HGV agrees to purchase BlueGreen Vacations

[dayooper]

Hilton Grand Vacations to Acquire Bluegreen Vacations

Hilton Grand Vacations to Acquire Bluegreen Vacations

www.businesswire.com

Not sure what to think of this. With the exception of a rumor, this out of nowhere. I really don’t think this will effect us much, but maybe a merger with the HVC/ DRI system?

I’m not sure how this will even work.

HGV Agrees to Purchase BlueGreen Vacations

https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20231105290916/en/Hilton-Grand-Vacations-to-Acquire-Bluegreen-Vacations Huge news. Welcome to HGV. Interested to see how this all works out. Link to the HGVC forum: https://tugbbs.com/forums/threads/hgv-agrees-to-purchase-bluegreen-vacations.358096/

tugbbs.com

 

[PigsDad]

Wow. I guess HGVC/HVC salespeople will use this as yet another "reason" to "encourage" people to buy into Max. As a former Bluegreen owner, they do have a couple of properties that I like, but the vast majority of them are of no interest to me, which is one of the reasons I got out of that system.

Or it will become a reason to create a "Max Plus" program. Do we think they will just add the new properties into the Max collection for free?

Kurt

 

[dioxide45]

Or it will become a reason to create a "Max Plus" program. Do we think they will just add the new properties into the Max collection for free?

Kurt

I have faith that they will not require new purchase by existing Max owners. Based on the release, they mention an easy integration and more resorts in Max.

• Opportunity to offer owners and members access to more vacations and experiences, including more resorts via HGV Max and across an even larger portfolio, backed by the strength of the Hilton brand.

 

[rickandcindy23]

Wow. I guess HGVC/HVC salespeople will use this as yet another "reason" to "encourage" people to buy into Max. As a former Bluegreen owner, they do have a couple of properties that I like, but the vast majority of them are of no interest to me, which is one of the reasons I got out of that system.

I don't think this is a good thing.

And you are sure right about only a few properties being of interest. I think Hilton is such a high quality product, and much of Bluegreen isn't. But I think that of Diamond as well. Many Diamond properties like quality. I also think Wyndham has a lot of properties that could use some improvement, but Wyndham can only do so much with some.

Hilton would go along well with Big Cedar Lodge, or whatever it's called. Great property.

The end goal could be devastating for RCI, as these internal trading systems continue to get more locations.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Wow. I guess HGVC/HVC salespeople will use this as yet another "reason" to "encourage" people to buy into Max. As a former Bluegreen owner, they do have a couple of properties that I like, but the vast majority of them are of no interest to me, which is one of the reasons I got out of that system.

Which are the properties you found worthwhile?

 

[sponger76]

I have faith that they will not require new purchase by existing Max owners. Based on the release, they mention an easy integration and more resorts in Max.

• Opportunity to offer owners and members access to more vacations and experiences, including more resorts via HGV Max and across an even larger portfolio, backed by the strength of the Hilton brand.

I do wonder if this will result in some changes in the way Bluegreen does things. They have been reportedly severely cracking down on renters lately, which I have not heard of as a problem for HGVC. There are also a lot of restrictions for purely resale owners, which doesn't seem to be an issue with HGVC. I wonder if those things will change, or if HGVC will take a more "hands-off" approach with respect to those types of policies.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Anyone attending the earnings conf call today? I wonder how their Q3 numbers look?

It seems they are doubling down on their sales strategy of buying existing TS owners who understand timesharing and trying to get them to upsell to the new Green Max.

Why can't they buy something upscale like Four Seasons?

 

[escanoe]

Makes it an even harder blow to RCI should HGV decide to take its ball and go home. So maybe another extended, exclusive contract that does good for HGV and RCI while not offering any better deals or competition for TS owners?

 

[GT75]

I wonder how their Q3 numbers look?

I am terrible at reading this financial stuff but the numbers look down for the quarter. I am looking forward to someone giving a full report.

 

[dioxide45]

Makes it an even harder blow to RCI should HGV decide to take its ball and go home. So maybe another extended, exclusive contract that does good for HGV and RCI while not offering any better deals or competition for TS owners?

HGV isn't leaving RCI anytime soon, but it does pull more resorts into the Hilton mini system. I think RCI is grasping at straws now with the loss of DVC and trying to increase fees to keep revenue in line. RCI certainly isn't going away, but the more and more we see smaller systems consolidate (even into Capital Vacations), the more irrelevant RCI becomes.

 

[sponger76]

Which are the properties you found worthwhile?

My personal favorite was The Club at Big Bear Village, and I hear they are currently constructing new buildings there. The Wilderness Club at Big Cedar. I like The Innsbruck Aspen based solely on the fact that it's in Apsen, but it was always extremely difficult to find availability so I never got to actually stay there, plus it's not as close to the ski slopes as I would want..

 

[PigsDad]

I do wonder if this will result in some changes in the way Bluegreen does things. They have been reportedly severely cracking down on renters lately, which I have not heard of as a problem for HGVC. There are also a lot of restrictions for purely resale owners, which doesn't seem to be an issue with HGVC. I wonder if those things will change, or if HGVC will take a more "hands-off" approach with respect to those types of policies.

I don't know about the renting restrictions, but take a look at how resales of HGVC vs. old Diamond ownerships are handled. Even after the merger, Diamond resale owners have many restrictions on reservations whereas HGVC resale owners are still treated almost the same as retail owners, just not eligible for Max. Makes me think they will keep the Bluegreen resale restrictions after the merger, just like they did w/ the Diamond merger.

Kurt

 

[HuskerATL]

That is my thought....HVC...unless they create another category "HVC-" .

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Does Bluegreen offer deeds or a trust product?

 

[CalGalTraveler]

I don't know about the renting restrictions, but take a look at how resales of HGVC vs. old Diamond ownerships are handled. Even after the merger, Diamond resale owners have many restrictions on reservations whereas HGVC resale owners are still treated almost the same as retail owners, just not eligible for Max. Makes me think they will keep the Bluegreen resale restrictions after the merger, just like they did w/ the Diamond merger.

Kurt

This could be a selling point to upgrade. Buy more and you can rent out your home week.

Trusts are difficult to offer a fair rental program vs. home week deeds. Look at how Wyndham and Worldmark have issues with mega renters taking all the inventory.

 

[sponger76]

I don't know about the renting restrictions, but take a look at how resales of HGVC vs. old Diamond ownerships are handled. Even after the merger, Diamond resale owners have many restrictions on reservations whereas HGVC resale owners are still treated almost the same as retail owners, just not eligible for Max. Makes me think they will keep the Bluegreen resale restrictions after the merger, just like they did w/ the Diamond merger.

Kurt

That's kind of what I figured. My curiosity is purely academic, as I left the Bluegreen playground as a retail owner and don't have any intention of returning, retail or resale.

 

[HuskerATL]

TS owners who understand timesharing and trying to get them to upsell to the new Green Max.

All owners will need to join the new HGV Max Deluxe program to have access...

 

[dioxide45]

Wow. I guess HGVC/HVC salespeople will use this as yet another "reason" to "encourage" people to buy into Max. As a former Bluegreen owner, they do have a couple of properties that I like, but the vast majority of them are of no interest to me, which is one of the reasons I got out of that system.

I would agree. I don't see a need for them to create some new level of Max. It would be a waste of money and resources. They needed Max, or something else when they brought in Diamond because they didn't want to open in up and they needed a carrot on the stick to sell to new and existing members. Creating some additional level will add more complexities and more cost. They will just rebrand what they can and fold those resorts into Max.

It will be interesting to see a HVC resort at the World Golf Village in St Augustine that is right beside a Renaissance hotel (part of the Marriott brand. Not that there will be any issues with that. Though I don't know if that property would even be converted to HVC.

 

[dioxide45]

Does Bluegreen offer deeds or a trust product?

I believe their primary product is now trust based points. There are older deeded weeks out there, but when they bring them back in they go into their points program.

 

[sponger76]

Does Bluegreen offer deeds or a trust product?

Kind of a hybrid. There are a lot of old deeds that are purely fixed week/unit. But for a number of years now retail purchases have been in a trust. They typically pitch it to you as a number of points but they are actually backed by a fixed week/unit. For those deeds, you can elect up to a certain point in advance (I think it's 13 months but I could be remembering incorrectly) to use that specific week/unit. If you don't, you instead receive the amount of points that week/unit combination is worth. You can then reserve at any of the properties using your points.

 

[dioxide45]

Kind of a hybrid. There are a lot of old deeds that are purely fixed week/unit. But for a number of years now retail purchases have been in a trust. They typically pitch it to you as a number of points but they are actually backed by a fixed week/unit. For those deeds, you can elect up to a certain point in advance (I think it's 13 months but I could be remembering incorrectly) to use that specific week/unit. If you don't, you instead receive the amount of points that week/unit combination is worth. You can then reserve at any of the properties using your points.

So it sounds more like HGV than HVC. If it is a deeded week with an allocated number of points, that is HGVC. A trust would be where you are deeded actual points from a trust that consists of several resorts.

 

[HedonisticEpicurean]

As an outsider just learning my immediate reaction:
Awesome for the C-suite and stock options over the next 5 years
Great for Bluegreen owners
Nonplus for HGVC current owners
I'm curious to hear if there are any positives for HGVC owners

 

[sponger76]

So it sounds more like HGV than HVC. If it is a deeded week with an allocated number of points, that is HGVC. A trust would be where you are deeded actual points from a trust that consists of several resorts.

Yes, I was thinking that in that respect it is very similar to HGVC. However, I think HGVC weeks are mostly floating, and all the Bluegreen deeds are backed as a fixed week and unit. With Bluegreen, if you elect to use your home ownership (not automatic, by the way, you have to notify them that you want to exercise it), you get exactly the week and unit listed on your deed. Also, with that style of ownership the paperwork does state that you are in a certain Trust type, I believe mine was Trust type E, it just also listed the specific unit number and week. It can be very weird and confusing because it is and yet it isn't a straight fixed week.

 

[HuskerATL]

So it sounds more like HGV than HVC. If it is a deeded week with an allocated number of points, that is HGVC. A trust would be where you are deeded actual points from a trust that consists of several resorts.

There are DRI deeds also....the folks who have not joined the Trust. It sounds like Blue Green is very similar. DRI owners have commented about trading their DRI week in II.

 

[Zenichiro]

I’m baffled, it’s strange how a company would tell everyone about this aqusition (obviously sales at BG and HGV knew) before it was official.

Edit: should have bought some BG stock. It went up 100%