Just purchased 1000 "trust" points. Should I rescind?

[korndoc]

Hello. I am a long time member of TUG and have been helped time and again due my membership. But I have been complacent and have not read this forum in a very long time, so I am not up on the latest information.
I go to presentations for a variety of reasons, but never with the intention of buying. But this time I was intrigued. We are in Maui now and did the presentation today and made a purchase.
I own resale at Desert Springs Villas I. I did enroll years ago and get 3250 points if I convert my week to points each year.
At the presentation the salesman explained that by adding 1000 Trust points, I could make reservations 13 months out and at over 4000 points, I will have more availability with my "hybrid" membership. He explained that right now I do not have access to the properties that are owned in the Trust. But with the purchase of 1000 points, I will have this greater access.
Although usually the minimum purchase is 1500 points, he allowed 1000 points.
Cost: $15.275/point. $784 maintenance.
I have 10 days to rescind.
Couple more points:
-I realize 4250 total points would have to be used creatively to get back to Maui. 1 BR rather than 2. Or 2 BR every other year, banking points.
- we were looking into buying an annual 2 BR here for around $18-20,000 with maintenace at about $2800. (Or maybe even a 2BR every other year for under $10,000 with $1350 maintenance). But this would only allow trading to other Marriotts through II. So buying 1000 points seemed like a much cheaper way to return to Maui and give us flexibilty to go to other Marriotts in addition to Maui.
Thanks,
Jeff

 

[mjm1]

Hello. I am a long time member of TUG and have been helped time and again due my membership. But I have been complacent and have not read this forum in a very long time, so I am not up on the latest information.
I go to presentations for a variety of reasons, but never with the intention of buying. But this time I was intrigued. We are in Maui now and did the presentation today and made a purchase.
I own resale at Desert Springs Villas I. I did enroll years ago and get 3250 points if I convert my week to points each year.
At the presentation the salesman explained that by adding 1000 Trust points, I could make reservations 13 months out and at over 4000 points, I will have more availability with my "hybrid" membership. He explained that right now I do not have access to the properties that are owned in the Trust. But with the purchase of 1000 points, I will have this greater access.
Although usually the minimum purchase is 1500 points, he allowed 1000 points.
Cost: $15.275/point. $784 maintenance.
I have 10 days to rescind.
Couple more points:
-I realize 4250 total points would have to be used creatively to get back to Maui. 1 BR rather than 2. Or 2 BR every other year, banking points.
- we were looking into buying an annual 2 BR here for around $18-20,000 with maintenace at about $2800. (Or maybe even a 2BR every other year for under $10,000 with $1350 maintenance). But this would only allow trading to other Marriotts through II. So buying 1000 points seemed like a much cheaper way to return to Maui and give us flexibilty to go to other Marriotts in addition to Maui.
Thanks,
Jeff

Rescind immediately. You can buy points resale and pay the junk fees to Marriott to make them just like points bought directly from them.

I believe you need to get to the Executive level in order to make reservations of 1 night or more at 13 months. I don’t recall what point total that is, but I think it is more than 4,000 points. Others can clarify that.

I had also understood that it’s best to buy at least 1,500 Trust points for your first purchase. Again I don’t recall the reason, but it may have something to do with potential restrictions.

The first step is to rescind your purchase and make sure what your needs are.

 

[Hindsite]

Yes rescind and then go back to basics on working out what you want and need.

You already have Abound ownership so can rent points from another owner for around the cost of points maint fees, so just do that to build points to get your Maui reservation.

Its a lie that "hybrid" ownership gets you better access to inventory, your elected club points, and any that are rented, can see the same inventory as the ones you have bought.

Resale club points, fully enrolled, giving you the status boost would be less than half the price you have paid.
Here is the link to the owner benefit level info.

https://www.marriottvacationsworldwide.com/common/cms/mvc/pdfs/owners/Owner-Benefit-Level.pdf

You are currently owner level (less than 4000 points), which gives you a penalty for reservations at 13 months as you need to pay a points premium. Just wait until 12 months and put in a request and you'll be fine, some MVC inventory is held back for release at 12 months and no Sheraton or Westin inventory is released before 12 months anyway.

As MVC charges $3/club point (min $3k) for the initiation fee to bring the points into the system, buying 1000 resale is a sensible min, if you feel there is any need at all.

 

[TUGBrian]

Hello. I am a long time member of TUG and have been helped time and again due my membership. But I have been complacent and have not read this forum in a very long time, so I am not up on the latest information.
I go to presentations for a variety of reasons, but never with the intention of buying. But this time I was intrigued. We are in Maui now and did the presentation today and made a purchase.
I own resale at Desert Springs Villas I. I did enroll years ago and get 3250 points if I convert my week to points each year.
At the presentation the salesman explained that by adding 1000 Trust points, I could make reservations 13 months out and at over 4000 points, I will have more availability with my "hybrid" membership. He explained that right now I do not have access to the properties that are owned in the Trust. But with the purchase of 1000 points, I will have this greater access.
Although usually the minimum purchase is 1500 points, he allowed 1000 points.
Cost: $15.275/point. $784 maintenance.
I have 10 days to rescind.
Couple more points:
-I realize 4250 total points would have to be used creatively to get back to Maui. 1 BR rather than 2. Or 2 BR every other year, banking points.
- we were looking into buying an annual 2 BR here for around $18-20,000 with maintenace at about $2800. (Or maybe even a 2BR every other year for under $10,000 with $1350 maintenance). But this would only allow trading to other Marriotts through II. So buying 1000 points seemed like a much cheaper way to return to Maui and give us flexibilty to go to other Marriotts in addition to Maui.
Thanks,
Jeff

grats on saving 15 grand!

 

[cp73]

Jeff,

I am in the same boat as you. Own one week at DSV 1 also. I know we have talked in the past. Only I rent points all the time. You can rent up to 20,000 points per year....I rent points and still use my full week at DSV 1. Also as mjm1 mentioned your ownership doesn't allow free 13 month reservations. You will have to pay a 20% preimium to get the 13 months or buy a bunch more points. Its not needed. Ive been going to Maui/Hawaii every year for a long time. Going next month to Maui....on rented points. PM me if you have any other questions....enjoy your trip in Maui....enjoy the whales. No need to keep the 1000 points...rescind...Also heading out to DSV 2 next week on some more rented points for a few days of golf.

The only other thing I would consider is to buy a deeded week there and just go every year...or other year... your flexability would be to rent it out if you dont want to go...The minute you buy those points they are only worth about $3k on the resale market.

 

[OutAndAbout]

Hello. I am a long time member of TUG and have been helped time and again due my membership. But I have been complacent and have not read this forum in a very long time, so I am not up on the latest information.
I go to presentations for a variety of reasons, but never with the intention of buying. But this time I was intrigued. We are in Maui now and did the presentation today and made a purchase.
I own resale at Desert Springs Villas I. I did enroll years ago and get 3250 points if I convert my week to points each year.
At the presentation the salesman explained that by adding 1000 Trust points, I could make reservations 13 months out and at over 4000 points, I will have more availability with my "hybrid" membership. He explained that right now I do not have access to the properties that are owned in the Trust. But with the purchase of 1000 points, I will have this greater access.
Although usually the minimum purchase is 1500 points, he allowed 1000 points.
Cost: $15.275/point. $784 maintenance.
I have 10 days to rescind.
Couple more points:
-I realize 4250 total points would have to be used creatively to get back to Maui. 1 BR rather than 2. Or 2 BR every other year, banking points.
- we were looking into buying an annual 2 BR here for around $18-20,000 with maintenace at about $2800. (Or maybe even a 2BR every other year for under $10,000 with $1350 maintenance). But this would only allow trading to other Marriotts through II. So buying 1000 points seemed like a much cheaper way to return to Maui and give us flexibilty to go to other Marriotts in addition to Maui.
Thanks,
Jeff

Agree with @Hindsite, at current maintenance fee levels and already being an owner, better to rent additional points as needed.

 

[LUVourMarriotts]

If the 13-month part is your primary goal, it seems to be BS for this purchase. You are currently OWNER, and with this purchase, you become SELECT level. Here's the breakdown (below). You are not REALLY gaining much. You could probably get 1000 points on the resale market for $6-7K if you really wanted it. You need to get to 7000 points to make a significant improvement in your booking windows.

SELECT:

• 13 months, 7+ nights with Vacation Club Points premium
• 12 months, 7+ nights
• 10 months, 1+ nights

OWNER:

• 13 months, 7+ nights
• 10 months, 1+ nights

 

[Pamplemousse]

If the 13-month part is your primary goal, it seems to be BS for this purchase. You are currently OWNER, and with this purchase, you become SELECT level. Here's the breakdown (below). You are not REALLY gaining much. You could probably get 1000 points on the resale market for $6-7K if you really wanted it. You need to get to 7000 points to make a significant improvement in your booking windows.

SELECT:

• 13 months, 7+ nights with Vacation Club Points premium
• 12 months, 7+ nights
• 10 months, 1+ nights

OWNER:

• 13 months, 7+ nights
• 10 months, 1+ nights

@LUVourMarriotts you have the premium marked with the wrong level-
owner (up to 3999 points) is the one that requires the premium to book 7 nights @ 13 months.
select (up to 6999 points) can book 7+ @ 13 without premium.

@korndoc I am at owner level and have been fed that line by salespeople to buy and move up to select every time I do an update. I see no benefit.
The only difference is booking 7+ at 13 months without a premium and I do fine and booking at 12 (just booked Maui @12 a few months ago) and getting platinum elite Bonvoy instead of gold (I’m already lifetime platinum).
As others have said you can rent points if you need more some years or buy resale points.
I agree with those suggesting you recind.

 

[LUVourMarriotts]

@LUVourMarriotts have the premium marked with the wrong level-

Thank you, fixed it.

 

[korndoc]

Thank you everyone! Love TUG.
Your answers inspired a few more questions:
-How will rental points go from the owner to me? And are there any hidden MVC costs like the $3/pt fee Hindsite mentioned when buying points?
- Can I book 13 months out if my current points from DSV plus rental points = 4200 points?
-I found resale points on TUG at $5250 for 1500 points. With the $3/point Hindsite mentioned, that would actually cost $9750, or $6.50/point! Still better than the $1378 per point I am paying now. (I miscalculated in my original post)
- But I found very few Marriott points for rent on TUG right now
- Does everybody agree with Hindsite that I currently have access to all the properies? From the salesman, I got the impression that the 4000 point Select level would open up "Trust" properies that were not available to me now UNLESS a Trust owner who gives us his week had already converted to points. He said at this time most Westin owners have not done so yet. So their properies are only available to Select members. He said it will likely take 4-6 years for most of them to get on board, at which time, yes, my current owner status would see their properties. But in the meantime I should see a lot more availability if I am Select
-Hi Chris. It's been a long time. Thanks for writing into this thread. I will PM to you shortly. It is raining here in Maui right now so we will take a drive to a vodka distillery right now. (had to cancel our whale watching tour :-( Vodka should help. I will write after we return.
Again, Thank you everyone!
Jeff

 

[Hindsite]

Renting points: anyone can transfer club points into your account @cp73 can advise what they do. No MVC hidden costs, they are not part of the transfer other than executing the move of points form one account to another, the only cost is what you agree as the price per point with the person renting to you.
13 months: Your status does not change with rented in points so the reservations window restrictions remain, no matter now many you rent in.
Resale prices: MVC have ROFR on points so look up rofr.net to get an idea on what a reasonable expectation of purchase price is. Yes it will be close to half of what you have been quoted.
Access to inventory: Its an old, old topic, look up the lies that salespeople tell post and you'll see it there, many, many posts on this over the years. Find someone to do a side by side test with and see whether you can see the same inventory or not, then you'll know because you'll have seen it yourself.

 

[JIMinNC]

Thank you everyone! Love TUG.
Your answers inspired a few more questions:
-How will rental points go from the owner to me? And are there any hidden MVC costs like the $3/pt fee Hindsite mentioned when buying points?

Since you have an enrolled DSV week, you already have a points account. The owner you are renting one year's worth of points from would just have MVC transfer them from their points account to yours for that one use year. No fee as of right now.

- Can I book 13 months out if my current points from DSV plus rental points = 4200 points?

You can still book at 13 months, but with just 3250 owned points, you will pay a 20% extra point premium. To avoid the 20% penalty you must actually OWN at least 4000 points.

-I found resale points on TUG at $5250 for 1500 points. With the $3/point Hindsite mentioned, that would actually cost $9750, or $6.50/point! Still better than the $13.78 per point I am paying now. (I miscalculated in my original post)

That's a typical price for resale points and it will likely take about that price to get past MVC's Right of First Refusal.

- But I found very few Marriott points for rent on TUG right now

Check out https://vacationpointexchange.com/

- Does everybody agree with Hindsite that I currently have access to all the properies? From the salesman, I got the impression that the 4000 point Select level would open up "Trust" properies that were not available to me now UNLESS a Trust owner who gives us his week had already converted to points. He said at this time most Westin owners have not done so yet. So their properies are only available to Select members. He said it will likely take 4-6 years for most of them to get on board, at which time, yes, my current owner status would see their properties. But in the meantime I should see a lot more availability if I am Select

Yes, Hindsite is correct based on how things work in practice. The salesman is also technically correct that only Trust owners can reserve inventory held in the Trust as long as it is held only in the Trust. But in practice, everything that we have seen seems to indicate that, at least by the 12 month reservation window and probably even at 13, all of the Trust-owned inventory gets deposited into the MVC Exchange Company, so it becomes available to all points owners. So, your salesman is technically correct, but in practice, that Trust inventory gets made available to everyone fairly early in the reservation windows it appears.

 

[Pamplemousse]

Thank you everyone! Love TUG.
Your answers inspired a few more questions:
-How will rental points go from the owner to me? And are there any hidden MVC costs like the $3/pt fee Hindsite mentioned when buying points?
- Can I book 13 months out if my current points from DSV plus rental points = 4200 points?
-I found resale points on TUG at $5250 for 1500 points. With the $3/point Hindsite mentioned, that would actually cost $9750, or $6.50/point! Still better than the $1378 per point I am paying now. (I miscalculated in my original post)
- But I found very few Marriott points for rent on TUG right now
- Does everybody agree with Hindsite that I currently have access to all the properies? From the salesman, I got the impression that the 4000 point Select level would open up "Trust" properies that were not available to me now UNLESS a Trust owner who gives us his week had already converted to points. He said at this time most Westin owners have not done so yet. So their properies are only available to Select members. He said it will likely take 4-6 years for most of them to get on board, at which time, yes, my current owner status would see their properties. But in the meantime I should see a lot more availability if I am Select
-Hi Chris. It's been a long time. Thanks for writing into this thread. I will PM to you shortly. It is raining here in Maui right now so we will take a drive to a vodka distillery right now. (had to cancel our whale watching tour :-( Vodka should help. I will write after we return.
Again, Thank you everyone!
Jeff

Realize that only some of the inventory is released at 13 months, the rest is released at 12 months.
As I said above I just booked Maui in November exactly at the 12 month date (as per the “when can I reserve calculator” under helpful tools on the MVC site).
If you try to book at 12 months and can’t get what you want you can always waitlist and you should keep searching daily- inventory changes all the time.
The salesperson seems to have you thinking you need to book at 13 months and that is not true either.

 

[korndoc]

WOW! As always, thank you all so much for your knowledge and information.
-So, rent points as needed and do not buy as that really isn't that advantagous given that only some inventory is available at 13 months, so not a big deal. And if in doubt, do a search with someone who can check out at 13 months to compare to my 12 month search. Compare both what is available at 13 months and also see if that person sees at 12 months more than I do.
-If I do want to purchase anywayl, do so at $6.50/point. But first check rofr.net
-renting 1000 points will not give me 13 month advantage
-I will check https://vacationpointexchange.com/ when I want to rent points
-Thank you Pamplemousse, I will check the “when can I reserve calculator” under helpful tools on the MVC site.

If I think of anything else, I will return to this thread.
Thank you everyone.
Hope you all have a wonderful new year with good health, peace and joyful vacations
Jeff

 

[Pamplemousse]

WOW! As always, thank you all so much for your knowledge and information.
-So, rent points as needed and do not buy as that really isn't that advantagous given that only some inventory is available at 13 months, so not a big deal. And if in doubt, do a search with someone who can check out at 13 months to compare to my 12 month search. Compare both what is available at 13 months and also see if that person sees at 12 months more than I do.
-If I do want to purchase anywayl, do so at $6.50/point. But first check rofr.net
-renting 1000 points will not give me 13 month advantage
-I will check https://vacationpointexchange.com/ when I want to rent points
-Thank you Pamplemousse, I will check the “when can I reserve calculator” under helpful tools on the MVC site.

If I think of anything else, I will return to this thread.
Thank you everyone.
Hope you all have a wonderful new year with good health, peace and joyful vacations
Jeff

You can search and book 7+ at ANY level at 13 months!
It just cost you 20% more points to book before 12 months at the owner level.

But unless there is some critical reason you must book an exact stay on specific dates just check the calculator and be ready to go at 12 months. You will find threads (and it was my recent experience) that the 12 month inventory loads before 9 AM eastern so you can start looking earlier that morning just be sure you are booking at regular points not premium.

 

[bazzap]

You can search and book at ANY level at 13 months!
It just cost you 20% more points to book before 12 months at the owner level.

But unless there is some critical reason you must book an exact stay on specific dates just check the calculator and be ready to go at 12 months. You will find threads (and it was my recent experience) that the 12 month inventory loads before 9 AM eastern so you can start looking earlier that morning just be sure you are booking at regular points not premium.

For Owner and Select levels though at 13 months only for 7+ nights with the 20% Vacation Club Points premium.

 

[Pamplemousse]

For Owner and Select levels though at 13 months only for 7+ nights with the 20% Vacation Club Points premium.

Yes, I’ll add that to my post for clarity. OP was between owner and select so same for both. Thanks!

 

[JIMinNC]

WOW! As always, thank you all so much for your knowledge and information.
-So, rent points as needed and do not buy as that really isn't that advantagous given that only some inventory is available at 13 months, so not a big deal. And if in doubt, do a search with someone who can check out at 13 months to compare to my 12 month search. Compare both what is available at 13 months and also see if that person sees at 12 months more than I do.
-If I do want to purchase anywayl, do so at $6.50/point. But first check rofr.net
-renting 1000 points will not give me 13 month advantage
-I will check https://vacationpointexchange.com/ when I want to rent points
-Thank you Pamplemousse, I will check the “when can I reserve calculator” under helpful tools on the MVC site.

If I think of anything else, I will return to this thread.
Thank you everyone.
Hope you all have a wonderful new year with good health, peace and joyful vacations
Jeff

I'll add, I've never considered it worth it, even with resale points, to buy more just to get from "Owner" to "Select". All you are really gaining is the ability to book between 13 and 12 months without the 20% premium. Owners can book at 13 months already, it just costs 20% more points. The "sweet spot", if there is one, is at "Executive" level where you gain the ability to book less than seven nights at either 13 or 12 months. But Executive requires 7000 points, so it's a much bigger buy up.

 

[Fasttr]

For Owner and Select levels though at 13 months only for 7+ nights with the 20% Vacation Club Points premium.

Yes, I’ll add that to my post for clarity. OP was between owner and select so same for both.

20% premium is only for Owner level.

https://www.marriottvacationsworldwide.com/common/cms/mvc/pdfs/owners/Owner-Benefit-Level.pdf

 

[korndoc]

12 month inventory loads before 9 AM eastern so you can start looking earlier that morning just be sure you are booking at regular points not premium.

Are the extra 20% points taken automatically if I messed up and did not use the calclulator? I get that feeling from Pamplemousse's statement.
(9:00 AM is 6:00 AM in San Diego. How much earlier would you recommend I try booking online?)
Any advantage to calling to make the reservation vs doing it online?

 

[Fasttr]

Are the extra 20% points taken automatically if I messed up and did not use the calclulator? I get that feeling from Pamplemousse's statement.
(9:00 AM is 6:00 AM in San Diego. How much earlier would you recommend I try booking online?)
Any advantage to calling to make the reservation vs doing it online?

20% is automatically calc’d.

I would look online at Midnight Eastern.

I prefer online.

 

[JIMinNC]

Are the extra 20% points taken automatically if I messed up and did not use the calclulator? I get that feeling from Pamplemousse's statement.
(9:00 AM is 6:00 AM in San Diego. How much earlier would you recommend I try booking online?)
Any advantage to calling to make the reservation vs doing it online?

That's a great question about exactly when the 20% premium drops off.

What @Pamplemousse is referring to is we have found that even though the "When Can I Reserve" calculator says you can reserve at 12 months on, lets say, January 12 at 9am, the new inventory released at 12 months often appears online as early as the mid-afternoon of the day PRIOR to the official release date. I could tell this because I was booking Maui a couple years ago at the 12 month point, and all the 13-month loaded inventory was already gone. But then, on the afternoon before the 12 month release date, a bunch of new availability showed up online and was able to grab it early. However, I'm Presidential level in MVC and I don't have the pay the 20% premium, so if the inventory shows up early, I can just book it. If you as an Owner level tried to book that same inventory a day before the 12 month release, I suspect you would have to pay the 20% premium. I would suspect the premium drops off at midnight on the "official" date or maybe at 9am. It all depends on how the MVC reservation system is programmed.

By the way, I recently booked a 2025 points stay at the Marriott Waikoloa Ocean Club on the Big Island at 13 months. That 13-month inventory was supposed to be available at 9am on Tuesday January 2, but I was perusing the site on the afternoon of January 1 and noticed the inventory was already there. I was able to book our 2025 stay at 3pm EST on January 1 even though the 13-month release day was Jan 2. I'm not sure if the New Years holiday meant MVC IT loaded the inventory early for some reason or if the inventory also regularly loads early at the 13 month date. This is the first time I had noticed that phenomena at 13 months.

 

[Dean]

That's a great question about exactly when the 20% premium drops off.

What @Pamplemousse is referring to is we have found that even though the "When Can I Reserve" calculator says you can reserve at 12 months on, lets say, January 12 at 9am, the new inventory released at 12 months often appears online as early as the mid-afternoon of the day PRIOR to the official release date. I could tell this because I was booking Maui a couple years ago at the 12 month point, and all the 13-month loaded inventory was already gone. But then, on the afternoon before the 12 month release date, a bunch of new availability showed up online and was able to grab it early. However, I'm Presidential level in MVC and I don't have the pay the 20% premium, so if the inventory shows up early, I can just book it. If you as an Owner level tried to book that same inventory a day before the 12 month release, I suspect you would have to pay the 20% premium. I would suspect the premium drops off at midnight on the "official" date or maybe at 9am. It all depends on how the MVC reservation system is programmed.

By the way, I recently booked a 2025 points stay at the Marriott Waikoloa Ocean Club on the Big Island at 13 months. That 13-month inventory was supposed to be available at 9am on Tuesday January 2, but I was perusing the site on the afternoon of January 1 and noticed the inventory was already there. I was able to book our 2025 stay at 3pm EST on January 1 even though the 13-month release day was Jan 2. I'm not sure if the New Years holiday meant MVC IT loaded the inventory early for some reason or if the inventory also regularly loads early at the 13 month date. This is the first time I had noticed that phenomena at 13 months.

I've routinely seen inventory available early both at the 12 & 13 month window for points. I've seen it available as much as 2 (maybe even 3) days early when a holiday was involved.

 

[bazzap]

20% premium is only for Owner level.

https://www.marriottvacationsworldwide.com/common/cms/mvc/pdfs/owners/Owner-Benefit-Level.pdf

Yes true, it was the 7+ night restriction for Owner and Select levels. 20% premium just for Owner level.

 

[Pamplemousse]

Are the extra 20% points taken automatically if I messed up and did not use the calclulator? I get that feeling from Pamplemousse's statement.
(9:00 AM is 6:00 AM in San Diego. How much earlier would you recommend I try booking online?)
Any advantage to calling to make the reservation vs doing it online?

As the others have said the 20% is automatically calculated and showing.
And as Jim said if you search a few days before the 12 month inventory drop you will probably see limited inventory left over from the 13 month release and it will have the 20% added and then at the 12 month date or just before there will be lots more inventory and the points won’t have the premium attached.
My experience booking Maui at 12 months in November was no new inventory at 11PM the night before or at 7AM day of release but new inventory was there just after 8 and I booked then (no premium). I knew to look early from posts I had read here but it was just a little early.
You can consult the points charts for each resort also under helpful tools on MVC so you know how many points are required for your dates, units size and view.