Diamond Resorts-to-Sunterra conversion

[timeos2]

Trusts have been known to fail

Am I wrong? To join the club, you have to relinquish your deed, right?
This brings me to another question. How do you get out of the club if timesharing is no longer feasible for you? You can't sell it, because the club's rights don't transfer, and you relinquished your deed. Are you stuck with MF's until the end of time?

Those are the two big show stoppers for me as well. Maybe it really doesn't mean all that much in the big scheme of things - and boy, does scheme ever seem to fit the timeshare game - but I want a deed for a week at resort "X" no matter what points system I'm in. I paid little enough and have received enough value back that the non-transferability of my Club Sunterra (non-trust) to a new buyer doesn't bother me. I don't like that it can't transfer, and certainly the buyer, if they want to be in Club Sunterra, may feel the value of my week is diminished if they have to pay $2900 or more (almost 3 times what Club membership cost us) to rejoin. But I simply wouldn't market my week to that buyer but rather one that values the use at a top resort, 100% float time with split week privileges on its own without the need for Club Sunterra. I don't think it's hurting my resale value as much as it is likely to cost Club Sunterra a member through this short sighted policy.

But now we have the "new" Club Sunterra - trust based. Sorry, but I am not going to give up my deed to pay more to buy into a multi-resort trust that makes any future resale possibilities very murky. Plus I'm now just one annual payment missed away from losing my whole purchase. No foreclosure process as there would be with a deed to protect me anymore. You wonder why developers love trust based systems? And there is that loss of voting rights already mentioned as well as the Club overhead on top of the "blended" fees that make it very hard to believe fees can stay low for very long. Every resort I know of has rising budgets so how can the blended rate plus management overhead be lower? Finally there is no guarantee that the trust will be properly operated and survive forever - poor management can do in any system.

Regardless if it's Sunterra, Fairfield, RCI Points or any other points system we have a deed to the underlying property that generates the point value. It may be a small amount of control but it is a comfort that we won't relinquish to any points system.

 

[fnewman]

While you may have to give up your deed to purchase into the 'trust' you certainly don't to join Club Sunterra outside the trust - at least I never have had to give mine up. So, if and when I wanted to leave the 'club' I should be able to to do so for any or all of my weeks just by notifying them of that decision.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

Okay, so why would a person convert to the trust? Why not simply go the affiliation route and keep the deed? What am I missing here?

In most cases going the affiliation route is best - that's what we did.

Most people will buy the Trust because that is what Sunterra mostly sells. If a person doesn't raise an objection to giving up their deed during the sales presentation, Sunterra doesn't let them know that retaining the deed is an option.

Also, a person who owns at resort that has high maintenance fees will pay less annual fee after conversion - that's because there annual fee becomes a blend of all of the units owned by the trust.

But for us keeping our week out of the Trust was a no-brainer. If the trust went sour we wanted to be able to terminate and revert to a deeded ownership.

 

[barndweller]

We are new members of Club Sunterra. We had no intention of joining the points bandwagon before attending the "owner's update" during a stay at Sedona Summit on an II exchange. We own 5 weeks of timeshare that are located at Sunterra resorts that we purchased resale for cheap. Two of those weeks are in studios & we have to work at getting a larger unit on an II exchange or pay an upgrade fee at the independents. Another 2 are 2 bedroom lock-offs that are every other year ownerships. We can get 2 weeks out of each of those but again we end up with studios to try to exchange into larger if possible and of course they are staggered usage. We were able to affiliate all 5 of those weeks into a Club Sunterra membership by purchasing a 3000 point Trust ownership, the $2900 each fee was waived & we retained our deeds. Now we have 30,500 points every year to use for any size units anywhere within Sunterra for no exchange fee & larger units with II exchanges. If we find it doesn't work well for us, we can pull any of our deeded units out of the system. If the whole shabang goes belly up, all we are stuck holding is the 3000 Trust points we purchased so it was a good way for us to go the points route & still have deeds to resorts we love.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

… Two of those weeks are in studios & we have to work at getting a larger unit on an II exchange or pay an upgrade fee at the independents. Another 2 are 2 bedroom lock-offs that are every other year ownerships. We can get 2 weeks out of each of those but again we end up with studios to try to exchange into larger if possible and of course they are staggered usage. …

Julie -

As I've looked at things, it seems to me that you likely get enough SunOptions from those studios to use them to exchange for a peak season 2-bdrm unit through II. Further, Sunterra gets preferential treatment from II in making exchanges - supposedly Sunterra should be able to pull any available 2-bedroom unit in the II system.

I haven't tried that, but I believe other TUGgers have. That makes those Sunterra studios with Club affiliation some of the most cost effective traders/raiders around.

 

[barndweller]

Steve
That is really what sold us on the Club. We found our studio units were restricted with II trades to other studios. That's okay for us most of the time but it seems to restrict what we can see even during flex time. Being able to combine the point value & opt for larger units was a big selling point for us. The other great thing is being able to book 2+ days and not be restricted to a 7 day reservation. We have already booked 2 seperate 2 day stays to link with other trips this year. I'll have a better feel for the system when I get all my points next year, but from what I see available on-line, it will be much more flexable for us than using our individual studio weeks for exchanges.

In addition, we have the Sunterra Select option on 2 of our other resorts for an additional 1600 points if we choose. I love the member pricing on those!

 

[pedro47]

Barndweller, I think you will also like exchanging with II & Club Sunterra now because it will opening more resorts to exhange into.

 

[timeos2]

It makes the case for points - again

Steve
That is really what sold us on the Club. We found our studio units were restricted with II trades to other studios. That's okay for us most of the time but it seems to restrict what we can see even during flex time. Being able to combine the point value & opt for larger units was a big selling point for us. The other great thing is being able to book 2+ days and not be restricted to a 7 day reservation. We have already booked 2 seperate 2 day stays to link with other trips this year. I'll have a better feel for the system when I get all my points next year, but from what I see available on-line, it will be much more flexable for us than using our individual studio weeks for exchanges.

In addition, we have the Sunterra Select option on 2 of our other resorts for an additional 1600 points if we choose. I love the member pricing on those!

You are describing the superior method of trade that almost every points system offers over the week for week model. The ability to split up, combine and every other combination you can dream up for your points used to get more time, bigger units, off season or smaller units to stretch time - all under your control is why people who have actually tried points usually prefer points.

Club Sunterra effectively makes II a point system - and a pretty good one at that. On top of some excellent resorts that Sunterra offers for internal use. If the price is right to get in it is one way to make your weeks ownership much more user friendly.

 

[barndweller]

Well, I probably paid too much for those 3000 points but it sounded good at the time. I just hope I don't regret it down the road. The new ownership weighs on my mind a bit. Only time will tell.

 

[AwayWeGo]

What Oft Was Thought But Ne'er So Well Expressed.

Those are the two big show stoppers for me as well. Maybe it really doesn't mean all that much in the big scheme of things - and boy, does scheme ever seem to fit the timeshare game - but I want a deed for a week at resort "X" no matter what points system I'm in. I paid little enough and have received enough value back that the non-transferability of my Club Sunterra (non-trust) to a new buyer doesn't bother me. I don't like that it can't transfer, and certainly the buyer, if they want to be in Club Sunterra, may feel the value of my week is diminished if they have to pay $2900 or more (almost 3 times what Club membership cost us) to rejoin. But I simply wouldn't market my week to that buyer but rather one that values the use at a top resort, 100% float time with split week privileges on its own without the need for Club Sunterra. I don't think it's hurting my resale value as much as it is likely to cost Club Sunterra a member through this short sighted policy.

But now we have the "new" Club Sunterra - trust based. Sorry, but I am not going to give up my deed to pay more to buy into a multi-resort trust that makes any future resale possibilities very murky. Plus I'm now just one annual payment missed away from losing my whole purchase. No foreclosure process as there would be with a deed to protect me anymore. You wonder why developers love trust based systems? And there is that loss of voting rights already mentioned as well as the Club overhead on top of the "blended" fees that make it very hard to believe fees can stay low for very long. Every resort I know of has rising budgets so how can the blended rate plus management overhead be lower? Finally there is no guarantee that the trust will be properly operated and survive forever - poor management can do in any system.

Regardless if it's Sunterra, Fairfield, RCI Points or any other points system we have a deed to the underlying property that generates the point value. It may be a small amount of control but it is a comfort that we won't relinquish to any points system.

That pretty much sums up why I have a generally sour outlook toward SunTerra. Sure, it's a nifty business plan -- so shrewd it might even make me want to buy stock in the company. But no way I'd want to buy any timeshare that cannot be resold, not from SunTerra, not from any timeshare company.

Hats off to all those folks, way smarter than me, who figured out ways they can work the SunTerra system. I just don't want to buy whatever it is that SunTerra is selling.

I mean, shucks, with all I'm asked to pay, exactly what do I own if -- after the dust settles -- I'm left with nothing I can sell?

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

I mean, shucks, with all I'm asked to pay, exactly what do I own if -- after the dust settles -- I'm left with nothing I can sell?

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

I guess that you didn't read all of the thread then Alan. I know that after the dust settles, the minimum I have to sell is the same deeded 2-bedroom unit I bought resale back in 1999.

***********

shucks, with all I'm asked to pay, exactly what do I own if -- after the dust settles -- I'm left with nothing I can sell? ​

If that's truly your attitude, Alan, why do you buy cars? Somehow, despite how much I pay for a car initially and after paying regularly for gas, insurance, upkeep, etc., the car always loses a lot more value than a good resale timeshare. I don't think your experience is different?

 

[AwayWeGo]

Something Beats Nothing.

I know that after the dust settles, the minimum I have to sell is the same deeded 2-bedroom unit I bought resale back in 1999.

Even if you hand over your 1999 2BR deed, plus a bunch of money to join the club, then when the dust settles & you quit the club, SunTerra gives you back your timeshare deed that you turned over? That was not the understanding I got from the most recent SunTerra "owner update" stealth sales pitches I've been on (not that there's anything wrong with those -- shrewd biz plan & all that). Maybe I wasn't paying close enough attention, because the only plan I heard them mention involved paying them a bunch of money plus handing over the deed to the SunTerra timeshare we already owned -- a nonstarter for The Chief Of Staff & me any way they shake it.

Alan, why do you buy cars?

Actually, that is why I buy cars (used, naturally -- near new, but used all the same) instead of leasing cars. When the dust settles & I've piled on the miles & grown tired of the old heap, I still have title to the old clunker -- meaning I can sell it for whatever it will bring, even if that's not much.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

Even if you hand over your 1999 2BR deed, plus a bunch of money to join the club, then when the dust settles & you quit the club, SunTerra gives you back your timeshare deed that you turned over?

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

Alan - go back to my post #49 in this thread.

This issue gets discussed frequently - probably twice a month here or at TS4Ms,whenever someone posts asking for advice about buying into Sunterra or converting.

 

[AwayWeGo]

I'm All Tuned In But Still Not Getting Any Clearer Picture.

Alan - go back to my post #49 in this thread.

Going back to #49 doesn't do it, but in #41 it's right there in black & white...

When the affiliation is terminated, what remains is the underlying ownership - a deed if the property is still deeded or a trust UDI if the property was convereted (or the original purchase was a trust UDI).

If the original purchase was trust UDI, it is completely unclear -- here & at those "owner update" stealth timeshare sales pitches -- how the no-longer-affiliated owner has any means to use that trust UDI, no longer being in the club (because the affiliation is terminated, putting it their way). Plus, I still saw nothing about getting back my handed-over deed(s) when the affiliation is terminated. Also, as mentioned in #62, those "owner update" sales reps have never mentioned to us any option other than (a) handing over our deed(s) and (b) paying SunTerra a bunch of money -- a double deal breaker for us. We'll listen harder & pay closer attention next time -- if there is a next time.

Based on what I have been able to comprehend here at TUG-BBS, some timeshare mini-systems (e.g., FairField) hard-sell their sizzle (VIP status, etc.) while still allowing resales of the actual steak (deeded ownership that works with their internal FairField timeshare points system). Apparently the shrewdness of SunTerra boils down to their business plan of No Steak Without Buying The Sizzle. I guess it works for SunTerra, so more power to them.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[dougp26364]

Going back to #49 doesn't do it, but in #41 it's right there in black & white...



If the original purchase was trust UDI, it is completely unclear -- here & at those "owner update" stealth timeshare sales pitches -- how the no-longer-affiliated owner has any means to use that trust UDI, no longer being in the club (because the affiliation is terminated, putting it their way). Plus, I still saw nothing about getting back my handed-over deed(s) when the affiliation is terminated. Also, as mentioned in #62, those "owner update" sales reps have never mentioned to us any option other than (a) handing over our deed(s) and (b) paying SunTerra a bunch of money -- a double deal breaker for us. We'll listen harder & pay closer attention next time -- if there is a next time.

Based on what I have been able to comprehend here at TUG-BBS, some timeshare mini-systems (e.g., FairField) hard-sell their sizzle (VIP status, etc.) while still allowing resales of the actual steak (deeded ownership that works with their internal FairField timeshare points system). Apparently the shrewdness of SunTerra boils down to their business plan of No Steak Without Buying The Sizzle. I guess it works for SunTerra, so more power to them.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

But this discussion has been about converting to SunOptions (points program but keep the deed) and not the trust. I think this thread has leaned in favor of joining the points program but not the trust. The only angel that's been discussed as a reason for joining the trust would be if you were in a high MF resort and wanted to lower your MF's by joining the trust and, with the cumulitive MF's of all resorts in the trust thus lower your yearly MF. Otherwise everyone seems to prefer to join SunOptions (points program, not the trust) and keep their deed.

 

[dougp26364]

another question

Steve,

You're situation with the marriage of a child gave me thought of a similar situation I face, the marriage of our daughter and giving them their honeymoon as a wedding gift. In discussing this yesterday she and her intended have desires to go where exchanges might be difficult.

I was contimplating paying my 2008 MF's with Villa's Polo Towers in order to reserve and start searching for possible exchanges. I can't do much with my Suites at Polo Towers because it's a week 36 and PT's won't allow me to reserve that week until 12 months out. Therefore I can't reserve it now, deposit it into I.I. and begin my search until the first week of Sept.

So my question is, with Club Sunterra, in order to make reservations through the club or exchange through I.I. for 2008, would 2008 MF's have to be paid ahead of time or are they like HGVC where I can make my 2008 reservation now and pay my MF's and club membership fee's when they're due at the end of the year?

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

If the original purchase was trust UDI, it is completely unclear -- here & at those "owner update" stealth timeshare sales pitches -- how the no-longer-affiliated owner has any means to use that trust UDI, no longer being in the club (because the affiliation is terminated, putting it their way). Plus, I still saw nothing about getting back my handed-over deed(s) when the affiliation is terminated. Also, as mentioned in #62, those "owner update" sales reps have never mentioned to us any option other than (a) handing over our deed(s) and (b) paying SunTerra a bunch of money -- a double deal breaker for us. We'll listen harder & pay closer attention next time -- if there is a next time.
[/FONT]

I think that you are thinking Club Sunterra = Sunterra Trust. That's not correct. Stop thinking that - it's not true and it only confuses things.

Club Sunterra is an added benefit provided to owners of Sunterra resorts who elect to join (paying the gatekeeper fee to do so, of course). You can't get into Club Sunterra unless you have an ownership interest in a resort. When you give up your Sunterra ownership interest, you give up your Club membership at the same time.

Trust is simply another form of Sunterra ownership. Instead of having a deed, you have an ownership interest in a trust that holds deeds to multiple resorts.

Note that there is no overarching Sunterra trust that holds deeds to all Sunterra resorts. The only way to get direct access to all Sunterra resorts is through Club Sunterra.

As I mention above, Club Sunterra is an added benefit for Sunterra owners. Joining the Club does not involve giving up ownership to anything (but the gatekeeper requires that you purchase additional ownership of something from Sunterra as part of the price of admission).

But anything that you own remains in your ownership, totally independent of Club Sunterra. If you converted anything to a trust UDI (or bought a UDI) as a part of the process of joining, you continue to own that UDI. If you have a deed that you didn't convert, you continue to own that deed.

****

Note that affiliation versus conversion applies only to deeded ownerships. Conversion means putting your deed into a trust - if your ownership is already in a trust all you can do is affiliate that trust ownership.

******

Since no one gave up ownership of anything to join Club Sunterra, if Club goes kaflooey each members underlying ownership remains intact.

If a trust goes kaflooey, only those people who own that trust are affected. Deeded owners at other resort and owners in other trusts are not affected.

****

In my experience, during the sales pitch conversion is the only process they describe for joining the club. "Interested in joining? Give us your deed and convert it points and combine it with the added points you are buying. Now you'll be a member of Club Sunterra with that number of SunOptions."

They don't tell you what is going on beneath that simplistic explanation unless the prospect starts asking questions. No need to make things more confusing than necessary.

But it's actually a two-step process. What's actually going on is two distinct steps. The first step involves establishing and redefining what the members ownership interest is. Then once that ownership interest is defined, that interest is then affiliated with Club Sunterra.

***

As mentioned, Sunterra wants owners in the Trust, so that is what they are most interested in selling. They don't tell you about other options unless you scratch beneath the service.

In fact, it's not necessary to put anything in a trust as part of the gatekeeper price. If the resort is deeded and Sunterra is selling deeds, the added purchase you make as part of the price of admission can be another deeded week. That was an option for us when we joined the Club, but we weren't interested in adding that many SunOPtions.

 

[barndweller]

Doug
We just sat through the Owner Update Stealth Sales Pitch in May & tried to ask every possible question like the good TUGGERs that we are. Here's the deal as best we could understand: You can book within the internal Sunterra system using Sunoptions (another word for points) up to 13 month in advance for home resorts only. That would be any resorts for which you have a deed or other form of ownership (such as the Florida or Hawaiian Trust.) At other resorts within the Sunterra system you can book at 10 months. I'm not sure about II exchanges since my account is not set up yet. You are allowed to borrow Sunoptions from next year to book something. Yes, fees for your Club Sunterra account must be paid for next year IF you will be using Sunoptions from that year. I assume you would need to pay your MFs on any deeded/affiliated resorts in order to use those points as well. I'm not even sure that you can borrow any of those affiliated resort points. Maybe Steve or Spence know the answer. Sunoptions are credited to your account every year on Jan 1st. You can bank them into the next year to save them for use later but you must do that by a specific set of deadlines or you will loose them. You can only bank forward for 1 year to save each years points.

The system can be complicated to use to full advantage. I still have a lot to learn about the nuances.

For honeymoon plans the Sunterra Select options might serve your needs. https://www.sunterraselect.com/index. Click on search & check out what sort of stuff is available. Those are non-Sunterra resorts that some members are allowed to convert to points each year if they choose to do so to gain additional points. They are available for booking with Sunoptions or for really bargain rental rates to Club Sunterra members. The list is available to the general public but the rental rates are much higher.

 

[bruwery]

Steve,

Thanks for your patience and diligence in explaining all of this.

So, IF I understand this (a stretch),
AND IF
I actually agree to sit through an "owner's update" (a bigger stretch),
AND IF
I actually want to buy into Sunterra (a REALLY BIG stretch),
my offer would essentially boil down to "Points sounds great, but you can't have my deed. Figure out how to complete the sale, Mr. Top Salesman".

 

[AwayWeGo]

Ditto.

Steve,

Thanks for your patience and diligence in explaining all of this.

Amen to that.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

Steve,

Thanks for your patience and diligence in explaining all of this.

So, IF I understand this (a stretch),
AND IF
I actually agree to sit through an "owner's update" (a bigger stretch),
AND IF
I actually want to buy into Sunterra (a REALLY BIG stretch),
my offer would essentially boil down to "Points sounds great, but you can't have my deed. Figure out how to complete the sale, Mr. Top Salesman".

And he should say,

"No problem. Keep your deed and we'll just affiliate your deed with Club Sunterra. You'll get the same number of points, and you'll keep your same home resort advantage (but you won't be able to reserve at your resort 13 months ahead of check-in as you could if you converted your deed to the trust).

But you still have to buy something from us to go with your deeded ownership for you to be able to join Club Sunterra. So what will it be? We have this nice selection of deeded weeks which we can sell you, or if you would rather purchase a specific number of SunOptions we can put you into a trust UDI that provides that number of points.

BTW - you can still use your trust based SunOptions for that 13-month reservation window if that's important to you."​

And your reply, if you're interested, should be something such as,

Ok - but tell you what. Since we're rolling all of these properties into the Club, why don't you also give me a one-year window in which any additional Sunterra units I purchase can be added to Club Sunterra without paying any additional fee? Do that and you've got yourself a deal.​

Call that the "Spence Gambit" if you like.

If they accept, you go on a Sunterra buying spree, scooping up 10k SunOption studios and 1-bdrms at low annual fee Sunterra sites and stuffing them into your portfolio. Pretty soon you reach elite status and you've got a bunch of SunOptions acquired for cheap.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

Steve,

Thanks for your patience and diligence in explaining all of this..

Believe me - it took me awhile to get this straightened out in my head - and I didn't really learn it until we actually went through a sale and I dissected exactly what was being offered and what my options were.

There isn't anything there that Spence hadn't already posted and I read. But I couldn't really wrap my arms around it until I actually pieced it together with a concrete example.

The keys for me were grasping that:

• Club Sunterra is not the same as the Trust,
• it doesn't make any difference to the Club whether the member owns a deed or a UDI. All the Club cares about is the member's reservation rights within Sunterra.
• the Club never takes possession of anything a member owns so when you go to sell all that happens is that the affiliation between the Club and the member is dissolved. Everything else the owner has the owner retains.

****

Be aware that purchasing small UDI units can make the UDI hard to sell. We bought 2500 SunOptions in the Sunterra Hawai'i trust. That has little value outside Club Sunterra, since 2500 SunOptions won't really allow you to reserve anything at either of the Hawai'i properties. Hence that piddly UDI is pretty much worthless as a resale to anyone other than another Sunterra Hawai'i trust owner.

 

[dougp26364]

The II account through club is a "corporate" account - you cannot use it with other resorts. At first I thought it was a problem but, like the others above, I now realize the heavy priority that these corporate memberships get vs the standard week owner makes II a different system. It's unbelievable. I'd never use II as a mere member again. It was an unexpected but very pleasant bonus to the Club Sunterra membership.

The cost per year is the annual fee ($150) but getting your time into Club will cost some $$$.

I finally have my DRI/Sunterra corporate account set up and can search I.I. using both my corporate account AND the two bedroom Villa's at Polo Towers unit I have on deposit.

I wanted to see first hand the value of the corporate account vs my Villa's at Polo Towers value in my personal account. I have to report that the results of corporate vs personal are, at best, mixed.

In that the corporate account using the Sun Options points given me for my Villa's and/or Suites at Polo Towers will actually pull more and/or better resorts, that is not a true statement. My Villa's at Polo Towers deposit in my personal account see's the same resorts as my corporate DRI/Sunterra points account. I find no upgrades or better resorts with my corporate account vs my personal account. This finding has been dissapointing to me.

On the other hand, the spending of my Sun Options points is a considerably more efficient usage of my Polo Towers units. Since I am only charged a point value, 6,500 points for most 2 bedroom exchanges, I can get more out of my weeks. As an example Westin Kierland rarely shows a 2 bedroom unit available (I've yet to see one doing an online search) so I exchanged my 2 bedroom Suites week (12,000 points) for a 1 bedroom Westing Kierland. If I had used my points account I could have received the same week for 6,500 Sun Options and had 5,500 points left over.

Now, I probably could have locked off my Suites week and used the 1 bedroom to pull the Westin unit. That would have left me a studio unit to exchange through I.I. While I could exchange a studio unit for a 1 bedroom unit (have done it before), it's easier to spend points to find a 1 bedroom unit.

One other major advantage, at least for us, is the discounted points required for Flexchange exchanges. We travel to Branson, MO in the spring and fall. There's generally availability somewhere if we're not to picky and there are very few Branson resorts that aren't very nice or not five star rated. So rather than use a full value exchange, I can most likely request time off at work and wait for the Flexchange period. Then All I have to do is match up my time off with whatever resort is available. For over/well developed area's this doesn't appear to be a problem.

Likewise with Las Vegas. I see a lot of availabilty on Flexchange if I'm not particular. We have a charter airline, Allegiant Airlines, that often has inexpensive flights to Vegas. Left over points from other exchanges can be used to easily flexchange for an extra vacation or long weekend trip to Vegas. For us this works as we're familiar with most of the Vegas resorts and I find acceptable resorts pretty easily right now. October/November is one of our favorite times in Vegas as the weather is reasonably mild.

I'm assuming other such desinations will be available from time to time. Since we enjoy traveling in off season, I'm certain we'll find others that fit our needs. There are some Colorado resorts that might work for a long weekend trip and maybe even down to Texas and New Mexico.

I'll enjoy the flexibility offered by the corporate Sunterra account. That is a big plus and you could classify that as amazing. However, the thought that the corporate account would see more and/or better resorts online seems to be an illusion. At least for Polo Towers owners. Perhaps if we had owned a lessor resort in an less desirable location or, perhaps if Vegas continues to add timeshare rooms until it exceedes a saturation point to were Vegas resorts just can't pull quality resorts things would be different. But for now, I'd say the results for me have been mixed.

 

[winger]

Doug. I wonder how a head-to-head comparison would end up if you were to place ongoing requests with both...

 

[dougp26364]

Doug. I wonder how a head-to-head comparison would end up if you were to place ongoing requests with both...

Which is a good question. What's seen online is mostly left overs not already taken by ongoing searches. Unfortunately, I don't want to do a head to head comparison with my current ongoing request for my Villa's unit. I'm pretty much convinced I can obtain the Key West week I've asked for as it's about the lowest weeks on the demand index. For 2007 I could have grabbed the weeks I'm asking for in 2008 online without difficulty.

While I'm not seeing anything with the Sunterra points that I don't see with my Villa's at Polo Towers week, I still like the flexibility of the points and how I can fractionalize my Polo Towers units to get a larger number of exchanges out of them. Depending on how I manage my points it's easy to see how I can get between 4 and 8 two bedroom units with the same units I was getting between 2 and 4 weeks exchange but having to settle for smaller units or not be as particular.

In the end it will be a more efficient usage of my ownership at Polo Towers than what I've had before. This is something I had sort of calculated when I looked at the usage/exchanges I've made since originally purchasing the units. I calculated that since 1998 I had left somewhere in the neighborhood of 30,000 points on the table. If nothing else that would have paid one years MF's on both units or purchased 4 round trip tickets on AA's. Not that those are efficient uses for the points but, I didn't even get the inefficient usage out of the points if they had been available to me since my original purchase.