Hotel point hound-should I buy a timeshare

[Bxian]

I have been lurking on the TUG boards and have found them helpful. We are trying to decide whether or not to buy a timeshare.
About us-in our 50's, both working (although I have 3 and 4 day weekends off). One kid in college, one starting college next week. We live in the northeast. The kids still LOVE to vacation with us.
I signed up for a Hilton credit card some years back-we put everything on it that we can (phone bill, groceries, etc.) which nets us a good number of Hilton points to stay in Hilton hotels. I also have charged college tution (paying off the bill with college savings so we don't have to pay credit card interest). This has gotten us some great vacations in the last couple of years-2 free rooms on the Big Island of Hawaii for 6 nights and 2 free rooms for 6 nights in Los Cabos. H and I are in the process of booking an "empty nest" trip to Paris and will also stay for free using Hilton points.
I used to be anti-timeshare, as a close friend bought years ago in Ocean City, MD. in December-I still remember her tales of having to lug a double size baby stroller up 3 flights of stairs at the only timeshare trade they could get in the Poconos.
More recently, I have started to rethink my earlier philosophy. We know people who own at Marriott, Hyatt and the Trapp Family Lodge in Vermont-all have had good experiences.
We love the beach, but the price of East Coast beach real estate is outrageous. I thought that as we moved into retirement (seems very far away), it would be nice to know that we could count on a week at the beach or at a nice resort. it might also encourage us to get away a little more.
Some questions:
1. Should we even think about timeshare if we can get enough Hilton points to go away for free? This may only last until child #2 is out of college.
2. I've thought of looking for a resale Hilton, but their locations seem limited. Is it true that in the Hilton system, "points are points," and that if I had the required HGVC points, I could trade Orlando for Hawaii?
3. I have also thought about the Marriott two-EOY option (buy 2 every other year in different places). I have fallen in love long distance with the Newport Beach resort, and my Marriott-owning friends told me we would love it there. However, i don't think we would want to visit California every year, so I thought we would try to balance with an east coast location. I called Marriott recently and learned that the closer beach resorts to us (Myrtle Beach, Hilton Head) are not included in that offer. The NJ and Virginia locations are a bit of a distance from the beach-and I am concerned that they might not trade well.
4. I would also consider Four Seasons (but only 2 locations and not beachfront), Westin or Hyatt-I think that H and I will have an easier time of it doing long weekend trips. Of the hotel timeshare options mentioned , which would give us the flexibility to do long weekend trips rather than an entire week?
Thanks for any help you can give me

 

[CaliDave]

I think timesharing is a great way to go, especially for beachfront vacations.

Hilton locations are limited. However as a resale buyer, you can still convert any unused timeshare points, into Hilton Honors points. They convert at a rate of 23-1. So 7000 point ownership would be 161,000 . Which isn't fantastic, but it's an ok option. Hilton does have a new affliate coming online in Carlsbad, Ca. Which I think will almost be on par with Marriott Newport.
Hilton has a fantastic points system. You can stay from 3 nights to 30 nights in a row. and yes.. points are points. Buy in Vegas or Orlando and use them in Hawaii. No problem at all.
I own in Vegas and I just booked a 2007 Easter week in a 2bd oceanview at Hilton Hawaiian Village.

After saying all that.. Marriott would be a good ownership for the locations you want. Especially if you bought a lockoff at a location that you want to visit most years. When the kids come, you use the 2bd, when they don't you use the studio or 1bd , even get two consecutive weeks. One in a 1bd and 1 in a studio. However Marriott doesn't offer you any extra days, unless you rent at a pretty high price.

I hope you have the Hilton AMEX, it gets more points than the Hilton Visa for everyday purchases.

Good luck

 

[stevens397]

My decision to buy timeshares was based primarily on comfort - one point you didn't mention. I love having a living room to go into if my wife sleeps late. I'm probably a year or two older than you with kids ranging from 25 to 32. And I've learned that if I keep paying, the kids will keep coming!

My other main point you did touch upon. Someday I'll retire and while things look very good for us, there is a difference between asking my wife IF she wants to go on a vacation versus asking WHEN she wants to go! We'll make sure to make the most of them.

Finally, most people would tell you to only buy where you would be happy going most of the time. Trades are often not as easy and predictable as we would like to think. Buy only where you would be happy going if the trade you wanted didn't come through.

You do need to think about whether or not you want to buy from the developer or resale. There's many discussions of the pros and cons of either side on the board. Good luck.

 

[Bxian]

Thanks for the prompt replies CaliDave-I do have the AMEX-just booked an AXON award for 4 days at the Hilton Eiffel Tower plus 2 additional nights at the Hilton Arc De Triomphe-flights for 2 are costing less than $100 as I was able to get two frequent flyer tickets. So my H and I will spend a week in Paris for less than a week at the Jersey shore!
Do you know if the Carlsbad HGVC location will have a view of the ocean?
Steve-I am pretty sure that my 2 kids will continue to join us on some of our
travels as long as we pay . In fact, that's one of the reasons I am thinking about timesharing-we are all much happier when we have a little space.
Can eitther of you tell me whether a hotel timeshare will get a status upgrade in the affiliated hotel program? I have bounced back and forth between Hilton Gold and Diamond and have gotten some nice upgrades (particularly if the hotel is not full when we stay).

 

[Henry M.]

I agree with stevens397 on the point about comfort and buying where you would want to go if there weren't any exchanges available. For short stays it doesn't matter as much, but it sure is nice to have a kitchen and washer/dryer in the room when you are away a week or more.

I own with Starwood (Westin Ka'anapali Ocean Resort Villas) and even though hotel points aren't always the best use of the property, I do get enough points for about 10 days or more at a nice hotel if I decide not to use the timeshare (given a fifth night free promotion that has been in place for a while). The hotel piece is most valuable at many international locations. You can go just for shorter periods of time than a whole week, but I think you can only make reservations something like 60 days out and some days of the week cost a lot more than others in terms of Staroptions, the points you use to exchange within the Starwood Vacation Network. I think other hotel programs don't give you quite as many points in terms of the nights you can use them for. That was one of the reasons (among others) I didn't buy at Marriott, for example.

I find that if you use your timeshare every year (either directly or exchanging into other similar locations) you do get significant value vs. paying for a hotel room. Even though I have a lot of hotel points, I find I still like the timeshare better. I use the hotel points for rooms around the time of my timeshare reservation to give me more flexibility to my travel dates (since mostly I use airline frequent flyer awards that don't always line up with the timeshare availability). Also, I use my points when I want to go places I can't exchange into.

To me having the timeshare is like buying the hotel rooms wholesale. You do lose the flexibility to not spend money in a given year because you pay everything up front but if you vacation every year then you spend the money anyhow. With the timeshare it is just cheaper for better accommodations than in a hotel

My children also love to travel with us (one in college, one a high school sophomore) and I intend to share my timeshare with them and perhaps some day pass on the property to them ( I have a deeded timeshare, not a right-to-use that expires after some time period). It has been nice that after the large initial expenditure I no longer have to think about a vacation budget or whether I really want to spend $x. It's done, so now it is just a matter of when and where we are going. I think I would not go out as long and to such nice places if I didn't have the timeshare. My more conservative side would want to save the money instead of building all the memories we now have

I haven't had much luck with external exchanges with Interval International. When I have tried to go to the nicer properties listed in their catalog they never seem to be available, even a year out. I would not count on that program to get a good exchange if you buy any of the higher end timeshares. I know for example that Starwood rarely if ever deposits Maui weeks into that program and I think the other hotel programs are the same. I can find many Orlando timeshares but not those inside Disney World.

My hotel-based timeshares have been working for me several years now. I'm definitely happy I bought into it. I don't think I'd want a single location timeshare, though, even if I could use an exchange company to go other places.

 

[CaliDave]

Hilton just gives you Silver when you own the timeshare or if you buy 14,000 points from the developer, they give you Gold.
You can also get Gold via the Amex if you spend $25K per year.

You are using your honors points very well.

The Hilton Marbrisa in Carlsbad will have an oceanview.. but I'd say its about 1.5 miles to the ocean, maybe more.

Here is the website
http://www.marbrisaresort.com/

 

[Henry M.]

Can eitther of you tell me whether a hotel timeshare will get a status upgrade in the affiliated hotel program? I have bounced back and forth between Hilton Gold and Diamond and have gotten some nice upgrades (particularly if the hotel is not full when we stay).

Westin gives you Gold status. you can get also get Platinum status if you own lot of time with them. I believe other hotel programs have similar benefits, getting you to at least their mid-level status when you buy their timeshares.

I think Marriott probably has the greatest variety of locations but I've heard it is sometimes difficult to exchange into their higher demand properties if you don't own a lot of time with them - don't have any direct experience, though.

 

[DeniseM]

Some people really love the option to convert their timeshare to hotel points, but I wouldn't buy a timeshare for the primary purpose of converting to points. Most of the time, it's not a good value, when you consider the high purchase price and high maintenance fees. If you travel to Europe often, it is a better deal, but domestically - no.

I own at the same Starwood resort as emuyshondt, and if I convert my 2 bdm. Maui Unit to points, I would get enough points for 10 days in a standard hotel room. But if I use my timeshare, I can stay in it for two weeks - one week in a studio and one week in a 1 bdm. and it's a heck of a lot bigger and nicer than a standard hotel room.

So we are comparing 10 days in a standard hotel room to 2 weeks in a roomy studio or 1 bdm. timeshare with all the amenities. Do you think that's a good value? I don't. As I said before, you get more value in Europe where the hotel rooms are very expensive, but I personally wouldn't trade 2 weeks on Maui for say, a week in a standard hotel room in London. Maybe that's attractive to some people, but to me it's not.

Also - Starwood Gold status is nearly worthless, because they give it to all TS owners, plus many others, through a variety of promos. There are so many gold members, that it has become very difficult to get any kind of real upgrade with gold status. If you check the Starwood board at flyertalk.com they confirm this over and over again. If you buy a bunch of timeshares and achieve Platinum level, then you have some clout, but it will cost you and arm and a leg.

 

[Henry M.]

I agree with Denise about not buying a timeshare with the primary purpose of getting hotel points. However, they are an option when for some reason you can't go or exchange within the SVO system. Ideally you would rent out your unit in a case like that but I have not yet tried to do that (nor have I uconverted to points - I use my timeshare!). I'm nost sure how successful private rents are. Maybe others here can comment.

My point above was just that timesharing does work for many and having a variety of locations within the timeshare program (not through II or RCI) is better than single or limited location units. Being able to get hotel points is just a side benefit that can be useful depending on your travel destinations.

 

[Sooby]

I think HGVC would be best for you. I also have a lot of points and use them for add ons to trips and trade in for air miles. It works great with Hiltons and when you are gold status they usually try to upgrade you even if you are using points for stays. I have had no problems booking Hawaii and have gone several times and I own in Las Vegas. Hiltons are great trades with RCI and I have never yet (9 years) not gotten my request. The HGVC's are nice places. I would definitely get Platinum season and no less than 7000 points. My husband is retired and I am not. We have taken family with us and they enjoy the trips too. Good Luck, Sooby

 

[BayouTraveler]

As a member of HGVC, a Diamond Honors member and a AMEX shopaholic, I can say I'm pleased with how owning has turned out for us. I accumulate enough points for some nice GLON vacations, but can you ever vacation enough? I often use points from both systems on vacation and I particularly enjoy the flexibility the Hilton system offers. We don't ever use the size and season we own. We typically go when demand is lower, stay for less than 7 nights, get a larger unit, and bring family with us. That's the big advantage to Hilton. The disadvantage: if you've been a member of Hilton's HHonors for a while you know that the point values can change dramatically. Owning in their HGVC system doesn't insulate you from that. If hotel points are devalued, they are devalued when you exchange club points to Honors points. As others have pointed out, it's not a great exchange rate to start with and there is no adjustment to the conversion rate if the point redemption rate table changes. To put it in perspective, a one bedroom gold week (3400 club points) ALMOST gets you two nights in a Category 6 hotel (78,200 HHonors points). That's $530 in maintenance & taxes or about $265/night for the hotel's cheapest room.

I own at HGVC Seaworld and one of the FL affiliated resorts. I would recommend running the numbers before you make your decision. Estimate what you typically spend for a week's vacation. Gather some resale prices and most importantly - the annual maintenance, taxes, membership fees and reservation fees. Consider not just the HGCV-developed but also the affliated properties. It's been my experience so far that my affiliated property points really do work just like the points I bought from Hilton. The only difference is price. There is no first Right of Refusal on affiliated properties so you might get lucky and find a cheap one.

If you can find a timeshare system, be it Hilton or another, with resorts where you want to be and you can come out ahead financially after ten years of ownership, I say go for it. But all of those factors, location, price, flexibility, your future travel budget all have to work. The tradeoff with any timeshare is that you don't just pick up and go wherever you want whenever you want. You've got to be satisfied with the locations offered and able to plan ahead to be successful. Redeeming points in the Hilton hotel system as a Gold/Diamond is less restrictive.

Best of Luck!

 

[WORLD TRAVELER]

HGVC is very flexible and easy to use

As previously mentioned, you should purchase where you intend to travel most. Hilton works for us because our two favorite places to travel to are Las Vegas and Hawaii and Hilton has the resort capacity in both places, that we don't have to worry about availability. If you are interested in Elite status(Gold VIP and other benefits), you can purchase HGVC resale through Joanne Peters - jpeters@hgvc.com and qualify with a purchase of 14000 points. The hotel conversion option is a nice feature and is available on a resale purchase. You will get the most value from your timeshare by using it as a timeshare and not trading for HHonors points. That said, however, it is nice to be able to travel using the Hilton hotel system to destinations where there aren't timeshares available, especially internationally.

 

[Sandy VDH]

I have a Hilton Elite membership which I did purchase resale from Joanne Peters. I also am a Hilton Diamond member, based on hotel stays.

It is generally not good use to take your HGVC points and convert them to HHonors points, I find borrowing HGVC points is the best option or if you must bank for the next year, for a fee, is still a better option than converting to HHonors points. Just book a hotel with HGVC points at the end of the year if you have points remaining. Or deposit a week into RCI as an alternate use of points.

The nice thing about being HGVC Elite is I may never have to travel again at a Hilton but still retain a Gold membership which will come in handy when I don't need to travel for work as often as I do now. It also gives me access to the VIP awards which are really the ones to use.

We are planning a Maldives trip at some point in the next few years and am looking forward to using a reward for that trip.

I am early 40s and not kids, so I have time and space to work and still play.

 

[Bxian]

Thnaks for all of the informative replies! If we buy at all, it would probably be Orlando or a FLA. affiliate-Hawaii is just too far away from the East Coast (and more pricey), and my H is not wild for Vegas. The Carlsbad location looks really nice, but I would prefer to pay resale prices. However, with Fla, I worry about Orlando being overbuilt TS-wise, and it seems like floating weeks at FLA. affiliates are scarce (we would prefer the west coast of Fla.) Can you give me an idea of what non-Hilton locations you have been able to trade into? Are any of the other major hotel chains TS part of RCI (I know that Marriott is II)?