all done by LOR Mgmt. Since receiving the letter (and also before) I have asked them for financial statements and reserve fund amount and have rec'd no reply. I have NOT rec'd anything since the Nov 2018 letter - has anyone rec'd some new info from LOR since then?
 
No. I also noticed that they don’t really have any names involved in their letter. I don’t trust it is a legal document. We opted to not pay.

We were huge suckers and paid to get out of the Fairmont deal after the lawsuit which we paid for dearly. What a mistake that was. ‘We would have been better to do it on our own. With all the money we have paid these crooks over the years we could have gone on a few wonderful cruises. So sorry we bought into the timeshare thing. Not a good savings after you pay maintenance and exchange company fees.
 
Interesting if you try to book the hotel portion on their site or any others it is not available it takes you to an error page. What gives. Do they not exist anymore? If you phone directly there they are quite rude they are Just the hotel portion. The timeshare portion has been overdue for a makeover for years. Has anyone had any financial documents from them? All the amenities are gone or in poor shape and yet you still have to pay first before you can book anything. Has anyone been there recently and viewed the property?
 
I bought into LOR ‘97 for a fixed week in July annually. I accepted option 3, to get out as I understand with no cancellation fee in 2023. I was relieved the fees for 2020 didn’t double as per notice. Personally I look at this as a opportunity to rid myself of them for good.
 
timeshare hell said:
I bought into LOR ‘97 for a fixed week in July annually. I accepted option 3, to get out as I understand with no cancellation fee in 2023. I was relieved the fees for 2020 didn’t double as per notice. Personally I look at this as a opportunity to rid myself of them for good.
Click to expand...
Hi,
is there a ‘best’ way to contact them? You are the most recent post and we would like to simply get out of LOR if possible. I sent an email to the customercare address and we are waiting for a response. The sooner we can move forward the better. Do you mind sharing what it cost you and the process you went through? Not sure if there is a way to do that privately if you prefer that.
 
DJE said:
Hi,
is there a ‘best’ way to contact them? You are the most recent post and we would like to simply get out of LOR if possible. I sent an email to the customercare address and we are waiting for a response. The sooner we can move forward the better. Do you mind sharing what it cost you and the process you went through? Not sure if there is a way to do that privately if you prefer that.
Click to expand...
If you want to get out of LOR before 2023, there is a substantial fee, around $3,500. I am relieved both 2020 and 21 have had no fee increase, 2 down and 2 to go. The only contact for timeshare I have is, customercare@lakeokanagan.com No phone contact. If the contract stands, there is no free to terminate, if all annual fees are paid up to and including 2023.
 
Can someone share how/if this was resolved?
 
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