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First eBay Timeshare purchase out of a few that has become a problem

Egret1986

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I purchased a Kingston Cove timeshare, which closed and transferred last November. I purchased it because of the time of year and SPECIFICALLY the unit since I had stayed in this unit previously through an exchange and our family preferred the location of this unit as opposed to the others for several reasons. My first usage is the last week of August this year (fixed week, fixed unit). I received a reservation confirmation from the resort showing the correct week, but a different unit from the one I purchased from VIN (Vacation Innovations) on eBay. I called the resort to find out why I was being placed in a different unit from my ownership. I was told that was not the case, that I was being placed in the unit that I owned. I explained that I had the seller's description and the Sales Contract, the closing company's documents and a deed that all indicated that I was the owner of the unit. They indicated that the number of the unit that I thought that I bought was really the Lot No. and that the Lot Nos. and Unit Nos. are different. They told me that someone else owns the unit and week that I throught that I owned. I have been on the Beaufort County website and it shows the actual seller was the original owner from the 1980s and it shows the unit that I thought I bought was what the seller owned. I have contacted the eBay seller (because of the claim that if they do not provide clear title to what was described in the auction listing, then a reversal of the transaction will take place including closing costs). I also contacted the closing company, which is an affiliate of the seller or visa versa. The seller quickly responded and assured me that what he sold and what he described is what I bought. The closing company also makes promises of the reversal also if I do not receive what I bought. They have not responded to me yet. This resort has a very high maintenance fee and I was only willing to accept paying this fee knowing that each year I would be able to utilize this specific unit. What now? Are there any other Kingston Cove current or former owners that have any insight about this lot no. vs. unit no.? Any suggestions on what steps to take now? Anyone else experienced something like this? Thank you, anyone, for any input!
 

Talent312

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If the seller owned the unit that you thought you wanted and thought you bought, then either: (1) the legal desciption on the deed was wrong (lot vs. unit?); or (2) the management was mistaken. At this point, I'd recommend that you take your paperwork to a real estate attorney and ask him him or her who is at fault in this matter. For a fairly reasonable fee, he can write the appropriate demand and threat-to-sue letters.
 

Bill4728

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They indicated that the number of the unit that I thought that I bought was really the Lot No. and that the Lot Nos. and Unit Nos. are different. They told me that someone else owns the unit and week that I throught that I owned.

I have been on the Beaufort County website and it shows the actual seller was the original owner from the 1980s and it shows the unit that I thought I bought was what the seller owned.
How can both these statements be true??

Either you bought something different than you thought or the resort is wrong.

If the resort is wrong, why is this a problem for the seller?

How can the seller and county be wrong??
 

Egret1986

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How can both these statements be true??

Either you bought something different than you thought or the resort is wrong.

If the resort is wrong, why is this a problem for the seller?

How can the seller and county be wrong??

I agree. I'm just asking for opinions about what to do. Doesn't the closing company have any responsibility in this? I'm going to try to get to someone at the resort other than those in Accounting and Reservations, which is the only penetration I've been able to make in my contacts. Nowhere on the deed is there anything about the unit number that the resort states that I own. If I go the real estate attorney route, should I try to find someone in South Carolina as opposed to where I live?

Thank you!
 

Talent312

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I agree. I'm just asking for opinions about what to do. Doesn't the closing company have any responsibility in this? I'm going to try to get to someone at the resort other than those in Accounting and Reservations, which is the only penetration I've been able to make in my contacts. Nowhere on the deed is there anything about the unit number that the resort states that I own. If I go the real estate attorney route, should I try to find someone in South Carolina as opposed to where I live?

I'd first try to enlist someone at the closing company to help straighten this out. Perhaps all you need is a corrective deed or a phone call to the resorts records department. But if its not that simple, then have a face-to-face with a lawyer where you live. OTOH, if it looks like you're going to have to sue someone for a declaratory judgment or rescision, you'll need a lawyer in the state where the suit is filed.
 

Blondie

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Perhaps just one more call to the resort? Maybe the person you spoke to really did not know the correct info. Or, can you contact the original owner for clarification? Twice now (and once from this seller you used) I hve gotten all the paperwork with the previous owners info on it and it would have been easy to reach him/her. If you find you are correct it may help you decide how to handle this.
 

derb

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I have used this seller twice, one sale "sailed" right thru.

The second had a title problem that took 6 months to clear. Seller compensated me and I got the clear title.

Seller stood by his product and made good. I am happy with him.
 

Egret1986

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Thank you to all who have responded!

Last night I stayed up late researching for original owner and found his contact information. I left a message on his answering machine this morning just asking if he could verify the unit that he had owned all those years. I was out and he left a message that the unit I purchased was not the unit I now owned. Therefore, the resort was correct all along. Now, I have to see if VIN and Timeshare Closing Services are going to honor their written word that they will provide clear title to what is listed and what is on the sales contract or they will reverse the transaction and refund all funds including closing costs. I have also bought other timeshares before and since this purchase with no problems. I bought this one for the specific unit listed. If I can't have that, then I don't want it. I hope this works out without having to go through lawyers.
 

Carolinian

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To build a fire under these people, I suggest you file three complaints:

1) SC Real Estate Commission, which regulates timeshare sales.
2) SC Attorney General Consumer Protection Division
3) SC State Bar

If SC is like NC, and if memory serves it is, then the last one will have a lot of punch because it is a criminal offense for a non-attorney who is not a buyer or seller in the transaction to prepare a deed. It is calling practicing law without a license.

Also, name eBay in your complaint for facilitating this transaction with an unqualified deed preparer. If they lean on eBay, eBay will likely in turn lean on this postcard company and closing company.

If you had demanded that a local attorney prepare the deed instead of one of these typically incompetent out-of-state closing companies, you would not have had this problem.
 

chellej

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I own a resort in Colorado that is the same way - the legal description and the actual "door number" are 2 different things and can be very confusing. It may be more of a case of due diligince rather than a deed error.
 

Dave H

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Actually your memory is mostly correct. SC goes even further, you must be a SC attorney to prepare the deed, handle the closing documents AND DISBURSE the funds.

I believe the SC Attorney General would take care of the problem, he has no problem protecting the rights of SC attorneys.
 

bocamike

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At one point I owned a unit at Kingston Cove, it was deeded as "unit lot #25" the actual unit that I would have to occupy was unit 42. Not sure, but I believe somewhere along the way Kingston Cove changed there numbering system on the units. The lot unit # on the deed is not the unit # you occupy. Confusing, and I don't know why it is like this. You may want to speak with the management company maybe they can give you some answers.
Mike
 

Egret1986

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I thought I had done due diligence when I contacted the resort

I own a resort in Colorado that is the same way - the legal description and the actual "door number" are 2 different things and can be very confusing. It may be more of a case of due diligince rather than a deed error.

However, they did not give me a heads up that I should be aware that the unit numbers and the lot numbers were different. I only got the information that all fees had been paid to date. I guess I should have gotten the name of the actual owner from the Postcard company and I probably would have learned then that the unit for sale was not the unit I wanted. I have bought and sold a few timeshares over the years and never ran into this and I didn't even know this existed. I've never noticed this addressed here on TUG before that the legal description and the actual unit can be different. I know now. It's now obvious from your post that Kingston Cove is not unique in this area. How did you perform your due diligence to find out about the differing description and unit number at your Colorado resort?
 

Egret1986

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Thanks Carolinian and Dave H

I was aware that that in North Carolina and South Carolina that attorneys are supposed to handle the closings. I guess that because I have purchased a couple of timeshares in each of these states previously through the postcard companies on eBay and everything appeared to come out okay, I really didn't give it a second thought. Well, my lack of thoroughness has come back to bite me I suppose. Thank you very, very much for responding and providing this valuable information that I can utilize to possibly get this transaction reversed. THANKS!!!
 

Talent312

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At one point I owned a unit at Kingston Cove, it was deeded as "unit lot #25" the actual unit that I would have to occupy was unit 42. Not sure, but I believe somewhere along the way Kingston Cove changed there numbering system on the units. The lot unit # on the deed is not the unit # you occupy. Confusing, and I don't know why it is like this. You may want to speak with the management company maybe they can give you some answers.
Mike

In contracts for TS's, there's some identifying # on the paperwork, by how would anyone know if that # has anything to do with its # on the door? Sometimes, it can be fairly obvious. If the identifying # is something like "Sunshine Condos, Phase IV, Unit 353," you can expect the resort to number the TS something more user-friendly like, "4-753."

In the OP's case, it may not have been apparent. When we buy a house, we've usually go to see the actual house that's being sold and sometimes do a survey to confirm property lines, but who actually goes to see the unit they're buying?
 

chellej

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How did you perform your due diligence to find out about the differing description and unit number at your Colorado resort?

When I first purchased, I was concerned that the unit faced a certain direction (Mountain vs parking lot) From what I had learned about unit numbers I believed it did. I was just lucky that it didn't change from mountain to parking when I realized the deeded number was different than the door number. The second time I purchased, I knew to ask.


Is the unit you purchased really terrible?
 

Egret1986

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No, the unit number is not really terrible

It's just not the unit I wanted. I wouldn't have bid on this timeshare if I had known it wasn't the unit I was looking for. This is a very, very small resort with free-standing homes located in a residential cul-de-sac with full ownership homes. I just preferred the location of the unit I thought that I had purchased due to location on the lagoon, proximity to the pool, etc. However, if it boils down to spending additional money on lawyer's fees, I'll pass and keep this unit. I am hoping to resolve it with the postcard company and their closing company. Fortunately, the purchase price was extremely low. The maintenance fees are high though and I wanted what I thought I was getting to make it worthwhile paying the higher maintenance fees in order to guarantee my stay in that particular unit. Otherwise, I could use one of my lower (much lower) maintenance fee timeshares to exchange into the resort. I think folks need to be aware that this can happen and it's just another thing to be checked out when doing their due diligence. I had no idea and I 've bought and sold many timeshares over the last 20+ years. But I know now!:doh:
 

Talent312

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This reminds of a certain late arrival at a Hilton where they handed us keys for Room #10243 and told where the elevators were located. We went up to the 10th floor... no such number. Back at Reception, they said, "Oh, that room is on the 6th floor." Go figure.
 

Egret1986

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In contracts for TS's, there's some identifying # on the paperwork, by how would anyone know if that # has anything to do with its # on the door? Sometimes, it can be fairly obvious. If the identifying # is something like "Sunshine Condos, Phase IV, Unit 353," you can expect the resort to number the TS something more user-friendly like, "4-753."

In the OP's case, it may not have been apparent. When we buy a house, we've usually go to see the actual house that's being sold and sometimes do a survey to confirm property lines, but who actually goes to see the unit they're buying?


I have closely looked at the deed and nowhere on it is any number that reflects the unit number that was actually purchased. The only number indicated on the deed is the one that I thought I was purchasing. I've been told that is the lot number. I actually stayed in the unit I thought I bought and mistakenly thought I knew what I was buying. Wow, this is a new twist in how diligent you must be.
 

Talent312

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I have closely looked at the deed and nowhere on it is any number that reflects the unit number that was actually purchased. The only number indicated on the deed is the one that I thought I was purchasing. I've been told that is the lot number. I actually stayed in the unit I thought I bought and mistakenly thought I knew what I was buying. Wow, this is a new twist in how diligent you must be.

I recall something from college (umpteen years ago) that, if only one party to a contract makes a mistake of fact, the contract is still valid, but if both are mistaken, the contract is voidable -- something having to do with whether a cow was pregnant or not. Now, I dunno if this has anything to do with your situation, that's what we have judges for. You could claim that mutual mistakes were made and threaten to sue (whether or not you'd go thru with it).
 

pcgirl54

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Wow, I did not know that unit and lot can be different. Peter Wolf is a real estate Attorney in HHI and has a good reputation from the research we did. We used him and he found something in the deed no one else noticed.
 

Talent312

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Wow, I did not know that unit and lot can be different...

Let's say that you're driving thru a subdivision and you see a house that you'd like to buy. You notice that on the mailbox it says, "35 Cherry Blossom Lane." Later, when all is said and done, you look at your deed and it says, "Lot 35, Hillbilly Acres, per plat thereof..." When you go to what you think is your home, does it dawn on you only then that Lot 35 is nowhere near 35 River Road? OR, when you signed the contract, did you think, "Maybe I'd better look at that plat to see what I'm buying." (Food for thought)
 

richardm

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This actually isn't that unusual..

There are numerous resorts that have changed their unit designations over the years- and the original deeds no longer match up. This happens often when there are new phases, or a takeover by new managment or developement. Also, this is a common practice in condominium mgmt when a tragedy of some type occurs in a specific unit- by changing the designations you reduce the stigmata that may otherwise stain the ownership or rental of that villa!

Also, there are some deeds that show interval numbers that may not exactly match with the common timeshare calendar- but rather match with a resort specific calendar only. EJS Towers and Mariner House are examples of these.

Your sale agent and/or closing agent could have been able to provide you with a copy of the estoppels or property verification report from the developer that would have shown you the discrepency... (HINT, HINT.... Always ask for a copy from your closing agent to ensure you are getting what you intended to purchase!)
 

Egret1986

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I appreciate the feedback and wisdom

Your sale agent and/or closing agent could have been able to provide you with a copy of the estoppels or property verification report from the developer that would have shown you the discrepency... (HINT, HINT.... Always ask for a copy from your closing agent to ensure you are getting what you intended to purchase!)


So it should have been clear in the estoppel that there was a differentiation in the unit number and lot number? The sales agent's response from before the weekend and prior to my talking to the actual owner was that the unit number listed was the unit number I bought. Any future purchases, I will definitely know that I have to dig deeper, and since I am the buyer and paid for the Estoppel, then I am definitely entitled to that. Thanks!
 
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