Current state of retro'ing and enrollment

[ljmiii]

What is the current state of retro'ing Vistana (and enrolling MVC) resale weeks? I have two voluntary EOY Vistana weeks (and one EOY MVC week) I purchased resale and was wondering what if anything buying direct could do for me. In particular, are retro'd Vistana weeks still eligible to be converted to Abound points or has that time passed. And can they both retro and enroll if I buy direct at a Vistana resort. TIA.

 

[Eric B]

They were still doing them for Vistana when I was at WSJ in December. No change to the thresholds $10K for 1 week plus $5K for each additional one. You would need to spend $15K for your 2 Vistana weeks even though they are EOY. They would be enrolled in Abound once authorized. They won’t be able to do anything for the MVC one.

 

[dioxide45]

What is the current state of retro'ing Vistana (and enrolling MVC) resale weeks? I have two voluntary EOY Vistana weeks (and one EOY MVC week) I purchased resale and was wondering what if anything buying direct could do for me. In particular, are retro'd Vistana weeks still eligible to be converted to Abound points or has that time passed. And can they both retro and enroll if I buy direct at a Vistana resort. TIA.

Once the weeks are retro's they are fully part of VSN and Abound. Eric's response is still my understanding as well. I beleive it will require the purchase of Vistana VOIs direct. Which is likely to be Sheraton Flex, Westin Flex or Westin Aventuras. I have seen a few scattered reports of people getting Marriott weeks enrolled or buying Club Points instead. I don't think that is something they regularly do. Buying Club Points though would likely require purchasing at a much higher dollar amount (3,500 Club Points) in order to qualify unenrolled weeks.

I would find it hard to justify re-qualifying every other years weeks, but that is only something you can determine if it is worth the price.

 

[ljmiii]

@Eric B and @dioxide45 Thank you both. I don't attend sales presentations anymore unless there is a chance I'll buy something (which once upon a time I did do to enroll a few MVC weeks).

And so I'm trying to decide if it is worth it to torture myself and the sales rep for a slim chance. Last year they were still selling weeks at WSJ and I *might* be willing to buy another EOY week at WSJ (or maybe EY fixed week) direct to retro/enroll...but I have no interest in flex points. Particularly since they're only offering 20K Bonvoy points. Ah well.

 

[ocdb8r]

I have seen a few scattered reports of people getting Marriott weeks enrolled or buying Club Points instead. I don't think that is something they regularly do. Buying Club Points though would likely require purchasing at a much higher dollar amount (3,500 Club Points) in order to qualify unenrolled weeks.

I know the sales offices at both Aruba and Spain are both well versed in selling an MVC week in order to retro Vistana (or a combo of MVC and Vistana) weeks. Not sure about in the US, but I don't think MVC "weeks" are for sale anywhere in the US in any case. I'm not sure about St. Kitts (which is the only other place I can think of that's still selling weeks).

 

[dioxide45]

I know the sales offices at both Aruba and Spain are both well versed in selling an MVC week in order to retro Vistana (or a combo of MVC and Vistana) weeks. Not sure about in the US, but I don't think MVC "weeks" are for sale anywhere in the US in any case. I'm not sure about St. Kitts (which is the only other place I can think of that's still selling weeks).

I don't think St Kitts has a sales office anymore. Perhaps they do but I thought they were not just selling the St Kitts weeks out of Aruba now. So the Aruba office is likely to push a St Kitts week as part of the retro deal. I think the only issue with buying Marriott to retro anything (Vistana or Marriott weeks) is that it is quite a bit more expensive than retroing through Vistana with the $10K/$5K.

 

[gregsrau]

Thanks for the great info, everyone! Does anyone know of a location in the western U.S. (preferably in Colorado) where I can purchase Vistana VOIs directly from MVC to retro some existing VOI contracts (Sheraton Flex points) that I bought on the secondary market? I'm guessing this is possible at any Marriott, Westin, or Sheraton VC resort with a sales center. We might be going to the Sheraton Steamboat Resort Villas in a couple weeks, but we've never been there before, so I don't know if they still do the sales pitch there.

 

[sponger76]

Thanks for the great info, everyone! Does anyone know of a location in the western U.S. (preferably in Colorado) where I can purchase Vistana VOIs directly from MVC to retro some existing VOI contracts (Sheraton Flex points) that I bought on the secondary market? I'm guessing this is possible at any Marriott, Westin, or Sheraton VC resort with a sales center. We might be going to the Sheraton Steamboat Resort Villas in a couple weeks, but we've never been there before, so I don't know if they still do the sales pitch there.

Sheraton Steamboat definitely still has a sales office. So does the Westin Riverfront in Avon. With that being said, some Sheraton and Westin properties only sell MVC Abound points now, and none of the Marriott resorts will sell Sheraton or Westin Flex VOIs. Also, Sheraton and Westin properties won't sell the other brand's VOIs, and Westin is more expensive in both retail and MFs cost, so you may want to stick to sales at a Sheraton that's not only selling Abound.

 

[Henry M.]

I was at the Westin Riverfront in Avon, CO, last Memorial Day week and they have a nice sales office there. I didn't attend any presentation so I don't have any details of what they are selling. Nice property.

 

[jabberwocky]

Westin Kierland may have some actual weeks in inventory that they could sell for retro purposes.

It may also be possible to buy the Flex products remotely without having to be on site. That’s how we did our retro several years ago.

 

[sponger76]

Westin Kierland may have some actual weeks in inventory that they could sell for retro purposes.

I'm surprised they would have developer weeks. I thought all unsold U,S Vistana, resort inventory was transferred into the Flex trusts when they were created.

 

[dioxide45]

I'm surprised they would have developer weeks. I thought all unsold U,S Vistana, resort inventory was transferred into the Flex trusts when they were created.

I think they have some reacquired weeks to sell. We were offered some at a presentation last summer. Even Gold Plus season. The Plat+ 2BR sell for big bucks. Probably sell for more as developer weeks than the equivalent number of HomeOptions. I don't think they are even adding newly reacquired weeks to Flex anymore. The only exception being Vistana Beach Club still being conveyed to Sheraton Flex.

 

[jabberwocky]

I'm surprised they would have developer weeks. I thought all unsold U,S Vistana, resort inventory was transferred into the Flex trusts when they were created.

Like @dioxide45 they had a selection of weeks that I was offered at my last update. They likely held them back since they can sell the for more as a week than as points. I’m not sure how it would relate to Abound points and whether they would buy the weeks for the trust - but I suspect it’s the same.

There isn’t ROFR at WKV - so I’m not sure what their best source of inventory would be.

 

[BuckeyeAndy]

Like @dioxide45 they had a selection of weeks that I was offered at my last update. They likely held them back since they can sell the for more as a week than as points. I’m not sure how it would relate to Abound points and whether they would buy the weeks for the trust - but I suspect it’s the same.

There isn’t ROFR at WKV - so I’m not sure what their best source of inventory would be.

Great to know this. We are heading to WKV in April and are considering to retro/requalify a couple EOY weeks that we recently purchased if there would be a chance to buy a Platinum + deeded week at WKV (which would be more attractive than Flex points or Abound points). Is there any chance you took notes on the different types of WKV units they had available and what they were selling them for at that time?

 

[dioxide45]

Great to know this. We are heading to WKV in April and are considering to retro/requalify a couple EOY weeks that we recently purchased if there would be a chance to buy a Platinum + deeded week at WKV (which would be more attractive than Flex points or Abound points). Is there any chance you took notes on the different types of WKV units they had available and what they were selling them for at that time?

I don't have notes, but I think the better Platinum weeks go fast. I recall we were pushed a Premium 1BR Gold Plus. Not really something we would want to own. I thought I might have a photo, but it doesn't look like it. I can see some of their scribbles with prices in the $14K-$15K range. I would suspect their 148.1K 2BR Plat+ to be closer to $70K. If they have them.

 

[jabberwocky]

Great to know this. We are heading to WKV in April and are considering to retro/requalify a couple EOY weeks that we recently purchased if there would be a chance to buy a Platinum + deeded week at WKV (which would be more attractive than Flex points or Abound points). Is there any chance you took notes on the different types of WKV units they had available and what they were selling them for at that time?

They had a pretty good range. Plat+ for both 2BR and the the 1BR (both varieties). They had some gold weeks as well.

In terms of pricing I didn’t take a picture (the sales guy had it on a spreadsheet on his screen). I remember it was pretty high relative to resale. You’d be losing money on the deal since the resale value would be much less; however, your MF would be less than Flex.

 

[BA21]

Great to know this. We are heading to WKV in April and are considering to retro/requalify a couple EOY weeks that we recently purchased if there would be a chance to buy a Platinum + deeded week at WKV (which would be more attractive than Flex points or Abound points). Is there any chance you took notes on the different types of WKV units they had available and what they were selling them for at that time?

Be prepared for some sticker shock. I was at a presentation 2 years ago at WKV and they were listing $92,000 for the 2 bedroom platinum +

 

[DavidnRobin]

WKV P+ (resale, pre-Aug'22) was one of best timeshare deals.

Not sure I would bother buying anymore WKV (P+ or otherwise) from MVC even with a requal - especially if your ownership was pre-Aug'22.

 

[BuckeyeAndy]

Be prepared for some sticker shock. I was at a presentation 2 years ago at WKV and they were listing $92,000 for the 2 bedroom platinum +

Thanks for the insights and to be ready to expect high prices for the Platinum plus weeks! We may have to eventually resort to Flex points to lower the Requalify cost but will share any interesting options should they come up in April.

 

[jbman]

This might be an odd question, but has anyone tried paying cash just to retro a resale week or weeks and not receive any additional points or week, ie, you own a SDO week and you pay them $10,000 to retro and that's it?

 

[jabberwocky]

This might be an odd question, but has anyone tried paying cash just to retro a resale week or weeks and not receive any additional points or week, ie, you own a SDO week and you pay them $10,000 to retro and that's it?

I don't think they would go for it. They want to have an incentive for you to buy more. You could get the same outcome by just doing a minimum purchase of a Flex package and then turn it back into them if I was to go that route.

 

[BuckeyeAndy]

Hi everyone, we just got back from a short trip to Westin Kierland and as previously mentioned, we went to the sales presentation to see what options they would offer to requalify two of our EOY resales that we purchased last year (a WKORV-N Oceanfront and WLR Platinum/Plus). The sales duo that we talked to were actually experienced veterans that knew the systems well and quickly moved to the fact that we could requalify both with a minimum $15k purchase. Recognizing what we were likely looking for (lower maintenance fees and reasonable price) they did not really push Westin/Sheraton Flex or Marriott Abound points at all. They shared that they didn't think Westin/Sheraton Flex was the best choice because Marriott was no longer investing in that program, which would limit the inventory in that system longer term. Interestingly, they mentioned that most of their Vistana "pre-merger" buyers typically bought Abound Club points to get the most flexibility across the 2 systems.

They then shared with us the current available inventory if we wanted to buy at WKV directly:

• They had multiple gold, silver 2BR and 1BR weeks, but only one Platinum week, which was a 1BR Premium Villa EOY odd. I was surprised they didn't have any 2 BR Platinum weeks, as we asked and they said the cost would have been around $90k if they had any in inventory - which means some people actually buy those at retail cost! The 2 options they recommended for us to consider requalifying were:
  • Buy Two 1BR Premium Gold EOY weeks and get 37,000 annual Staroptions or 1500 annual Club points. The cost for this was $22,100 but with an added 10% discount came to $19890 +$1850 in closing costs = $21,740. Maintenance fees for both of these EOY's together was $850 annually. Additional incentive of 74,000 Staroptions.
  • Buy one 1BR Premium Platinum EOY week and get 81,000 Star options EOY or 2600 club points EOY. Cost was $26,190 + $925 closing cost = $27,115. Maintenance fees for this were $650 annually. Additional incentive of 81,000 star options for use by 2027.
• They also offered the hotel linkage credit of $1500 if staying at Marriott hotel 7 days before or after stay.
• My wife and I discussed this and I told her I was neutral and ok to decline on this offer because I was willing to try to maximize what we currently had (2 EOY ownerships that were "qualified" in both Vistana and Abound and 2 EOY's that were resales but not requalified). She actually wanted to make the purchase to requalify because she liked the idea of simplifying all of our timeshares to be "enrolled" as she didn't like the burden of trying to remember which timeshares could transfer to Staroptions or Club points, and/or which ones we had to rely on Interval International to trade for (WLR) and all the different rules (and 2 different Interval logins!). In addition, the perks of going from "Select" level where we are today, to "Presidential" level were also a nice bonus (primarily with the ability to book only 1+ night at the 13 month mark), although certainly not worth the cost in and of itself.

In the end, we decided to sign the deal for the platinum 1 Bedroom Premium - EOY week due to the better maintenance fees then Flex/Abound, plus the ability to more easily go to Phoenix during Baseball spring training and also have some resale value if we decide to sell someday. I had been hoping to requalify for closer to $15k, but the only way to do that was to buy Abound or Flex points, and I wasn't excited about that. My guess is that the ideal scenario would have been if they had a smaller 1 BR EOY at WKV in platinum season that would have been under $20k...but they didn't have one to sell. That said, the premium 1BR will be nicer to stay in when we use it, and you only live once so why not splurge!

Technically, we still have a few days to rescind, but I think we're planning to stick with this, especially as my wife is more excited about this situation (and that's an important factor!). In the future, there may be more limited opportunities to requalify with a good property like WKV. That said, if we were to do it all over again and if I knew everything I learned from TUG at the beginning I would have bought all our properties resale (vs. 2 developer purchases) and then requalified all in this one transaction...but hindsight is 20/20.

Would be curious of other strategies to requalify (assuming you wanted to)...would the better long term (15 to 20+ year) financial option just be to choose Flex or Abound points? Or is buying deeded at a place like WKV worth the premium?

 

[bizaro86]

Would be curious of other strategies to requalify (assuming you wanted to)...would the better long term (15 to 20+ year) financial option just be to choose Flex or Abound points? Or is buying deeded at a place like WKV worth the premium?

Assuming you're set on the requal I would definitely stick with WKV plat vs one of the flex trusts. I think there's a very good chance those trusts end up loaded with only off-season inventory at some point at very high MFs, whereas a WKV week will always be just WKV.

 

[DavidnRobin]

"they mentioned that most of their Vistana "pre-merger" buyers typically bought Abound Club points to get the most flexibility across the 2 systems."
You do realize these guys lie like they breathe right?

if I understand correctly... (lots of words)
Paid $27K for a 1Bd EOY WKV P+ (81K SO), and Requaled resale EOY WKORVN OF and EOY WLR. and already own 2 'qualified' EOYs.
Plus incentive of $1500 to stay at a Marriott hotel.

$27K for a 1Bd EOY WKV P+ (81K SO) that is worth <$5 on the resale market. Plus, ongoing additional MFs.
I would rescind immediately. They did a great job selling you and especially your wife apparently - that is why they insist on both attend these meetings.

Use your $27K (plus ongoing MFs...) and rent what you want, or do something better with your money.

btw - we own two WKV P+ (81K SOs, resale in 2007/08) and by far the most valuable VOIs (and profitable) we own.
Also Chairman level with our other pre-merger VOIs.
But... those days are long gone.

What did you improve other than requaling two resale EOYs - one which is already Mandatory. More MFs, and another VOI to deal with.
For $27K!!!

You want to make your TSs easier to deal with?
Pay me $10K, and I will send you annual reminder... LOL

 

[SChiam]

This is my version of simple math: $26k - $1500 hotel credit - $2500 (one-time 81000 star options estimated worth) = $22k versus $5k resales for EOY Kierland 1-B. So, your decision is whether $17k is worth requalifying for your EOY WKORN OF (8325 abounds EOY) and WLR (assuming 2B Platinum+ 4950 abounds or 148100 star options EOY).