• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 30 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other Owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered 24 hours a day!
  • TUG started 31 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Read about our 31st anniversary: Happy 31st Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    Free memberships for every 50 subscribers!

    Visit TUG on Youtube!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $24,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $24 Million dollars
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free!

    Tens of thousands of subscribing owners! A weekly recap of the best Timeshare resort reviews and the most popular topics discussed by owners!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    All T-shirt options here!
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

Glut of DVC Resale Listings?

dioxide45

dioxide45

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
May 20, 2006
Messages
53,225
Reaction score
24,787
Location
NE Florida
Resorts Owned
Marriott Grande Vista
Marriott Harbour Lake
Sheraton Vistana Villages
Club Wyndham CWA
I was watching the most recent video/podcast from the World of DVC and they indicated that they have ten times the number of resale listings now than they had the same time last year. 700 listings compared to 70 last year. Looking at the listings on their website, I see a lot that say "reduced" or "seller to pay closing". I suspect the recent downturn in the markets and economy and with gas prices at historic highs is leading to a sell off. Certainly DVC resale prices are at historic highs, but with a bunch of new resale inventory hitting the market, I would think it would lead to a downturn in prices.
 
kanerf said:
Not to mention that the cost of going to the parks is also at an historic high and APs have not returned. No DDP either.
Click to expand...
Yeah, that could also certainly be part of it. The product certainly isn't the same. That said, the parks are still packed, but perhaps the DVC members are bailing while the nightly guests are still willing to fork over a lot of money for a product that has diminished over time. I was reading a thread over on DISBoards where someone was asking of $10K CAD was enough for a trip for a family of five. I can't imaging spending $10K on that kind of vacation.
 
Ralph Sir Edward said:
Dare I say it? . . . . Maybe the Disney experience is starting to price itself out of the mass market?
Click to expand...
Perhaps, but I think there are also other external factors like fuel prices and a downturn in the economy. Is DVC resale listings just a predictor of things to come? I am not sure we have seen similar increases in resale listings for other timeshare brands.
 
As someone very immersed in DVC, I think ROFR has a huge impact in this right now. For instance, you can’t get SSR through below $130 a point. People buying don’t want to pay that much and may be hoping to wait it out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Limace said:
As someone very immersed in DVC, I think ROFR has a huge impact in this right now. For instance, you can’t get SSR through below $130 a point. People buying don’t want to pay that much and may be hoping to wait it out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Perhaps if Disney starts to see the glut of resale inventory they may back down their ROFR a little bit causing prices to come down some?

You can price something at $130, but if you can't find a buyer then Disney won't even have the opportunity to exercise on ROFR. At some point in time people will have to be willing to sell for less and either let Disney take them or see if Disney backs off their ROFR price points.
 
Snazzylass said:
hmmm..this does not surprise me at all! Totally predicted this. I think a lot of people are over Disney.
Click to expand...
I think a lot of people are, but going by the number of people in the parks, there are a lot of new people getting into Disney. The parks are still full, lines are long. How long can it last though?
 
it's hard to say whether or not other timeshare systems are seeing an increase in available resales, because the market for them is much more decentralized and opaque. But, even if this is a Disney-specific thing, there are reasons for it both good and bad.

As noted, the Parks product is different, and the price points are not helping. However, I suspect that has less to do with this than many think. A good number of DVC owners are not going to blink at the changes in price point. it's just money, and relatively little for most people who would be comfortable dropping low-to-mid five figures on a luxury discretionary purchase. And, that might be true of many Disney vacationers in general: the biggest surprise for management about the new pay-to-play system was how the large number that were willing to pay.

The parks are slammed, the resorts are full. It is true that there is a breaking point, but this idea that "finally they've gone too far" comes up every time Disney increases the prices for something. Disney has been in the business of setting prices for their product for decades, they are fanatical about measuring guest sentiment, and they probably know more about what their guests will accept than Joe the armchair CEO. That doesn't mean they can't be wrong, but my money is on the Mouse.

I do think the economic headwinds have something to do with it, but not in the way that some of you might. Prices have soared in the secondary marketplace over the past year. That's likely not going to continue for very much longer, and I suspect there are a good number of owners testing the market with "buy me out, I dare you" prices, thinking they are near a short-term top. If they get it (or close to it) fine, they'll sell. If not, no worries, they will keep it and just move on.
 
Travel overseas has also not returned in a big way. Perhaps people are opting for the little Eiffel at World Showcase rather than the real one.
 
Limace said:
As someone very immersed in DVC, I think ROFR has a huge impact in this right now. For instance, you can’t get SSR through below $130 a point. People buying don’t want to pay that much and may be hoping to wait it out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
On my DVC Facebook group, a woman just closed on VWL for $108 per point. Passed ROFR quickly.

Disney AP's not being available to members currently is a big mistake. We kept ours current. Not allowing the sale of new AP's seems very non-inclusive. It's like they are wanting a lawsuit. After all, we still have them, others cannot get them, and that seems wrong to me. We have encouraged our kids to keep them in case they are never allowed to buy them new again.

Some of it is politics. There are quite a few people who feel that Disney lost its magic. They want out because they are making profit over what they paid years ago and because they don't see any reason to continue to pay daily admission costs.

Disney started selling alcohol everywhere in the parks. That is creating some loud guests. I cannot imagine paying the price for alcohol in the parks enough to get drunk, but you see it.
 
This is surprising because I see many pending and sold listings for Marriott and Vistana on Redweek. Maybe that will slowdown too. When/if housing gets affected, then we will know we are in a real downturn/recession.

I read a book about the development of Florida in the 1920s and how speculatoon there contributed greatly to the depression. Florida got slammed a few years before the depression. Many of the famous developers in Florida ended up dying with nothing. The author said housing is the true indicator of the economy more than the stock market. This is what happened in 2008.

Now housing is red hot but we are starting to see price reductions and homes staying for sale longer. Economists and others say the housing market may go down soon.

So let’s see how timeshares in general are affected. Based on what people are saying in this thread, perhaps DVC has other factors affecting the market for its timeshares.
 
I did a quick search the other day, looking to buy a small contract just for the perk of annual pass discount. I was surprised how much 50 points cost and quickly squashed that idea!
 
mdurette said:
I did a quick search the other day, looking to buy a small contract just for the perk of annual pass discount. I was surprised how much 50 points cost and quickly squashed that idea!
Click to expand...
Don't you have to purchase direct for the AP discount? Wouldn't you also have to own the minimum to be considered a qualifying member for that perk? I don't know what that number is these days. Or are AP discounts open to everyone?
 
mdurette said:
I did a quick search the other day, looking to buy a small contract just for the perk of annual pass discount. I was surprised how much 50 points cost and quickly squashed that idea!
Click to expand...
You will need to purchase 150 points direct to get blue card benefits. Or be grandfathered in.

No DVC AP discounts unless you had existing AP since covid.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:
frank808 said:
You will need to purchase 150 points direct to get blue card benefits. Or be grandfathered in.

No DVC AP discounts since covid.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
We kept our AP's through all of the shutdowns and renewed with the AP discount. But it was the Sorcerer's Pass, and it was $815 to renew. Not as many blackout dates as we had with our other passes. They are quite a savings, when you go to Disney World 9-12 weeks a year. We go four weeks starting 10/8.
 
dioxide45 said:
Don't you have to purchase direct for the AP discount? Wouldn't you also have to own the minimum to be considered a qualifying member for that perk? I don't know what that number is these days. Or are AP discounts open to everyone?
Click to expand...
DVC has been grandfathering anyone who qualified under "old" thresholds, including those who bought resale before there was any distinction.
 
bnoble said:
DVC has been grandfathering anyone who qualified under "old" thresholds, including those who bought resale before there was any distinction.
Click to expand...
True, but I was replying to @mdurette and I wouldn't think they fall into this category based on their post.
 
I don't think it has anything to do with the economy because those that can afford DIS aren't that effected by the downturn. If that were the case you'd see it across the board in the travel sector and you're not, in fact quite the opposite, activity and rental prices are at a premium, as is purchase price. Is DIS a leading indicator? Again I don't think so. In the last recession, at least in the high end space, business went on as usual and my rental business didn't miss a beat. It is likely something with the product.
 
Maybe those who paid $60 per point in 2010 are just selling at $120 per point today to take their profit. Could be that simple.
 
MOXJO7282 said:
I don't think it has anything to do with the economy because those that can afford DIS aren't that effected by the downturn. If that were the case you'd see it across the board in the travel sector and you're not, in fact quite the opposite, activity and rental prices are at a premium, as is purchase price. Is DIS a leading indicator? Again I don't think so. In the last recession, at least in the high end space, business went on as usual and my rental business didn't miss a beat. It is likely something with the product.
Click to expand...
Certainly during prior recessions there would have been an increase in rental supply potentially leading to depressed prices? Sure people that can afford DIS may not be affected, but there are a lot of people that finance or can barely afford that would be impacted and possibly want out. Based on finances, not everyone going to Disney should be going to Disney. In a downturn, there will always be fewer of those at the top of the market that they sell these products to. People with good paying jobs lose them too.
 
Quite a few of the DVC owners on my Facebook group are complaining about their inability to borrow points from their next year's use. They have limited borrowing to 50% of your year's allotment. If you have 100 points and need 170 for your reservation, you cannot use 70 points from next year to make that reservation. All kinds of complaints about it. Apparently, you can call and get an exception to that rule, but online has no such capability.

That is a "rule" Disney made that is not in keeping with the governing documents. It was supposedly due to Covid, but I see no reason for them to continue enforcing it. I would be bitter, if I was counting on using my points for next year. I do not worry about it, especially with exchanges so easy to get for most of the weeks we want to go.
 
We aren’t renewing our AP’s. Going to the Disney parks feels like a big chore with all the planning required. We also reduced our DVC points again. Down to just 125.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top